WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

      FROM GROUND ZERO ........  HAVE WE GONE "SOFT" OR JUST PLAIN "STUPID" ?????    WAKE UP AMERICA !!!!    WHAT SAY YOU ?????
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

       NO RESPONSE ????  I GUESS IT MUST BE O K......  NO BIG DEAL, I GUESS !!!!!
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from JaySev2010. Show JaySev2010's posts

    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    Since when do we prevent people from constructing religious structures? It is a free country, and freedom of religion is part of that. If you don't like people building a mosque in NY, then you should move to Denmark or Switzerland.
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    Since when do we prevent people from constructing religious structures? It is a free country, and freedom of religion is part of that. If you don't like people building a mosque in NY, then you should move to Denmark or Switzerland.
    Posted by JaySev2010
    SINCE THAT RADICAL GROUP/RELIGION  KILLED  3000+ PEOPLE TWO (2) BLOCKS AWAY.........  BUT THE LIBERALS SEE NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT ???  NOT TILL THEY TAKE DOWN A PLANE OR BUILDING WITH THEIR WIFE OR FAMILY ON BOARD.... EVEN THEN, YOU/THEM  WOULD MISS THE POINT !!!!!!
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ : SINCE THAT RADICAL GROUP/RELIGION  KILLED  3000+ PEOPLE TWO (2) BLOCKS AWAY.........  BUT THE LIBERALS SEE NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT ???  NOT TILL THEY TAKE DOWN A PLANE OR BUILDING WITH THEIR WIFE OR FAMILY ON BOARD.... EVEN THEN, YOU/THEM  WOULD MISS THE POINT !!!!!!
    Posted by Bill-806


    You are a moron.

    And a Christian Patriot killed people in down down Oklahoma City; should we ban the building of churches there?
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ : You are a moron. And a Christian Patriot killed people in down down Oklahoma City; should we ban the building of churches there?
    Posted by JaySev2010
       HE WAS NOT A CHRISTIAN PATRIOT IN MY EYES....... A "NUT CASE", YES... PATRIOT NO, AND IM NOT SURE THE U S GOV GOT TO THE BOTTOM OF THAT EITHER.......  NOW THEN,  "MORON" IS SO CHILDISH AND LIBERAL, I WOULD RATHER THAT WE ALL BE ALLOWED TO JUST SHARE OPINIONS ON THIS BOARD........  IN THE TUNE OF  FUN, FUN, FUN, TILL THE "BIG O" TAKES THE BOARD AWAY !!!!  
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ :    HE WAS NOT A CHRISTIAN PATRIOT IN MY EYES....... A "NUT CASE", YES... PATRIOT NO, AND IM NOT SURE THE U S GOV GOT TO THE BOTTOM OF THAT EITHER.......  NOW THEN,  "MORON" IS SO CHILDISH AND LIBERAL, I WOULD RATHER THAT WE ALL BE ALLOWED TO JUST SHARE OPINIONS ON THIS BOARD........  IN THE TUNE OF  FUN, FUN, FUN, TILL THE "BIG O" TAKES THE BOARD AWAY !!!!  
    Posted by Bill-806


    Now you are playing with words. In the eyes of many Muslims Osama bin Laden isn't a true muslim...doesn't matter.

    Just so you realize, Christian Patriot is a specific extremist ideology, that blends elements of racism, religion, patriotism and militia activity together. Just as the Salafi Jihadist groups are an offshoot of Islam, Christian Patriot ideology is an offshoot of christianity. It is a real threat, that has killed hundreds of people in the US. My point wasn't to demonize Chistianity, but to show that you can't blame all religious people for the actions of extremists. And certainly in the US we cannot prohibit a religion because some of its adherents embrace violence.

    Moron isn't a word liberals have any monopoly on. And in this instance it is appropriate. You have demonstrated idiocy beyond what one expects from even the least throughtful of pundits on the far right. Not just idiocy, but you've embraced bigotry and suggested we violate the constitution.
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ : Now you are playing with words. In the eyes of many Muslims Osama bin Laden isn't a true muslim...doesn't matter. Just so you realize, Christian Patriot is a specific extremist ideology, that blends elements of racism, religion, patriotism and militia activity together. Just as the Salafi Jihadist groups are an offshoot of Islam, Christian Patriot ideology is an offshoot of christianity. It is a real threat, that has killed hundreds of people in the US. My point wasn't to demonize Chistianity, but to show that you can't blame all religious people for the actions of extremists. And certainly in the US we cannot prohibit a religion because some of its adherents embrace violence. Moron isn't a word liberals have any monopoly on. And in this instance it is appropriate. You have demonstrated idiocy beyond what one expects from even the least throughtful of pundits on the far right. Not just idiocy, but you've embraced bigotry and suggested we violate the constitution.
    Posted by JaySev2010
    JAY7....... SHOW ME A RELIGION WHERE THEIR GOD TELLS THEM IT'S O K TO  K I L L  REGULAR HARD WORKING PEOPLE  ( 9/11 & BEYOND) AND EVEN YOU SHOULD SEE THAT IS A PROBLEM
    THAT NEEDS TO BE WATCHED AND DEFENDED AGAINST........ WOW, AS MY DAD WOULD SAY........  "SON,  THIS GUY DOES NOT GIVE UP...... GET YOUR BALL & COME ON HOME" !!!!!   BTW,THERE WILL BE NO MOSQUE NEAR GROUND ZERO !!!  ( I BET YOU AN ICE CREAM )
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ : JAY7....... SHOW ME A RELIGION WHERE THEIR GOD TELLS THEM IT'S O K TO   K I L L   REGULAR HARD WORKING PEOPLE  ( 9/11 & BEYOND) AND EVEN YOU SHOULD SEE THAT IS A PROBLEM THAT NEEDS TO BE WATCHED AND DEFENDED AGAINST........ WOW, AS MY DAD WOULD SAY........  "SON,  THIS GUY DOES NOT GIVE UP...... GET YOUR BALL & COME ON HOME" !!!!!   BTW,THERE WILL BE NO MOSQUE NEAR GROUND ZERO !!!  ( I BET YOU AN ICE CREAM )
    Posted by Bill-806


    All three Abrahamic religions have passages in their holy books (for Christians this would be in the Old Testament) where God calls not only for killing, but wiping out whole groups of people. That said, I think Islam has a bigger problem presently with violent interpretations of its passages. Most Jews and Christians, while the passages are still there, don't take those passages seriously because they clash with modern notions of morality. In Islam there are still plenty of people who embrace violent interpretations. But far from all. But there are lots of Christian groups in the US that use violence to advance their agenda. Abortion shooters and bombers, Christian Patriot groups, etc. I am not going to say they are as big of a threat right now as Islamic terrorists, but they are still an active threat.

    I have no problem keeping an eye on any extremist movement, but I am not going to advocate america throw away its traditional (and its constitutional protection) of religious liberty.

     
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    HE WAS NOT A CHRISTIAN PATRIOT IN MY EYES..
    Posted by Bill-806
    '

    ALL MUSLIMS ARE NOT TERRORISTS, IN A NON-RACIST'S EYES.


     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ : JAY7....... SHOW ME A RELIGION WHERE THEIR GOD TELLS THEM IT'S O K TO   K I L L   REGULAR HARD WORKING PEOPLE  ( 9/11 & BEYOND) \
    Posted by Bill-806


    CHRISTIANITY, 1 A.D. - 1800 A.D., AROUND THE WORLD. 

    REFUSE TO CONVERT -- /> HERETIC --> FIRE, NOOSE, OR SWORD.  OR MUCH MUCH WORSE.
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ : CHRISTIANITY, 1 A.D. - 1800 A.D., AROUND THE WORLD.  REFUSE TO CONVERT -- /> HERETIC -- /> FIRE, NOOSE, OR SWORD.  OR MUCH MUCH WORSE.
    Posted by WhatIsItNow


    I actually studied this period in college. While there is truth to what you say, on the whole, Christians were less violent than the Germanic tribes they converted or the Romans. In many respects the violence was part of the give and take of the conversion process. You target warlords for conversion, you are going to get a rowdy bunch of Christians. I have to question you extending that to 1800. A bit of a stretch. Interesting thing about the witch trials, the protestant groups were actually much worse in many respects. The closer you were to Rome, the safer you were, because they actually had a system (however flawed) for weeding out false accusations.
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ : I actually studied this period in college. While there is truth to what you say, on the whole, Christians were less violent than the Germanic tribes they converted or the Romans. In many respects the violence was part of the give and take of the conversion process. You target warlords for conversion, you are going to get a rowdy bunch of Christians. I have to question you extending that to 1800. A bit of a stretch. Interesting thing about the witch trials, the protestant groups were actually much worse in many respects. The closer you were to Rome, the safer you were, because they actually had a system (however flawed) for weeding out false accusations.
    Posted by JaySev2010


    It sounds like what you studied was a class limited to the Roman coption of Christianity and use of Christianity to expand its empire.

    But look, I wasn't referring just to pure conversion (though I would strongly beg to differ about whether targeting Germanic tribes for conversion was motivated purely by the idea of saving souls...)

    Starting with Constantine's cooption of the religion, Christianity was bound up with conquest; Christianity often serving as a thin veil for conquest's true goals, for the next 1400-1500 years

    Christianity has done a lot more than convert Germanic tribes.  Not going to list off every little thing, but there are plenty of other examples.  Think:  Crusades, South America, North America, India, Africa and so on.  Every campain resulting in massive slaughter of the indigenous -- at least facially in the name of saving peoples' souls via post-conquest conversion.

    And of course, there were lovely things like torturing lots of Jews and suspected Jews to death in the inquisition(s)...

    All this being a counterpoint to Bill's apparent belief that all muslims are bad people and are terrorists, and therefore shouldn't have a mosque near the ruins.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from WhatIsItNow. Show WhatIsItNow's posts

    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    And of course...conversion itself wasn't much guarantee.  Think Massacre of Verden.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Billingsly. Show Billingsly's posts

    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    "SHOW ME A RELIGION WHERE THEIR GOD TELLS THEM IT'S O K TO  K I L L  REGULAR HARD WORKING PEOPLE  ( 9/11 & BEYOND) AND EVEN YOU SHOULD SEE THAT IS A PROBLEM
    THAT NEEDS TO BE WATCHED AND DEFENDED AGAINST........ WOW, AS MY DAD WOULD SAY........  "SON,  THIS GUY DOES NOT GIVE UP...... GET YOUR BALL & COME ON HOME" !!!!!   BTW,THERE WILL BE NO MOSQUE NEAR GROUND ZERO !!!  ( I BET YOU AN ICE CREAM )"

    Is this idiot serious? Learn some history, champ - say, a few thousand years. 
    I think the other posters did a nice job of explaining it. 

    Have you ever heard of the Crusades, perhaps? Do you know how many innocent "hard-working" Muslims were slaughtered in the name of Christ? Or how about Judaism -do you know anything about the violence encouraged in their holy books? Give me a break, Islam is no better or worse than any of the other Western religions. 
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
      FROM GROUND ZERO ........  HAVE WE GONE "SOFT" OR JUST PLAIN "STUPID" ?????    WAKE UP AMERICA !!!!    WHAT SAY YOU ?????
    Posted by Bill-806


    Do explain the legal basis for stopping the mosque from taking over that building.   Keep in mind we have this First Amendment protection for expression of religion.  Go ahead explain how you stop it legally. 
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    " SHOW ME A RELIGION WHERE THEIR GOD TELLS THEM IT'S O K TO   K I L L   REGULAR HARD WORKING PEOPLE  ( 9/11 & BEYOND) AND EVEN YOU SHOULD SEE THAT IS A PROBLEM THAT NEEDS TO BE WATCHED AND DEFENDED AGAINST........ WOW, AS MY DAD WOULD SAY........  "SON,  THIS GUY DOES NOT GIVE UP...... GET YOUR BALL & COME ON HOME" !!!!!   BTW,THERE WILL BE NO MOSQUE NEAR GROUND ZERO !!!  ( I BET YOU AN ICE CREAM )" Is this idiot serious? Learn some history, champ - say, a few thousand years.  I think the other posters did a nice job of explaining it.  Have you ever heard of the Crusades, perhaps? Do you know how many innocent "hard-working" Muslims were slaughtered in the name of Christ? Or how about Judaism -do you know anything about the violence encouraged in their holy books? Give me a break, Islam is no better or worse than any of the other Western religions. 
    Posted by Billingsly
      SON, IM NOT CONCERNED WITH WHAT WENT ON 3000 YEARS AGO......  IM TALKING THE LAST 20 YEARS & MORE SO SINCE 9/11 AND I DON'T MUCH CARE WHAT RELIGION IS AT FAULT.......  THE FACT IS THERE IS MORE FANATIC KILLING GOING ON THAN EVER BEFORE. AS A RESULT, A MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS FROM GROUND ZERO IS JUST ANOTHER STEP IN THE "TRANSFORMING" OF AMERICA.... I STILL SAY THAT THIS WON'T HAPPEN !!!
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ :   SON, IM NOT CONCERNED WITH WHAT WENT ON 3000 YEARS AGO......  IM TALKING THE LAST 20 YEARS & MORE SO SINCE 9/11 AND I DON'T MUCH CARE WHAT RELIGION IS AT FAULT.......  THE FACT IS THERE IS MORE FANATIC KILLING GOING ON THAN EVER BEFORE. AS A RESULT, A MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS FROM GROUND ZERO IS JUST ANOTHER STEP IN THE "TRANSFORMING" OF AMERICA.... I STILL SAY THAT THIS WON'T HAPPEN !!!
    Posted by Bill-806


    So what part of religious tolerance in the constitution DONT YOU GET. That is why the founders of the US made colonies here. To get away from narrow minded a holes like you.
     So should we ban a Falafel cart there too. Cause it is mideastern which is kinda like moslem and arab. What about banning moslems from the streets ten blocks around ground zero. Yes even if they are white moslems.
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ :    HE WAS NOT A CHRISTIAN PATRIOT IN MY EYES....... A "NUT CASE", YES... PATRIOT NO, AND IM NOT SURE THE U S GOV GOT TO THE BOTTOM OF THAT EITHER.......  NOW THEN,  "MORON" IS SO CHILDISH AND LIBERAL, I WOULD RATHER THAT WE ALL BE ALLOWED TO JUST SHARE OPINIONS ON THIS BOARD........  IN THE TUNE OF  FUN, FUN, FUN, TILL THE "BIG O" TAKES THE BOARD AWAY !!!!  
    Posted by Bill-806


    Yes he was as much a christian as the 911 terrorists were muslim. Why do you say christian patriot BTW. The only christian state is the vatican. Are you saying Tim mc moron was not a patriot of the vatican state? Im not surprized since I think Tim flunked geography.
     Why would any one take your o so valuable opinion away? Does that SCARE YOU? President Obama scares you but you put up with george bush? That is seriously twisted.
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ : JAY7....... SHOW ME A RELIGION WHERE THEIR GOD TELLS THEM IT'S O K TO   K I L L   REGULAR HARD WORKING PEOPLE  ( 9/11 & BEYOND) AND EVEN YOU SHOULD SEE THAT IS A PROBLEM THAT NEEDS TO BE WATCHED AND DEFENDED AGAINST........ WOW, AS MY DAD WOULD SAY........  "SON,  THIS GUY DOES NOT GIVE UP...... GET YOUR BALL & COME ON HOME" !!!!!   BTW,THERE WILL BE NO MOSQUE NEAR GROUND ZERO !!!  ( I BET YOU AN ICE CREAM )
    Posted by Bill-806


    Check The Bible. The bible does not distingush hard working people but it is full of people killed for rather slight infractions by todays standards.
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    " SHOW ME A RELIGION WHERE THEIR GOD TELLS THEM IT'S O K TO   K I L L   REGULAR HARD WORKING PEOPLE  ( 9/11 & BEYOND) AND EVEN YOU SHOULD SEE THAT IS A PROBLEM THAT NEEDS TO BE WATCHED AND DEFENDED AGAINST........ WOW, AS MY DAD WOULD SAY........  "SON,  THIS GUY DOES NOT GIVE UP...... GET YOUR BALL & COME ON HOME" !!!!!   BTW,THERE WILL BE NO MOSQUE NEAR GROUND ZERO !!!  ( I BET YOU AN ICE CREAM )" Is this idiot serious? Learn some history, champ - say, a few thousand years.  I think the other posters did a nice job of explaining it.  Have you ever heard of the Crusades, perhaps? Do you know how many innocent "hard-working" Muslims were slaughtered in the name of Christ? Or how about Judaism -do you know anything about the violence encouraged in their holy books? Give me a break, Islam is no better or worse than any of the other Western religions. 
    Posted by Billingsly


    Just a point. The Jewish holy book is the bible, Old testament. The books of interpreted law are in the talmud. Not a holy book, just the law.
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ :   SON, IM NOT CONCERNED WITH WHAT WENT ON 3000 YEARS AGO......  IM TALKING THE LAST 20 YEARS & MORE SO SINCE 9/11 AND I DON'T MUCH CARE WHAT RELIGION IS AT FAULT.......  THE FACT IS THERE IS MORE FANATIC KILLING GOING ON THAN EVER BEFORE. AS A RESULT, A MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS FROM GROUND ZERO IS JUST ANOTHER STEP IN THE "TRANSFORMING" OF AMERICA.... I STILL SAY THAT THIS WON'T HAPPEN !!!
    Posted by Bill-806


    The religion is not at fault, the people who committed the crime are at fault.  Basic.  Now give us the legal reason as to how you can stop this mosque.  You are not just venting from pure emotion and irrationality are you?
     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ : JAY7....... SHOW ME A RELIGION WHERE THEIR GOD TELLS THEM IT'S O K TO   K I L L   REGULAR HARD WORKING PEOPLE  ( 9/11 & BEYOND) AND EVEN YOU SHOULD SEE THAT IS A PROBLEM THAT NEEDS TO BE WATCHED AND DEFENDED AGAINST........ WOW, AS MY DAD WOULD SAY........  "SON,  THIS GUY DOES NOT GIVE UP...... GET YOUR BALL & COME ON HOME" !!!!!   BTW,THERE WILL BE NO MOSQUE NEAR GROUND ZERO !!!  ( I BET YOU AN ICE CREAM )
    Posted by Bill-806



    You never heard of a religion wherein the God commands his followers to kill regular hard working people?  How about all people, men women and children... babies... kill 'em all! 

    I never quote that farce called the Buy-Bull... er, I mean Bible, but since you asked, here's just one of hundreds of instances:

    "Next we headed for the land of Bashan, where King Og and his army attacked us at Edrei.  But the LORD told me, 'Do not be afraid of him, for I have given you victory over Og and his army, giving you his entire land.  Treat him just as you treated King Sihon of the Amorites, who ruled in Heshbon.'  So the LORD our God handed King Og and all his people over to us, and we killed them all.  We conquered all sixty of his towns, the entire Argob region in his kingdom of Bashan.  These were all fortified cities with high walls and barred gates.  We also took many unwalled villages at the same time.  We completely destroyed the kingdom of Bashan, just as we had destroyed King Sihon of Heshbon. We destroyed all the people in every town we conquered – men, women, and children alike.  But we kept all the livestock for ourselves and took plunder from all the towns."   (Deuteronomy 3:1-7 NLT)

    Maybe you want to discount this historical God-invoked wanton slaughter on the grounds that King Og had possibly committed the initial aggression, had been the first attacker. Then I’d like to direct your attention to the centuries-old war between the “Christians” and the “Muslims”. Ever heard of the “Holy” Crusades?

     
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    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........:
    In Response to Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........ : It sounds like what you studied was a class limited to the Roman coption of Christianity and use of Christianity to expand its empire. But look, I wasn't referring just to pure conversion (though I would strongly beg to differ about whether targeting Germanic tribes for conversion was motivated purely by the idea of saving souls...) Starting with Constantine's cooption of the religion, Christianity was bound up with conquest; Christianity often serving as a thin veil for conquest's true goals, for the next 1400-1500 years Christianity has done a lot more than convert Germanic tribes.  Not going to list off every little thing, but there are plenty of other examples.  Think:  Crusades, South America, North America, India, Africa and so on.  Every campain resulting in massive slaughter of the indigenous -- at least facially in the name of saving peoples' souls via post-conquest conversion. And of course, there were lovely things like torturing lots of Jews and suspected Jews to death in the inquisition(s)... All this being a counterpoint to Bill's apparent belief that all muslims are bad people and are terrorists, and therefore shouldn't have a mosque near the ruins.
    Posted by WhatIsItNow


    No, I studied mostly medieval Christianity. Please don't make assumptions about me based on one post. The problem with your analysis is you confound christianity with civilizations and countries that happen to be Christian. Just as the OP is doing with Islam. To blame Christianity for the slaughter of indiginous peoples is simply unfair. What you had in these instances was people violating the tenets of Christianity in order to achieve political and economic aims. But for all the harm you can point to, you can also point to a great deal of good that was done in the name of Jesus. This is pretty much true of the Judeo-Christian-Islamic faiths. They've all been used to justify bad and good things.

    Another thing to keep in mind is many of the great leaders who converted to christianity, only did so because it was politically useful. So you had an awful lot of giving lip service to Christianity, and using Christian teachings to justify conquest and slaughter. And yes, you did have serious mistreatment of Jews, and rampant anti semitism. These things cannot be denied. But you also had the growth of universities, just war theory, etc. The history of Christianity is marked by frequent tension between the peaceful teachings of the new testament, and the violent expansion of Christian civilization. 

    Keep in mind, I don't disagree with you that bad things occured in the name of Christianity. I just think it is a gross oversimplification to focus only on the bad. There was also plenty of good. One of the acheivments of Christianity was a cutlural unification of Europe that it could be argued greatly mitigated internal conflict.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from rwvoigt. Show rwvoigt's posts

    Re: WAKE UP AMERICA, A 13 FLOOR MOSQUE 2 BLOCKS........

    Big deal. Religious freedom is a Constitutional right. If you don't like American freedoms, you don't have to live here.  A number of Muslims were working at the WTC that day and died with the Christians and Jews. 

    If there are hundreds of Muslim worshipers near Ground Zero, that's a good thing. It makes good sense to make potential terrorists know that they might be targeting their own faithful if they attack NYC again.
     
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