Music and Religion/Music as Religion

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: Music and Religion/Music as Religion

    How do I quiet my mind? I would pay anything for that.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from devildavid. Show devildavid's posts

    Re: Music and Religion/Music as Religion

    Here is another song with "religious" references.

    "Free Your Mind and Your Ass Will Follow" - Funkadelic

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K84xkFOci3c

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from yogafriend. Show yogafriend's posts

    Re: Music and Religion/Music as Religion

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to yogafriend's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

     

    Not sure how to continue this debate without coming off as offensive...

    ...so I'll stop now unless further entreated.

     

     

    Is it hokey to you?   Unreasonable because it can't be reasoned?  Intellectually without merit?  I can understand that it's not possible to believe in divine providence if you don't believe in God per se, but that still doesn't mean that an atheist wouldn't see, sense of feel other ways that rare humans are given gifts from an unexplained, unidentifiable (UFO?! :) ) source?    No?   

    Just asking.   Is it simply a matter of believing that we are who we are, derive all of our gifts from nature and nurture?   No matter what the output, no matter how extraordinary, no matter at all?    That's not the least offensive, and I am not offended by you, or anyone, who refutes divine providence, or whatever term is used to describe this other belief system that "saith" : there's more.  

     



    I'm comfortable with the idea that people need a way to describe things they cannot understand.  Humans have done that throughout their existence, whether they believe in one omnipresent god or a nymph in every pond and a sprite in every tree.

    To that end, "divine" to me is just another superlative, like "genius" or "masterpiece" (or "universal"...which means something different now than it did 1000 years ago) which gets thrown around at art objects like rice at a wedding.  I'm also wary of sanctification for its own sake.

    The Pieta is a religious-themed, church-commissioned work based on the gospels, but it is also a sculpture of two people rendered in a moment of emotional distress.  The fact is that it can be both things regardless of what the artist intended or even how pious he/she was.  If some read more into the godly implications of it, that's fine by me.  But in the end, it's still just a sculpture of a woman cradling a dying man (or mother cradling a son, et al.).

    The Renaissance is conspicuous by its expansion beyond the purely religious into the (partially) secular, and the art of the time progressively distinguished itself thus.  Just like in other eras and places, art found themes and motivations to address beyond the hegemony of the church.

     



    You would make an excellent anthropologist, and that's not surprising, since art history is at the crossroads of anthro studies.  I've known a few anthro majors who went into museum studies, and of course, advanced degrees in history.   All blend together like a beautiful tapestry.   

    The need that man(kind) has had to seek a source of strength, solace, spirituality is fascinating, because as you say, it's been a part of human nature since the dawn of time.  Magic mushrooms, smoking the old peace pipe, ingesting herbs, yikes, we've been at this a long time.  :)   It's sad that there's been so much religious persecution that set the tone for the continuing modern day divisiveness on this topic -- a legacy that has left a sour taste re: religion for many people.  

    Regardless, your clarity re: your belief system, in a nutshell, is obvious.  Since you're able to articulate where you stand (and never waver), and don't diminish what others think and "feel", I don't find it at all controversial (can't imagine why anyone would, but that's of course, me).    Thanks for answering my questions.  

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: Music and Religion/Music as Religion

    I have to say this is definitely one of the smartest groups I have ever encountered in an online forum. Conversations are diversified & respectful with well thought out opinions. I take personal pride in this forum and I believe Zilla does as well considering where it was at some 4 years ago when we first tried to re-establish it as a way for us to get away from the insanity that is the Red Sox forum. 

    Perhaps I am a God Tongue Out We already know that Zilla is.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from yogafriend. Show yogafriend's posts

    Re: Music and Religion/Music as Religion

    In response to jesseyeric's comment:

    How do I quiet my mind? I would pay anything for that.


    Come closer.   I need to whisper the secret into your ear.  :P  

     Seriously, I can empty and quiet my mind with relative ease.   It's scary, in fact.  I hope I never empty it to the extent I lose it.   Laughing

     

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from yogafriend. Show yogafriend's posts

    Re: Music and Religion/Music as Religion

    In response to devildavid's comment:

    Here is another song with "religious" references.

    "Free Your Mind and Your Ass Will Follow" - Funkadelic

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K84xkFOci3c



    LOVE IT.   

    Want to know why I am laughing MAO especially hard right now?   Monday night, I met a young woman for the first time in a yoga class.   My main teacher now teaches in a new studio, so we're blended in with new students (nice). 

    My yoga instructor, in a word, is extraordinary.  Her practice and instruction is the most challenging yoga you will ever see or find, there are no words, really -- and she is "all in" with her ability to challenge, inspire and demonstrate (she's soooo amazing).  

    Well, this woman has only taken a couple of her classes and said: "the last time I was here, I HAD MY @SS HANDED TO ME."    I couldn't stop laughing -- still can't.   Laughing

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from mrmojo1120. Show mrmojo1120's posts

    Re: Music and Religion/Music as Religion

    Hey Jessey,long time no read.Welcome back.

    From Joyful Wisdom:Embracing change and finding freedom

    6 Steps to quiet the mind:

    Step One: Objectless Attention

    The most basic approach to attention is referred to as “objectless”–not focusing on any specific “scene” or aspect of experience, but just looking and marveling at the wide range of scenery as it comes and goes….Objectless attention involves settling into this “is-ness,” simply watching thoughts, emotions, appearances, and so on, as they emerge against or within the background of “space.”

    Step Two: Attention to Form

    Form meditation simply involves raising this unconscious process to the level of active awareness. Just by looking with bare attention at a specific object, the restless bird [your mind] settles on its branch….When you rest your mind on an object you’re seeing it as something distinct or separate from yourself. But when we let go and simply rest our minds in bare attention, gradually we begin to realize whatever we see, and however we see it, is an image made up of thoughts, memories, and the limitations conditioned by our sensory organs. In other words, there’s no difference between what is seen and the mind that sees it.

    Step Three: Attending to Sound

    Attending to sound is very similar to attending to form, except that now you’re engaging the faculty of hearing instead of sight….Gradually allow yourself to pay attention to sounds close to your awareness, such as your heartbeat or your breath. Alternatively, you can focus on sounds that occur naturally in your immediate surroundings, such as rain pattering against a window, the noise of a television or stereo coming from a neighbor’s apartment, the roar of an airplane passing above, or even the chirps and whistles of restless birds outside.

    Step Four: Attending to Physical Experience

    Our embodied state is a blessing in disguise, fertile ground through which we may discover the possibilities of awareness. One way to access these possibilities is through paying attention to physical sensations, a process that may be most simply accessed through watching your breath. All you have to do is focus your attention lightly on the simple act of inhaling and exhaling. You can place your attention on the passage of air through your nostrils or on the sensation of air filling and exiting your lungs. Focusing on the breath is particularly useful when you catch yourself feeling stressed or distracted. The simple act of drawing attention to your breath produces a state of calmness and awareness that allows you to step back from whatever problems you might be facing and respond to them more calmly and objectively.

    Step Five: Attending to Thoughts

    Paying attention to thoughts isn’t aimed at stopping thoughts, but simply observing them. Like taking time to look at a rose or listen to a sound, taking time to observe your thoughts doesn’t involve analyzing the thoughts themselves. Rather, the emphasis rests on the act of observing, which naturally calms and steadies the mind that observes. You can use your thoughts rather be used by them. If a hundred thoughts pass through your mind in the space of a minute, you have a hundred supports for meditation….There’s no need to become attached to the awareness of a thought or to focus on it so intently that you attempt to make it go away. Thoughts come and go, as an old Buddhist saying holds, like “snowflakes falling on a hot rock.” Whatever passes through the mind, just watch it come and go, lightly and without attachment, the way you’d practice gently resting your attention on forms, sounds, or physical sensations.

    Step Six: Attending to Emotions

    The method of observing emotions varies according to the type of emotion you’re experiencing. If you’re feeling a positive emotion, you can focus on both the feeling AND the object of the feeling. For example, if you’re feeling love for a child, you can rest your attention on both the child AND the love you feel for him or her. If you’re feeling compassion for someone in trouble, you can focus on the person needing help AND your feeling of compassion….A more practical approach to emotions, similar to that of working with thoughts, is simply to rest your attention on the emotion itself rather than on its object. Just look at the emotion without analyzing it intellectually. Don’t try to hold on to it or resist it. Simply observe it. When you do this, the emotion won’t seem as solid, lasting, or true as it initially did.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: Music and Religion/Music as Religion

    Thanks Mojo - I think I will still with Jack Daniels and hot chicks. Doesn't actually quiet the mind, but it does allow me to forget thet nasty stuff for awhile Undecided

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Music and Religion/Music as Religion

    In response to yogafriend's comment:

     

    You would make an excellent anthropologist, and that's not surprising, since art history is at the crossroads of anthro studies.  I've known a few anthro majors who went into museum studies, and of course, advanced degrees in history.   All blend together like a beautiful tapestry.   

    The need that man(kind) has had to seek a source of strength, solace, spirituality is fascinating, because as you say, it's been a part of human nature since the dawn of time.  Magic mushrooms, smoking the old peace pipe, ingesting herbs, yikes, we've been at this a long time.  :)   It's sad that there's been so much religious persecution that set the tone for the continuing modern day divisiveness on this topic -- a legacy that has left a sour taste re: religion for many people.  

    Regardless, your clarity re: your belief system, in a nutshell, is obvious.  Since you're able to articulate where you stand (and never waver), and don't diminish what others think and "feel", I don't find it at all controversial (can't imagine why anyone would, but that's of course, me).    Thanks for answering my questions.  



    Perhaps, although I'm not terribly fond of people, so I don't know if that disqualifies me from studying humanity...if not THE Humanities, if you follow me.

    I think the religious violence is borne more out of our inherent tribalism and our instinctive need to form groups for safety, survival, etc.  

    We've seen in this forum and others the degree to which people take sides...which would be fine, except when people limit their choices to "this" or "that".  I prefer to think there are more options and facets to consider.

    My problem with religions are their insistence on dogma and infallibility.  Rules were made to be broken, and nobody is infallible, not even 'god'.  It's a hard thing for most people to accept, much less understand.  What's worth knowing is also worth changing one's mind about, and principles fade, while patience wins out.

    So instead, the whole thing remains to me a cosmic joke...an ant farm...a vast hall of mirrors in which our world and universe are reflected ad infinitum with no beginning, no end...just a big, fat middle...and us floating around in it kind of clinging to each other.

    But while I'm here, I prefer to simply seek out beauty and truth and magic and hope peace and appeal to the best instincts we can summon.  That's what art and music are to me (and why they trump religion): the very best we tall apes have and can come up with.  And we ain't finished yet...!  ;))

     

     

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: Music and Religion/Music as Religion

    This whole thing got me thinking to one David Bowie's Ziggy masterpieces - Sweet Head. Here is the verse:

     

    Run south to where your mother dwells
    If she knew what's going down, she'd give you hell
    I'm the kind of man she warned me of
    Till there was rock you only had god

    I find that last line somewhat fulfilling.

     

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