Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from xXR3S1NXx. Show xXR3S1NXx's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

     

    Considering the costs associated with medical procedures it's easy to see that a few million dollars doesn't equate to a lot of patients here in the US.

     

     

    PROCEDURE               COST IN U.S.   /    COST ABROAD

    Orthopedic    

    Hip Replacement $40,000 - $65,000 /- $7,000 - $13,000 

    Hip Resurfacing $50,000 - $60,000  /- $8,000 - $12,000

    Knee Replacement $45,000 - $60,000 /-  $7,500 - $12,000

    Neurology    

    Spinal Fusion $80,000 - $100,000  /- $6,000 - $10,000 

    Total Spinal Disc Replacement $100,000 - $150,000 -/  $8,000 - $12,000

    Discectomy $20,000 - $24,000 - / $5000 - $7,000

    Cardiology    

    Angioplasty $50,000 - $65,000  /  $5,000 - $7,000

    Heart Bypass $90,000 - $120,000 /  $10,000 - $18,000

    Heart Valve Replacement $125,000 - $175,000  /  $13,000 - $18,000

    Gynecology    

    Hysterectomy $18,000 - $25,000  /  $4,000 - $7,000

    Cosmetic    

    Face & Neck Lift $8,000 - $15,000  /   $2,500 – $4,000

    Breast Augmentation $6,000 - $12,000  /   $3,500 - $5,000

    Tummy Tuck $6,000 - $12,000  /  $3,800 - $5,200

    Liposuction/Area $2,000 - $3,000   /  $800 - $1,200

    Dental    

    Dental Implants/Tooth $3,000 - $5,000 /  $800 – $2,000

    Dental Crowns $800 – $1,200  /  $200 – $600

     

    http://www.medretreat.com/procedures/pricing.html

       

     



    Can any one honestly tell me(with a straight face) that you would feel safe getting some of these procedures done in another country?

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

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    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

    Right...I made those numbers up. Whatever ya need to believe. Have a good one sweetcheeks!

     

     

    The numbers might be real.

    But your conclusions are BS.  I tried to clarify and/or call you on them, and you dodged.  Typical.

    Take a whiff, cupcake...!!

     I didn't dodge anything. Your questions had nothing to do with anything. 

    Doesn't matter what the cost of the same procedure in their native land would be. The point was that people are coming here in droves to get medical procedures done. To the tune of $88M for just TWO hospitals.

    If universal coverage is so great why the need to come here?

     More BS.

     You portrayed those millions were from "single-payer systems".  Can you back up that claim?  I'll bet a good portion came from impoverished nations like the DR, Haiti, Latin America, et al.

    Can you back that up? 

    Well, since our International business is self pay I would say your assertion that a good portion is coming from impoverished nations is a bad one.

    No, it's not, because there are rich people in poor countries without single-payer healthcare (your assertion).  I didn't say the medical tourists are poor; likely they wouldn't be because US costs are astronomical.

    I posted above an example above showing how medical tourism from the U.S. far and away outnumbers people coming here.

    Yes, you did show something from 2007...that's great....what does that have to do with what I brought up???

    It shows that you're confused.  Far more people leave the US for healthcare than come here for it.  If you have opposing or more current data, then post it.  

    In addition, the relevance is that people come to the U.S. for healthcare because they can afford it, not necessarily because of single-payer.  Even single-payer nations have a private insurance market where richer people can get care wherever and whenever they want.

    Again, you're confusing coverage with care.  

    Perhaps if you showed how that $51M is a percentage of the total FY12 revenue and then accounted for so-called "civilized" nations, you might have had an honest argument.  Instead, you're being unnecessarily obtuse and prickish.

    What does the percent of International for our total book of business have to do with anything? NOW who's moving the goalposts? Again, the point was to show in total dollars that TONS of people are coming from these universal coverage countries. Sorry you don't like it

    It's relevant because you're throwing out numbers without context like a audience member at The Price Is Right.  Healthcare spending adds up to roughly a trillion dollars in the U.S., so your sums of $51M and $88M are rather meaningless. (just like bigdog's touching though irrelevant anecdote)

    I'm trying to help you by educating you.  Don't get pi55y just because you're wrong.




     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hansoribrother. Show Hansoribrother's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    Considering the costs associated with medical procedures it's easy to see that a few million dollars doesn't equate to a lot of patients here in the US.

     

     

    PROCEDURE               COST IN U.S.   /    COST ABROAD

    Orthopedic    

    Hip Replacement $40,000 - $65,000 /- $7,000 - $13,000 

    Hip Resurfacing $50,000 - $60,000  /- $8,000 - $12,000

    Knee Replacement $45,000 - $60,000 /-  $7,500 - $12,000

    Neurology    

    Spinal Fusion $80,000 - $100,000  /- $6,000 - $10,000 

    Total Spinal Disc Replacement $100,000 - $150,000 -/  $8,000 - $12,000

    Discectomy $20,000 - $24,000 - / $5000 - $7,000

    Cardiology    

    Angioplasty $50,000 - $65,000  /  $5,000 - $7,000

    Heart Bypass $90,000 - $120,000 /  $10,000 - $18,000

    Heart Valve Replacement $125,000 - $175,000  /  $13,000 - $18,000

    Gynecology    

    Hysterectomy $18,000 - $25,000  /  $4,000 - $7,000

    Cosmetic    

    Face & Neck Lift $8,000 - $15,000  /   $2,500 – $4,000

    Breast Augmentation $6,000 - $12,000  /   $3,500 - $5,000

    Tummy Tuck $6,000 - $12,000  /  $3,800 - $5,200

    Liposuction/Area $2,000 - $3,000   /  $800 - $1,200

    Dental    

    Dental Implants/Tooth $3,000 - $5,000 /  $800 – $2,000

    Dental Crowns $800 – $1,200  /  $200 – $600

     

    http://www.medretreat.com/procedures/pricing.html

       



    WHat is all this supposed to mean? I think we all know it is expensive here in the US. What is Obamcare doing about it? Not much. Obamacare is all about how you pay for services, not how much they cost.

    Plus, cost is only one aspect of a procedure or treatment. Another is outcome or quality which is not mentioned. 

    The problem with US healthcare is the processes are too complex, we throw money at it and all that does is cause price to go up, and we behave in an unhealthy manner which causes all sorts of chronic conditions that many of the other countries do not have - YET. 

     

     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to xXR3S1NXx's comment:

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

     

    Considering the costs associated with medical procedures it's easy to see that a few million dollars doesn't equate to a lot of patients here in the US.

     

     

    PROCEDURE               COST IN U.S.   /    COST ABROAD

    Orthopedic    

    Hip Replacement $40,000 - $65,000 /- $7,000 - $13,000 

    Hip Resurfacing $50,000 - $60,000  /- $8,000 - $12,000

    Knee Replacement $45,000 - $60,000 /-  $7,500 - $12,000

    Neurology    

    Spinal Fusion $80,000 - $100,000  /- $6,000 - $10,000 

    Total Spinal Disc Replacement $100,000 - $150,000 -/  $8,000 - $12,000

    Discectomy $20,000 - $24,000 - / $5000 - $7,000

    Cardiology    

    Angioplasty $50,000 - $65,000  /  $5,000 - $7,000

    Heart Bypass $90,000 - $120,000 /  $10,000 - $18,000

    Heart Valve Replacement $125,000 - $175,000  /  $13,000 - $18,000

    Gynecology    

    Hysterectomy $18,000 - $25,000  /  $4,000 - $7,000

    Cosmetic    

    Face & Neck Lift $8,000 - $15,000  /   $2,500 – $4,000

    Breast Augmentation $6,000 - $12,000  /   $3,500 - $5,000

    Tummy Tuck $6,000 - $12,000  /  $3,800 - $5,200

    Liposuction/Area $2,000 - $3,000   /  $800 - $1,200

    Dental    

    Dental Implants/Tooth $3,000 - $5,000 /  $800 – $2,000

    Dental Crowns $800 – $1,200  /  $200 – $600

     

    http://www.medretreat.com/procedures/pricing.html

       

     



    Can any one honestly tell me(with a straight face) that you would feel safe getting some of these procedures done in another country?

     



    Happens all the time.

    Far more than people who come here for medical care.

    Dental work, in particular, is stupid expensive here, and dental insurance here likewise blows chunks.  Too bad, because it's a health issue like any other.

    All of my dentists and doctors are foreign-born anyway.  What's the difference?  Cost.

     

    Americans must stop believing we are the best in everything.  Most things, yes.

    But not everything.  Not by a long shot.

     

     

     

     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from xXR3S1NXx. Show xXR3S1NXx's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to xXR3S1NXx's comment:

     

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

     

    Considering the costs associated with medical procedures it's easy to see that a few million dollars doesn't equate to a lot of patients here in the US.

     

     

    PROCEDURE               COST IN U.S.   /    COST ABROAD

    Orthopedic    

    Hip Replacement $40,000 - $65,000 /- $7,000 - $13,000 

    Hip Resurfacing $50,000 - $60,000  /- $8,000 - $12,000

    Knee Replacement $45,000 - $60,000 /-  $7,500 - $12,000

    Neurology    

    Spinal Fusion $80,000 - $100,000  /- $6,000 - $10,000 

    Total Spinal Disc Replacement $100,000 - $150,000 -/  $8,000 - $12,000

    Discectomy $20,000 - $24,000 - / $5000 - $7,000

    Cardiology    

    Angioplasty $50,000 - $65,000  /  $5,000 - $7,000

    Heart Bypass $90,000 - $120,000 /  $10,000 - $18,000

    Heart Valve Replacement $125,000 - $175,000  /  $13,000 - $18,000

    Gynecology    

    Hysterectomy $18,000 - $25,000  /  $4,000 - $7,000

    Cosmetic    

    Face & Neck Lift $8,000 - $15,000  /   $2,500 – $4,000

    Breast Augmentation $6,000 - $12,000  /   $3,500 - $5,000

    Tummy Tuck $6,000 - $12,000  /  $3,800 - $5,200

    Liposuction/Area $2,000 - $3,000   /  $800 - $1,200

    Dental    

    Dental Implants/Tooth $3,000 - $5,000 /  $800 – $2,000

    Dental Crowns $800 – $1,200  /  $200 – $600

     

    http://www.medretreat.com/procedures/pricing.html

       

     



    Can any one honestly tell me(with a straight face) that you would feel safe getting some of these procedures done in another country?

     

     



    Happens all the time.

     

    Far more than people who come here for medical care.

    Dental work, in particular, is stupid expensive here, and dental insurance here likewise blows chunks.  Too bad, because it's a health issue like any other.

    All of my dentists and doctors are foreign-born anyway.  What's the difference?  Cost.

     

    Americans must stop believing we are the best in everything.  Most things, yes.

    But not everything.  Not by a long shot.

     

     

     

     




     

    All of the best foreign doctors come here... Sooo if all the best foreign doctors come here, What's over there?

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

     

     

     



    Missed the point entirely

     




    Actually, I think the question was a valid one. Are the people coming here for health care from countries such as France, Sweden, Great Britain, etc...or are they from third world..or even developing countries. Many developing countries have public health care or single payer systems..but by virtue of the fact that they are developing..none of their systems are going to be as state of the art as ours. In other words, they may have a health care system that works for them, but doesn't provide the kind of specialty care that the US has available.

    I am guessing the hospital is not eating that 52 million line item. I am sure on the other side of the accounting equation there is revenue ( grants, etc) to offset this expense.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to xXR3S1NXx's comment:

    All of the best foreign doctors come here... Sooo if all the best foreign doctors come here, What's over there?



    "All of the best"?  Really?!  That's hyperbole.

    Even if that were true (it's not), surely some other competent ones stayed.  Plus, there are those who came here to get educated, then went home.

    Again, MORE people leave the U.S. for care than come here for it.  Mostly because it's cheaper elsewhere for the same exact services.  Facts are facts.

     

     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    Again, MORE people leave the U.S. for care than come here for it.  Mostly because it's cheaper elsewhere for the same exact services.  Facts are facts.

     



    That's true MORE people leave the US to find CHEAPER care.

    It's also true alot of people come here to get better QUALITY care.

    Just like many buy cheaper drugs from Mexico and China. The drugs are not always pure and sometimes have severe negative affects but, people do it.

     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    Shame on them for actually wanting a reasonable chance at a healthy life.

     




    Buying non approved drugs from foreign countries is "wanting a reasonable chance at a healthy life"?

    ok spin doctor

     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to tvoter's comment:

     

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2013/05/30/rate-shock-in-california-obamacare-to-increase-individual-insurance-premiums-by-64-146/

    Rate Shock: In California, Obamacare to Increase Individual Health Insurance Premiums by 64-146%

     

     




     

    For people who buy on the individual market - not through exchanges or employers.

     

     

     



    Your point?

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

    they pour in by the millions (legal and illegal) so they won`t die while waiting for a simple procedure that might save their life.

     


    Sure.

     




     

    Sat in a Washington airport last night next to a guy from Brazil.  He has been at Johns Hopkins for the last 3 weeks and was trying to get home for a week before he had to turn around and come back.  His 11-year old son was sick for ONE YEAR and couldn`t get needed care.  After a year of hell they found a baseball sized, malignant, tumor on the base of the boy`s spine.  He left his home and moved his family into a slum-shack outside of Baltimore.  He has no money, he`s lost his job from being in the US for a month, and he can`t pay for any of the treatments his kid is getting.  I will pray for his son.  This should never happen to a child.  I am happy that we have a facility like Johns Hopkins for this EXACT situation. 

    "Sure" is right.

     




     

    You said "millions."



     




     

    Yes I did.

     



    McKinsey and Co. report from 2008 found that between 60,000 to 85,000 medical tourists were traveling to the United States for the purpose of receiving in-patient medical care.[80] The same McKinsey study estimated that 750,000 American medical tourists traveled from the United States to other countries in 2007 (up from 500,000 in 2006).[81] The availability of advanced medical technology and sophisticated training of physicians are cited as driving motivators for growth in foreigners traveling to the U.S. for medical care,[80] whereas the low costs for hospital stays and major/complex procedures at Western-accredited medical facilities abroad are cited as major motivators for American travelers.[81] 

     

    ********************

    Looks like you only have another 900k+ or so patients to go to reach even your first hypothetical "million" based on this evidence.

    Good luck with all that.

    Meanwhile, the same evidence shows medical tourism from the U.S. at up to 10x the rate as those coming in.

     

     

     



    What about the illegal aliens, er, I mean undocumented democrats? Nearly all of them come here for the largess of the U.S. ,including health care, do they not?  That's well over the remaining 900 thousand.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

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    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

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    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

    Right...I made those numbers up. Whatever ya need to believe. Have a good one sweetcheeks!

     

     

    The numbers might be real.

    But your conclusions are BS.  I tried to clarify and/or call you on them, and you dodged.  Typical.

    Take a whiff, cupcake...!!

     I didn't dodge anything. Your questions had nothing to do with anything. 

    Doesn't matter what the cost of the same procedure in their native land would be. The point was that people are coming here in droves to get medical procedures done. To the tune of $88M for just TWO hospitals.

    If universal coverage is so great why the need to come here?

     More BS.

     You portrayed those millions were from "single-payer systems".  Can you back up that claim?  I'll bet a good portion came from impoverished nations like the DR, Haiti, Latin America, et al.

    Can you back that up? 

    Well, since our International business is self pay I would say your assertion that a good portion is coming from impoverished nations is a bad one.

    No, it's not, because there are rich people in poor countries without single-payer healthcare (your assertion).  I didn't say the medical tourists are poor; likely they wouldn't be because US costs are astronomical.

    I posted above an example above showing how medical tourism from the U.S. far and away outnumbers people coming here.

    Yes, you did show something from 2007...that's great....what does that have to do with what I brought up???

    It shows that you're confused.  Far more people leave the US for healthcare than come here for it.  If you have opposing or more current data, then post it.  

    In addition, the relevance is that people come to the U.S. for healthcare because they can afford it, not necessarily because of single-payer.  Even single-payer nations have a private insurance market where richer people can get care wherever and whenever they want.

    Again, you're confusing coverage with care.  

    Perhaps if you showed how that $51M is a percentage of the total FY12 revenue and then accounted for so-called "civilized" nations, you might have had an honest argument.  Instead, you're being unnecessarily obtuse and prickish.

    What does the percent of International for our total book of business have to do with anything? NOW who's moving the goalposts? Again, the point was to show in total dollars that TONS of people are coming from these universal coverage countries. Sorry you don't like it

    It's relevant because you're throwing out numbers without context like a audience member at The Price Is Right.  Healthcare spending adds up to roughly a trillion dollars in the U.S., so your sums of $51M and $88M are rather meaningless. (just like bigdog's touching though irrelevant anecdote)

    I'm trying to help you by educating you.  Don't get pi55y just because you're wrong.

     




     



    Oh....so when you said impoverished nation you were referring to the rich ones??? Sigh...

    um...my sums were for just two hospitals....do you think those two hospitals are the only ones that get foreigners? Yikes. 

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to miscricket's comment:

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

     

     

     



    Missed the point entirely

     

     




    Actually, I think the question was a valid one. Are the people coming here for health care from countries such as France, Sweden, Great Britain, etc...or are they from third world..or even developing countries. Many developing countries have public health care or single payer systems..but by virtue of the fact that they are developing..none of their systems are going to be as state of the art as ours. In other words, they may have a health care system that works for them, but doesn't provide the kind of specialty care that the US has available.

    But we're always told universal care is better. If it is then why do people come here? I'm trying to show that universal coverage doesn't mean everything will be covered. In other words...buyer beware 

    The international business is self pay so they aren't coming from developing countries. 

    I am guessing the hospital is not eating that 52 million line item. I am sure on the other side of the accounting equation there is revenue ( grants, etc) to offset this expense.


    no grants. These people are paying the medical expenses. Some of them ask for a discount so they don't have to pay full amount but its still significant amount they pay

     




     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to skeeter20's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to tvoter's comment:

     

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2013/05/30/rate-shock-in-california-obamacare-to-increase-individual-insurance-premiums-by-64-146/

    Rate Shock: In California, Obamacare to Increase Individual Health Insurance Premiums by 64-146%

     

     




     

    For people who buy on the individual market - not through exchanges or employers.

     

     

     

     



    Your point?

     

     




     

    My point is: shut up skeeter



    alrighty, then.  You didn't have a point.  Thanks for the candid emission.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    Two-Thirds of Americans Don't Know If They Will Insure Under Obamacare

    There's no assurance folks will be buying insurance under Obamacare, and that could spell trouble for the Affordable Care Act.

    Nearly two-thirds of Americans who currently lack health insurance don't know yet if they will purchase that coverage by the Jan. 1 deadline set by the ACA, a new survey revealed Monday.

    And less than half of those in the survey released by InsuranceQuotes.com think they'll get better health care after Obamacare takes full effect. Nearly 50 percent believe the ACA will make it more difficult for them to get tests and procedures done in a timely manner, according to the phone survey of 1,001 adult Americans conducted in early May.

    And a whopping 68 percent of low-income Americans aren't sure they qualify for tax credits that would subsidize their purchase of health insurance—despite they fact that they almost invariably will qualify, the survey found. That population is most likely to benefit from government subsidies under the health-care reform law.

    Laura Adams, senior insurance analyst at InsuranceQuotes.com, said public uncertainty about Obamacareparticularly a lack of commitment to signing upcould end up driving up health-insurance costs under the program because not enough healthy people will participate to offset benefits payouts.

    (CNSNews.com)– In a final regulation issued Wednesday, the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) assumed that under Obamacare the cheapest health insurance plan available in 2016 for a family will cost $20,000 for the year.

    Under Obamacare, Americans will be required to buy health insurance or pay a penalty to the IRS.

    The IRS's assumption that the cheapest plan for a family will cost $20,000 per year is found in examples the IRS gives to help people understand how to calculate the penalty they will need to pay the government if they do not buy a mandated health plan.


    “When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.”
    âۥ Socrates

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to skeeter20's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

     

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

    they pour in by the millions (legal and illegal) so they won`t die while waiting for a simple procedure that might save their life.

     


    Sure.

     




     

    Sat in a Washington airport last night next to a guy from Brazil.  He has been at Johns Hopkins for the last 3 weeks and was trying to get home for a week before he had to turn around and come back.  His 11-year old son was sick for ONE YEAR and couldn`t get needed care.  After a year of hell they found a baseball sized, malignant, tumor on the base of the boy`s spine.  He left his home and moved his family into a slum-shack outside of Baltimore.  He has no money, he`s lost his job from being in the US for a month, and he can`t pay for any of the treatments his kid is getting.  I will pray for his son.  This should never happen to a child.  I am happy that we have a facility like Johns Hopkins for this EXACT situation. 

    "Sure" is right.

     




     

    You said "millions."



     




     

    Yes I did.

     



    McKinsey and Co. report from 2008 found that between 60,000 to 85,000 medical tourists were traveling to the United States for the purpose of receiving in-patient medical care.[80] The same McKinsey study estimated that 750,000 American medical tourists traveled from the United States to other countries in 2007 (up from 500,000 in 2006).[81] The availability of advanced medical technology and sophisticated training of physicians are cited as driving motivators for growth in foreigners traveling to the U.S. for medical care,[80] whereas the low costs for hospital stays and major/complex procedures at Western-accredited medical facilities abroad are cited as major motivators for American travelers.[81] 

     

    ********************

    Looks like you only have another 900k+ or so patients to go to reach even your first hypothetical "million" based on this evidence.

    Good luck with all that.

    Meanwhile, the same evidence shows medical tourism from the U.S. at up to 10x the rate as those coming in.

     

     


    What about the illegal aliens, er, I mean undocumented democrats? Nearly all of them come here for the largess of the U.S. ,including health care, do they not?  That's well over the remaining 900 thousand.

     

     

    The percentage of those who actually end up using health services is small...and clustered around the least efficient, most expensive-for-the-uninsured type of care.

    Which means nothing to the three-quarter-million who travel abroad because the costs here are burdensome

    .

     

     

     
  22. This post has been removed.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to skeeter20's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

    they pour in by the millions (legal and illegal) so they won`t die while waiting for a simple procedure that might save their life.

     


    Sure.

     




     

    Sat in a Washington airport last night next to a guy from Brazil.  He has been at Johns Hopkins for the last 3 weeks and was trying to get home for a week before he had to turn around and come back.  His 11-year old son was sick for ONE YEAR and couldn`t get needed care.  After a year of hell they found a baseball sized, malignant, tumor on the base of the boy`s spine.  He left his home and moved his family into a slum-shack outside of Baltimore.  He has no money, he`s lost his job from being in the US for a month, and he can`t pay for any of the treatments his kid is getting.  I will pray for his son.  This should never happen to a child.  I am happy that we have a facility like Johns Hopkins for this EXACT situation. 

    "Sure" is right.

     




     

    You said "millions."



     




     

    Yes I did.

     



    McKinsey and Co. report from 2008 found that between 60,000 to 85,000 medical tourists were traveling to the United States for the purpose of receiving in-patient medical care.[80] The same McKinsey study estimated that 750,000 American medical tourists traveled from the United States to other countries in 2007 (up from 500,000 in 2006).[81] The availability of advanced medical technology and sophisticated training of physicians are cited as driving motivators for growth in foreigners traveling to the U.S. for medical care,[80] whereas the low costs for hospital stays and major/complex procedures at Western-accredited medical facilities abroad are cited as major motivators for American travelers.[81] 

     

    ********************

    Looks like you only have another 900k+ or so patients to go to reach even your first hypothetical "million" based on this evidence.

    Good luck with all that.

    Meanwhile, the same evidence shows medical tourism from the U.S. at up to 10x the rate as those coming in.

     

     


    What about the illegal aliens, er, I mean undocumented democrats? Nearly all of them come here for the largess of the U.S. ,including health care, do they not?  That's well over the remaining 900 thousand.

     

    [/QUOTE]

     

    The percentage of those who actually end up using health services is small...and clustered around the least efficient, most expensive-for-the-uninsured type of care.

    Which means nothing to the quarter-million who travel abroad because the costs here are burdensome

    .

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    What does the number of actual users have anything to do with it?  The motiviation is to be here in case you need it.

     
  24. This post has been removed.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from UserName99. Show UserName99's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    Medical tourists to the US: About 100,000/yr

    Medical tourists from the US to other countries:

    Deloitte Consulting estimated that 560,000 U.S. residents went abroad for care last year — and the number likely will rise to 1.6 million by 2012.

    http://www.chron.com/news/health/article/More-Americans-going-global-for-health-care-1595586.php




     

     

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