Barely Half Of Republican Americans Support This Shutdown Strategy

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hansoribrother. Show Hansoribrother's posts

    Re: Barely Half Of Republican Americans Support This Shutdown Strategy

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    Repubs: 49-44% in favor

    Dems: 90-6% against

    Indies: 74-19% against

     

    Not good.  Whose idea was this anyway?!?  

     

    QUINNIPIAC POLL out this a.m.:

    “American voters oppose 72-22 percent Congress shutting down the federal government to block implementation of the Affordable Care Act, or Obamacare …

    Voters also oppose 64-27 percent blocking an increase in the nation’s debt ceiling as a way to stop Obamacare …

    American voters are divided on Obamacare, with 45 percent in favor and 47 percent opposed, but they are opposed 58-34 percent to Congress cutting off funding for the health care law to stop its implementation. Republicans support the federal government shutdown by a narrow 49-44 percent margin, but opposition is 90-6 percent among Democrats and 74-19 percent among independent voters.

    President Barack Obama gets a negative 45-49 percent overall job approval rating, [statistically unchanged from] 46-48 percent score August 2.

    American voters disapprove 74-17 percent of the job Republicans in Congress are doing, their lowest score ever, and disapprove 60-32 percent of the job Democrats are doing.”

     

    GOPers now would be like the Jacksonville Jaguars if they refused to play on Sunday yet still got credited with the win...simply because their fans want them to win.

     

     

     

     



    I'm not a Republican but for the sake of argument I'll say that I am.  I do not like the way the Republicans are handling this matter of the Continuing Resolution and the Debt Ceiling. That doesn't mean that I support the insanity of Obamacare. It doesn't mean that I would not like to see it repealed and replaced with something that is reasonable. It doesn't mean that I am going to vote for one you sissy pants libs either.

    For all you libs that claim ACA is settled law - go bleep yourselves. Is it any more or less settled than Citizens United which  you constantly whine about? No. Is it any more settled than the 2nd amendment?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from NowWhatDoYouWant. Show NowWhatDoYouWant's posts

    Re: Barely Half Of Republican Americans Support This Shutdown Strategy

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

    For all you libs that claim ACA is settled law - go bleep yourselves.



    If you agree that what Republicans are doing right now to try to fight it is wrong, then you must also agree that it is settled until and unless Republicans can get enough votes to unsettle it.

    In the proper Democratic process, not this embarassing display of childishness.

     
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  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Barely Half Of Republican Americans Support This Shutdown Strategy

    In response to massmoderateJoe's comment:

     

    So its better to just give the chosen few an exemption, now that's a demcocratic solution.  If the law isn't ready for prime time and all of us then it is flawed.


    Flawed more accurately describes the current health care system and its reliance upon insuring and treating the richest people first and then throwing scraps to the poor and chronically ill...when they can actually get or afford treatment, that is.

    Flawed also describes the mediocre overall state of health care quality in the U.S., the huge price differences from market-to-market for identical procedures, and poor value returned for the prices.

    The current system is already skewed toward the rich to the extreme; the ACA at least attempts to level the coverage landscape.

     

     
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  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Barely Half Of Republican Americans Support This Shutdown Strategy

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

     

    For all you libs that claim ACA is settled law - go bleep yourselves. Is it any more or less settled than Citizens United which  you constantly whine about? No. Is it any more settled than the 2nd amendment?



    Both laws had their days in court, and the court affirmed both as not only constitutional, but "settled law" as a matter of both congressional and judicial record.

    And Repubs are vehemently staking out their own claims in "Whine Country" over the ACA.

     

    Did you hurl the same brainless epithet at the Citizens United backers...??

    Somehow I doubt it....

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from massmoderateJoe. Show massmoderateJoe's posts

    Re: Barely Half Of Republican Americans Support This Shutdown Strategy

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    In response to massmoderateJoe's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:


     

    In response to massmoderateJoe's comment:


     

     

    The Senate, as the other chamber in the bi-cameral Congress. through which all bills must pass, had an up-or-down vote where every senator was equally represented and they stripped out the amendments, approved the CR, and sent that funding bill back to the HoR.

    The Senate allowed an up or down vote.

    The HoR won't allow any vote.

    So who's doing the obstructing?

    If the HoR sends a bill and the Senate, by powers vested in it by the Constitution, votes to modify that bill, why won't the HoR take a vote rather than writing a new bill?

    If they are so confident that the Senate version will fail then allow a vote and go on record as to where everyone stands.

    But the HoR refuses to let the process work.

    They are obstructing gov't.

     

     

     



    The political process only works when parties are willing to meet, exchange ideas, discuss, negotiate and cut a deal.

     

     

    Heck the Senate won't even meet in Conference Committee, talk about drawing a line in the sand.  If they look at recent history the last Dem to draw a line in the sand needed to use Putin as a life line to change the conversation.

     

     



    The Senate passed it's own budget in March and sent it to the HoR. They ignored it.

     

    The Dems have been asking for a confrenece for the 6 months since, and the House refused.

    The HoR believed they didn't have the leverage to extort and meaningful concessions over the summer so their strategy was to not conference and wait until critical mass was achieved and they had the power to shutdown the gov't....and this is the result.

     

     

     

     



    So the Senate passed their first budget in 4 years and becuase the HoR didn't meet when they wanted to the Senate won't meet when its critical?

     

     

    Both sides are acting like kids; nothing gets resolved until there is resolve to solve a problem by both.

    As bad as the 90's were between Clinton and Gingrich; they both were committed to the political process resulting on a compromised solution.  That's what's required in a divided Government, which is what we have.  A good leader can help steer a centrist approach.

    The good leader attributes of governing from the center is not what we currently have.  POTUS still thinks he has control of both Houses of Congress and he clearly doesn't.

    We are experiencing a monumental chasm of leadership.

     

     




    Ummm, I think you've got that bass ackwards.

     

     

    The Dems have been asking for a committee for 6 mths and the HoR told them to take a hike. Now, at the eleventh hour, the HoR wants to meet, on issues unrelated to the budget. No, you don't get to ignore the process for half a year and then blame the otherside when you call for a meeting after the stuff has hit the fan. The wingnuts delayed the process purely for political reasons and now the entire country has to suffer.

     

    "...both were committed to the political process..."


    And this is decidely NOT the political process. The political process happens during the legislative process, not after the law is passed, ajudicated by SCotUS and in place for 3 yrs. That is extortion, plain and simple.

    And if the gop-ers were really invested in the political process then they would pick up one of the 4 or 5 CR bills that the Senate has returned to them, after going through a straight-up political process in the Senate, and hold a vote on it. Bonner refuses to even consider holding a vote on any bill that has already passed the Senate's political process ... just because he and the tp-ers don't like the result of that process and know that they would lose that vote.

    This has nothing to do with PotUS or leadership anything else but the wingnuts intransgience. How can you 'lead' the other party when they are willing to hold the entire country hostage because they don't like a law passed by duly elected representatives, ajudicated as Constitutional by SCotUS and in place for 3 yrs?

    How can you expect to 'lead' the opposing party who have stated, unequivocally' that they will oppose anything and everything that Obama puts forth and will do anything to make him a one-term PotUS?

    It's not Obama's fault that the gop-ers have a dearth of leadership.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    It has everything to do with our leader's lack of leadership; a great community organizer and campaigner doesn't automatically make a great leader and we paying for it.  After all Clinton figured out how to deal with the evil Gingrich.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Barely Half Of Republican Americans Support This Shutdown Strategy

    In response to massmoderateJoe's comment:

     

    It has everything to do with our leader's lack of leadership; a great community organizer and campaigner doesn't automatically make a great leader and we paying for it.  


    The opposition party does not want to be led, because they're in denial.  It's quite pathological.

     

    Like you, they do not see the president as legitimate, despite an election, a re-election, and consistently having better approval numbers than congress...

    ...whose ratings among gop members has never been worse or had less credibility.

    They're on the ropes but think they've won the match.

     

     

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from massmoderateJoe. Show massmoderateJoe's posts

    Re: Barely Half Of Republican Americans Support This Shutdown Strategy

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to massmoderateJoe's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    It has everything to do with our leader's lack of leadership; a great community organizer and campaigner doesn't automatically make a great leader and we paying for it.  

     

     


    The opposition party does not want to be led, because they're in denial.  It's quite pathological.

     

    Like you, they do not see the president as legitimate, despite an election, a re-election, and consistently having better approval numbers than congress...

    ...whose ratings among gop members has never been worse or had less credibility.

    They're on the ropes but think they've won the match.

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    My believing he's incompetent doesn't mean he's not legitimate.  We get the politicians we deserve and I've always referred to the president respectfully.

    I just don't believe he is up to the job of leading.  He continues to make rookie mistakes; draw lines in the sand he can't or won't back up, he leads through coercion not through charisma. He has a chip on his shoulder (my opinion).  He's not interested in results, just winning.  He doesn't even reach out to his own party never mind the opposing party and this is critical in a divided government.

    A leader brings people of opposing views together with the result being an agreement, I just don't see this.  He is preachy and whiney when he doesn't get his way and then he wants to take home his football because the others won't play by his rules.  A leader accepts responsibility and earlier this year when Obama had an opportunity to invoke Harry Truman's the "buck stops here" ethos he fumbled it and denied it stopped with him.  

     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Barely Half Of Republican Americans Support This Shutdown Strategy

    In response to massmoderateJoe's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to massmoderateJoe's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

    It has everything to do with our leader's lack of leadership; a great community organizer and campaigner doesn't automatically make a great leader and we paying for it.  

     

     

     

     


    The opposition party does not want to be led, because they're in denial.  It's quite pathological.

     

    Like you, they do not see the president as legitimate, despite an election, a re-election, and consistently having better approval numbers than congress...

    ...whose ratings among gop members has never been worse or had less credibility.

    They're on the ropes but think they've won the match.

     

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    My believing he's incompetent doesn't mean he's not legitimate.  We get the politicians we deserve and I've always referred to the president respectfully.

     

    I just don't believe he is up to the job of leading.  He continues to make rookie mistakes; draw lines in the sand he can't or won't back up, he leads through coercion not through charisma. He has a chip on his shoulder (my opinion).  He's not interested in results, just winning.  He doesn't even reach out to his own party never mind the opposing party and this is critical in a divided government.

    A leader brings people of opposing views together with the result being an agreement, I just don't see this.  He is preachy and whiney when he doesn't get his way and then he wants to take home his football because the others won't play by his rules.  A leader accepts responsibility and earlier this year when Obama had an opportunity to invoke Harry Truman's the "buck stops here" ethos he fumbled it and denied it stopped with him.  

    [/QUOTE]

    All of these are opinions, and I'll respect them as such.

    But it's unclear what your standards of competence or leadership are relative to the political environment we (and he) are living in.  Every president has his slip-ups and foibles, much less a personality distinct enough to a) get elected, and b) endure 24/7 attention and criticism.  I say this not as an excuse but an explanation: no single president has had to appeal to so many interests across so much of the population in such a short amount of time in such a digitally instant digital way.

    And the fact is that there ARE large numbers of the opposition party who indeed view his tenure as illegitimate and have been doing so breathlessly since the day he was elected.  The infamous "make him a one-term president" was no idle threat.  They tried (and failed), yet still claimed he actually lost.  (You did it yourself.)  I admit...Bush got it bad, but Obama got it much worse...and for all of the wrong reasons.

    No other president has had to endure a first year in office where not a single yes vote was cast by the opposition.  You say it's his fault.  I say it's not entirely his fault, but that he still played the hands he were dealt with grace, resiliency, and dignity.

     

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from macnh1. Show macnh1's posts

    Re: Barely Half Of Republican Americans Support This Shutdown Strategy

    the republicans need to get out of the way and let the dems have their way...no matter how much damage it creates....the american people deserve government run healthcare.....the republicans need to stop trying to protect Americans from their incompetency in the voting booth......elections have consequences...let the American people lay down in the bed they've made...

     

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