1. You have chosen to ignore posts from lukeseri58. Show lukeseri58's posts

    Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    so Emma's lyme disease levels are at a treatable stage at the moment so she is going on antibiotics for a month.  The vet wants to then get her vaccinated since we live in a high risk area and we go out in the woods, the resevoir and what not.  I have read a lot about this and am still stuck on the issue.  Some vets and lay people say (and i would have to agree with them) if she already has the disease, is adding more to her system (which is what a vaccanination does) a good idea?  I tried to post this in Ask An Angel Vet but couldn't figure out how to do it.  Anyone have any experience with Lyme disease?
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from lukeseri58. Show lukeseri58's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    yea, i don't do vacinnes either -- just the required rabies -- i don't like the frontline products either since they are a neurotoxin and many reports have been done regarding their damage -- don't do heartworm either because in the 20 years since they have been given to every dog who ever walks into a vet's office, there has been no decrease in the incidence of heartworm -- what i do do and have done since i got the pup was test every 3-6 months for all tick borne illnesses and heartworm - since discovering the lyme disease last june, i then had the $80 test to test levels -- treated her with antibiotics and then tested again in December -- her levels were insignificant - tested again just the other day for both all tick borne illnesses, heartworm and the extra c6 test to determine lyme levels -- she is not showing any symptons, i just like to test often so i can treat if appropriate -- most people think i don't do the chemical thing for $$ purposes, but it is actually more expensive to have the testing done every three months or so -- to keep the fleas and ticks away i feed raw, spray apple cider vinager mixed with water on her before we go out - she smells like salad, and check her for the ticks -- but obviously its not enough given that we live in high risk area and actually like to spend time outdoors.  Thanks.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    Robin, sorry to hear your terrible story re Lyme.  

    I have mixed feelings about the Lyme vaccine for all the afore mentioned reasons, but, fwiw, I do give it to Gracie because we live in a HIGHLY infested area near the Quabbin Resevoir.  Our yard is surround by woods, and deer regularly wander through.

    About Frontline, I agree with Robin - I hate to give it to Gracie, but I hate ticks more.  I just started giving her freeze dried garlic, "Bugoff" from Springtime.  I don't trust it will be 100% effective in repelling ticks and fleas, though, so I'm giving it in conjunction with the poison.  We saw ticks on her last year quite regularly (DH takes her on hikes) even with Frontline so maybe this added protection will do the trick.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Shortylicious. Show Shortylicious's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    I do get my dog vaccinated for lyme and heartworm but I don't use Frontline. In the past, even with Frontline, he's brought in ticks so I just check him daily for them. He's got light colored fur and skin so I don't have too much trouble finding them.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ruthcatrin. Show ruthcatrin's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    No experience with Lyme myself, but I recently did a bunch of research on it in deciding on whether to vaccinate my puppy.

    1st off, (if you/your vet haven't) ask your vet if they tested for JUST Lyme, or if they tested for any of the other of diseases ticks carry.  Some (if not all) of the other diseases carried by ticks are potentially fatal and certinally not pleasent to experience.  They can be hard to diagnose in humans, so I imagine they can be even harder to ID in dogs, but dogs can catch them too, and some don't show up till down the road.  (Look up Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever, for example)

    2nd, the Lyme vaccine does NOT protect against pretty much all of those other diseases, so your dog could end up just as sick, if not sicker even if it IS vaccinated.

    3rd, although technically the human lyme vaccine was discontinued due to lack of interest, there was some serious concern over the potential side affects of long term exposure to the vaccine.  I can't find anything online that tells me what the results of the research into those side effects was, or if they're possibly the same for canines, but one of the potential side affects was arthritis.  I HAVE arthritis already and it s**ks.  If my doctor told me about a new vaccine that would probly be very good for me, but oh, btw, they're researching the possibility of it causing arthritis in a few years, I'd tell her to GTH to be completely honest.  The chances that my puppy, who comes from a long lived breed, might have that extra chance of having to deal with arthritis at an earlier age because I chose to give him a possibly not needed vaccine?  Yah, no.

    4th, You'll want to double check, but I believe that, just like they can do a blood titer to check for antibody levels for various other vaccines, I recall seeing that they can do the same for lyme.  Assuming my memory is correct my suggestion would be to have her periodically retested to check for antibodies, if at any point the antibody level drops below the prefered level THEN consider the possiblity of vaccinating.  Just to warn you, if your vet is particulary traditional they may object to the titer and attempt to convince you that it "won't tell you what you need to know" or similer.  Don't be afraid to stand your ground.

    Edited to add: just read your 2nd post again, you look  like you have the concepts about testing that I was talking about already down pat so good for you.  Personally in your situation I'd not be vaccinating, but you''re the one in the situation, so good luck with making your decision!
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    In Response to Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination:
    I do get my dog vaccinated for lyme and heartworm but I don't use Frontline. In the past, even with Frontline, he's brought in ticks so I just check him daily for them. He's got light colored fur and skin so I don't have too much trouble finding them.
    Posted by Shortylicious

    I can't say if this works because I just started using it this week, but check this out if you want a natural repelent.  I know garlic can be bad for dogs, but only in amounts MUCH greater than the dose recommended to repel ticks and other biting pests.  Bug Off Garlic from Springtime  I'm using this in conjunction with Frontline because, like you, I also found ticks on Gracie last year.  I'm hoping the combo actually keeps them off her this year!  She's black and quite big so it's pretty hard to find them all.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoneToTheDogs39. Show GoneToTheDogs39's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination


     Dogs can test positive and never show symptoms.

     I know the Frontline type products are poison,  but I have to kill those ticks, plus they can end up on you.

     The heartworm prevention, is important too.

     The antibiotic treatment is very important,  in fact some Vets give it for even longer than 1 month to kill the bacteria.

       Doesn't smelling like a salad attract mosquitoes?                    www.2ndchance.info/lyme.htm                    

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from lukeseri58. Show lukeseri58's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    nope -smelling like a salad keeps the insects away - i actually spray the solution on myself too when i'm out at dusk and the mosquitoes are flying around -- i read that article yesterday and many others and like ruthcatrin said i will most likely not be vacinnating -- i bought a new tick/flea preventative from natural pet store on line the other day -- its kind of far fetched but i'll try anything that is not poisin/nuerotoxin -- i really hate putting that chemical stuff on my pup -- the new thing is called a tick clip -- again, sounds a little far fetched but since it's not harmful i figured i'd try it out -- here's a link
    http://www.onlynaturalpet.com/products/Anibio-Tic-Clip/900000.aspx
     - well having trouble getting the link to copy but just goggle tick clip and you'll see it -- she's wearing it now but who knows if it will work --
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    We tried the tic clip last year.  It seemed to work 100%.  Honestly.  We saw a tick on her every day until we put that thing on, and it didn't even take a whole week like it says it will.

    However, it doesn't last 2 years.  The design started chipping off after about 10 months so I'm sure whatever field it had it isn't emitting anymore.  

    And, my vet was skeptical - she said the fact that we didnt' see any more ticks on her might have been coincidental with it moving into a time of year when ticks are less prevelant.  But, I didn't go for that - every day then, boom, none?  Didn't make sense.  Not that the tic clip makes tons of sense, though, lol.

    I'm considering buying another one.  But, that's $50 on top of Frontline and the garlic stuff...gosh, the $$$ we spend.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from lukeseri58. Show lukeseri58's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    so since i am not busy at work - i decided to read up on the preventantive heartworm meds and found this

    For years consumers have been mislead on the subject of heartworm. Here are the facts. Most veterinarians will have you believe that giving a daily or monthly pill to prevent heartworm is safer than the treatment to cure it. Once again, the veterinarians may not have the right answer here. Let's look at the bottom line: 

    1. The majority of these preventatives kill the heartworms before they mature. So every day or every month you give your animal that pill, you are actually administering the cure for heartworm, you're not really preventing it
    2. The cure for heartworm is not safe, it has toxic consequences
    3. These "preventative" products are just that, cures
    4. Sure, the dosage is much smaller when given in a preventative dose. But when you give it to your pet month after month, this is where the toxic effects become a serious health risk

    And they expect us to believe this is safer? Heartworm prevention treatments are a chemical insecticide, no matter what brand or what type. The chemicals alone are enough to potentially cause disease. Here is how: 

    bulletThese pills beat up your pet's immune system 
    bulletYour pets system recognizes the chemicals as a foreign toxic substance 
    bulletThe system then works harder to eliminate the toxins 
    bulletThe major organs (such as liver and kidney) become strained unnecessarily 
    bulletThe system becomes run down, suppressing the immune response 
    bulletWhen a real disease or virus enters the animal's body, it can not fight it off and the animal is consumed by sickness 

    Side Effects 
    The chemicals used in most of these heartworm preventatives can cause serious side effects like vomiting, diarrhea, weakness and convulsions even in the healthiest animals. It is not uncommon for pet owners to rush into vet offices confused about what is wrong with their pet. Here is the irony, when the vets see these symptoms, they usually want to start your pet on a heartworm "preventative" medication thinking the symptoms may be heartworm, and they want to take precautions. 

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    Gracie did get bad diahrea on HeartGuard, but she does great (to my knowledge) on Inteceptor.

    Lukes, did you see my review of the Tic Clip?
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from lukeseri58. Show lukeseri58's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    yes, kar, i did see your review of the tick clip - glad to hear you had good luck with it - i was a little skeptical about it working -- if it works for three months i'm willing to pay that price -- my husband thinks i'm nuts i spend so much money on this dog.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoneToTheDogs39. Show GoneToTheDogs39's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    I'm sorry but I respectfully disagree,  I believe in avoiding vaccinations and chemicals as much as possible,  but heartworm disease and lyme disease will harm your dog faster than any preventative medications or poisons. 
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from lukeseri58. Show lukeseri58's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    that's alright - to each there own -- 30 years ago did you use heartworm monthly pills?  I test Emma for tickborne illnesses and heartworm every 3-6 months so i will catch it early if it happens and it will be treatable at that point -- i don't feel like giving her toxic chemicals unnecessarily -- that post by the way that i copied in came from consumer reports pets
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Novembride. Show Novembride's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    Lukes - how much water to vinegar do you use?  I tae my dog to NH ont he weekends, and he is getting alittle more adventurous about going into the woods.  I already use Frontline, but would use this too to really keep the bugs away.  Pus, I like the smell of apple cider vingear
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from lukeseri58. Show lukeseri58's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    50/50 -- you have to get the unreconstituted apple cider vinager -- you can get it at trader joes or whole foods -- just mix it half and half with water in a spray bottle and there you go -- i've had it out at cookouts at my house (i live on a small salt marsh) and everyone was putting it on and said it worked
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    In Response to Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination:
    yes, kar, i did see your review of the tick clip - glad to hear you had good luck with it - i was a little skeptical about it working -- if it works for three months i'm willing to pay that price -- my husband thinks i'm nuts i spend so much money on this dog.
    Posted by lukeseri58

    Well, I think it worked - I did start using it at the tail of prime tick season, but, in my heart I think it did perform like it promised except for the fact that it started falling apart in less than a year.  Grr.

    My husband thinks the same thing about me - you should have seen his face when I told him how much that little "crazy" medalian that magically repels ticks cost!  LOL  Let us know how it works for you.  It gets good reviews on ONP.com, too, so  here's hoping you can add a 5 paw review.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from lukeseri58. Show lukeseri58's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    i'll let you know how it works -- we just got it last week so i'm gonna give it the benefit of the doubt for the first two weeks
    on another totally unrelated note, i just read the review of water for elephants and they say it s u c k s -- i'm very upset - i loved the book and don't go to the movies very often -- last movie i saw at the theatre was marley and me (yes, my daughter and i sobbed and sobbed during the entire thing) - i had read it on a plane too prior to the movie coming out and did the same thing - very embarrassing -- but i was going to go see this one - what a bummer
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from lukeseri58. Show lukeseri58's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    well, i think you can tell i care deeply about my dog - i guess my point was that as i stated before, since the time that was the case, no heartworm meds/no vets, etc., the incidence of heartworm in dogs has not decreased even though most people do give a monthly heartworm med, so i don't think the preventative helps -- i think its the luck of the draw kind of

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    You'll know if it's working if it works for your dog like it did for Gracie - it's like a switch.  Ticks on, ticks off.   I wonder if ours will still work now that it looks like this:




    I sobbed through M&M, too - it was NOT the comedy the ads promised, that's for sure.  Too bad about the movie review, but I've always found whatever book to be better than its movie by far.  
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Novembride. Show Novembride's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    In Response to Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination:
    50/50 -- you have to get the unreconstituted apple cider vinager -- you can get it at trader joes or whole foods -- just mix it half and half with water in a spray bottle and there you go -- i've had it out at cookouts at my house (i live on a small salt marsh) and everyone was putting it on and said it worked
    Posted by lukeseri58


    Awesome.  Thanks.  I'll be a hero around the campfire this summer if this really keeps the mosquitos away, too. 
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from ruthcatrin. Show ruthcatrin's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    Speaking of keeping away Ticks and such, does anyone have any experience with the flea/tick/heartworm preventitive Revolution?
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    Never heard of Revolution; is your vet recommending it?

    Gracie is not enjoying her garlic laced food, but she does eat it after about 10 minutes of sniffing and walking away.  I'll get the tablets next time.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from ruthcatrin. Show ruthcatrin's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    In Response to Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination:
    Never heard of Revolution; is your vet recommending it? Gracie is not enjoying her garlic laced food, but she does eat it after about 10 minutes of sniffing and walking away.  I'll get the tablets next time.
    Posted by kargiver

    My sister-in-law uses it on her German Shepherd actually.  Has for a few years and not had any problems with it. I like the concept of not having to do two medications and we have a pretty severe misquito problem so heartworm is something I have to think about.  I was looking into the info on it, and even collies who otherwise often have trouble with some of those meds didn't seem to react to it.

    I already left a message for my vet asking if it would be a viable alternative in their opinion, but I thought I'd see if anyone else had experience with it.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from ruthcatrin. Show ruthcatrin's posts

    Re: Lyme Disease and Vaccination

    The problem I'm having is my puppy is a Tibetan Mastiff, which is an uncommon enough breed that none of these studies included them.  The breeder I got him from uses a combination of Preventix (I think I spelled that right) collars, with treating the property with diatomacious earth to keep ticks at bay, and wasn't familer with Revolution either.  Now I am going to treat the dog run and general surrounding areas with diatomacios earth myself (food grade is actually generally inexpensive on Amazon) as soon as it stops raining every other day, but I'm struggling to make up my mind on the rest of the treatment plan I want to use.
     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share