MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

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    MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    MSNBC’s newest liberal darling Chris Hayes has just been given a promotion, going from weekend anchor to host of his own primetime show, All In w/ Chris Hayes.  So how does he celebrate? By arguing that Guantanamo detainees should be paid restitution and allowed to live in the United States, with a path, ultimately to citizenship, of course.

    In an article posted on MSNBC.com, Hayes criticized Guantanamo Bay’s continued existence in a piece entitled, “Time for radical action on Guantanamo.”  Hayes, who railed against Obama’s failure to keep his promise to close the prison in Cuba, argues that:

    The dozens of men who have been cleared by the United States government for release should be released immediately, should be paid restitution, and offered legal residence in the United States.

    Hayes began his diatribe by sympathizing with the 40 or so detainees engaging in a hunger strike at the prison, comparing them to the hundreds of New York City fast food workers who walked off the job on April 4.  Hayes argued that:

    Of the 166 detainees left at Guantanamo over half of them have already been cleared for release, meaning that the government does not have a case against them and does not think they pose a threat to the United States. And yet they languish at the prison at Guantanamo. 

     

    Hayes ignored the obvious fact that most countries from which the detainees originate do not want these men to return to their county, for obvious reasons.  If numerous countries do not want to accept these inmates back into their home country, why would the United States?  Hayes not only wants these detainees to receive restitution, but also offer legal residence in the United States, a policy that is far to the left of President Obama. 

    The issue of what to do with detainees at Guantanamo who have been found not guilty is a sensitive and tricky issue, but Hayes’ reactionary response ignores the seriousness of the war on terror.

    Not guilty doesnt mean innocent, or not a threat to commit terrorist acts....maybe they can hang out with Chris Hayes at his house...





    Read more: http://newsbusters.org/blogs/jeffrey-meyer/2013/04/05/msnbc-s-hayes-let-released-gitmo-detainees-live-us-paid-restitution#ixzz2PoB5k2Nc
     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    Isn't one of Obamas lies he would close gitmo?
     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    So what do you do with these people? 

    Cleared of wrongdoing with no place to go after we snatched them up in the first place over a decade ago...  Don't we have some responsibility for creating this situation? 

     

     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    We have laws. We have maximum security jails. We even have lawyers and judges who are very capable of dealing with these cases in a just and timely manner. 

    Those whom we have no case against should be let free. And yes, we should compensate them for the suffering they had to endure for over 10 years. Those who committed crimes, should be tried in US courts, on US soil. Guantanamo needs to close. Period.

    If only the folks worried about President Obama taking away their guns would get half as worked up about this actual misuse of government power.

     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    Wait...wasn't Obama going to close Gitmo???

     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    In response to UserName99's comment:

     

    We have laws. We have maximum security jails. We even have lawyers and judges who are very capable of dealing with these cases in a just and timely manner. 

    Those whom we have no case against should be let free. And yes, we should compensate them for the suffering they had to endure for over 10 years. Those who committed crimes, should be tried in US courts, on US soil. Guantanamo needs to close. Period.

    If only the folks worried about President Obama taking away their guns would get half as worked up about this actual misuse of government power.

     

     

    Domestic US criminal laws do not apply to international soldiers of terrorism....

    On 13 January 2009, the Pentagon said that 18 former Gitmo detainees previously released are confirmed to have participated in terrorist attacks, and 43 are suspected to have been involved in attacks!!!

    We let some Gitmo detainees go, because of clueless liberals claiming they were but poor innocent farmers. And they go back out and kill.

    And you now want to release them and pay them money for participating in terrorist attacks on the US... The only reason we dont release them to other countries, is that these other countries WONT TAKE THEM. Why might that be?

    The fact we cant convict some of these terrorist soldiers beyond a reasonable doubt under domestic criminal laws ,  is no reason to release them. They are dangerous, even the Obama Administration knows this.

    Perhaps a condition of release is that these terrorists should have to take a solemn oath to promise never to participate in future terrorism aginst the US.

    Most wont do that, because they are zealots out to kill us. Let 'em rot in prison.  

     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    Most liberals signed on from Day One to the meme that Gitmo was a torture chamber, and the Gitmo detainees were innocent farmers, and ACLU lawyers must work full time to free them.

    The Bush Administration responded to this pressure by trying to weed out those that were less of a threat. They let out way too many,  who went right back to the battlefield.

    The Obama Administration to its credit learned from those mistakes, and released fewer, and fewer were recidivists...Obama wanted to close Gitmo, but Obama never committed to freeing all the prisoners....even those who could not be convicted in a domestic criminal court...

     
     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

     

    So you're saying that anything you don't like that a Repub administration does is the liberals fault, anything they do that you like is just good Repub policy even though they are both done by the same person.

    That is quite convenient.

    I bet you win alot of arguments that way.

     



    One might think so...but no...not really....

     

    Shooting the messenger - as per the OP - is another of his, er, peculiarities....

     

     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens


    "So you're saying that anything you don't like that a Repub administration does is the liberals fault, anything they do that you like is just good Repub policy even though they are both done by the same people.That is quite convenient.
    I bet you win alot of arguments that way.
    Of course the obvious should go without saying... if the liberals have so much influence over the opposing party then; Why have two parties?
    Or are the liberals just there for you to blame for all the failings of the Repub party, regardless of culpability?"


    I am glad you agree that releasing prisoners from GITMO is a terrible idea. The Bush Adminstration is to blame for releasing terrorists to other countries, who went back to the battlefield to kill again....

    So please explain to me why we should not only release GITMO prisoners, but release them into US territory, pay them money and make them citizens? 

     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    Obama closed Gitmo.

     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    Putting aside Hayes' remarks, what should be done?

     

    We run around the planet snapping up anyone we think might be a terrorist or related to one. We yank them from their families, from their lives. We fail to prove they are a terrorist. We have stolen 10 years of their life.

    What should we do with such a person?

    Buy them a one-way to Afghanistan and say "p!ss off, sucker"......just because we can? "USA! USA! USA!" ?

     



    "We run around the planet snapping up anyone we think might be a terrorist or related to one. We yank them from their families, from their lives. We fail to prove they are a terrorist. We have stolen 10 years of their life."

     

    Yes we snapped up terrorist soldiers from the battlefield...we "stole 10 years of their lives"...

    Whereas you have no issue with Obama drones stealing not 10 years, but entire lives, and those of their families, for anyone as you say we "think" might be a terrorist, including a 16 yr old...

    The double standard is jaw dropping.

     

     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    Putting aside Hayes' remarks, what should be done?

     

    We run around the planet snapping up anyone we think might be a terrorist or related to one. We yank them from their families, from their lives. We fail to prove they are a terrorist. We have stolen 10 years of their life.

    What should we do with such a person?

    Buy them a one-way to Afghanistan and say "p!ss off, sucker"......just because we can? "USA! USA! USA!" ?

     

     



     

    "We run around the planet snapping up anyone we think might be a terrorist or related to one. We yank them from their families, from their lives. We fail to prove they are a terrorist. We have stolen 10 years of their life."

     

    Yes we snapped up terrorist soldiers from the battlefield...we "stole 10 years of their lives"...

    Whereas you have no issue with Obama drones stealing not 10 years, but entire lives, and those of their families, for anyone as you say we "think" might be a terrorist, including a 16 yr old...

    The double standard is jaw dropping.

     



    I certainly take issue with him on his Gitmo and Drone policies. 

    Its difficult to guage which is more counterproductive, immoral, or cowardly.  Both will go down as his biggest failures as a leader.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    Putting aside Hayes' remarks, what should be done?

    We run around the planet snapping up anyone we think might be a terrorist or related to one. We yank them from their families, from their lives. We fail to prove they are a terrorist. We have stolen 10 years of their life.

    What should we do with such a person?

    Buy them a one-way to Afghanistan and say "p!ss off, sucker"......just because we can? "USA! USA! USA!" ?

     




     

    No response then. K....



    You get a gold sticker for your "gotcha" moment....wear it with pride young man!

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

     

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

     


    "So you're saying that anything you don't like that a Repub administration does is the liberals fault, anything they do that you like is just good Repub policy even though they are both done by the same people.That is quite convenient.
    I bet you win alot of arguments that way.
    Of course the obvious should go without saying... if the liberals have so much influence over the opposing party then; Why have two parties?
    Or are the liberals just there for you to blame for all the failings of the Repub party, regardless of culpability?"


    I am glad you agree that releasing prisoners from GITMO is a terrible idea. The Bush Adminstration is to blame for releasing terrorists to other countries, who went back to the battlefield to kill again....

    So please explain to me why we should not only release GITMO prisoners, but release them into US territory, pay them money and make them citizens? 

     

     


    I can speak for myself thank you, so I don't need you putting words in my mouth that I never said.

     

    It's an accepted fact that some of the detainees at Gitmo are innocent.
    Those, and only those, people should be released.

    Your blanket assumption that they are all guilty and shouldn't be released is just wrong for a couple of reasons.

    I've read many of your posts and one of the overriding themes is that gov't is bad and gets everything wrong. So why are you so intent to believe all of these prisoners are guilty? They were captured by that same gov't you keep saying is so incompetent. It sounds like another one of your 'selective' arguments where you only accept those things that align with your political ideology and conveniently dismiss the realities that you just don't like.

    One of the founding principals of the US was:

    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

    Your position is in conflict with what this country stands for. The Dec of Ind. doesn't say only Americans. The Founding Fathers recognized that depriving anyone of their Liberty without just cause was immoral and in conflict with the law of the Creator. That document is just as valid for these innocents as it was for the colonists fighting for their own Liberty.

    As for restitution, I think they should be given something for wrongly losing a decade or more of their life.

     

     

     

    "The Founding Fathers recognized that depriving anyone of their Liberty without just cause was immoral "

    By the laws of war, those not in uniform, spies,  sabouteurs and terrorists could be hung without trial. General George Washington followed that Law of War, the Declaration of Independence notwithstanding...

    Get real. Unless you have forgotten the 3,000 killed on 9/11 and the thousands of innocent terror victims, there is just cause. This is war.

    It is an accepted fact that most GITMO detainees are Jihadists, whose mission in life is to commit mass murder aginst Americans. Most were captured on the battlefield.

    Once again, you cannot use the domestic criminal laws and burdens of proof in a situation of terrorism and war.

    Where is the precedent for prisoners of war to each get an individual trial after capture on the battlefield, so they could argue it was all a big mistake? Did German prisoners of war each get a trial? POWs stay incarcerated until the conflict ends. 

     

     

     
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  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

     

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

     

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

     


    "So you're saying that anything you don't like that a Repub administration does is the liberals fault, anything they do that you like is just good Repub policy even though they are both done by the same people.That is quite convenient.
    I bet you win alot of arguments that way.
    Of course the obvious should go without saying... if the liberals have so much influence over the opposing party then; Why have two parties?
    Or are the liberals just there for you to blame for all the failings of the Repub party, regardless of culpability?"


    I am glad you agree that releasing prisoners from GITMO is a terrible idea. The Bush Adminstration is to blame for releasing terrorists to other countries, who went back to the battlefield to kill again....

    So please explain to me why we should not only release GITMO prisoners, but release them into US territory, pay them money and make them citizens? 

     

     


    I can speak for myself thank you, so I don't need you putting words in my mouth that I never said.

     

    It's an accepted fact that some of the detainees at Gitmo are innocent.
    Those, and only those, people should be released.

    Your blanket assumption that they are all guilty and shouldn't be released is just wrong for a couple of reasons.

    I've read many of your posts and one of the overriding themes is that gov't is bad and gets everything wrong. So why are you so intent to believe all of these prisoners are guilty? They were captured by that same gov't you keep saying is so incompetent. It sounds like another one of your 'selective' arguments where you only accept those things that align with your political ideology and conveniently dismiss the realities that you just don't like.

    One of the founding principals of the US was:

    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

    Your position is in conflict with what this country stands for. The Dec of Ind. doesn't say only Americans. The Founding Fathers recognized that depriving anyone of their Liberty without just cause was immoral and in conflict with the law of the Creator. That document is just as valid for these innocents as it was for the colonists fighting for their own Liberty.

    As for restitution, I think they should be given something for wrongly losing a decade or more of their life.

     

     

     

    "The Founding Fathers recognized that depriving anyone of their Liberty without just cause was immoral "

    By the laws of war, those not in uniform, spies,  sabouteurs and terrorists could be hung without trial. General George Washington followed that Law of War, the Declaration of Independence notwithstanding...

    Get real. Unless you have forgotten the 3,000 killed on 9/11 and the thousands of innocent terror victims, there is just cause. This is war.

    It is an accepted fact that most GITMO detainees are Jihadists, whose mission in life is to commit mass murder aginst Americans. Most were captured on the battlefield.

    Once again, you cannot use the domestic criminal laws and burdens of proof in a situation of terrorism and war.

    Where is the precedent for prisoners of war to each get an individual trial after capture on the battlefield, so they could argue it was all a big mistake? Did German prisoners of war each get a trial? POWs stay incarcerated until the conflict ends. 

     

     

     

     




     

    There ya go again, trusting the inept gov't only when it suits your political ideology.

    It's hard to argue a point with someone who inserts opinion in place of fact.

    Who says every one of these detainees is guilty?

    It certainly wasn't Bush, the guy who set up the camp in the first place. He released hundreds of prisoners.

    It certainly isn't the military who is in charge of these prisoners.

    By November 2005, 358 of the then-505 detainees held at Guantanamo Bay had Administrative Review Board hearings. Of these, 3% were granted and were awaiting release, 20% were to be transferred, 37% were to be further detained at Guantanamo, and no decision had been made in 40% of the cases. ... Of two dozen Uyghur detainees at Guantanamo Bay, The Washington Post reported on August 25, 2005, fifteen were found not to be "enemy combatants."

     


    As for your specious and wildly innacurate "rules of war" argument, the US Supreme Court has ruled at least TWICE on the matter, finding both times that the detainee process was illegal under BOTH US law and the Geneva Convention.

    In July 2004, following the Hamdi v. Rumsfeld ruling by the US Supreme Court, which said detainees had the right to challenge detention before an impartial tribunal, the Bush administration established Combatant Status Review Tribunals to determine whether individual detainees were "enemy combatants."
    On June 29, 2006, the Supreme Court of the United States reversed the ruling of the Court of Appeals in Hamdan v. Rumsfeld, and found that President Bush did not have authority to set up the war crimes tribunals. They ruled that the commissions were illegal under both military justice law and the Geneva Convention.

     

    This is where you blame the liberals and anyone who believes in the founding principals of this country and the rule of law as decided by the US Supreme Court only because you can't accept the facts. It's easier to mindlessly blame someone, anyone, because reality isn't going the way you want it to.



    Welcome back, angryman.

     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    "It's an accepted fact that some of the detainees at Gitmo are innocent.
    Those, and only those, people should be released."

    Easy to say, hard to accomplish consistent with keeping Americans safe from mass terrorists...
    How do you determine, exactly, who is "innocent"? What is the standard of proof?
    And how do you define innocent? If an Al Qaeada trained terrorist was  identified before he has killed anyone, is he "innocent"?

    Is your position there is no such thing as the "Law of War", and these prisoners are no different from a burglar caught by police? That they can be released on bail?
     
    If an Al Qaeada pledges once released to return to Al Qaeada and become a suicide bomber, does he have a "constitutional right" to be released onto US soil? 

    It is not as easy as you state. Even Obama's leftist lawyers are wary of releasing from Gitmo a future mass terrorist.

     
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    Re: MSNBC newest lefty loon Chris Hayes: Gitmo detainees shoud be given restitution and become US citizens

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

     

    "It's an accepted fact that some of the detainees at Gitmo are innocent.
    Those, and only those, people should be released."

    Easy to say, hard to accomplish consistent with keeping Americans safe from mass terrorists...
    How do you determine, exactly, who is "innocent"? What is the standard of proof?
    And how do you define innocent? If an Al Qaeada trained terrorist was  identified before he has killed anyone, is he "innocent"?

    Is your position there is no such thing as the "Law of War", and these prisoners are no different from a burglar caught by police? That they can be released on bail?
     
    If an Al Qaeada pledges once released to return to Al Qaeada and become a suicide bomber, does he have a "constitutional right" to be released onto US soil? 

    It is not as easy as you state. Even Obama's leftist lawyers are wary of releasing from Gitmo a future mass terrorist.

     




     

    We don't have time machines and invisibility cloaks that would allow us to be 100% certain that someone is innocent, therefore, we should be fine with our government snapping people up from anywhere in the world and imposing a life sentence without trial?

    Please.

    It takes a considered evaluation of the evidence to determine whether there is sufficient proof. Juries do this every day. There is nothing magical about accused terrorists that would prevent evaluation of evidence.

    Your posts boil down to "hold them for life without evidence because that makes me less scared."

     

     

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

    If an Al Qaeada trained terrorist was  identified before he has killed anyone, is he "innocent"?

     


    We arrest gang members for crimes they have committed. We do not hold someone in jail for life simply because a police officer saw them hanging out with persons known to be gang members on a number of occasions.

    Is your position that people who are not American citizens need not be treated as human beings - especially if you are afraid? That if there weren't these pesky constitutional rights, you'd be just as happy if they did it with Americans the pre-cogs have identified as potential future criminals? Because that's what it sounds like, at the end of the day.

    Of course, if this thread goes as usual, we may see gitmo-lovers avoid the actual questions with self-righteous bloviating along the lines of: "So you don't care if one of them kills an American

    Such bloviation misses the point entirely.

    The question is how we want our government - which represents us - to treat human beings who weren't born on American soil.

    One would hope the moralist warriors of the right could come up with more than "well, they aren't citizens and I'm afraid and what if"

     

     



    No one wants innocent people being held indefinitely, but I think you are confusing law of war with law of civilians.  I think you have a law background, so, I would be interested in your opinion.

     

     

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