Enough with Afghanistan already

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from fancy-shamanski. Show fancy-shamanski's posts

    Enough with Afghanistan already

    I think we need to do what a certain board member's 17 year old daughter told me to do the other night and "pull out".

    Why are we wasting countless resources in the heart of the bush recession/depression on a war in afghanistan?
    Why is it ok to waste trillions on wars in iraq and afghan, but not ok to spend on health care, when health care could actually benefit us all.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from hawkeye01. Show hawkeye01's posts

    Re: Enough with Afghanistan already

    Are you sure it wasn't "get off me you creepy old guy"? Sorry, but you opened youself up to that one.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from GreginMedford. Show GreginMedford's posts

    Re: Enough with Afghanistan already

    After looking foolish calling the Iraq surge a failure, he has to be careful as he launches his own. 

    He's between Iraq and a hard place
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from lrecliner. Show lrecliner's posts

    Re: Enough with Afghanistan already

    Going on an anonymous message board and lying about your sex life to impress others is pretty sad Fancy.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Mattyhorn. Show Mattyhorn's posts

    Re: Enough with Afghanistan already

    It may be a depressing thought, but we need to finish what we started.  In spite of the mistakes of the past 8 years, the War in Afghanistan was the war that needed to be fought, for better or worse.

    That said, any discussion of strategy in this war that does not include Pakistan (directly or indirectly)...is not a discussion worth having.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from scauma82. Show scauma82's posts

    Re: Enough with Afghanistan already

    In Response to Re: Enough with Afghanistan already:
    [QUOTE]It may be a depressing thought, but we need to finish what we started.  In spite of the mistakes of the past 8 years, the War in Afghanistan was the war that needed to be fought, for better or worse. That said, any discussion of strategy in this war that does not include Pakistan (directly or indirectly)...is not a discussion worth having.
    Posted by Mattyhorn[/QUOTE]

    this is where i'd have to disagree with you, fighting a war in afghanistan is pointless, Russia taught us  that. you simply can't fight some one who's willing to kill themself just to kill you. we can stay there a 100 years and nothing will ever change.
     
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  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from sk8ter2008. Show sk8ter2008's posts

    Re: Enough with Afghanistan already

    In Response to Re: Enough with Afghanistan already:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Enough with Afghanistan already : this is where i'd have to disagree with you, fighting a war in afghanistan is pointless, Russia taught us  that. you simply can't fight some one who's willing to kill themself just to kill you. we can stay there a 100 years and nothing will ever change.
    Posted by scauma82[/QUOTE]

    Pay attention:

    The difference is Russia invaded Afganistan alone with the sole intent of taking it over and running a pipeline through it to the Caspian sea and a few other energy related issues.

    We are driving out the Taliban and do not want to take it over. We want the people to elect a real governmentn that represents them.

    Understand?
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Mattyhorn. Show Mattyhorn's posts

    Re: Enough with Afghanistan already

    In Response to Re: Enough with Afghanistan already:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Enough with Afghanistan already : this is where i'd have to disagree with you, fighting a war in afghanistan is pointless, Russia taught us  that. you simply can't fight some one who's willing to kill themself just to kill you. we can stay there a 100 years and nothing will ever change.
    Posted by scauma82[/QUOTE]

    I agree with boater.  Part of the difference is motivation.  Russia (then-USSR) shared a border and part of its cultural history with Afghanistan as a political dynamic of central Asia.  But neither is it about "building democracy" and especially not about "winning".

    It's about reducing the influence of destructive ideology in the region and reducing the extremism which is presently their biggest export other than heroin.  Ironically, that combination of "narcotics" and "psychotics" is the biggest threat to the Afghan people and the root cause of their problems.

    At the same time, Greg's parallel to Iraq is invalid, because if THIS war had been fought effectively from the beginning, no "surge would be necessary.  Instead, by creating a conflict in Iraq where none really existed, we ended up with TWO difficult campaigns instead of just the one.  Instead, we got "mission accomplished" and assorted other non sequiturs.  Not a good way to fight a war, much less two.

     
     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from DamainAllen. Show DamainAllen's posts

    Re: Enough with Afghanistan already

    In Response to Re: Enough with Afghanistan already:
    [QUOTE]I thinik the parallel is fine because your gonna see the president avoid the S word like a tax cut. And how else could I get "Iraq and a hard place in" Sheesh!
    Posted by GreginMeffa[/QUOTE]

    I think he will avoid calling it a surge largely because "The Surge" was how the troop increase Iraq was marketed to the American people.  The conflict in Afganistan won't require as much sloganeering simply because, by and large, American's still beleive in the war, even if that support has diminished over the years.  Also it would  be an inaccurate description since we have been "surging" US forces in Afganistan for some time now, the last infusion of new boots sent nearly 20,000 more troops following Obama's authorization back in February.

    It is that last point that deserves more consideration in my view, however.  The troop increases have nor produced results and to hear Gen McCrystal tell it the situation on the ground has gotten worse in spite of the additional resources being thrown at the problem.  The discussion surrounding this isn't honest and therefore the response will be flawed if the the narrative doesn't evolve. 
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Mattyhorn. Show Mattyhorn's posts

    Re: Enough with Afghanistan already

    In Response to Re: Enough with Afghanistan already:
    [QUOTE]I thinik the parallel is fine because your gonna see the president avoid the S word like a tax cut. And how else could I get "Iraq and a hard place in" Sheesh!
    Posted by GreginMeffa[/QUOTE]

    Droll indeed.

    Don't quit 'cher day job, Greg.  (if that is your real name...where's the strat?)
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from dazydo. Show dazydo's posts

    Re: Enough with Afghanistan already

    In Response to Enough with Afghanistan already:
    [QUOTE]I think we need to do what a certain board member's 17 year old daughter told me to do the other night and "pull out". Why are we wasting countless resources in the heart of the bush recession/depression on a war in afghanistan? Why is it ok to waste trillions on wars in iraq and afghan, but not ok to spend on health care, when health care could actually benefit us all.
    Posted by fancy-shamanski[/QUOTE]

    Hmmmmmm, is about twenty states, you'd be charged with statutory rape, that's something to brag about.
     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from scauma82. Show scauma82's posts

    Re: Enough with Afghanistan already

    In Response to Re: Enough with Afghanistan already:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Enough with Afghanistan already : Pay attention: The difference is Russia invaded Afganistan alone with the sole intent of taking it over and running a pipeline through it to the Caspian sea and a few other energy related issues. We are driving out the Taliban and do not want to take it over. We want the people to elect a real governmentn that represents them. Understand?
    Posted by sk8ter2008[/QUOTE]

    war is war, and there's no winning a war in afghanistan, at least imo anyway. and do you really think America had no intention of running a pipeline to the caspian sea? 

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from sk8ter2008. Show sk8ter2008's posts

    Re: Enough with Afghanistan already

    In Response to Re: Enough with Afghanistan already:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Enough with Afghanistan already : I agree with boater.  Part of the difference is motivation.  Russia (then-USSR) shared a border and part of its cultural history with Afghanistan as a political dynamic of central Asia.  But neither is it about "building democracy" and especially not about "winning". It's about reducing the influence of destructive ideology in the region and reducing the extremism which is presently their biggest export other than heroin.  Ironically, that combination of "narcotics" and "psychotics" is the biggest threat to the Afghan people and the root cause of their problems. At the same time, Greg's parallel to Iraq is invalid, because if THIS war had been fought effectively from the beginning, no "surge would be necessary.  Instead, by creating a conflict in Iraq where none really existed, we ended up with TWO difficult campaigns instead of just the one.  Instead, we got "mission accomplished" and assorted other non sequiturs.  Not a good way to fight a war, much less two.  
    Posted by Mattyhorn[/QUOTE]

    Same tired argument "mission accomplished" "creating a conflict in Iraq".

    Iraq broke the 93 ceasefire and 16 UN resolutions. Both parties unanimously approved force.

    Bush 43 in no way "created a conflict" he held Iraq to the ceasefire agreement and stood up for the UN.

    He botched his public main motive for the war when he focused too much on the WMD's but, that doesn't mean you should ignore the other factors addressed in the congressional "authorization for use of force" unless it's just for political reasons.
     

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