Rising costs at Newton's school

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonDotCom. Show BostonDotCom's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    The tensions emerging from the rising costs of building the state's most expensive school ever in Newton were reported in today's Boston Globe.

    What do you think of the proposed school? Is a showplace school that reflects well on a community worth the price?

  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from timmah. Show timmah's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    what a joke. I graduated from this school 20 years ago. They should have just updated what they had. This school was big enough to educate the students, just needed some improvements. Fancy schools don't necessarily equal a better education. Will the city have $ left for books and other supplies :) How about paying for teachers? :) I am so glad I moved away from this crazy city. Residents will be paying for this FOREVER, and even if the mayor is telling them the override isn' t for the school, perhaps if there were a hundred million dollars floating around in the city budget they wouldn't need an override to pay for other city services. And, for those of you unfamiliar with Newton, North is one of two public highschools in the city-South will probably need a 165M+ update soon, too.

    As for the restaurant???? They could have walked to Newtonville like we did at hit any of the little places down there. Looks like kids will need more lunch money.

    If only we all had so much money to burn during a RECESSION!!

  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from gimmeedaball. Show gimmeedaball's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    Hold up people, there are a lot of problems with this projects but the restaurant is not one of them. NNHS still has a successful Tech Voc program, of which culinary arts is a part of. The restaurant is a learning environment for many kids who don't fit the traditional student profile. I also went to NNHS 20 years ago and still live in the same district. Believe me, we're having a hard time choking this one down...

  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from jssssb1. Show jssssb1's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    Big Dig only on smaller scale. Unions and contractors produce shoddy work that requires work changes that are expensive. Town officials are totally clueless about finance and estimation. And hacks are trying to build utopia when modesty is more than adequate. Kids are going to school to learn, not be pampered. This is just another example why this state is heading to oblivion. To many hacks kissing up to unions, multi-cultural liberal idealist BS, and spending money as if it is endless.

  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from meffaman. Show meffaman's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    Wow! I'm so glad I don't live there. I have family there though and I can tell you they're not happy about this at all. Their property taxes are already out of control, and now they're looking at more? You gotta be kidding me. This isn't Beverly Hills folks. Get a grip Newton, you don't need to build the Taj in order to give your kids a good education.
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from mygirlrosie. Show mygirlrosie's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    The high school my daughter attends is at risk of losing its accreditation because of a crumbling building and we haven't been able to get any money, state or otherwise, for years. So, sure, by all means, give them more money while kids in less affluent towns do their chem labs in the hallways because there aren't enough power outlets in the classroom. Or sit on the floor and use their chairs as a desk because there just aren't enough to go around. Are they kidding me? A student restaurant? We'd be so happy to have fraction of what they're spending in Newton. At least then we'd have desks.
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from bosstang. Show bosstang's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    Not only is the price so far out of norm, they are building it because they did not properly maintain the 34 year old building they had. I am for new schools with appropriate community and student enrichment activities but not for a city or town that does not maintain it. School buildings that are paid for at any % with State Aid should come under the control of a seperate authority for maintenance not the any school department.

    Certainly they do a great job educating our children, no doubt about that, but building maintenance is a joke in every community.

    I am waiting for the state to prove it is not only going to stretch a buck to get the best building but when they get it they are going to take care of it in the same way we take care of our homes. That's when State govenment will prove they are working in all of our best interest. In the mean time let Newton pay for their mistakes and pay for there building themselves. Let them have a pool and a resteraunt if they want to pay for it after all it is there community. I do oppose spending a single dime to replace a building that a community could not take care of. For Newton if they don't like it then fire the administration that wasted a 34 year old building and the group that wants to spend 186 Million more and get a building they can afford and will be able to maintain.

  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from merlinmurph. Show merlinmurph's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    It truly amazes me how much emphasis parents place on building shrines for their kid's education. Nothing but the best, no expense spared. The design and architectural fees are exorbitant enough - then you have to build it. Show me a public building project that doesn't have its share of shoddy work and poor construction that is a result of poor management, indifference, and irresponsibility. There is simply no accountability when it comes to building these things.

    Look, it's a classroom. Your kid goes in, spends time in a class, then leaves and goes to another classroom. In addition to classrooms, throw in a few amenities like auditoriums, gymnasium, and a cafeteria, and that's it. Quite simple, really. But nooooooooo, everything has to be the best.

    When it comes to classrooms, even the best colleges in the world are pretty spartan. You have a room, some chairs and a desk for the instructor. My college 30 years ago had old wooden chairs with a small platform built-in to write on a notebook (oddly, all right-handed). 30 years later, I bet they have those same chairs. You know why? Because that's all you need.

    OK, parents you have a choice. Spend your money on a big ol' shrine, or spend your money where it counts - on good teachers and educational programs. Either one or the other. But, if you build the shrine, don't come running back a few years later crying that we need a tax hike to support the shrine, or teachers will have to be laid off. Sorry, no tax hike, you made your choice.

  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ppag. Show ppag's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    The cost of the new school in Newton is less that the cost of one day on the Iraq wat (270 million/day) so whos priorities are messed up?
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from ppag. Show ppag's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    That would be 'of the Iraq war'
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from estavo. Show estavo's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    Just wow. Couldn't the schools in places like Somerville, Springfield, Billerica, Lowell, Brockton, or Fall River use just a couple of these millions to do so much more? Local funding of schools based on property taxes (and police, fire, and highway departments, etc.) is an incredibly stupid holdover from Colonial times whose time has long since come and gone. Statewide or regional management of these services would make so much more sense (and would save loads of money due to the efficiencies associated with combined management) and would likely make it harder to wind up with "rich get richer" results like this "Taj Mahal" high school in Newton.

  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from punkrawk. Show punkrawk's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    My high school was built in 1850 and it's still in use... and one of the top schools in the country. It drives me nuts that people think a public building should only last 30 years these days.
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from chuckufarley. Show chuckufarley's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    With all these office parks around with empty buildings...how about a town LEASING TO OWN one of these facilies which were vacated for cheap labor down south.

    I'm sure it's far cheaper, basic structure, wiring, plumbing HVAC is there, throw up some partitions..."cubicle classrooms"

  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from jwb22. Show jwb22's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    The state has given money for many different school projects over the years. For both poor and affluent towns.

    recent example: the new middle school in Melrose

  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from archi.tect. Show archi.tect's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    The ultimate irony of this run-away-cost of the project: it's not even a good building architecturally, academically and environmentally. It is smaller than the existing one: 4000,000 sf versus 470,000 sf , but the longer, zig-zagging footprint is sitting over all the trouble spots in the ground. We all are paying for this monumental stupidity, the city of Newton and the state of Massachusetts. And in addition, the mayor proposed the $25 million override to cover his lack of managerial skills. Welcome to the Garden City!
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from pmassari. Show pmassari's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    $46M in state assistance for one of the most affluent towns in MA? That's more than the entire school budget of my hometown of Salem, where we just laid off a bunch of teachers because of a budget crunch, and hiked taxes 5%.

    Roads and bridges are a disaster. The T is in slow motion collapse. We don't know how we're going to fund healthcare reform. The good folks of Newton want to build the Taj of high schools, good for them. But they shouldn't get my tax dollars to do it.

  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from merlinmurph. Show merlinmurph's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    ppag, you're bringing up something that is totally irrelevant to the conversation - it's apples and oranges. The people of Newton have no control over Iraq, but they do have direct control over their own town's decisions, and that's what we're talking about. How about staying on topic?
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from trottier. Show trottier's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    I am wondering, is the city of newton, and its citizens, trying for some kind of record? is that some kind os status symbol?welcome to Newton, home of the most expensive school in history,I am sure, the ammount right now, will climb, has anyone ever built a quarter of a billon dollar high school? In my teen days we had a saying , we use to use, to describe less than intelligent people, Gee the guys a regular Fig Newton.

  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from myron1958. Show myron1958's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    We had a situation in Everett a few years back, when a "neighborhood coalition" sued to prevent the new HIgh School from being built. This delayed the project by 2 years and increased the cost significantly. What did the city do? They sucked it up and paid the increase but also cut back on some of the ammenities to control costs. Maybe the Newton school needs a resturant for the culinary program but a pool? Maybe the gym, or the auditirium could be down sized. In the face of rising costs maybe they should cut back instead of getting all the bells and whistles they wish for

    Remember the old saying "The Taj Mahal was a garden shack designed by a commitee"

  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from 42Giants. Show 42Giants's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    "If no state money from other than Newton residents is in this then its o.k. "

    There is state money going to the new school.

    And not only that, the city has to get an override passed for an additional 25 Million so that other schools in the city can be maintained.

    If they didn't have such an elaborate high school, there would be plenty of money available for the other schools.

    While all of this is going on, you have cities and towns that cannot get updates to their school buildings due to state cut backs. Our high school needs a new roof but the town can't afford it. The state is not giving us assistance.

    Maybe I'll send my children to this new high school since altough I don't live there, I did end up paying for it.

  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from hqmhqm. Show hqmhqm's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    Everyone keeps throwing around the number $150 million like it's astronomical. The price of each home surrounding the new high school is over a million dollars. Things cost a lot today, and are only getting more expensive. Just two years ago, a thousand rounds of new .223 ammunition cost $180, today it costs $400. Have you tried to buy copper wire lately? Every day we wait, the price of construction will go up. The high school would have been built already if it wasn't for the whining selfish people who have delayed it for literally years. The price of metals and other materials used in construction has shot up. Newton just spent $1million on road clearing in the last two storms.

    I actually think the name brand architect was a mistake, and the building design looks like it is already dated, but I can only hope they don't make the same mistakes they made when they built the current high school.

    Our public library in Newton is terrific, a beautiful and functional building. I wish we had just made a copy of it to use as the high school. People whined about the cost of the library too, but it is a central part of Newton life, and enriches everyone in many ways.

    Education is
    perhaps the most important investment we can make. For people who don't have kids, and think they shouldn't have to pay for the schools, that is a creepy attitude. Why bother living in a community if you
    have nothing to contribute to it?

  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from boston123. Show boston123's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    Liberal elites at their finiest.

    What a total waste of taxpayer money.........A restaurant? 186 Million? Is this a top tier private college or a public high school? Runaway spending and keeping up with the joneses 101.

  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from sfarren. Show sfarren's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    Citizens should be more concerned that the high cost is a result of the state mandating that we have to pay union/prevailing wages. Laborers alone are paid over $40 an hour, carpenters, bricklayers, etc. probably ore like $60-$70. The price tag would be half that much for open-shop wages and we could probably afford to build better schools in more depressed areas.

    The Big Dig could have been done in half the time for half the cost and been better quality work if this state didn't mandate unions for public work.

  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from FCivian. Show FCivian's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    Wow . . looks like the passion is getting WAY ahead of the facts here.

    1 - State funds: when we built a new middle school in Dedham the state paid for th basics and Dedham taxpayers - if they choose to do so - paid for extras above the basics . . example for us was a gym big enough for 2 full basketball games, one with spectators . . the same state rules apply to Newton . . as one poster said, the state is paying for $46 million and Newton taxpayers the rest . . that means that we state taxpayers are NOT paying for what you all those Newtonian extras

    2 - frills: in Dedham we send kids who want to learn trades to the voc schools . . Newton keep sthma at tehir hihg schools . . so their schools have kitchens, shops, etc., that a lot of other high schools don't have . . and those things - like the student run restaurant - are built as classrooms for kids who want to learn trades . . . college isn't for everyone, even in Newton**

    3 - democracy: if Newton citizens vote to tax themselves for a school that in YOUR community would be too much, that's OK . . that's the way democracy works . .in Dedham we concentrated on the basisc because we knew Dedham taxpayers would pay for little more than the basics

    4 - replace or rebuild: the generic problem with rebuilding is that - same as with a house - once you rebuild over a certain amount state codes require that the entire building be brought up to current codes . . . that adds significant costs to rebuild over and above the costs of the rebuild alone . . in Dedham it was CHEAPER to build a new middle school than it would have been to rebuild

    5 - construction costs: here's hwo it works: schoosl are legally required to award to the qualified bidder with the lowest bid . . these companies then find legal ways to add costs . . our final cost for the low bidder were - surprise surprise - about the same as the next highest company . . . this has little to do with unions and more to do with preventing public managers from picking their favorites instead of the best qualified

    ** But I still want the right to swim in that luscious poll!

  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from sparky. Show sparky's posts

    Rising costs at Newton's school

    I hardly think unions are the biggest problem. Should illiterates hanging out at the 7-11 be hired instead?