Law vs. Ethics

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from massmoderateJoe. Show massmoderateJoe's posts

    Law vs. Ethics

    I'm sure most of you are aware of the Austrailian DJ's prank call to the London Hospital where Prince William's wife was hospitalized in which the DJ's impersonated themselves to be the Queen and Prince Charles inquiring about the health of Kate and where put through to the ward and received confidential informaton.  The call was played on the radio, created a firestorm and two days later the humiliated nurse that transferred the call to the ward killed herself.

    So was this just free speech or was there a crime?

    http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/10/world/europe/uk-royal-hospital-death/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

    Defense; prank calls made alll the time by radio stations but unfortunately this one ended badly, with the apparent suicide of the nurse.

    Plantif; this was an outrageous attempt to violate health privacy laws and invade personal privacy issues.  The incident left the nurse humiliated and she could handle the worldwide shame.

    I think there is more to the story and the hospital was embarassed by the event and most likely came down very hard on the nurses involved; after all the nurses not only violated protocol on release of medical information - it was the information of British Royalty.

    Like most stories this is complicated; the trigger was the prank call, the accellerant was the hospital's reaction with its employees and the undetermined mental health of the deceased nurse is the unknown.

     

    Crime - No

    Business ethics and humanity violation - Yes as there are unexpected consequences to peoples actions and the consequences should be mitigated by ethical behavior.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Reubenhop. Show Reubenhop's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    Something similar happened to Palin when a D.J. pretended to be the Canadian Prime Minister and wanted to talk to her about foreign policy.  She fell for it.  Thankfully she did not take her life.  But it was a part of her political suicide...

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    It seems to me that the nurse may have had other mental issues and this was the last straw.

    I heard the recording but, what was she so upset about? It was a joke for goodness sakes!

     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from massmoderateJoe. Show massmoderateJoe's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    Interesting lack of compassion for the deceased.

    Correct no crime; but if you don't want to read about what you did in the newspaper that may have triggered someones demise then you particpated in an ethics violation.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    In response to Reubenhop's comment:

    Something similar happened to Palin when a D.J. pretended to be the Canadian Prime Minister and wanted to talk to her about foreign policy.  She fell for it.  Thankfully she did not take her life.  But it was a part of her political suicide...



    There is a perfume named after your condition relative to Palin.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from DirtyWaterLover. Show DirtyWaterLover's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    No crime.  Nobody was hurt by the prank phone call.

    Sad that the nurse took her own life, but she should have known better than to give out that type of information to anyone.

    I fail to see the humiliation.  She fell for a prank.  It happens.  Be a good sport and laugh it off. 

     
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  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from massmoderateJoe. Show massmoderateJoe's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    In response to DirtyWaterLover's comment:

    No crime.  Nobody was hurt by the prank phone call.

    Sad that the nurse took her own life, but she should have known better than to give out that type of information to anyone.

    I fail to see the humiliation.  She fell for a prank.  It happens.  Be a good sport and laugh it off. 



    Actually its serious stuff and covered by HIPPA in the US.  The humiliation was due to the negative publicity brought to her employer and herself over desimination of sensitive health health information and may have also been heightened by cultural issues as she was from India.

    The Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act of 1996 ("HIPAA") and its regulations (the "Privacy Rule" and the "Security Rule") protect the privacy of an individuals health information and govern the way certain health care providers and benefits plans collect, maintain, use and disclose protected health information (PHI).

    Britiain most likely has a similar act.  Health providers are required to implement processes, procedures, training and have compliance officers.  Violations of HIPPA include inhouse sanctions, retraining, suspension to termination.

    The prankster information was gathered through fraud and the call was recorded without permission.  Both illegal activities in the US and FCC violations for transmitting this type of information over the air.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Firewind. Show Firewind's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    Not sure if commenters leaving out their empathy for the nurse and her family is cause for comment.  How could anyone not be empathetic?  It is a pure tragedy.  (Unless it turns out she was complicit.  But even still:  Tragedy.)  

    Someday, TMZ's British counterpart, or TMZ, may learn what's going on behind the scenes, at the hospital's level, anyway.  The nurse's final location makes clear whom she did it "to".

    Does anyone else "feel the presence of the royal family"?  Knowing British culture, we can bet that the nurse did.  Doesn't take much to imagine that Prince William and Prince Charles are rip----.  And that Prince Harry was ready to fly his helicopter all the way to Oz.  And that the queen reminded them of "who we are".  And that what we are getting now is for the sake of appearances.  

    Now, turning to those two DJs, where anything is still possible... As the station's management, board et al have gone through their formalities, the first thing that came to mind, with the royal family in mind, was the Gary Larson cartoon of the giant maw whose caption is, "Objects in mirror are closer than they appear".

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from FaolanofEssex. Show FaolanofEssex's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    I believe it was more of a cultural response. The nurse was Indian. Indian people hold honor in very high regard. That her "mistake" was fodder for international media would have been more devastating to her than the reaction of her bosses. She would have felt shame and that she had brought shame to her family. Sad, but more likely than speculating she had mental issues.

    If we are going to place blame here, lets place it where it belongs. The over the top 24/7 media frenzy at something so minor. I don't blame the DJ's. I blame the media response.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoneToTheDogs39. Show GoneToTheDogs39's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

     

    Who knows why or if she took her own life?

    Violation of HIPPA laws are serious, have you ever dealt with the Board of Registration in Nursing, let's just say they do very thorough investigations.

    The prank was stupid, not amusing at all, violating Kate's privacy while she's sick and in a delicate condition in the hospital.  Some news reports are even hinting that the stress of these events are affecting her pregnancy.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from FaolanofEssex. Show FaolanofEssex's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to tvoter's comment:

    what was she so upset about? It was a joke for goodness sakes

     


    Health care providers are not supposed to just plain give out information to anyone who calls in claiming they are someone else. I don't know British health law, but I'm guessing there are at least somewhat analogous provisions as in the U.S. concerning patient privacy.

    She probably figured it was OK to make an exception for the queen. But once this supposed "joke" came to light, it was very likely on the top of her mind that she might lose her job and get closed out of the health care industry for violating patient privacy laws. And that, simply because she made an exception for what she thought was a very worried relative.
     
    Add that type of thought and level of stress to someone who is already troubled, and its a recipe for disaster.

     

     

    When the joke is on you and could have real world consequences, it's a lot harder to say "its a joke for goodness sakes"

    A curious lack of compassion here.




    I think the call should never have been put through to the floor in the first place.Floor nurses should not be in placed in a position to screen calls. The only priority they should have is the patient. The DJ's have said repeatedly they were shocked that they were put through. I am shocked too. That is a failure of the hospital protocol, not the nurse and not the DJ's.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoneToTheDogs39. Show GoneToTheDogs39's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    The hospitals I am familiar with do not have a receptionist 11-7, the nurse is expected to answer all phone calls.  If you go by the book...NO information is to be given over the phone. You take their name and #,  confirm a release of info has been signed, then call them back.

    You may be able to give the general condition ie: stable

    ETA: For  psych  or detox, you cannot even acknowledge they are a patient.

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from FaolanofEssex. Show FaolanofEssex's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    In response to Robin39's comment:

    The hospitals I am familiar with do not have a receptionist 11-7, the nurse is expected to answer all phone calls.  If you go by the book...NO information is to be given over the phone. You take their name and #,  confirm a release of info has been signed, then call them back.

     




    Every hospital I have ever been in has an adminstrative desk on each floor with a unit secretary. That is who should be taking calls. Not the nurses. Nurses should be focused on the patient. Every hospital I've ever dealt with has a switchboard operator and when dealing with a VIP , the call never goes to the floor.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to tvoter's comment:

    what was she so upset about? It was a joke for goodness sakes


    Health care providers are not supposed to just plain give out information to anyone who calls in claiming they are someone else. I don't know British health law, but I'm guessing there are at least somewhat analogous provisions as in the U.S. concerning patient privacy.

    She probably figured it was OK to make an exception for the queen. But once this supposed "joke" came to light, it was very likely on the top of her mind that she might lose her job and get closed out of the health care industry for violating patient privacy laws. And that, simply because she made an exception for what she thought was a very worried relative.
     
    Add that type of thought and level of stress to someone who is already troubled, and its a recipe for disaster. 

    When the joke is on you and could have real world consequences, it's a lot harder to say "its a joke for goodness sakes"

    A curious lack of compassion here.




    The horrible outcome does not make it a crime or anything more than a bad joke. I heard the phone call and she never hesitated or questioned or seemed anxious about talking to the alleged Queen; she quickly just transfered it to the other nurses station. How is that breaking privacy laws?

    I feel for her family and the DJ's who now have to live with it. She committed suicide which is a mental issue; when you lose the instinct for survival!

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoneToTheDogs39. Show GoneToTheDogs39's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    http://bostonherald.com/business/media/view.bg?articleid=1061181071&format=text

    The latest.... criminal charges are a possibility.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    Break the law, and it might just break you...and often someone else.

     

    "Am I the victim or the crime..?"

     

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoneToTheDogs39. Show GoneToTheDogs39's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    http://www.tmz.com/2012/12/11/australian-radio-station-donates-money-nurse-suicide-kate-middleton-prank-2day-fm/

    Interesting...

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoneToTheDogs39. Show GoneToTheDogs39's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics



    The family said it learnt there are no switchboard staff at the hospital at certain times of the day, leading to the phone system automatically diverting calls to a senior nurse. 

        (excerpt, see link below for full article)          

    http://www.timesnow.tv/Nurse-left-note-but-family-wants-to-know-full-facts-Vaz/articleshow/4416666.cms

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoneToTheDogs39. Show GoneToTheDogs39's posts

    Re: Law vs. Ethics

    http://www.tmz.com/2012/12/14/nurse-suicide-hospital-kate-middleton-queen-hoax-radio-dj/

     

     
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