Facebook Nonsense

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Facebook Nonsense

    I asked this guy to friend me on fb a year or so back, because I learned that,through the friend of a real-life friend, the guy is creative in a way that I am. I wanted to read and see his work, which is off-limits unless you're his fb or r/l friend. He responds to my posts and my creative work, too. He's more gifted than I could ever hope to be.

    The past week or so we've been flirting like mad, then, last Wednesday, texted literally all day to each other. It turns out we have so many commonalities beyond our art form. He's also safe and sane, and has quite the following in his area of the country (about half a day's drive from me, maybe 12 hours). We decide to call each other over the weekend, and in the meantime, he and I are both posting about how intriguing we find each other. He's so bright, though - how could I ever keep up with him?

    We finally have our phone chat, planned for last weekend.

    Within 30 minutes, I could tell he was "not that into me." To begin with, the conversation was fairly-much all one way. As a former newspaper reporter (me), I felt like I was interviewing an artists for a feature story, not chatting with a potential romance! He asked me almost nothing about myself - which I thought was odd for such a charismatic man. When I flirted with him, he seemed uneasy - even though he flirted madly with me online! I had been, and remain, so taken with him.

    He tells me how pretty my voice is (I happen to like that compliment, from anyone), and that he'll be doing a demo of his craft in Boston in the fall. I'll be there, I say, but even though he has to pay for his own hotel bill (his manager won't cover it), I'm too stupid to offer him and his manager my place for resting their weary bones (he's driving and doing the demo on the same day/evening).

    We talk for like 2 hours, then he has to take a call from overseas (mid-morning there - another reason I was attracted to him was that he has cousins in London; I have extended family near Bath). He asks if he can call me again sometime (his word- sometime), and I of course say yes.

    He writes a thank you to me for the conversation, delighted with our friendship, and how he's so into me. I write back a little more amorously, thanking him, then wishing him sweet dreams.

    Then - nothing.

    I feared I had overstepped, so I apologized for being so forward. What I can, chat board folks? I'm affectionate. He says there's nothing for which to apologize, we're friends, and he wants to know what I'm thinking.

    That was a couple of days ago. Now I feel bereft. He contacts me in a limited way (liking my fb posts, but not commenting); no more emails, no more flirting.

    You know, prolly wishful thinking on my part, but last week I really felt that this man and I could pull something together. I can't think of what I could possibly have said to have turned him off. But I won't bug him, I won't nudge him. But it seems that circumstances dicate that while I can still admire him, it must be from a distance.

    Your thoughts on what I did wrong?



     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    Hey, rdg, sorry you are tormenting yourself, but I'm fairly certain you didn't do anything wrong.  If he talked with you 2 hours on the phone (a marathon for any man), he's into you.  Not to mention the flirting. 

    There could be any number of non-rdg related reasons he's backing off a bit, now.  Maybe he's had a habit of falling to far too fast and has resolved to tap the brakes a bit, for instance.  Going through 100s of what-ifs is not productive, but that's the first one that comes to mind.

    Be patient (resist the urge to ping, ping, ping him) and see where it goes.  It's too early to tell if that's nowhere.  Let him toss the ball to you; it's in his court. :)

    Best,
    ~kar
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    I agree with you, kar. He does keep "poking" me - including while I was out getting pizza a few minutes ago. So, I'll take your advice, and not poke him for a while.

    OK, I'll be patient :) Thank you.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from plasko. Show plasko's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    There is only so much you can do from a distance. No man could keep that momentum up on the phone and internet until the fall. Especially with a big show to get ready for.
    You will just have to wait until you meet for real and see where the wind takes you both. 
    He will become more active regarding you as the time draws closer.
    Patience and anticipation are great things sometimes. Although your imagination might be putting him on a high pedestal. 

    Good luck.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    Letting him do the chasing is a tried and true method to bag a guy.  Yes, I know I'm old fashioned in just about every way, but, hey, men and women are wired the way they are wired, and being chased (not the chaser) has worked for women since the beginning of time for a reason.  Women today are encouraged, nay, expected to ditch that model, but imo for you to do that will be to the peril of what could have been a worthwhile relationship.  Sounds like you have a lot going here for a special relationship to develop which is why, I understand, you are eager.  Just take a few deep breaths and enjoy the journey.

    I'm not saying play "hard to get" or any other game, of course (not that you thought that).  Just reign in the temptation to constantly find out if the relationship is going anywhere, if he's as interested in you as you are in him, etc.  He'll let you know, I can sense it - he already is, isn't he?  

    The key is behaving like your natural self when you communicate with him.  If you want to contact him, have a real reason and thing to talk about like you do with everyone else before initiating any kind of contact.  Respond naturally if he contacts you.  If you find yourself considering acting purely out of anxiety about the potential relationship, that's a clue you need to calm down and think about reigning it in and putting the phone down.

    You can do it - you're worth it, and he knows it.  Let him come to you.
    ~kar

    P.S.  plasko is 100% right about anticipation.  Don't take that away from him by not allowing his anticipation (about your next conversation, meeting, whatever) to build.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from bzorn22. Show bzorn22's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    You know, prolly wishful thinking on my part, but last week I really felt that this man and I could
     pull something together. I can't think of what I could possibly have said to have turned him off

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    There is absolutely nothing wrong with your behavior and certainly nothing wrong with you. Not all artistic people are actually affectionate. The kind of man you would want to be with is probably affectionate. This guy isn't. His loss. And no you shouldn't have opened up your home to him and his manager. You do not know either of them and you have a fawn there. You're all good.


     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from RogerTaylor. Show RogerTaylor's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    Ahhh, it's like "cold calling" in sales. 

    Your goal isn't to talk to the prospect for 2hrs on the phone, it's to make an appointment to get in front of them.

    Why you ask?

    Body language is 60% of a conversation! and it's 10 times harder/less likely to hear "No!"

    You did nothing "wrong" - per se - but without the "intimacy" of sitting across the table from each other where he can see your, smile, dimples, legs, etc....You made it too easy for him to walk away based on e-mail and texts (could it be any less intimate?)

    First 15 to 30 minutes into your conversation with this guy - "Hey let's meet for ----- at ------ am/pm!

    Don't beat yourself up! 

    I'm certain there will be other men in your life!  ;)
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    Via one of the blogs CHC reads, I found this link:

    http://www.baggagereclaim.co.uk/letting-go-of-a-relationshipthat-doesnt-exist/


    As the Deirdre Brandon song goes:

    "One more time for the time that you're giving/
    Why not come on back to the land of the living?"
    -- (1992, Deirdre Brandon, "Song for Papa")
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    "Although your imagination might be putting him on a high pedestal."

    True that, Plasko! I tend to that anyway.

    Also, after hearing about his family life, and after he heard about mine, well, I might be more of nester than he desires. After a few marriages and one child whom he rarely saw until that child was in her 20s, he could go either way with a fawn still at home. Because he does art here, art there, art all over the country, could be he likes the freedom of traveling w/out children to worry about. (My conjecture here - I can't know until I ask him.)

    I do feel he's far ahead of me in his craft (having to feed and house only himself also gives an artist space for that, while I was teaching and unable to give my craft the attention it needed for many years; could be also that he's just more talented that I am). He's also gifted with words - so much so that I invited him to my online poetry workshop as a worthy contributed. A reindeergirl SWOONS over words.

    He's a hs dropout but an autodidact and a polymath. Faulker wrote about polymaths (Miss Rosa was one). What's not to love about them?

    For the past 14 years (fawn's birthday was last week) my life has been about being a mother and a sometimes-artist. For work, I tutor foreign languages, and do free-lance proofreading and copy-editing. This gives me low pay, but mother's hours. Now that she's a year away from h.s., I have more time to focus on my other needs - and less, perhaps, on pedestaling others.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    "Be patient (resist the urge to ping, ping, ping him)"

    And to think, kar, I was dragged kicking and screaming on to fb (and into the 21st century Cool).

    I'll reply to Roger and bzorn in a bit. The two of you took the time and care to post, so I want to respect that and respond.

    Rest assured, all four of you have made me all warm and fuzzy!
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from 2ada63d622e89774a9fdcbc90527ab8e. Show 2ada63d622e89774a9fdcbc90527ab8e's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    I don't see that you did anything wrong or scared him off. I agree wholeheartedly with Bzorn that not inviting him to stay over was a good decision. Go to the demo in the fall to meet him in person. This is going to sound old-fashioned, but, like Kar, I think it's OK to let him lead for a while. Stay cool. Reply to his posts. "Like" the work he posts. Leave some space for him to approach you. My young cousin is married to a man she conversed with in an online community for over a year, nothing romantic, just common interests. He eventually posted that he was visiting her city and she offered to pick him up at the airport, nothing further than that, no flirting, no lodging offered. They hit it off in person even better than they had online. You sound plenty bright to me, so don't worry about not being smart enough. However, you picked up a vibe that he might be really self-centered, so don't get your hopes up too high.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from -Cariokie. Show -Cariokie's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    Oh RDG, how I have walked in your shoes. 

    Men are such wonderful flirts online, on FB and on instant messaging boards. It's easy, there's a give and take etiquette that almost everyone gets, but phone conversations are far more real--- there's a voice at the other end of the phone and cleverness and flirting aren't as simple...nuances occur and it's actually a real life human thing. I'm sure you knew that, but I'll use Dave as an example. First date was great... enough wine and a comfortable setting for us both to be comfortable. Second date (36 hours) was like a 180...

    We were on his territory, and all he did was chat about his accomplishments with Disney, the platinum AMEX he had where he dropped $750k on a project, etc, etc. Basically, it was look at how great I am and we talked about me precious little. It was mildly off-putting, but I realized that he was doing his best to try and impress me. He was probably nervous too, since it was just us for a day and a half. Maybe in time, if we get to know each other better, he won't feel the need to do that. I like him for who he is, just Dave, not the big shot with a famous astronaut as his best buddy, neighbor and business partner.

    The other thing that is frustrating is that he's a workaholic and I haven't seen him since Disney. We have short phone chats, but because of his wacky schedule, I'm not sure when we'll see each other again. It's kind of like a LDR, but only 45 miles.

    Only thing I can think of which might have been a bit intense was the 'sweet dreams' ending. At least for me, that's a more intimate than he was ready for. I agree with GMV--- stay cool, reply to his posts and give him space to pursue you a bit and let his nervousness calm a bit. One day at a time....

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    Just because you perceive he's a more accomplished artist than you are should not influence how you view his character.  Be careful to draw the distinction between the artist and the overall man as you proceed, not blinded by how great an artist he is.  Art is art, decency is decency, and they are not synonymous...careful.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from RogerTaylor. Show RogerTaylor's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    The web - facebook, Skype, e-mail, tweets, text, IM's give us - "beer muscles!"

    Think about it, we can say and do anything when we are not face to face. What are the consequences? You don't reply? Ouch!

    Friendships exist based on face to face contact and "physical" interaction - going to the movies, lunch, dinner, dance, hunting, fishing, playing cards, etc.

    What does being "friended" on facebook really mean? You know each other? Wow! sign me up - lol

    reindeergirl go for the "real" friendship, not the cyber!

    Close the sale!
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    In Response to Re: Facebook Nonsense:
    [QUOTE]Letting him do the chasing is a tried and true method to bag a guy.  Yes, I know I'm old fashioned in just about every way, but, hey, men and women are wired the way they are wired, and being chased (not the chaser) has worked for women since the beginning of time for a reason.[/quote]
     
    Except for poking me (I haven't poked back since you first posted, above), he hasn't "liked" any of my posts today - and they're good ones, if I do say so myself. He is spending all day posting his own days - links to this, and links to that. All of them very interesting to me, so it's all I can do not to press that "like" button. He seems to have quite the fan club, though! I wish I did!

    [quote]Women today are encouraged, nay, expected to ditch that model, but imo for you to do that will be to the peril of what could have been a worthwhile relationship.[/quote]

    I just told some married guy to buzz off, and he's still chasing the wimmenz. I wish the philanderers would leave me alone - I'm not interested in married men!

    My therapist feels "my" guy is a hunter, but a peculiar sort. He's not hunting for sustenance (ie, over), but for the thrill of the chase. Once he has his prey, he
    s done.


    [quote]Sounds like you have a lot going here for a special relationship to develop which is why, I understand, you are eager.  Just take a few deep breaths and enjoy the journey. I'm not saying play "hard to get" or any other game, of course (not that you thought that).  Just reign in the temptation to constantly find out if the relationship is going anywhere, if he's as interested in you as you are in him, etc.  He'll let you know, I can sense it - he already is, isn't he?[/quote]

    I hope so. I *do* like him, but I'll do it by way of giving him space, as you reco'd.


     [quote]The key is behaving like your natural self when you communicate with him.  If you want to contact him, have a real reason and thing to talk about like you do with everyone else before initiating any kind of contact.  Respond naturally if he contacts you.  If you find yourself considering acting purely out of anxiety about the potential relationship , that's a clue you need to calm down and think about reigning it in and putting the phone down. You can do it - you're worth it, and he knows it.  Let him come to you. ~kar P.S.  plasko is 100% right about anticipation.  Don't take that away from him by not allowing his anticipation (about your next conversation, meeting, whatever) to build.
    Posted by kargiver[/QUOTE]

    You are *so* good, kar! Are you sure you're an engineer, and not a therapist? I've said it before - you have such insight (and you give it with kindness).

    I'm glad for fb in that it's helped me reconnect with old friends, including two of my nearest and dearest. But I s*ck in the romance dept in general, and online I make it worse!
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    There is absolutely nothing wrong with your behavior and certainly nothing wrong with you. Not all artistic people are actually affectionate. The kind of man you would want to be with is probably affectionate. This guy isn't. His loss. And no you shouldn't have opened up your home to him and his manager. You do not know either of them and you have a fawn there. You're all good.
    ----

    Thanks, bzorn. You're right about the fawn. I just felt so guilty that a fellow artist has to pay for housing in a city where he knows no-one, when I'm right here.

    I'm sure the fawn, though, now a full-fledge teenager and very wary of her privacy, would kill me.Wink
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    You did nothing "wrong" - per se - but without the "intimacy" of sitting across the table from each other where he can see your, smile, dimples, legs, etc....You made it too easy for him to walk away based on e-mail and texts (could it be any less intimate?)

    Nope. The pitfall of Web chat. No coffee and eye contact to linger over.

    First 15 to 30 minutes into your conversation with this guy - "Hey let's meet for ----- at ------ am/pm!

    Ah, RogerTaylor, I would have asked, if but for the three-state distance. When I can, I travel for a three-day weekend or so for museum openings, etc. Maybe there will be one half-way between us. If we continue as friends, though, I will ask him to meet me for coffee the day after his demo (if he has time, before he has to drive home).

    Thanks for the vote of confidence. Smile
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    GMV,

    Thank you for your cousin's lovely story. What a wonderfully-organic way for a relationship to evolve!
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    Just because you perceive he's a more accomplished artist than you are should not influence how you view his character. Be careful to draw the distinction between the artist and the overall man as you proceed, not blinded by how great an artist he is. Art is art, decency is decency, and they are not synonymous...careful.
    ----

    I know, I know! I know plenty of self-absorbed people in the arts (and plenty of wonderful ones too - but I know that the arts do not confer sacred status on someone along, unless his named happened to be Apollo, or Orpheus!)                     
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    reindeergirl go for the "real" friendship, not the cyber!
    ----

    RogerTaylor,

    I have a (now-deceased - RIP, ND) friend who always told folks, "Nothing is real until you meet." He did lots in Internet dating, but had the presence of mind (that I don't have) not to get his hopes up until that moment when he was showering, shaving, picking out a nice shirt - in short, preparing for the first date with someone.

    I'm a hopeless romantic, alas. A cynic; a woman with a sardonic humor; and someone with strident political views - for a hopeless romantic nonetheless.

    "What does being "friended" on facebook really mean? You know each other? Wow! sign me up - lol"

    Ha ha! Funny, because "our" Xenophonic (b.com) told me just yesterday that he won't friend anyone but his family, and he finds fb a total waste of time. (Yeah, I know - I myself to a crazed amount of posting on b.com - one self-employed woman's exuse.)

    However, I have projects I'm involved in there (real-life projects, that are discussed on fb amongst some groups). I wish they'd migrate elsewhere, like just to email.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    Body language is 60% of a conversation! and it's 10 times harder/less likely to hear "No!"
    ----

    Plus, RogerTaylor, no awkward silences when you're out with someone for coffee and dessert. You can always break the silence by saying something mild/bland, like "These pretzels are good!" (c. Elaine Benes/ Seinfeld)
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    Hi Cari!

    Sorry about the limitations with your Dave. (His work.) Yeah, 45 might not seem like much, I know. I had a Mississippi - Massachusetts relationship. We saw each otgher every three weeks for long weekends (taking turns and using up our frequent miles). Yet, I saw him more frequently than I did some people who live just on the other side of Boston from me.

    This guy, too, talks so much about himself - but it might be a shyness thing. Or perhaps he was just trying to come up with topics that interested me (we both love old houses and birds, for example).

    People say, Cari, that dating is easier with the Web. My BFF says you can't date these days without it. I would say that for certain people, with certain interests, that's true. But I was surely a lot less stressed without it, lol. (Even if I did go for longer periods without dating.)

    Thank you for your perspective Cari - always welcomed.

    I may also be feeling a little down about this because I'm just flat out exhausted after having half a dozen teens here over the weekend. I wanted the fawn to have a special b-day, especially this year, given the trauma we're enduring right now. But I'm tired. And the next big party - Sweet 16. Next year will be a lovely dinner with her best friend, her uncle/godfather, me, and my brother (if he's resurfaced by that time).

    Thank you, everybody. I am truly grateful for your special POVs, and your willingness to write about them.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Elekktra. Show Elekktra's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    There's no way to know if you you said or wrote anything "wrong," rdg. I do think your imaginings of the future are in overdrive and may need some reigning in  :-)

    That said, his phone conversing talent is probably no match for his communicating through his art talent  It's also possible you pre-romanticized a set of expectations and that he actually met them  -- just not with the exact words you pre-scripted in your mind.  Am I making any sense?

    Advice you didn't ask for: 

    Don't give your not offering your home to him (them) a second thought. He's a grown-up and a professional after all; hotel expenses go with the territory.  Do offer to free up enough of your time to accompany him to a specific cultural event/exhibit of mutual interest.  But that's all. Let him take it from there. 

    Embrace the journey. 

    My Aunt Marian was right. Never try to discuss marriage with a musician.  --Lucy Van Pelt

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from reindeergirl. Show reindeergirl's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    Hi Elekktra,

    Thank you for responding.

    I'm half-tempted to copy our emails on to this forum, but I have a thing about that. I can't do it to him - nor to anyone else. He was all lovey-dovey though, over a series of a week. Then I went back and looked at the pics I posted a year and a half ago, and he was so complimentary there (I hadn't seen the posts back then; didn't look for them.) If I reproduced the emails, though, people would see that he seemed to be courting me (and I, him).

    Heck, I was out and out flattered.

    Late last night I learned from his page that he has been working intensely to finish up a piece that he's been working on for commission, and preparing to start another commissioned piece. So, like so many of us in a variety of professions, he's under deadline pressure (him, from a private buyer).

    I know that not every man is right for every woman. I just don't understand the radio silence (except for the fb "poking'). That's what has me confused. Especially since he's responding to his scores of fans fawning (not my fawn) over his most recent accomplishment. He *is* talented. But all those hearts and "ooh, I have to meet you" and all that cooing .... . He's not courting attention (at least, not that I know of), but I certainly couldn't compere with all that, nor would I want to do so. I have a quiet life; for now, I like it that it that. When the fawn goes off to college, I'll start over. But his equanimity also I find appealing.

    Maybe it's just his style. after a lengthy phone call. I'm more used to the guys who, when they dig you, have those phone calls for a week all at once - and then invite you to come visit if they live far away, or for dinner if they live close by.

    I'll give it time. His autumn show is more than a month away. He can write his hotel bill off his taxes (as his art gallery dealer-agent should be doing for him anyway). The fawn, as bzorn suggests, needs and deserves her privacy - we will in a small place.

    Perhaps if the married guy from the past hadn't been trying with me again, I wouldn't be so rattled. But he got the last word - so what, right? He got the last word in, but he didn't get me.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Facebook Nonsense

    In Response to Re: Facebook Nonsense:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Facebook Nonsense : You are *so* good, kar! Are you sure you're an engineer, and not a therapist? I've said it before - you have such insight (and you give it with kindness). I'm glad for fb in that it's helped me reconnect with old friends, including two of my nearest and dearest. But I s*ck in the romance dept in general, and online I make it worse!
    Posted by reindeergirl[/QUOTE]

    You're so kind to say those things, rdg, I really appreciate it.  No, I swear I'm not a closet therapist, just someone who's made a LOT of mistakes herself and fancies herself to have learned something from them worth sharing.

    By saying the man should do the chasing, I definitely didn't mean married men.  They already have their prize.

    Your guy might be a little self absorbed or maybe he's not good at "liking" things in a balanced fashion.  I think the only way to tell anything about where you'd like this relationship to go is to encourage the offline, r/l thing while essentially forgetting about the online back and forth game, "I 'liked' his post this morning about xyz, but he didn't 'like' my clever comment about..." - a fruitless waste of emotional effort imo that will only serve to frustrate you, cause baseless resentment with the guy right off the bat, and might doom the relationship before it begins in r/l.

    ETA:  Regarding offering your home to him or any other gesture that far exceeds the boundaries of your current relationship?  Ugh, absolutely not.  It wouldn't be a nice thing to do, it would be a disaster for both of you.  As another poster noted, he's an adult, and that means fending for yourself.  It could mean leaning on your friends now and again, too, but you do not qualify as that yet, and forcing a relationship by jumping that gun ALWAYS fails. 

    You can trust me on that or we can discuss it further offline, kargiverbdc at gmail.

    ("These pretzels are making me thirsty!" - great episode!  LOVE that SHOW!!!)

    P.S.  I love letting a scum bag get the last word with me, actually.  I know they are hoping for and expecting another chance to respond negatively to me that never comes.

     

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