Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    Seems to me that those who think the government can just keep going despite the lack of revenue have a limited grasp on where the money comes from.  Here are the sources:

    Workers: via income tax, sales tax, gas tax, every other consumption tax.

    Borrowing:  which is eventually paid for by people who work.

    Corporate taxes:  Which are eventually paid by people who work.

    Fees and Fines:  in other words, taxes on people, who work.

    There may be some small, ancillary forms of government income, like in theory, GM, but we see how that is working out.

    I would be interested to hear the progressives tell me where all this money that will pay for government employees comes from, if not people who work and make money.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from BilltheKat. Show BilltheKat's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    In Response to Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?:
    Seems to me that those who think the government can just keep going despite the lack of revenue have a limited grasp on where the money comes from.  Here are the sources: Workers: via income tax, sales tax, gas tax, every other consumption tax. Borrowing:  which is eventually paid for by people who work. Corporate taxes:  Which are eventually paid by people who work. Fees and Fines:  in other words, taxes on people, who work. There may be some small, ancillary forms of government income, like in theory, GM, but we see how that is working out. I would be interested to hear the progressives tell me where all this money that will pay for government employees comes from, if not people who work and make money.
    Posted by skeeter20


    Duh! No sh*t sherlock.
    But yet you rail against taxes.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from DamainAllen. Show DamainAllen's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    Then why did we pass tax cuts? 
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from BobinVa. Show BobinVa's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    Good question.
    The basic answer is that liberals have a core belief, a Marxist view, that there are no fundamental private property rights.
    The all-powerful State can take and redistribute your hard-earned money, because you dont really "own" it.  If you succeed on your own, you are evil and selfish; all the more for the State to confiscate.
    "From each according to his ability, to each according to their needs."
    Then it breaks down, as Margaret Thatcher pointed out:
    "The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money"
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from beKool. Show beKool's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    In Response to Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?:
    Seems to me that those who think the government can just keep going despite the lack of revenue have a limited grasp on where the money comes from.  Here are the sources: Workers: via income tax, sales tax, gas tax, every other consumption tax. Borrowing:  which is eventually paid for by people who work. Corporate taxes:  Which are eventually paid by people who work. Fees and Fines:  in other words, taxes on people, who work. There may be some small, ancillary forms of government income, like in theory, GM, but we see how that is working out. I would be interested to hear the progressives tell me where all this money that will pay for government employees comes from, if not people who work and make money.
    Posted by skeeter20


    Important qurestion is do wing nuts understand union members are the very same people like they are that pay those taxes to the government like they do ? No that wouldnt fit the whine then would it ?
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from beKool. Show beKool's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?:
    Then why did we pass tax cuts? 
    Posted by DamainAllen


    Of that last tax give away the top 2% recieved 200 + billion out of the deal. That means the government had to borrow all of that to pay for the tax cut because there wasnt a spending cut to cover the loss income to the government. And the right held WORKING PEOPLE hostage to do it , not to mention held the unemployed hostage also.  Last thing anyone on the right should be acting like they want to protect is the workers of this country. Bunch of hypocrites.
     
  7. This post has been removed.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelldog1. Show kelldog1's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?


      Ahhhh now I get it....the Republicans/Conservatives deliberately sabotaged this nations economy. They figured fewer jobs = less tax revenue = less Government
    spending which in turn results in smaller government.....so what if there is a little bit of human suffering and social unrest. Heck we have a military that can deal with that.

    What can I say other than Brilliant.....simply Brilliant!!!
    Republican strategists are genius personified.....how else do explain the McCain/Palin ticket....and GW Bush ....he was good too.


    Brilliant.....!
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from WhatIsItNow. Show WhatIsItNow's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    The basic answer is that liberals have a core belief, a Marxist view, that there are no fundamental private property rights."
    Posted By BobinVa


    Oh of course.

    Can't start a post without at least one delusion or lie. 

    You're a real piece of work...  
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from WIIN12AM. Show WIIN12AM's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    But yet you rail against taxes.


    You mean over-taxing....there's a difference. Not one conservative on BDC has EVER said they are against ALL taxes. Yet people on the Left still repeat over and over (I think they're trying to convince themselves) that the Right is against taxes. Again....not all taxes. We just don't want more and more taxes added. Enough is enough.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from beKool. Show beKool's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?:
    The politically awake ones do and of course the mantra is tax the rich because anyone that makes more than a liberal is obviously stealing it. But those people are not "workers". Workers make less than a liberal. When it comes to their own taxes a liberal is a conserviative looking for every deduction they can get so that they can avoid their "fair share". The politically brain dead that receive benefits probably do not care where the money comes from. They are the entitled takers. However there is one item to consider and that is now Ben Bernanke and the FED are printing money. Once inflation really kicks in then inflation will be the invisible tax that will come from everyone. Politicians hope no one figures that out.
    Posted by Newtster


    Yea we saw all those richie riches out there protesting for lower taxes. No wait that was their lap dogs out there waiting for that trickle down their back of liquid gold . Fools didnt even know it wasnt liquid gold even after the smell set in . Talk about brain dead .
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from DamainAllen. Show DamainAllen's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    Immediately the wingnut brigade descends into canned nonsense about liberals being takers, while ignoring that the central argument revolves around availability of revenue and shortfalls that result from lack of revenue, so instead of boosting revenue the righties want MORE TAX CUTS for business and the wealthy.  Righties want to try to portray a 3 point move in the tax rate as some draconian exercise in liberal class warfare despite the fact that taxes in the US have dropped steadily over the past fifty years and that many wealthy people and companies have a tax burden that is less, percentage wise, than many working and middle class americans.  But ultra rich deserve an extra 200K, despite the fact tax increases have been shown not to create jobs (the bush tax cuts existed in era of flat job growth), business deserve tax breaks to create jobs (and most still don't, they just ship them abroad) and the trash workers, police, firefighters, teachers, hourly wage workers are left to foot the bill as the government has the audicity to ask for these same people to work even longer so that entitled can afford another exotic sports car and boxes of caviar. 

    Republicans are so quick to call liberals elitists, but who is really washing the feet of the elites in this country at the expense of average American who builds and maintains the infrastructure, fights the wars, patrols the streets, picks the crops, farms the crops, etc?
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThinkSnow99. Show ThinkSnow99's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?:
    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers? : Of that last tax give away the top 2% recieved 200 + billion out of the deal. That means the government had to borrow all of that to pay for the tax cut because there wasnt a spending cut to cover the loss income to the government. And the right held WORKING PEOPLE hostage to do it , not to mention held the unemployed hostage also.  Last thing anyone on the right should be acting like they want to protect is the workers of this country. Bunch of hypocrites.
    Posted by beKool


    Making a statement like this really just proves Bobin's point.  The left thinks that government owns all of the wealth, which is Marxist. 

    This is the single biggest fundamental difference between D and R's.  Thanks for summing it up.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from BobinVa. Show BobinVa's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    Class envy; hate the rich; boxes of caviar...same old, same old...

    The only multi millionaire I ever knew personally was a great person, glad to pay his fair share of taxes, and his hard work resulted in hundreds of good paying private sector jobs.


    Truth is, the real noveau-rich elite these days, the real elite class,  are public sector bureaucrats , who make six figures with no heavy lifting, and spend their careers talking down at those who pay their exorbitant salaries and benefits...
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from beKool. Show beKool's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    Yea bobin class warfare . Oh wait isnt that what you are engaged in by protect the rich over the middle class and poor ? And look at your cries about the teachjers they make more money than you and you are crying about it because they do. Yet its the left crying class warfare huh ? LMLAO

    That warm liquid running down your back isnt liquid gold from your masters kid.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from DamainAllen. Show DamainAllen's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    Hahaha, so people who make six figure incomes are "rich" now? 

    And class envy?  Would it hurt to pretend to argue on merit and not rehashed talking point garbage?  The fact of the matter the GOP held the government hostage and refused to grant funding for unemployed workers, many of whome lost jobs due to a financial crisis none of them had anything to do with and likely don't even understand.  These people are the problem?  What about the money managers who rigged a system that they then gamed until system broke?  They reaped, in some cases, millions of dollars (and in extreme cases hundreds of millions) off of fraudulent activities and yet none of those people went to jail.  Its capitalism when financial masters of the universer rape the country for trillions of dollars wiping 401K's, killing equity in home value, causing millions of job losses, leading to increased bancruptcies, and high unemployment.  But its socialism when those affected look to the government, whose job it was to protect the people from exactly the same type of casino mentality in the first place, to assist while the times are hard?

    How many of those 50,000 people in the US who were found to be using Swiss bank accounts via UBS as tax shelters have been brought to justice?  Well, we know only 5000 of them were identified and many of them haven't even taken the IRS' plea deal to pay pennies on the dollar for the taxes they fraudently hid overseas, while the other 45K get off scott free.  How many of those 50,000 are blue collar working class people?  Why is it that the rich can loophole the system, that everyone else is expected to abide by, with no consequence? 
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from massmoderateJoe. Show massmoderateJoe's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?:
    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers? : Of that last tax give away the top 2% recieved 200 + billion out of the deal. That means the government had to borrow all of that to pay for the tax cut because there wasnt a spending cut to cover the loss income to the government. And the right held WORKING PEOPLE hostage to do it , not to mention held the unemployed hostage also.  Last thing anyone on the right should be acting like they want to protect is the workers of this country. Bunch of hypocrites.
    Posted by beKool

    Note who pays the taxes:

    Tax Year 2008

    Percentiles Ranked by AGI

    AGI Threshold on Percentiles

    Percentage of Federal Personal Income Tax Paid

    Top 1%

    $380,354

    38.02

    Top 5%

    $159,619

    58.72

    Top 10%

    $113,799

    69.94

    Top 25%

    $67,280

    86.34

    Top 50%

    $33,048

    97.30

    Bottom 50%

    <$33,048

    2.7

    Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
    Source: Internal Revenue Service


    The top 6% also create most of the jobs, tax incentives help them create more.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?:
    In Response to Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers? : Duh! No sh*t sherlock. But yet you rail against taxes.
    Posted by Bill.the.Cat


    I rail against excessive spending and excessive taxes.

    40% of the current budget is borrowed.  this will be paid off in future years by workers.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?:
    Immediately the wingnut brigade descends into canned nonsense about liberals being takers, while ignoring that the central argument revolves around availability of revenue and shortfalls that result from lack of revenue, so instead of boosting revenue the righties want MORE TAX CUTS for business and the wealthy.  Righties want to try to portray a 3 point move in the tax rate as some draconian exercise in liberal class warfare despite the fact that taxes in the US have dropped steadily over the past fifty years and that many wealthy people and companies have a tax burden that is less, percentage wise, than many working and middle class americans.  But ultra rich deserve an extra 200K, despite the fact tax increases have been shown not to create jobs (the bush tax cuts existed in era of flat job growth), business deserve tax breaks to create jobs (and most still don't, they just ship them abroad) and the trash workers, police, firefighters, teachers, hourly wage workers are left to foot the bill as the government has the audicity to ask for these same people to work even longer so that entitled can afford another exotic sports car and boxes of caviar.  Republicans are so quick to call liberals elitists, but who is really washing the feet of the elites in this country at the expense of average American who builds and maintains the infrastructure, fights the wars, patrols the streets, picks the crops, farms the crops, etc?
    Posted by DamainAllen


    Clearly by this post, you do not understand.  your motto is obviously

    "TAX THEM UNTIL THEY CROAK!"
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from WIIN12AM. Show WIIN12AM's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    Hahaha, so people who make six figure incomes are "rich" now? 


    Hahaha...they ain't poor. I certainly consider someone making half a mill rich...maybe that's just me. $500,000 is six figures right? One, two, three...yup it is.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    Even accounting for benefits, public workers make less than their private sector counterparts, especially as the required levels of higher education and skills go up.  (education which is currently in a hyper-inflation state)

    Compare the salaries of a lawyer in the public defender's office and a lawyer working for a private firm...no contest the private lawyer is making double or even triple what the public lawyer is.

    To be certified as a teacher in most states requires a minimum of a master's degree, plus the equivalent in additional periodic certification credits that amount to a doctorate.  Many colleges will barely look at professors without a PhD.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from massmoderateJoe. Show massmoderateJoe's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?:
    Even accounting for benefits, public workers make less than their private sector counterparts, especially as the required levels of higher education and skills go up.  (education which is currently in a hyper-inflation state) Compare the salaries of a lawyer in the public defender's office and a lawyer working for a private firm...no contest the private lawyer is making double or even triple what the public lawyer is. To be certified as a teacher in most states requires a minimum of a master's degree, plus the equivalent in additional periodic certification credits that amount to a doctorate.  Many colleges will barely look at professors without a PhD.
    Posted by MattyScornD

    There was a good discussion of this on NPR within the past two days.  The professional staff those requiring higher levels of education are generally paid less than their private counter parts, but when you throw in the additional 5 holiday's, the pay out on unused sick leave, better pension system and less of a match that they pay on thier insurance, the public sector is still on par or better of than the private sector.  At the lower level, it far exceeds the private sector, case in point Tool collectors at $60K plus, cops over $100K the list goes on.

    Technical colleges would be better off without the phd's and depend more on practioners with real experience.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?:
    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers? : There was a good discussion of this on NPR within the past two days.  The professional staff those requiring higher levels of education are generally paid less than their private counter parts, but when you throw in the additional 5 holiday's, the pay out on unused sick leave, better pension system and less of a match that they pay on thier insurance, the public sector is still on par or better of than the private sector.  At the lower level, it far exceeds the private sector, case in point Tool collectors at $60K plus, cops over $100K the list goes on. Technical colleges would be better off without the phd's and depend more on practioners with real experience.
    Posted by massmoderateJoe


    I heard that discussion, and the argument seemed fairly split...again, until you get to the higher-educated workers.  There just isn't a fair comparison in the private sector for cops, teachers and firefighters - hence part of the reason why they should retain the right to bargain collectively

    But if you haven't noticed, those additional benefits have mostly been phased out by private companies to boost their bottom lines and raise productivity - all while the income gap grows and grows.  The current recession has been made worse by the privatization of pensions into 401Ks subject to the whims of the highly temperamental stock market.  So, the rich get richer while the poor and middle class stay in the poor and middle class.

    I'm not talking about technical colleges, but since you brought it up, why would an experienced engineer pass up a six-figure private salary to teach for 50 grand at State Tech somewhere?  (Hints: contract?  tenure? other public employee incentives?)
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from massmoderateJoe. Show massmoderateJoe's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?:
    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers? : I heard that discussion, and the argument seemed fairly split...again, until you get to the higher-educated workers.  There just isn't a fair comparison in the private sector for cops, teachers and firefighters - hence part of the reason why they should retain the right to bargain collectively But if you haven't noticed, those additional benefits have mostly been phased out by private companies to boost their bottom lines and raise productivity - all while the income gap grows and grows.  The current recession has been made worse by the privatization of pensions into 401Ks subject to the whims of the highly temperamental stock market.  So, the rich get richer while the poor and middle class stay in the poor and middle class. I'm not talking about technical colleges, but since you brought it up, why would an experienced engineer pass up a six-figure private salary to teach for 50 grand at State Tech somewhere?  (Hints: contract?  tenure? other public employee incentives?)
    Posted by MattyScornD

    I don't buy into the victim mentality that the rich are taking advantage of the working professionals.  Sure I pay more for insurance, once I paid zero.  My two weeks sick leave was cut in half and added to my vacation time as paid time off, which actually is better because I was never using my two weeks.  I get 9 vacation days as opposed to the public sector 15.  These are all changes to react to a new world economy, so the public sector needs to join the party.

    Sure I get 6 figures now but I get paid for the stress level of 50-60 hour weeks. I have teaching in my transition plan to retirement.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?

    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers?:
    In Response to Re: Do Liberals understand that all government money is earned by actual workers? : I don't buy into the victim mentality that the rich are taking advantage of the working professionals.  Sure I pay more for insurance, once I paid zero.  My two weeks sick leave was cut in half and added to my vacation time as paid time off, which actually is better because I was never using my two weeks.  I get 9 vacation days as opposed to the public sector 15.  These are all changes to react to a new world economy, so the public sector needs to join the party. Sure I get 6 figures now but I get paid for the stress level of 50-60 hour weeks. I have teaching in my transition plan to retirement.
    Posted by massmoderateJoe


    I'll quote that endless fountain of modern wisdom and uncomfortable truths, George Carlin:

    "You know how I define the economic and social classes in this country? The upper class keeps all of the money, pays none of the taxes. The middle class pays all of the taxes, does all of the work. The poor are there... just to scare the sh(*)t out of the middle class. Keep 'em showing up at those jobs..."

    "That's the way the ruling class operates in any society. They try to divide the rest of the people. They keep the lower and the middle classes fighting with each other so that they, the rich, can run off with all the fuc*ing money! Fairly simple thing! Happens to work!"
     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share