Liberal program "Head Start" now scientifically certified as a $180 billion massive failure. Time for more "investment"!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to Newtster's comment:

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to Newtster's comment:

    So when there is no difference between kids that go through the Head Start program and those that don't when they start the first grade, how exactly does that benefit ANYONE???

     


    If you read the comments you'd see answers were already given to the problem: Head Start does not improve cognitive goals, but it is essentially free day care, and free day care helps parents work who would otherwise have to stay home taking care of a little toddler.


    Therefore, trim expenses by doing away with the non-daycare parts that are supposedly aimed at improving cognitive capability but keep the daycare aspect.

     

     

     

    I suppose its easier to ignore those comments if you just want to rant about how the hated liberals get off on using your money to keep pointless programs going....

    ...for some....reason. Not sure what it is, but them libs is EVIL. So... they must be up to something. Right?

     



    We already have day care programs. What do we need another one for? So you dopes can feel good about yourselves?

     

    How much money gets wasted on such duplication of effort? 

    You morons think that because we complain about money being wasted on programs that don't work conservatives are just wingnuts that want people to die in the streets and work in sweatshops.

    Why are you so limited in your ability to think? Why is everything black and white with you self-appointed smartest people in the world?




    Headstart is not a daycare program. It is a federally funded program that provides 2.5 hours of service a day. Most headstart centers offer wrap around care ( care before and after the headstart program). This care operates on a sliding fee scale..depending on the mom's income.

    Headstart predates almost all early childhood education in this country. I agree that it needs to be reformed..but not because it is a failure. No where in the study does it indicate that the program fails. What it basically says is that headstart is not better than other quality early education programs.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to FaolanofEssex's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to NO MO O's comment:

     

    In response to FaolanofEssex's comment:

     

    In response to NO MO O's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to tvoter's comment:

    They cant wait because it's free day care!



    Which then allows them to participate in the economy rather than staying home with the kid. Those without trust funds often cannot afford nannies.

     


    If the program isn't showing any meaningful cognitive gains, then it should jettison that part of it and simply become free day care for the disadvantaged. Simply make active work a requirement to participate.

     



    You really think these mothers have any interest in participating in the economy?

     

    Geepers.. that means .... (shudder).. working !!! are you nuts ?

    Get real.

     




    You are nothing but a troll who knows nothing what you are talking about. My nephew did 2 years of Head Start. At the time, my sister was working her a** off at McDonalds. She was lucky enough to be working full time there. Some weeks 50 or 60 hours. I bet she worked harder then you ever worked in your life. For crap pay. So losers like you can fill your face with 50 cent cheeseburgers. Don't dare imply she didn't participate in the economy.

     

     



    I applaud and salute them and you.

     

    I submit they are the rare exception.

     

     



    You're flat wrong.  They are far more numerous than you realize.

     

    The cheats and layabouts are the minority, not the majority.

    Until you understand that, you can't be impartial.

     

     




    And here is how dense the trolls really are! With a bit of help from Google I discovered that there is a work or training requirement for parents to receive child care - unless you are the parent of a disabled kid or a foster parent.

     

    Next.




    You are half right. There is no work or training requirement for the 2.5 hours a day of headstart program. The work/training requirement is for the wrap around care ( before and after headstart). Virtually all of the headstart participants are also enrolled in wrap around care because almost all of them are involved in some kind of work or training program. Those who aren't only get the 2.5 hour a day program.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to tvoter's comment:

    In response to UserName99's comment:



    If people critical of welfare recipients spent a year of their lives trying to live on food stamps and a cash pittance they might have some insight into how desperately people actually want to get off welfare. Alas, luckily for the privileged and unhappily for the poor, this will never happen.

    So the rightwing myths continue.

     

     



    Biotch I spent 3-1/2 years working full time minimum wage job while going to school 5 hours a day 5 days a week and longer on weekends to do research and assignments with 2 kids in diapers and a wife working a minimum wage job while we paid day care every week!!

     

    I then worked at a little better paying job 60-80 hours a week for 10 years to pay the student loans back with interest!!

    No sleep, no life, no whinning; just working and sacrificing so, that one day things could be better!!!

    I didn't ask for a fvcking thing and the govt didn't give me fvcking thing!!

    I am a better man for it!!

     

     




    I'm calling you out on the above statement. I think you are not telling the truth. 2 parents earning minimum wage could not afford full time day care for two children in diapers.

    Just using today's numbers

    minimum wage  $8/HR times 40 hours =$320 gross per adult. Child care cost for "kid diapers" = $300 per week. If you and your wife were both working minimum wage jobs..you would not even bring home enough to pay for child care.

     

    Now..imagine if you were doing it on your own..without the benefit of the other parent? How would you do it??

    By the way..did you take the child dependent tax credit on your income tax return? If yes..then you got government assistance.

    But..nice try at hyperbole.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Reubenhop. Show Reubenhop's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to NO MO O's comment:

    In response to UserName99's comment:

     

    In response to NO MO O's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to NO MO O's comment:

    You really think these mothers have any interest in participating in the economy? Geepers.. that means .... (shudder).. working !!! are you nuts ? Get real.

     


    Go away.

     




    You can't take the TRUTH sonny... or elect to deny it.

     

    More government dependency for the lazypaid for and sponsored by working Americans.

     




    You're just another astonishly ignorant wingnut who believes that "welfare" is a bottomless pit of unlimited cash, available free of any rules, to anyone who wants it, for as long as they want to take it.   And you just "know" that all welfare recipients are lazy, illiterate, drug-addicted minority criminals who refuse to work and bear children simply for the "rewards" of higher welfare benefits.

     

    Go away!


     

     




    Stop living in your little dream world.

     

    You know nothing of this topic.

    I know the rules... as well do the welfare players.

    I never thought you were naive.. till now...OR you are blindly protecting this corrupt system for vested interests. 

     



    You have your own dream world.  Go away.  Your rants are boring.

     
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  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to miscricket's comment:


    Biotch I spent 3-1/2 years working full time minimum wage job while going to school 5 hours a day 5 days a week and longer on weekends to do research and assignments with 2 kids in diapers and a wife working a minimum wage job while we paid day care every week!! 

    I then worked at a little better paying job 60-80 hours a week for 10 years to pay the student loans back with interest!!

    No sleep, no life, no whinning; just working and sacrificing so, that one day things could be better!!!

    I didn't ask for a fvcking thing and the govt didn't give me fvcking thing!!

    I am a better man for it!!

    [QUOTE]


    I'm calling you out on the above statement. I think you are not telling the truth. 2 parents earning minimum wage could not afford full time day care for two children in diapers.

    Just using today's numbers

    minimum wage  $8/HR times 40 hours =$320 gross per adult. Child care cost for "kid diapers" = $300 per week. If you and your wife were both working minimum wage jobs..you would not even bring home enough to pay for child care. 

    Now..imagine if you were doing it on your own..without the benefit of the other parent? How would you do it??

    By the way..did you take the child dependent tax credit on your income tax return? If yes..then you got government assistance.

    But..nice try at hyperbole.

    [QUOTE]

    I really don't care what you THINK you know.

    I was in school from 88-92 worked making minimum wage (4.25 hr) at that time, and my wife worked minimum wage as well; I took the bus to school/work and she drove our only vehicle a 1972 ford pinto. We paid 80.00 a week for each baby to go to day care (160.00 a week for both). We struggled ate garden vegetables, live in a cheap apt and scraped by. We cut coupons, used cloth diapers, but, we never asked for anything we could not earn.

     
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  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from FaolanofEssex. Show FaolanofEssex's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to tvoter's comment:

    In response to miscricket's comment:


    Biotch I spent 3-1/2 years working full time minimum wage job while going to school 5 hours a day 5 days a week and longer on weekends to do research and assignments with 2 kids in diapers and a wife working a minimum wage job while we paid day care every week!! 

    I then worked at a little better paying job 60-80 hours a week for 10 years to pay the student loans back with interest!!

    No sleep, no life, no whinning; just working and sacrificing so, that one day things could be better!!!

    I didn't ask for a fvcking thing and the govt didn't give me fvcking thing!!

    I am a better man for it!!

    [QUOTE]


    I'm calling you out on the above statement. I think you are not telling the truth. 2 parents earning minimum wage could not afford full time day care for two children in diapers.

    Just using today's numbers

    minimum wage  $8/HR times 40 hours =$320 gross per adult. Child care cost for "kid diapers" = $300 per week. If you and your wife were both working minimum wage jobs..you would not even bring home enough to pay for child care. 

    Now..imagine if you were doing it on your own..without the benefit of the other parent? How would you do it??

    By the way..did you take the child dependent tax credit on your income tax return? If yes..then you got government assistance.

    But..nice try at hyperbole.

    [QUOTE]

    I really don't care what you THINK you know.

    I was in school from 88-92 worked making minimum wage (4.25 hr) at that time, and my wife worked minimum wage as well; I took the bus to school/work and she drove our only vehicle a 1972 ford pinto. We paid 80.00 a week for each baby to go to day care (160.00 a week for both). We struggled ate garden vegetables, live in a cheap apt and scraped by. We cut coupons, used cloth diapers, but, we never asked for anything we could not earn.



    Sooooo did you take the child tax credit? How about the tax credit you get for child care? Did you take either of those? How did you afford baby formula?

    $80 a week for a baby? Sounds like you used an illegal day care.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from FaolanofEssex. Show FaolanofEssex's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to StalkingButler's comment:

    Say, what exactly is our exit strategy on this "war on poverty" thing?

     



    The only exit strategy for the war on poverty is a classless society. Unless that's what you want we will always have an obligation to help those less fortunate. After all, isn't that the "christian" way?

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to FaolanofEssex's comment:

    In response to StalkingButler's comment:

    Say, what exactly is our exit strategy on this "war on poverty" thing?

    The only exit strategy for the war on poverty is a classless society. Unless that's what you want we will always have an obligation to help those less fortunate. After all, isn't that the "christian" way?




    We should always help those that NEED help.

    We should not allow people to abuse the programs and therefore steal from the down trodden and those that actually need real help!

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from FaolanofEssex. Show FaolanofEssex's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to tvoter's comment:

    In response to FaolanofEssex's comment:

     

    In response to StalkingButler's comment:

    Say, what exactly is our exit strategy on this "war on poverty" thing?

    The only exit strategy for the war on poverty is a classless society. Unless that's what you want we will always have an obligation to help those less fortunate. After all, isn't that the "christian" way?

     




    We should always help those that NEED help.

     

    We should not allow people to abuse the programs and therefore steal from the down trodden and those that actually need real help!

     




    And you determine who needs help? Headstart families don't need help in your view? Headstart families are the very meaning of poor and downtrodden.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    The fact Head Start fails at its stated goal is found to be irrelevant by liberals. This is not surprising.

    The U.S. welfare system is set up not to give people a temporary boost toward self reliance and work, but to make people servile and dependent. Subsidizing poverty incentivizes people to remain indefinitely on these programs.

     

    Poor person loses, by lack of self reliance, being given a lack of incentive to work their way up the ladder, Taxpayers lose. Who beneifts?

    The social service bureaucracy, the public unions and the Democratic Party's vote totals all benefit.

    Benefits stacked upon benefits can mean it is financially better, at least in the short term, to stay at a lower-paying jobs rather than taking a higher paying job and losing those benefits. This is called the “welfare cliff.”

    Let’s take the example of a single mom with two kids, 1 and 4. She has a $29,000 a year job, putting the kids in daycare during the day while she works.

    As detrmined by  Gary Alexander, Pennsylvania’s secretary of Public Welfare —  the single mom is better off earning gross income of $29,000 with $57,327 in net income and benefits than to earn gross income of $69,000 with net income & benefits of $57,045.

    It would sure be tempting for that mom to keep the status quo rather than take the new job, even though the new position might lead to further career advancement and a higher standard of living.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to FaolanofEssex's comment:

    In response to tvoter's comment:

    In response to miscricket's comment:


    Biotch I spent 3-1/2 years working full time minimum wage job while going to school 5 hours a day 5 days a week and longer on weekends to do research and assignments with 2 kids in diapers and a wife working a minimum wage job while we paid day care every week!! 

    I then worked at a little better paying job 60-80 hours a week for 10 years to pay the student loans back with interest!!

    No sleep, no life, no whinning; just working and sacrificing so, that one day things could be better!!!

    I didn't ask for a fvcking thing and the govt didn't give me fvcking thing!!

    I am a better man for it!!

    [QUOTE]


    I'm calling you out on the above statement. I think you are not telling the truth. 2 parents earning minimum wage could not afford full time day care for two children in diapers.

    Just using today's numbers

    minimum wage  $8/HR times 40 hours =$320 gross per adult. Child care cost for "kid diapers" = $300 per week. If you and your wife were both working minimum wage jobs..you would not even bring home enough to pay for child care. 

    Now..imagine if you were doing it on your own..without the benefit of the other parent? How would you do it??

    By the way..did you take the child dependent tax credit on your income tax return? If yes..then you got government assistance.

    But..nice try at hyperbole.

    [QUOTE]

    I really don't care what you THINK you know.

    I was in school from 88-92 worked making minimum wage (4.25 hr) at that time, and my wife worked minimum wage as well; I took the bus to school/work and she drove our only vehicle a 1972 ford pinto. We paid 80.00 a week for each baby to go to day care (160.00 a week for both). We struggled ate garden vegetables, live in a cheap apt and scraped by. We cut coupons, used cloth diapers, but, we never asked for anything we could not earn.

    [QUOTE]

    Sooooo did you take the child tax credit? How about the tax credit you get for child care? Did you take either of those? How did you afford baby formula?

    $80 a week for a baby? Sounds like you used an illegal day care.



    They were breast fed and my wife spent a lot of time with a breast pump to maintain a stock.

    Nothing was illegal but, it obviously upsets you that we sacrificed and worked hard and didnt want a hand out! why is that?

     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from FaolanofEssex. Show FaolanofEssex's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to tvoter's comment:

    why is that?



    Oh, no, I think it was the bit about making sh!t up to support another mindless rant that was aggravating... 

     



    Interesting how TVVoter doesn't want to answer the question about the child tax credit and the day care tax credit.  Nor does he answer the question on how he would have done it without his wife. Interesting.

     
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  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from FaolanofEssex. Show FaolanofEssex's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to msobstinate99's comment:

    In response to FaolanofEssex's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to tvoter's comment:

    why is that?



    Oh, no, I think it was the bit about making sh!t up to support another mindless rant that was aggravating... 

     

     



    Interesting how TVVoter doesn't want to answer the question about the child tax credit and the day care tax credit.  Nor does he answer the question on how he would have done it without his wife. Interesting.

     

     



    Were either of those tax credits available in 88-92? I thought they were fairly new.

     




    Both were available.  The dependent tax credit has been around since I was a kid. The cost of infant care was also more like $140-$180 per child too. TVVoter claims to have paid half of that. I agree that the numbers don't add up.

     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to tvoter's comment:

    why is that?

    Oh, no, I think it was the bit about making sh!t up to support another mindless rant that was aggravating... 



    ok troll, no one expects you to be logical. Still not going away as promised huh lol

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to msobstinate99's comment:

     Some people miss what is right in front of them.

    Indeed.  As Orwell said, it's a constant battle.

    However, some people have the intimate, working knowledge to understand the problem and how it affects everyday, ordinary people.

    Years of teaching ESL will do that.

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from StalkingButler. Show StalkingButler's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    The only exit strategy for the war on poverty is a classless society.


    Uh huh. Say, exactly what colors are the unicorns in your universe?

    Oh, I agree that we need to help the poor. I just think that we need a system in which they are not exploited for votes and an environment that gives them incentive to become successful.

    But then the Democrats would lose their base, now wouldn't they.

     

     

     

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to StalkingButler's comment:

     

    The only exit strategy for the war on poverty is a classless society.

     


    Uh huh. Say, exactly what colors are the unicorns in your universe?

    Oh, I agree that we need to help the poor. I just think that we need a system in which they are not exploited for votes and an environment that gives them incentive to become successful.

    But then the Democrats would lose their base, now wouldn't they.



    "not exploited for votes"

    Is that why the GOP has been actively trying to strike poor and minority voters from the rolls in several key swing states...?  Voter ID laws are exploitative, too.

    If the GOP was even remotely capable of appealing to those parts of the population, then what are they waiting for...?  What "incentives" have they created - or even considered - to do so...?

     

    I agree a classless society is impossible (barring a nuclear war or plague).  But class can also co-exist with opportunity, if only the latter is favored over the former.  The elite on both sides just aren't that cool with it.

     

     

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from FaolanofEssex. Show FaolanofEssex's posts

    Re: Liberal program

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to StalkingButler's comment:

     

     

    The only exit strategy for the war on poverty is a classless society.

     


    Uh huh. Say, exactly what colors are the unicorns in your universe?

    Oh, I agree that we need to help the poor. I just think that we need a system in which they are not exploited for votes and an environment that gives them incentive to become successful.

    But then the Democrats would lose their base, now wouldn't they.

     



    "not exploited for votes"

     

    Is that why the GOP has been actively trying to strike poor and minority voters from the rolls in several key swing states...?  Voter ID laws are exploitative, too.

    If the GOP was even remotely capable of appealing to those parts of the population, then what are they waiting for...?  What "incentives" have they created - or even considered - to do so...?

     

    I agree a classless society is impossible (barring a nuclear war or plague).  But class can also co-exist with opportunity, if only the latter is favored over the former.  The elite on both sides just aren't that cool with it.

     

     




    The ironic thing is that entitlement spending has been higher when the GOP is in control. Obama's strategy now of forcing the GOP to agree on spending cuts Boehner can get the votes for is brilliant.  The GOP can't even agree amongst themselves and are about to tank the global economy.

     
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