North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to StalkingButler's comment:

    I think you're starting to understand the point the NC legislators were trying to make.



    Indeed, but as I explained on the last page, they picked a pretty daft subject to try to make the point about....     

     

    They have wiggle room challenging restrictive gun laws. They don't challenging incorporation of the 1st.




    Agreed,  it is futile to claim states can ignore federal court interpretations of the First Amendment.

    Unfortunately, it is usually futile also for a small county's local official to challenge the big bad ACLU, on its antireligious jihad mission to intimidate and harass Christians...

    Local counties dont have the money or legal talent to hire to challenge the intimidation tactics of the ACLU. So likely they will have to acquiesce. Another nail in the coffin for religious freedom.

    There is no direct Supreme Court case saying a county official cant say a prayer to open a meeting ....but the ACLU doesnt care, it is out to muzzle religious freedom.

    A recent California case held, “a Bishop’s single reference to Jesus in an invocation did not amount to a violation of the Establishment Clause (of the First Amendment). The Court found that public prayers are legal if they do not “proselytize, advance, or disparage one religion or affiliate government with a particular faith.”

    Two citizens had sued the City of Lancaster after one pastor used the name of Jesus in a public prayer. The case went to the Court of Appeals. The judges said they “saw nothing in the record or in the prayer policy to indicate that the City had affiliated itself with Christianity.”

     
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    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to StalkingButler's comment:

    I think you're starting to understand the point the NC legislators were trying to make.



    Indeed, but as I explained on the last page, they picked a pretty daft subject to try to make the point about....     

     

    They have wiggle room challenging restrictive gun laws. They don't challenging incorporation of the 1st.

     




     

    Agreed,  it is futile to claim states can ignore federal court interpretations of the First Amendment.

    Unfortunately, it is usually futile also for a small county's local official to challenge the big bad ACLU, on its antireligious jihad mission to intimidate and harass Christians...

    Local counties dont have the money or legal talent to hire to challenge the intimidation tactics of the ACLU. So likely they will have to acquiesce. Another nail in the coffin for religious freedom.

    There is no direct Supreme Court case saying a county official cant say a prayer to open a meeting ....but the ACLU doesnt care, it is out to muzzle religious freedom.

    A recent California case held, “a Bishop’s single reference to Jesus in an invocation did not amount to a violation of the Establishment Clause (of the First Amendment). The Court found that public prayers are legal if they do not “proselytize, advance, or disparage one religion or affiliate government with a particular faith.”

    Two citizens had sued the City of Lancaster after one pastor used the name of Jesus in a public prayer. The case went to the Court of Appeals. The judges said they “saw nothing in the record or in the prayer policy to indicate that the City had affiliated itself with Christianity.”

     

    It all depends on personal perspective.

    If the prayers invoked Allah or Muhamed, would these same legislators defend it as a 1st Amend right?



    No doubt the ACLU would.  

     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    In response to jedwardnicky's comment:

    In response to skeeter20's comment:

     

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:

     

    In response to skeeter20's comment:

     

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:

     

    In response to Reubenhop's comment:

     

    Does the G.O.P. want live in a different century and/or country?  Certain conservatives down South seem to want to...

     

    Republican North Carolina state legislators have proposed allowing an official state religion in a measure that would declare the state exempt from the Constitution and court rulings.

    The bill, filed Monday by two GOP lawmakers from Rowan County and backed by nine other Republicans, says each state "is sovereign" and courts cannot block a state "from making laws respecting an establishment of religion." The legislation was filed in response to a lawsuit to stop county commissioners in Rowan County from opening meetings with a Christian prayer, wral.com reported.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/03/north-carolina-religion-bill_n_3003401.html

     



    I'm considering retiring to that state but stuff like that really turns me off ..... they might even change their State Motto from "First in Flight" to "First to Frighten the Bejeezus out of you " !

     

     




    Even though the post is not true,  I am with you conceptually.  Don't need the gov't messing around in this in terms of selecting a religion.  What might scare you about moving to NC, however, is that christians are not treated with the contempt and hatred that one sees up here in the frozen north.

     

     




    I spent 8 years in the "Bible Belt ........ I have nothing against anybody ........ I think NC is a beautiful state .

     

    btw who is treating Christians with contempt ?

     

     




    Do you not read these boards?

     

     





    I have never felt any contempt for true Christians. People like you, however, cause me to let it all out.

     



    Ha! Weasel around it all you like.  You use my religion like a club against baby seals.

     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from StalkingButler. Show StalkingButler's posts

    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    If nothing else, at least the ACLU is fair and consistent.

     

    I think that was true at one time a long time ago. Nowadays it's got to be pretty egregious for the ACLU to cross a Democrat. Kind of like how if you got a chance to look at the former serial philanderer in chief Clinton's backside you'll find the lip marks of the women who were in charge of NOW at the time.

    I do like how they piped up a bit after the last NDAA though.

     
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    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

     
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    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:


    Clumsy stupid statement, claiming only godless atheists can serve in a Legislature.

    How will you "make sure" religious beliefs dont influence any Legislator?

    Will you have to question every Legislator ? Will they have to take an oath? "I hereby declare I  do not believe in a Higher Power, and my religious beliefs will have no influence in how I vote..."

    The Founders didnt want a theocracy, but that is quite different than banning religion from the public square...  

     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    Keep your religion out of our government,

    And we'll keep our government out of your religion.



    "Our" government?  It is supposed to be religious Americans' Government, too.
    "We" meaning atheists exclusively running the Government? No thanks.

    That is an Establishment of Religion....the 'religion' being atheism.

     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Reubenhop. Show Reubenhop's posts

    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

     

    Keep your religion out of our government,

    And we'll keep our government out of your religion.

     



    "Our" government?  It is supposed to be religious Americans' Government, too.
    "We" meaning atheists exclusively running the Government? No thanks.

     

    That is an Establishment of Religion....the 'religion' being atheism.



    Now you are just being hysterical.  Calm down.  There are no atheists under your bed.  There is no godless conspiracy out to destroy America.

    We live in a secular state and it was set up that way from the beginning.  Best get used to it.

     
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    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    In response to jedwardnicky's comment:

     

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

     

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:

     

     

     

     

    Clumsy stupid statement, claiming only godless atheists can serve in a Legislature.

    How will you "make sure" religious beliefs dont influence any Legislator?

    Will you have to question every Legislator ? Will they have to take an oath? "I hereby declare I  do not believe in a Higher Power, and my religious beliefs will have no influence in how I vote..."

    The Founders didnt want a theocracy, but that is quite different than banning religion from the public square...  

     



    What a clumsy response on you behalf. I love your assumption about "godless athiests".

     

     




    Isn't "godless atheists" redundant?  But it sounds so much worse...

     

     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from StalkingButler. Show StalkingButler's posts

    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    Now that is a novel, albeit ignorant, argument ... atheism is now a "religion".

    It's a personal belief system ACC, and like any personal belief system it should not be imposed on anyone.

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Reubenhop. Show Reubenhop's posts

    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    In response to StalkingButler's comment:

    Now that is a novel, albeit ignorant, argument ... atheism is now a "religion".

     

    It's a personal belief system ACC, and like any personal belief system it should not be imposed on anyone.

     



    No one is imposing atheism on anyone.

    Unless, of course, you think the embrace of science and rational thinking is "atheism"...

     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    "No one is imposing atheism on anyone.

    Unless, of course, you think the embrace of science and rational thinking is "atheism"..."


    Typical arrogant claptrap from Rubie, wallowing in his snooty belief that any opposing viewpoint is not "science or rational thinking".

    Apparently unaware that the greatest scientists and thinkers in human history, gave humble thanks to the Almighty. 

    Science, rational thinking and belief in God are quite compatible, despite your insistence otherwise. 

    "It is true, that a little philosophy inclineth man’s mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth men's minds about to religion; for while the mind of man looketh upon second causes scattered, it may sometimes rest in them, and go no further; but when it beholdeth the chain of them confederate, and linked together, it must needs fly to Providence and Deity." --Sir Francis Bacon

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from AlleyCatBruin. Show AlleyCatBruin's posts

    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    In response to Reubenhop's comment:

    Does the G.O.P. want live in a different century and/or country?  Certain conservatives down South seem to want to...

     

    Republican North Carolina state legislators have proposed allowing an official state religion in a measure that would declare the state exempt from the Constitution and court rulings.

    The bill, filed Monday by two GOP lawmakers from Rowan County and backed by nine other Republicans, says each state "is sovereign" and courts cannot block a state "from making laws respecting an establishment of religion." The legislation was filed in response to a lawsuit to stop county commissioners in Rowan County from opening meetings with a Christian prayer, wral.com reported.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/03/north-carolina-religion-bill_n_3003401.html



    Yes, the GOP wants to live in the stone-age. They want a one religion country.

     
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  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sistersledge. Show Sistersledge's posts

    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    In response to Newtster's comment:

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:

     

     



    Of course Democrats do it all the time. They impose their opinion on the rest of us daily. Isn't that what politics is all about?

     

    If someone wants to file a bill that makes some religious opinion a law, what difference is that from someone filing a bill to make some other opinion law? They are both subject to the legislative process and the votes of elected officials?

    Aren't there many laws which reflect some religious opinion? Are we supposed to get rid of criminal laws that reflect the Ten Commandments? Some we did, some we didn't.

    Basically your quote is just a lot of bullshiiite



    Newster ..... we all know it's the unreasonable portion of the GOP who wants to impose thier opinion on the rest of the Nation and that is why your party is shinking .... so please save your breath when it comes to  bashing the Democrats about imposing their opinions on the Nation ......

    As for your statement that many of our laws reflect some religious opinions... well that is your opinion and I disagree with your opinion ..... our laws reflect common sense and they don't reflect any super natural events or an supreme being.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:

    In response to Newtster's comment:

     

    In response to Sistersledge's comment:

     

     



    Of course Democrats do it all the time. They impose their opinion on the rest of us daily. Isn't that what politics is all about?

     

    If someone wants to file a bill that makes some religious opinion a law, what difference is that from someone filing a bill to make some other opinion law? They are both subject to the legislative process and the votes of elected officials?

    Aren't there many laws which reflect some religious opinion? Are we supposed to get rid of criminal laws that reflect the Ten Commandments? Some we did, some we didn't.

    Basically your quote is just a lot of bullshiiite

     



    Newster ..... we all know it's the unreasonable portion of the GOP who wants to impose thier opinion on the rest of the Nation and that is why your party is shinking .... so please save your breath when it comes to  bashing the Democrats about imposing their opinions on the Nation ......

     

    As for your statement that many of our laws reflect some religious opinions... well that is your opinion and I disagree with your opinion ..... our laws reflect common sense and they don't reflect any super natural events or an supreme being.

    Believe what you will, but the origins of American law are rooted in Judeo-Christian principles.
    Christianity is part of the origin of the common law. 

    The principles of free limited government were rooted in Christianity....like it or not. That doesnt mean Christianity is the official state religion, that is just fact.

    US Supreme Court, 1802: "The declaration is, not that government is essential to good religion, but that religion is essential to good government. Both propositions are true, but they are true in quite different senses. Good government is essential to religion for the purpose declared elsewhere in the same section of the constitution, for the protection of mere protection. But religion, morality, and knowledge are essential to government, in the sense that they have the instrumentalities for producing and perfecting a good form of government..."

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sistersledge. Show Sistersledge's posts

    Re: North Carolina May Declare Official State Religion Under New Bill

    Br'er Crankup I'm sorry to disagree with your last comment but our government and laws are influenced more by John Locke than Jesus Christ ........  I believe the origins of our laws and government has more to do with Deism and not Christianity .

     

     
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