Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from andiejen. Show andiejen's posts

    Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    One of the longstanding Congressional traditions is to open daily House and Senate business with a prayer, but a case on the Supreme Court's October docket places that practice in jeopardy, argues Sen. Marco Rubio.

    Rubio, a Florida Republican, said in a statement on Monday that the upcoming Supreme Court case of Town of Greece v. Galloway "brings about an historic moment in the effort to preserve the fundamental American principle of religious liberty."

    Rep. Randy Forbes, a Virginia Republican and co-chair of the Congressional Prayer caucus, and 84 House members also announced on Monday  that they had filed an amicus curiae brief regarding the Galloway case.

    The intent of the brief was to "call attention to the importance of this case for Americans of all faiths and world views who value the uniqueness of America's promise of religious freedom."

    Sen. Mary L. Landrieu of Louisiana was the lone Democrat to sign the amicus brief.

    In Galloway, the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit ruled that the use of public prayer before town meetings in the town of Greece was a violation of the First Amendment's Establishment Clause.

    The U.S. 2nd Circuit Court of Appeals ruled in the Galloway case that the manner in which the opening prayer was determined violated the Establishment Clause.

    “Government should be inclusive,” said Susan Galloway, 51, one of two women in the Rochester, N.Y. suburb challenging the practice. 

    “There are people who don’t believe, and they’re part of this country, too. We all have a right to be part of it and not feel excluded.” 

    In its ruling, the Circuit Court stated that "the town’s prayer practice must be viewed as an endorsement of a particular religious viewpoint. This conclusion is supported by several considerations, including the prayer-giver selection process, the content of the prayers, and the contextual actions (and inactions) of prayer-givers and town officials."

    The ruling further stated: "We emphasize that, in reaching this conclusion, we do not rely on any single aspect of the town's prayer practice, but rather on the totality of the circumstances present in this case. The town's process for selecting prayer-givers virtually ensured a Christian viewpoint."

    Greg Stohr of Bloomberg News, who recently traveled to the town of Greece, says the case marks the first time the court has considered legislative prayer since upholding the practice 30 years ago.


     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    Your point? 

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from andiejen. Show andiejen's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

    Your point? 



    46&2,

    I did not bury the lead.

    If Galloway is upheld, then the practice of opening public meetings all across the U.S. with a prayer is in deep jeopardy, including in Congress. 

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to andiejen's comment:

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    Your point? 

     



    46&2,

     

    I did not bury the lead.

    Huh? What are you talking about?

    If Galloway is upheld, then the practice of opening public meetings all across the U.S. with a prayer is in deep jeopardy, including in Congress. 

    Ok, is that a good or bad thing in your opinion? Most people usually add their own comments/opinions when they cut and paste info. You didn't add anything so I wasn't sure what your whole point was with this thread. Just looking for clarification

    [/QUOTE]


     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from andiejen. Show andiejen's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

    In response to andiejen's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    Your point? 

     

     



    46&2,

     

     

    I did not bury the lead.

    Huh? What are you talking about?

    If Galloway is upheld, then the practice of opening public meetings all across the U.S. with a prayer is in deep jeopardy, including in Congress. 

    Ok, is that a good or bad thing in your opinion? Most people usually add their own comments/opinions when they cut and paste info. You didn't add anything so I wasn't sure what your whole point was with this thread. Just looking for clarification

     

    [/QUOTE]


     

    [/QUOTE]

    46&2,

    Fair point.

    Since I do believe opening a public meeting with a prayer iminges on the rights of those who do not believe in an all mighty deity, as well as it violates the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment, I hope Galloway is upheld and the practice of prayer at public meetings is abolished.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to andiejen's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

     

     

    In response to andiejen's comment:

     

     

     

     

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

    Your point? 

     

     

     

     



    46&2,

     

     

     

     

    I did not bury the lead.

    Huh? What are you talking about?

    If Galloway is upheld, then the practice of opening public meetings all across the U.S. with a prayer is in deep jeopardy, including in Congress. 

    Ok, is that a good or bad thing in your opinion? Most people usually add their own comments/opinions when they cut and paste info. You didn't add anything so I wasn't sure what your whole point was with this thread. Just looking for clarification

     

     

     




     

     

     

     

     



    46&2,

     

     

    Fair point.

    Since I do believe opening a public meeting with a prayer iminges on the rights of those who do not believe in an all mighty deity, as well as it violates the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment, I hope Galloway is upheld and the practice of prayer at public meetings is abolished.

     



    Gotcha.

     

    So you don't like it that prayer upsets those who don't believe in god. Yet you're ok if having no prayer upsets those who do believe in god. I see. 

    BTW...I'm not religious at all. If prayers are said around me, know what I do?....I don't join in. 

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from UserName99. Show UserName99's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    Religion may have a played useful role in earlier times, but today it has demonstrably lowered the national IQ, mainly because right-wing politics has used it as a giant fishing net to capture enormous numbers of poor, gullible, fearful and poorly educated voters who are literally tricked and scared into voting against their own futures by waving the Bible and the flag at them while robbing them blind and shredding the American social contract that once existed.

    Perhaps America's puritanical streak made it a good and decent place in yesteryear, but today religion in America often holds people back in education, science, logic, critical thought and common sense.

    Look what Islam and the lack of separation of mosque and state did to the Middle East - religion has failed the Middle East and Christianity in politics is helping America fail today.

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from GregoryFromMeffa. Show GregoryFromMeffa's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    Chaplain of the US Congress dates back to 1789.  Kind of a big year.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from andiejen. Show andiejen's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to andiejen's comment:

     

     

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

     

     

     

     

    In response to andiejen's comment:

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

    Your point? 

     

     

     

     

     



    46&2,

     

     

     

     

     

    I did not bury the lead.

    Huh? What are you talking about?

    If Galloway is upheld, then the practice of opening public meetings all across the U.S. with a prayer is in deep jeopardy, including in Congress. 

    Ok, is that a good or bad thing in your opinion? Most people usually add their own comments/opinions when they cut and paste info. You didn't add anything so I wasn't sure what your whole point was with this thread. Just looking for clarification

     

     

     

     




     

     

     

     

     

     

     



    46&2,

     

     

     

    Fair point.

    Since I do believe opening a public meeting with a prayer iminges on the rights of those who do not believe in an all mighty deity, as well as it violates the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment, I hope Galloway is upheld and the practice of prayer at public meetings is abolished.

     

     



    Gotcha.

     

     

    So you don't like it that prayer upsets those who don't believe in god. Yet you're ok if having no prayer upsets those who do believe in god. I see. 

     

     



    46&2,

     

    When we are talking about public meetings, my "bible" is the Constitution.

    This practice never should have started. Time to end it.

    People can pray anywhere they like as long as they do not violate the Constitution. They can pray in the car before the meeting.

    I learned a long time ago I did not have to go to a building to pray. I did not have to talk to God thru a priest. I could talk to him directly. And I certainly do not have to pray with a bunch of people before a public meeting.

    And btw, did you ever think about the content of those prayers? Do you think they satisfied those of every religion?

    "Gotcha"? You do not get it at all. 

    Try reading User99's post above as a starter.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to andiejen's comment:

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to andiejen's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

    In response to andiejen's comment:

     

     

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

     

     

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

     

     

    Your point? 

     

     

     

     

     



    46&2,

     

     

     

     

     

    I did not bury the lead.

    Huh? What are you talking about?

    If Galloway is upheld, then the practice of opening public meetings all across the U.S. with a prayer is in deep jeopardy, including in Congress. 

    Ok, is that a good or bad thing in your opinion? Most people usually add their own comments/opinions when they cut and paste info. You didn't add anything so I wasn't sure what your whole point was with this thread. Just looking for clarification

     

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]


     

     

     

     

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    46&2,

     

     

     

    Fair point.

    Since I do believe opening a public meeting with a prayer iminges on the rights of those who do not believe in an all mighty deity, as well as it violates the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment, I hope Galloway is upheld and the practice of prayer at public meetings is abolished.

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Gotcha.

     

     

    So you don't like it that prayer upsets those who don't believe in god. Yet you're ok if having no prayer upsets those who do believe in god. I see. 

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    46&2,

     

    When we are talking about public meetings, my "bible" is the Constitution.

    This practice never should have started. Time to end it.

    People can pray anywhere they like as long as they do not violate the Constitution. They can pray in the car before the meeting.

    Why are people just NOW so concerned with this being a violation of the constitution? And how did they get away with violating the constitution for this long?

    I learned a long time ago I did not have to go to a building to pray. I did not have to talk to God thru a priest. I could talk to him directly. And I certainly do not have to pray with a bunch of people before a public meeting.

    And btw, did you ever think about the content of those prayers? Do you think they satisfied those of every religion?

    No...I don't give a sh!t what the content of the prayers are. I am not religious so I don't join in when prayers are being recited. If the person next to me gets something from reciting a prayer then good for them....to each his own I say.

    [/QUOTE]


     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from andiejen. Show andiejen's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    46&2,

    No...I don't give a sh!t what the content of the prayers are. I am not religious so I don't join in when prayers are being recited. If the person next to me gets something from reciting a prayer then good for them....to each his own I say.

     

    Your rights end where my rights begin. My right not to have a prayer before a public meeting trumps your right to have one. 

                                                                

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from GregoryFromMeffa. Show GregoryFromMeffa's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    No...I don't give a sh!t what the content of the prayers are. I am not religious so I don't join in when prayers are being recited.

    ------------------

    Problem solved.  Next

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to andiejen's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

     

     

    Your point? 

     

     



    46&2,

     

     

    I did not bury the lead.

    If Galloway is upheld, then the practice of opening public meetings all across the U.S. with a prayer is in deep jeopardy, including in Congress. 

     



    I've never understood why people who don't believe in god have a problem with prayer. If they don't believe in god, how are they harmed?

     

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    Iffy issue for me.


    I'm far more inclined to oppose things like public prayer sessions in schools, even if kids are told it is 'voluntary': Kids are much more malleable, particularly when young, and

    Others, of course, are more like me when a kid and resistent to authority; I refused to recite the pledge of allegience not because of anything to do with not liking America, but because teacher, no I won't do what you tell me!

     

     

    When we're talking about a town meeting, and a bunch of adults happen to pray before it...  how much does that sound like the concept of establishing a religion?

    Hard to say. Is it required? Does the meeting not start unless there is a prayer?

    If I were taking part of the meeting, I'd probably just be very mildly annoyed at the slight waste of time: Ok, do that on your own time. Let's talk about business now.

    For me, when it's not a mandated activity, I suppose I place a lot of emphasis on how likely is it for someone to feel compelled. And an adult is generally far less likely to feel compelled than a kid.

     

     

    For the same reason I think a lot of the noise made about christmas trees on a public building lawn is overblown. Has the building specifically refused a request of Jewish persons to display a menorah? No?

    Well then it seems less an establishment of religion.

     

     

    To me, the concept isn't so much a freedom from having religious things happen around you, it's a freedom from having government favor or establish one particular religion over others. And unless you have some situation where a government actor is allowing one religious thing but specifically disallowing another, I tend to shrug it off.

     

     

     

     

     

     

     



    I tend to agree with you sentiment when it comes to government functions and meetings.  It is no big deal either way. It is not like they are jabbing you with a hot poker, or like not opening with a prayer is going to cause a school board meeting to descend into chaos. If I feel the need to pray before a meeting i can do so on my own.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to andiejen's comment:

    46&2,

    No...I don't give a sh!t what the content of the prayers are. I am not religious so I don't join in when prayers are being recited. If the person next to me gets something from reciting a prayer then good for them....to each his own I say.

     

    Your rights end where my rights begin. My right not to have a prayer before a public meeting trumps your right to have one. 

                                                                



    You're not paying attention.....I'm not religious. I'm not asking for prayer. See, just like things like abortion and gay marriage, I say to each his own. Want an abortion...go for it. Want to marry your gay partner...go for it. Want to say a prayer....go for it.

    I thought liberals were all about freedom of choice?

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    Gee I don't know why, but I'm glad the Supreme Court does a little more analysis of establishment clause issues than telling people that they should shut up and not give a sh!t....   

     

    As usual Richard head misses the point.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sistersledge. Show Sistersledge's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    I could care less if they pray ... just as long as they don't try to pass a bill to stone anyone who refuses to follow their supersitions other then that let the insanity begin

     

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:

    I could care less if they pray ... just as long as they don't try to pass a bill to stone anyone who refuses to follow their supersitions other then that let the insanity begin

     



    Exactly

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:

    I could care less if they pray ... just as long as they don't try to pass a bill to stone anyone who refuses to follow their supersitions other then that let the insanity begin

     



    Because that is so going to happen. Sigh.

    you are not neutral on religion, you seem antagonistic to those who are religious, constantly throwing out these gems.

     

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from GregoryFromMeffa. Show GregoryFromMeffa's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to GregoryFromMeffa's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    No...I don't give a sh!t what the content of the prayers are. I am not religious so I don't join in when prayers are being recited.

    ------------------

    Problem solved.  Next

     




     

    Gee I don't know why, but I'm glad the Supreme Court does a little more analysis of establishment clause issues than telling people that they should shut up and not give a sh!t....   

    [/QUOTE]


    I said that?

    Okey dokey

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from GregoryFromMeffa. Show GregoryFromMeffa's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:

    I could care less if they pray ... just as long as they don't try to pass a bill to stone anyone who refuses to follow their supersitions other then that let the insanity begin

     



    Is it if, or when and where?

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sistersledge. Show Sistersledge's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to skeeter20's comment:

     

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:

     

     

     

    I could care less if they pray ... just as long as they don't try to pass a bill to stone anyone who refuses to follow their supersitions other then that let the insanity begin

     

     

     



    Because that is so going to happen. Sigh.

     

     

    you are not neutral on religion, you seem antagonistic to those who are religious, constantly throwing out these gems.

     

     




    skeeter .... you have your opinion and I have mine ...... it seems to me that you always think that anybody else's opinion isn't as important as your is ...... take a hike or a 'force march"..... route step "march" !

     

    btw I served so people even like you are allowed to practice whatever religion they want .... you're welcome !

    Semper Fi !

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:

     

    In response to skeeter20's comment:

     

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:

     

     

     

    I could care less if they pray ... just as long as they don't try to pass a bill to stone anyone who refuses to follow their supersitions other then that let the insanity begin

     

     

     



    Because that is so going to happen. Sigh.

     

     

    you are not neutral on religion, you seem antagonistic to those who are religious, constantly throwing out these gems.

     

     




    skeeter .... you have your opinion and I have mine ...... it seems to me that you always think that anybody else's opinion isn't as important as your is ...... take a hike or a 'force march"..... route step "march" !

     

    btw I served so people even like you are allowed to practice whatever religion they want .... you're welcome !

    Semper Fi !

     



     

    your prior post isn't an opinion, it is simply a foolish example of your religious bigotry.

    you would think that some one who constantly reminds us of their service would be less bitter.

    sorry that you apparently haven't been thanked enough.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    In response to andiejen's comment:

    46&2,

    No...I don't give a sh!t what the content of the prayers are. I am not religious so I don't join in when prayers are being recited. If the person next to me gets something from reciting a prayer then good for them....to each his own I say.

     

    Your rights end where my rights begin. My right not to have a prayer before a public meeting trumps your right to have one. 

                                                                




    How so..? How is the idea of someone else saying a prayer infringing on your right? And..why is your right more important than someone else's right? This doesn't sound like a statement that someone who follows the path of Buddism would make..not at all.

    Being in the same room with another person who is saying a prayer is not violating anyone's rights. If the reciting of said prayer were mandatory..then yes..I can see being upset...but it is not in this case.

    I believe strongly in both the freedom of and freedom from religion..but people on both sides of the debate need to lighten up a little.  I belong to a group where part of every meeting opening is a prayer ( or invocation)...offered by one person( usually someone different every meeting). No one is ever offended by this. In the past year we have had a dozen different "prayers" offered up at the beginning of the meeting, including Muslim, Native American and various interpretations of Christian prayers from around the world. Not everyone in our group believes in religion...but everyone appreciates the words spoken in their own way.

    Prayers are just words someone believes in. Again..people need to lighten up on this issue.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from StalkingButler. Show StalkingButler's posts

    Re: Congressmen File Brief to Supreme Court to Keep Daily Prayers

    Religion may have a played useful role in earlier times, but today it has demonstrably lowered the national IQ

    I suppose you have a ton of SCIENCE! to back that up?


    And you people complain about birthers...

    --

    Think for yourself, question authority.

     
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