cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from dog-lady. Show dog-lady's posts

    cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    Is supermarket dog/cat food really that bad?  I know some go on and on about corn and fillers, but since when did we have to spend $50  $60 for a bag of dog food?   I now think my dogs have a better diet than I do!                        I remember a dog we had growing up that ate 1 can of "Calo" a day and lived to be 18!   If the dog doesn't have allergies,  appears healthy and likes the inexpensive/moderately priced food... is that good enough?  After all it does have vitamins, minerals, protein and is FDA approved.  My friend feeds his cats Hills Science dry food (recommended by his vet) and says his cats are doing great on it and yet people say terrible things about it!  What to believe?
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ruthcatrin. Show ruthcatrin's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    I'm not a vet, but I'm gonna toss out my opinion.

    In general I'm leary of corn as a filler, due to problems that (reasonably frequently) occur with a mold that can kill your animal (or you if it gets in your food).  Don't have the name of it handy cause I'm at work, will dig it out when I get home.

    Personally I feed a rather less common diet to my dogs (modified raw/home cooked) mostly just so that I know exactly what goes into it if there ever IS a problem.  On the other hand my inlaws' Chow has never been feed anything but Kibbles n Bits (or whatever its called now), she's 12yrs old, and other than some arthritus is in perfect health.

    So I will pretty much always recommend the higher quality foods with less fillers, but if your dog is happy and healthy on what you're feeding then I won't argue to hard with you either.  Just do me a favor and KNOW whats in the food so if there ever is a problem you can be prepared to deal with it. 

    (Having said that your dog can appear healthy and not be.  The whole reason I got a 2nd puppy last month was due to a very surprise litter.  His parents were rescued from a horder.  The rescue thought one or both of the parents were sterile as they'd been kenneled together for 6 years and never produced a single pup.  Well, this past fall was her first heat after the rescue (why she wasn't spayed is a long story I'm not going to go into right now) and presto, puppies.  In retrospect they were only "sterile" due to poor diet and possibly their housing situation (at least one other female thought sterile ALSO produced pups).  The dogs appeared to be a healthy weight and condition when they were rescued, but were being feed the cheapest kibble the owner could find due to the number of dogs he was trying to keep up with.)


    Edited to add: I also think that pet food companies tend to overcharge for foods, at least the larger ones do.  Smaller companies have less room for market changes, but larger companies, espeically considering their buying power, are over charging for the quality of food that they produce.  And don't get me started on the cost of prescription diets (or the quality, my vet and I are having that discussion now for one of my cats.  Sorry, when the kibble I buy her from the pet store has better, healthier, numbers than the prescription stuff you're insisting I feed her I'm going to argue with you.)
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from sntocci. Show sntocci's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    I had my dog on Iams for a year. He developed allergoes (common in bulldogs) and the groomer suggested an all natural venison dog food- cost a fortune! 2-3 months later he developed bladder stone and needed surgery ASAP! I then made his food for a while- potatos, chicken, etc for a while. Finally I had enough and switched back to Iams for my 2 dogs and have not had any problems in the last 4 years. I know Iams is not the cheapest, but my experience just proves that more expensive does not necessarily mean better.
    My mom also has had a few dogs in her lifetime and swears by store brand dog food- and they all lived 14-16 years.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ruthcatrin. Show ruthcatrin's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    Finally remembered to check, the mold on corn (and occasionally other things) is an aflatoxin, and produces symptoms often labeled hepatitus X.  Almost always fatal but the rare survivor will have major liver damage.  There were 3 or 4 brands of dog food (including Iams) recalling some of their products just last month due to aflatoxin contamination.  I've not seen any deaths listed from this last recall, but most of the time there's a recall for aflatoxin there's at least a few canine deaths.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    Oh, yeah, I remember that, ruth - scary.

    I also learned when Gracie had an allergic reaction (itchy paws) to a dog food with duck in it that they put the absolute worst duck meat in dog food - the stuff that is left over from the genetically modified ducks that down producers throw away (according to my vet who said she sees a lot of problems with dogs and duck-based food).  So, even if you're feeding something without corn, you could be feeding goodness knows what.

    Corn is a filler that isn't particularly nutritious for dogs and can cause problems especially for certain breeds, but if a dog does well on it, who's to say an owner needs to feed them something else?
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from dog-lady. Show dog-lady's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    Blue Buffalo recall list  http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/newpetfoodrecalls/brand_list.cfm?Trade_Name=BLUE%20BUFFALO&pet=Dog
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    Thanks dog-lady.  Happily for Gracie, her food isn't on the list (and for us - we have a year's worth of it in the basement that we got on sale).
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from pinkkittie27. Show pinkkittie27's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    In Response to cheap dog food Question for Angellvets:
    [QUOTE]Is supermarket dog/cat food really that bad?  I know some go on and on about corn and fillers, but since when did we have to spend $50  $60 for a bag of dog food?   I now think my dogs have a better diet than I do!                        I remember a dog we had growing up that ate 1 can of "Calo" a day and lived to be 18!   If the dog doesn't have allergies,  appears healthy and likes the inexpensive/moderately priced food... is that good enough?  After all it does have vitamins, minerals, protein and is FDA approved.  My friend feeds his cats Hills Science dry food (recommended by his vet) and says his cats are doing great on it and yet people say terrible things about it!  What to believe?
    Posted by dog-lady[/QUOTE]


    IMHO it really depends on what the health concerns you have for your dog. If you have a dog whose breed is predispositioned to be overweight, it's best to give them something with as little filler as possible. Personally, i feed my dog natural hollistic diet because:
    1.) His breed is predispositioned to being overweight
    2.) He has allergies and the diet helps manage them
    3.) I like being able to understand the ingredients in my dog's food. I wouldn't to eat a bunch of chemicals, so I don't want to give them to him either.
    4.) A lot of big-name dog food brands test their products on animals in an inhumane way. I'd hate to think some dogs and cats suffered so that my dog could have a balanced diet.
    5.) If I'm going to spend money on dog food, I'd rather be spending it on good, wholesome ingredients. Not filler. If I wanted to go the cheap way, I'd buy him canned tuna and rice, and then give him scrap veggies from dinner.

    Lastly, I commend Blue Buffalo for voluntarily recalling their food due to the possibility that it might contain too much vitamin D, which some dogs may have a reaction to. The excess of a vitamin supplement shouldn't be lumped in with the recalld from manufacturers who have had to pull food due to their cheapo ingredients being toxic.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    Pinkkittie, is that YOU?!  How have you been?  I was just thinking about you yesterday and wondering if you'd ever be back, weird.  How is Max?

    Great post - I didn't even look at BB's reason for recall.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from dog-lady. Show dog-lady's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    A recall is a recall, carelessness is carelessness and vitamin D in large amounts has the potential to be toxic,  I commend all the brands for voluntarily recalling their products, BB did so in response to dogs becoming ill and showing symptoms and elevated vitamin D levels when examined by a vet.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    Yes, a sick dog is a sick dog no matter what the cause, but as far as the integrity of the company goes regarding their ingredients, I think there's a difference.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from dog-lady. Show dog-lady's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    http://www.mysettersam.com/2008/11/recall-roundup-do-not-use-these-pet.html    

    Products that just happened to be contaminated!  

    BTW: If I see a product with a lot of recalls ...I don't buy it, for example: Toyota! 
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from DirtyWaterLover. Show DirtyWaterLover's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    It's not just the corn fillers. 

    Most of the dog food sold in grocery stores is made from meat that isn't fit for human consumption.  They use the diseased and dying animals for dog food.  They cook the meat until it's very well done to kill all of the disease.  But they also kill all of the enzymes in the meat that aids in the dog's digestion of the meat. 

    A dog's digestive system is extremely small, much smaller than ours.  It's designed to eat stuff that's raw.  The more the meat is cooked, the harder it is for the dog to digest.  And Corn is hard for a human to digest, and impossible for you dog to break down.  The only reason they put corn in dog food is to increase the protein content, but it's protein the dog can digest.

    Then they add sugar and food coloring to the food, which is bizarre because a dog can't even see color.

    And Science diet is really junk.  The Vets make a ton of money on it and that's why they recommend it. 

    The best diet for a dog is one that's varied.  My dogs are primarily on a raw diet but they also get kibble for training treats.  I buy a lot of different kinds of kibble and mix it all together.  They get everything - fish, venison, buffalo, beef, chicken, lamb, a little bit of everything. 

    By the way, I bet the calo that your parents fed your dog when you were a kid isn't the same calo they sell now.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from ruthcatrin. Show ruthcatrin's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    In Response to Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets:
    [QUOTE]By the way, I bet the calo that your parents fed your dog when you were a kid isn't the same calo they sell now.
    Posted by DirtyWaterLover[/QUOTE]


    I have to admit that I'd love to see the actual ingredients list from the foods that were around 15 or 20 (or more) years ago, and compare them to whats on the labels now.  I've not found any reliable source for that information though (not that I've looked really hard mind, but its one of those things that occurs to me now than then).

    And yes, Science diet, my cats get Taste of the Wild kibble (the River flavor), the Dry matter figures are identical or better (in specific reference to my cat's requirements) than the presciption foods my vet wants me to feed her in every way except where required by law (prescription foods are allowed to futz the vitamin/mineral requirements), and even there the differences aren't large.  Plus they won't eat Science Diet in any form.



    Edited: The only pet food manufactuor that that 100% guarantee that their foods come from human grade products is The Honest Kitchen, their foods are actually FDA certified for human consumption.  I've not been able to find another pet food maker who has that, alot of them SAY their foods are human quality, but they aren't certified.  And oddly enough, though THK isn't cheap, on a meal to meal basis they are NOT nearly as expensive as some of the other high quality stuff, though they can be hard to find locally in some areas.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    The list of ingredients might be exactly the same.  But, that doesn't mean those ingredients are the same at all.

    All the corn and some (if not all) of the meat has been genetically modified since then.  I know that the duck they use today is genetically modified to produce more down and is why dogs (like Gracie) have allergic reactions to it.  It's not fit to eat.

    "The Future of Food" (streamable from online and from Netflix) is a very interesting explanation as to why food isn't being processed by man or beast they way it used to be.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ruthcatrin. Show ruthcatrin's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    A good point too. The meat animals of today aren't the same as 20+years ago which also makes a difference.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from pinkkittie27. Show pinkkittie27's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    In Response to Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets:
    [QUOTE]Pinkkittie, is that YOU?!  How have you been?  I was just thinking about you yesterday and wondering if you'd ever be back, weird.  How is Max? Great post - I didn't even look at BB's reason for recall.
    Posted by kargiver[/QUOTE]

    hey kar! Yeah, I don't get a chance to check in too often anymore. I miss all of you! Max is good as always. He's been loving this snowless winter. Hope Gracie is doing well.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from pinkkittie27. Show pinkkittie27's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    In Response to Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets:
    [QUOTE]A recall is a recall, carelessness is carelessness and vitamin D in large amounts has the potential to be toxic,  I commend all the brands for voluntarily recalling their products, BB did so in response to dogs becoming ill and showing symptoms and elevated vitamin D levels when examined by a vet.
    Posted by dog-lady[/QUOTE]

    in this case, it was not their carelessness. it was a mistake made by the supplier they get their vitamin D supplements from.

    I know it's easy for people who have had dogs who live long lives on Dog Chow to not understand why someone else chooses to spend more or be more discerning about what they feed their dogs. But ultimately, that's their business. I don't care what you feed your dog. I would never criticize someone for their choices like that. some people do it because they're loyal to the brand, some can't afford anything better, and some just do it because they think dog food is dog food is dog food. It's not for me to judge. And I would also venture to guess that most vets take the same position. All they care about is that you feed your dog and care about them. that's what's really important.

    we don't go "on and on" about the food because we're snobby or pretentious. we go on and on about it for the same reason I go on and on about my hair stylist or my favorite pair of jeans. when you buy something and it delivers, you want to scream it from the mountain tops.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from dog-lady. Show dog-lady's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    I agree, I like this product!   There are many good dog foods to choose from, some people even make their own pet food. I'm hearing good things about Paul Newman's brand (I love his salad dressings)!   Dick VanPatten has created a pet food that he claims it's so good humans could eat it!

    Castor & Pollux Natural Ultramix Adult Dry Dog Food

    Ideal for active adult dogs (all breeds, all sizes) through their golden years. Our recipe uses natural chicken as the #1 ingredient, followed by other poultry and fish-based protein sources for optimal nutrition and great taste. Real pieces of minimally processed fruits and vegetables provide a natural source of antioxidants, vitamins, and fiber that you can actually see in the bag. And there are plenty of other powerful benefits that aren't visible to the eye, including Omega 3 and 6 Fatty Acids that contribute to healthy skin and a luxurious coat, and a balanced Calcium to Phosphorous ratio that helps promote healthy bones and teeth. Natural Ultramix Adult Dog Food contains no artificial colors or preservatives, and no corn, wheat or soy.

     
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    In Response to Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets : hey kar! Yeah, I don't get a chance to check in too often anymore. I miss all of you! Max is good as always. He's been loving this snowless winter. Hope Gracie is doing well.
    Posted by pinkkittie27[/QUOTE]

    We miss you and Max - glad to know he's doing well.  Graice, too.  She's also enjoying the essentially snowless winter; falling through the deep snow is how she tore her knee last year.  Hope you'll keep checking in from time to time.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from dog-lady. Show dog-lady's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    http://allrecipes.com/recipe/homemade-dog-food/     I may try this,  but I think I'll just add some to the dry food so they'll have something crunchy too!
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    If you want to save a lot of money, you can replace the ground turkey (around $5/lb) with chicken hearts, livers, and gizzards.  Gracie LOVES chicken hearts!  I think they are about $1/lb.  And, I just dump the whole container into a 12 inch pan, cover, and stew in their own juices for 12 minutes on medium.  Hearts are the healthiest sub, of course.  Liver is fatty.  Not sure about gizzards.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from dog-lady. Show dog-lady's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    Organ meats are very high in fat (cholesterol) and calories, of course they love them! 

    In my opinion they are too rich for an everyday diet (okay for an occasional treat), in excess could lead to gallstones, pancreatitis... too much protein is also rough on the kidneys. 

    Not to mention the fl@tulence issues!
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from toytrumpet. Show toytrumpet's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    Reading viewers comments on the AllRecipes site for making your own dog food, there are a lot of warnings about being sure to add other additives to help break down the homemade food, as well as being sure to grind it down enough that the dogs can digest it and get it into their systems.  Life was simpler when we could feed our animals table scraps.  Dogs and cats in my childhood lived into their late teens.  Of course now with the way processing, as well as growing food, has changed, wouldn't be a good choice.

    My mother always took the hearts and giblets and boiled them up and mashed them for our animals - a treat - and we had one cat who lived to be 19.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets

    In Response to Re: cheap dog food Question for Angellvets:
    [QUOTE]Organ meats are very high in fat and calories, of course they love them!  In my opinion they are too rich for an everyday diet,  could lead to gallstones, pancreatitis... too much protein is also rough on the kidneys.  Not to mention the  fl@tulence issues!
    Posted by dog-lady[/QUOTE]

    According to nutritiondata.self.com, chicken hearts are a healthy substition for ground turkey, and they are 5 times cheaper.  I didn't look at the protein content, but turkey and heart muscle have got to be about the same.  Just trying to help you with your quest to feed well and save money.  If you want to spend 5 times more on turkey which has more saturated fat than the hearts, that's your choice.  Same as those who want to feed corn based dog food.  I have nothing to say about it, but your assumption that hearts are worse for dogs than turkey, imo, isn't correct.

    1 cup chopped chicken hearts has 268 calories, 3 grams of saturated fat and 8 grams of unsaturated fat.

    1 cup ground turkey has 388 calories, 5.5 grams of saturated fat and 16 grams of unsaturated fat.
     

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