Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to UserName99's comment:

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    Medical tourists to the US: About 100,000/yr

    Medical tourists from the US to other countries:

    Deloitte Consulting estimated that 560,000 U.S. residents went abroad for care last year — and the number likely will rise to 1.6 million by 2012.

    http://www.chron.com/news/health/article/More-Americans-going-global-for-health-care-1595586.php

     




     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This includes the tens of thousands of Canadians who spend their winter in Florida.

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    The Affordable Care Act has been the “law of the land” for almost three years. Time really flies. Despite the many resources available, most of the general population has no clue how “Obamacare” is supposed to work. With the insurance provisions finally kicking in January 1, 2014 and the realization that the law is not going away, people need to brush up quickly on their basic knowledge. Where will you get your health insurance and how much will it cost? Today I share with you information about the “Health Insurance Marketplace.”

    Health insurance will be available through the same avenues where insurance is currently purchased:

    1. Group insurance through employers
    2. Individual insurance
    3. Public programs such as Medicare or Medicaid

    Employer Based Coverage

    Companies with more than fifty employees are required to offer health insurance or pay a fine. One advantage I have of speaking at numerous financial planning conferences is the opportunity to attend sessions about tax planning. And what is one of the favorite topics of tax planners? Instructing companies on how they can get around the rules of providing health insurance under Obamacare. In a previous post, I discussed a few concepts on how this can be accomplished. I predicted from the outset that Obamacare would push employers out of the business of providing health insurance. In fact, the conspiracy theorist in me thinks this was one intention of the law.

    For people who purchase their insurance for the entire family through their employer, there will be another change. An employer is required to provide insurance only for the employee and their dependents. Is your spouse a dependent? No. Therefore, employers may choose to not provide insurance to the spouse.

    The Individual Market

    What do you do if your employer no longer provides health insurance coverage or your spouse cannot obtain coverage through your employer? The good news: the individual market policies will provide the same coverage as the group policy purchased through your employer. The bad news: the insurance will cost a bit more than group insurance for two reasons I’ll discuss shortly.

    Individual insurance has historically been a crap shoot – policies may have sub-standard benefits such as no mental health or maternity coverage, insurance companies can turn you down because of health factors, or the policies can be hugely expensive because of medical underwriting. Individual insurance is regulated by the states, and each state is very different on how well it looks out for its constituents. With Obamacare, policies will still be regulated by the states, but the policies are required to provide minimal essential benefits, such as mental health and maternity coverage. Also, insurance is “guaranteed issue,” meaning you cannot be turned down no matter what illness you have in your past. Finally, price is determined only by four criteria:

    1. Age – older people will not pay more than three times the amount younger people pay.
    2. Premium rating area – high cost health areas will have more expensive insurance than low cost areas.
    3. Number of family members getting coverage.
    4. Tobacco use – this is the only lifestyle factor that is allowed to be considered.

    Starting October 1, 2013, you will have the ability to shop for these new individual policies on a health insurance exchange. What is the exchange? In a nutshell, you will go to a website, put in your information, and pick from policies provided by private insurance providers. And guess what? You can try the website now. The exchange is accessed through the healthcare.gov website that has been in operation since the ACA passed into law. The policies there now are not the same policies that will be available starting in 2014, but the general site setup will essentially be the same.

    So what about cost?

    Let’s discuss employer based coverage first. Employees have a delusional disorder when it comes to the cost of health insurance. They know their employer pays some of the cost but have little idea how much the employer pays. Even when an employee quits their job and goes on COBRA, they are under the impression that COBRA is a different insurance and it is much more expensive than their previous employer coverage. Folks, COBRA is your employer coverage, except now you pay 100% of the cost instead of just a portion of the premium. There can be an additional 2% charge for “administrative expenses,” but that is pretty much it. Your employer has been providing a great benefit.

    Compared to individual insurance, employer based insurance has been traditionally more expensive because it has mandated benefits and it must be guaranteed issue. No one who works in a group can be turned down for health insurance, even if they’ve had cancer or any other serious disease. In Florida, I could easily buy an individual policy for $250 per month in premiums, but I cannot get pregnancy coverage and the insurance company can deny coverage if I’m not a good risk for them. My current group policy costs about $500 per month with the same deductible, but I’m guaranteed coverage and have great pregnancy benefits. The bad news for me? At age 48, I am past my pregnancy prime but don’t have the choice to turn that coverage down.

    Back to the individual market costs… now that individual coverage will have the same benefits and be guaranteed issue like group coverage, the costs will theoretically equal group insurance. However, there are two factors that will make individual insurance more expensive than group insurance: the taxation of health insurance and overhead allowances to insurance companies.

    The taxation of health insurance:

    Employers get a tax break for providing health insurance, and the employee is allowed to pay their part of the premium on a pre-tax basis, so they get a tax break too. If a person is self-employed and earns income through a business or receives a 1099, they can also deduct 100% of their health insurance premiums.

    Who gets the short end of the stick? Employees who receive a W-2 tax form and purchase their own health insurance. They can deduct the premium as an itemized medical expense only above 10% of their adjusted gross income and they must itemize – this will knock most people out of the running for any tax deduction and it will only be a partial deduction. Basically, the employee will pay more for the same insurance because they will pay for it with after tax dollars. This is an inequity for which a fix is long overdue. If employers leave the market, the government will get a nice bump up in revenue from the extra income. Until a fix comes around, one way to get a tax break is to get a side job that pays 1099 income – most of that income will be tax free up to the cost of the insurance premiums.

    Overhead allowances to insurance companies:

    One part of Obamacare I applaud is the requirement that insurance companies reduce their overhead. Previously, overhead in the small group and individual market could be as high as 30% of premiums. Of course, generous CEO paychecks are part of that overhead, along with a lot of waste such as advertising. With Obamacare, overhead for large group insurance cannot be greater than 15% of premiums. For the small group and individual market, overhead cannot be more than 20% of premiums. If overhead is higher than the target, the insurance company must provide a rebate of premiums. Many people benefited from premium rebates this past year.

    So how does this affect insurance premiums in the individual market? Since overhead can be up to 20% of premiums, you can be darn certain the insurance company will allow the overhead to stay as high as allowed. This is more money in their paycheck. Will it be 5% higher than large group coverage since that is the difference in overhead allowances? That remains to be seen.

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/carolynmcclanahan/2013/03/03/obamacare-is-around-the-corner-where-will-you-buy-health-insurance-and-what-will-it-cost/

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

    In response to miscricket's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

     

     

     



    Missed the point entirely

     

     




    Actually, I think the question was a valid one. Are the people coming here for health care from countries such as France, Sweden, Great Britain, etc...or are they from third world..or even developing countries. Many developing countries have public health care or single payer systems..but by virtue of the fact that they are developing..none of their systems are going to be as state of the art as ours. In other words, they may have a health care system that works for them, but doesn't provide the kind of specialty care that the US has available.

    But we're always told universal care is better. If it is then why do people come here? I'm trying to show that universal coverage doesn't mean everything will be covered. In other words...buyer beware 

    The international business is self pay so they aren't coming from developing countries. 

    I am guessing the hospital is not eating that 52 million line item. I am sure on the other side of the accounting equation there is revenue ( grants, etc) to offset this expense.


    no grants. These people are paying the medical expenses. Some of them ask for a discount so they don't have to pay full amount but its still significant amount they pay

     

     




     

    [/QUOTE]

    I agree with the fact that universal coverage doesn't mean everything will be covered...but most things will be covered. In our private payer, employer based system not everything is covered. Many developing countries may have universal health coverage, but their medicine ( health care) may not be as advanced as ours is ( or that over other first world, industrialized nations). No one is questioning that we have among the most advanced research and health care in the world ( other countries have it too)...I stand by my point that all the medical advances in the world don't mean anything if most of the population can't access them because of the way the way the system workere

    I'd still be interested in knowing which countries these self payers were coming from. You do understand that well to do people exist in developing nations as well..right? Just in smaller numbers.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    Interesting...today I learned how much my health insurance premiums will rise in the coming year. Not even close to the numbers the OP is claiming. In fact the total increase between health and dental comes in at just under 9%. I like this slower growth in cost. I remember when 15-20% increases were the norm.

    " Above all..be the heroine in your life..not the victim" Nora Ephron

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to miscricket's comment:

     

     


    I agree with the fact that universal coverage doesn't mean everything will be covered...but most things will be covered. In our private payer, employer based system not everything is covered. Many developing countries may have universal health coverage, but their medicine ( health care) may not be as advanced as ours is ( or that over other first world, industrialized nations). No one is questioning that we have among the most advanced research and health care in the world ( other countries have it too)...I stand by my point that all the medical advances in the world don't mean anything if most of the population can't access them because of the way the way the system workere

    And I agree more access is needed. I've never been against Obamacare. I like that pre-x is gone. I just don't agree with those that say giving access to healthcare will help bring our costs down. Having access is only PART of it. UTILIZING the access and HEEDING the advice of ones doc is the other part. So far we haven't shown we're capable of doing the second part. Millions have coverage and yet we're still the most obese nation in the world. All the access in the world isn't going to change that. We need to change out culture. We need to change our habits. Until then our costs are going to keep increasing.

    I'd still be interested in knowing which countries these self payers were coming from. You do understand that well to do people exist in developing nations as well..right? Just in smaller numbers.

    They mainly come from Europe and Middle East (mainly Saudi Arabia)




     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to miscricket's comment:

    Interesting...today I learned how much my health insurance premiums will rise in the coming year. Not even close to the numbers the OP is claiming. In fact the total increase between health and dental comes in at just under 9%. I like this slower growth in cost. I remember when 15-20% increases were the norm.

    " Above all..be the heroine in your life..not the victim" Nora Ephron



    15-20%? Yikes that sucks. Since '07 the highest increase I had was 10.89%. Otherwise it's been single digit increases. 

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    However, for those who have kept up with Congressional Budget Office (CBO) projections on the implementation and progress of Obamacare over the next decade, the results will not be all that surprising. On the contrary, the most recent report issued by the CBO in May appears pessimistic by comparison. Of the 55 million "Uninsured Nonelderly People" the report lists for 2013, only 11 million, or 20 percent, are projected to obtain insurance during 2014; the number of uninsured falls only to 44 million next year according to the CBO. This leaves a full 80 percent uninsured, significantly more than the 67 percent found by the survey.

    In fact, the CBO projects that under Obamacare over the next decade, the number of uninsured will never fall below 30 million. Here are the year-by-year projections from the report:

    2013 - 55,000,000
    2014 - 44,000,000
    2015 - 37,000,000
    2016 - 31,000,000
    2017 - 30,000,000
    2018 - 30,000,000
    2019 - 30,000,000
    2020 - 30,000,000
    2021 - 31,000,000
    2022 - 31,000,000
    2023 - 31,000,000

    Despite Obamacare’s mix of requirements, mandates, subsidies, and penalties, the CBO projects that the law will never be able to decrease the number of uninsured below 11 percent of the population. During the decade projected by the CBO, the percentage of uninsured nonelderly persons decreases from 20 percent in 2013 to 11 percent by 2016, but then remains there for the rest of the ten year period. Not everything in the CBO report is similarly static, however. The "Average Exchange Subsidy per Subsidized Enrollee" increases 50 percent over the same time period, rising from $5,290 in 2014 to $7,900 in 2023.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to tvoter's comment:

    [QUOTE]issued by the CBO



    And suddenly it's to be trusted again.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I would guess you object to your own religious-like adherence to anything that supports your case the burps out of the CBO.

     
  9. This post has been removed.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

    Get your freakin head out!  It`s actually over 20 million and growing daily.

     

    I don't think you can prove that.

    In any case, with our biggest immigration partner, Mexico, more people are going home than coming here.  It's been that way for a few years, at least.

    Further, most illegals are scared to death of being reported and so tend not to use public facilities except in dire emergencies.  Yet, they have provider networks that attend exclusively to this "shadow population".

    Last, that's even more of a reason to change our system of healthcare, so that the ridiculously expensive ER isn't used to treat sniffles and bruises.

     

     

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    How`s fantasyland dummy?

     


    Better than your home of pricksville, I would guess.

     

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

    [QUOTE]How`s fantasyland dummy?



    How's the compost pile you keep pulling all this b__ls__t from ?

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Don't let him bother your, bigdog.  We chase him into a corner on just about every issue, and his only defence is to stick his fingers down his throat.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    Dems will be the party that ruined the most advanced healthcare system in the world for decades!

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    "

    Illegal immigration to the United States is the act of foreign nationals entering the United States, without government permission and in violation of United States nationality law, or staying beyond the termination date of a visa, also in violation of the law.

    The illegal immigrant population of the United States in 2008 was estimated by the Center for Immigration Studies to be about 11 million people, down from 12.5 million people in 2007.[1] Other estimates range from 7 to 20 million.[2] According to a Pew Hispanic Center report, in 2005, 56% of illegal immigrants were from Mexico; 22% were from other Latin American countries, primarily from Central America;[3] 13% were from Asia; 6% were from Europe and Canada; and 3% were from Africa and the rest of the world.[3]"

     

    Must be 11 million cuz.......um, ah.......obama said so.

     

     




     

    Must be 20 million cuz....um, ah...... a big internets DAWG says so.


    And yet you cite things saying it was 11 mil in 2008 and anywhere between 5 and 20 in 2005.

     

     

     




     

    Exactly dummy!  If those numbers are from 2005, just imagine what they are now!  Let`s see.......we have the worst president in the history of earth, we have nobody guarding the border, we are giving free HC to all, free food stamps to all, free EBT cards to all, and free phones to all.  Let`s not forget 99 weeks of free money too........and YOU CAN VOTE!!!

    Geee...........those illegal numbers must have shrunk........LOL!

    Let me guess, you believe they have ......right?
      

    [/QUOTE]


    The numbers don't matter - they aren't coming to the US because our health-care system is first-rate.  You don't see hospitals in border cities flooded with dying immigrants.  They are here for other reasons, and eventually need emergency care.

    There's an argument to be made that we do have the most advanced medical abilities in the world, but who cares if 90% of the population is priced out of taking advantage of them?  It's not the extremely poor who are traveling to Mexico and Costa Rica for MRIs or surgical operations - it's middle class families who either don't have insurance, can't afford the ridiculous deductible, or need to keep it all under the radar to avoid insurance rates increases.

    Maybe we have the most advanced medical capabilities in the world, but we also have the most broken system.

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:
     

    What exactly are Republicans proposing again? (that they won't disown in 20 years)?

    [/QUOTE]

    Here's the problem. We need BOTH conservative and liberal ideas to fix it.

    The hedge against premium shock requires the Obama administration and their allies to convince young adults to sign up to ensure the risk pool has enough young and healthy people buying more insurance than they may need. And why is this a concern? Because most young adults don’t think they need a lot of insurance, and most aren’t willing to pay a significant amount for it … and because when you step back and consider what the law is doing to individual health insurance premiums in the broad sense, there’s no question that it’s going to make insurance coverage more expensive for those who are young and healthy.

    Here’s where things get frustrating. Over the past week there’s been an increasingly angry back and forth among health care policy writers online regarding the lessons to take from the rate shifts in California under Obamacare, climaxing with this piece from Jonathan Cohn, who essentially accuses Avik Roy of being an irresponsible partisan hack. What is frustrating about these attacks on the validity of Roy’s argument is that they make real conversation about the effects of Obamacare difficult if not impossible. And it’s a conversation we ought to be having – and having fairly, if we take policy seriously – because this is a law that is already not living up to its promises… promises that most honest liberals concede ought to never have been made in the first place.

    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2013/06/04/obamacare_and_the_young_and_healthy_118685.html#ixzz2VHiEnPZi

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to skeeter20's comment:

    [QUOTE]We chase him into a corner on just about every issue



    And yet, when you finally sober up, you find your own bloody tail between your teeth.

    Funny how that works.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    You must live a very lonely life.  

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    Been telling libs to own it, now Democrats agree they have no other choice:


    http://www.politico.com/story/2013/06/dems-2014-strategy-own-obamacare-92172.html?hp=t1_3

    "POLITICO: "Democrat's 2014 strategy: Own ObamaCare"

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to UserName99's comment:

    Regardless of whatever good the ACA will bring to millions, Republicans will cherry pick its flaws and call it a miserable failure.

    One day America will have Single Payer system like the rest of the civilized world, and the Know Nothing wingnuts will love it and strenuously deny they ever opposed it.



    That of course is the real goal of ObamaCare, single payer. Glad you admit it. Others tell us ObamaCare is just a small tiny conservative GOP idea, just small potatoes. You know better. 

    Is it OK to call 'single payer' socialism?

    Typical liberal "progress", incremental destruction of our freedoms. 

    Government program (ObamaCare) fails miserably, and the emergency remedy is more of the same disease, a full government takeover and end of the free market...

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to slomag's comment:

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    "

    Illegal immigration to the United States is the act of foreign nationals entering the United States, without government permission and in violation of United States nationality law, or staying beyond the termination date of a visa, also in violation of the law.

    The illegal immigrant population of the United States in 2008 was estimated by the Center for Immigration Studies to be about 11 million people, down from 12.5 million people in 2007.[1] Other estimates range from 7 to 20 million.[2] According to a Pew Hispanic Center report, in 2005, 56% of illegal immigrants were from Mexico; 22% were from other Latin American countries, primarily from Central America;[3] 13% were from Asia; 6% were from Europe and Canada; and 3% were from Africa and the rest of the world.[3]"

     

    Must be 11 million cuz.......um, ah.......obama said so.

     

     




     

    Must be 20 million cuz....um, ah...... a big internets DAWG says so.


    And yet you cite things saying it was 11 mil in 2008 and anywhere between 5 and 20 in 2005.

     

     

     

     




     

     

    Exactly dummy!  If those numbers are from 2005, just imagine what they are now!  Let`s see.......we have the worst president in the history of earth, we have nobody guarding the border, we are giving free HC to all, free food stamps to all, free EBT cards to all, and free phones to all.  Let`s not forget 99 weeks of free money too........and YOU CAN VOTE!!!

    Geee...........those illegal numbers must have shrunk........LOL!

    Let me guess, you believe they have ......right?
      




     

    The numbers don't matter - they aren't coming to the US because our health-care system is first-rate.  You don't see hospitals in border cities flooded with dying immigrants.  They are here for other reasons, and eventually need emergency care.

    There's an argument to be made that we do have the most advanced medical abilities in the world, but who cares if 90% of the population is priced out of taking advantage of them?  It's not the extremely poor who are traveling to Mexico and Costa Rica for MRIs or surgical operations - it's middle class families who either don't have insurance, can't afford the ridiculous deductible, or need to keep it all under the radar to avoid insurance rates increases.

    Maybe we have the most advanced medical capabilities in the world, but we also have the most broken system.

     



    Most broken system? It wasnt broken, but ObamaCare will break it.

    Prior to ObamaCare, poll after poll showed huge majorities of Americans were satisfied with their health care coverage. 81 to 91 percent satisfaction.  Government-run health care as an option was never popular, and still isnt.

    The purpose of enacting ObamaCare changes every 5 minutes...From "cost savings" LOL...to protecting the poor (for which we already have innumerable programs) ...to "keeping the uninsured from ripping us off"...liberals playing tough guy! Sorry, for the image of Dems as tough enforcers and protectors of tax dollars...picture Don Knotts.

    The real reason is to screw up the system so bad that single payer will be the next solution.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

    we are giving free HC to all, free food stamps to all, free EBT cards to all, and free phones to all.  Let`s not forget 99 weeks of free money too........and YOU CAN VOTE!!!




     

    Calm down, Limbaugh - you big DAWG you.


    Why don't you come up with solid proof about how many illegals get ANY of that stuff before you run your big mouth?



    Just ask the President's Aunt about illegals receiving welfare benfits, housing, food stamps. Better yet , ask this woman:

    Illegal alien and mother of seven, Florida resident Marita Nelson, receives $240 in food stamps, monthly medications, $700 in Social Security and a housing allowance.

    And she has been receiving government assistance for over 20 YEARS – ever since she illegally entered the U.S. by swimming the Rio Grande.

    She celebrates it…and is on a crusade to get other illegals to sign up for as many programs as possible.

    But to quote the Massachusetts Governor, these must all be "anecdotal".

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

    we are giving free HC to all, free food stamps to all, free EBT cards to all, and free phones to all.  Let`s not forget 99 weeks of free money too........and YOU CAN VOTE!!!




     

    Calm down, Limbaugh - you big DAWG you.


    Why don't you come up with solid proof about how many illegals get ANY of that stuff before you run your big mouth?

     




     

    I will when you "prove" that LESS illegals are coming because the economy is bad....BWAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!

    And when that one doesn`t work or you find some article on dogwithablog.com backing up your nonsense, why don`t you try the old student stand by of "they`re coming for the jobs that no Americans want"?

    LOL

     

    [/QUOTE]

    But:

    Bush made the economy bad...

    Romney invented Obamacare...

     

    The progressives see this whole mess toppling, and are tossing their mess onto the backs of liberal republicans.

     

     
  22. This post has been removed.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

    In response to slomag's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    "

    Illegal immigration to the United States is the act of foreign nationals entering the United States, without government permission and in violation of United States nationality law, or staying beyond the termination date of a visa, also in violation of the law.

    The illegal immigrant population of the United States in 2008 was estimated by the Center for Immigration Studies to be about 11 million people, down from 12.5 million people in 2007.[1] Other estimates range from 7 to 20 million.[2] According to a Pew Hispanic Center report, in 2005, 56% of illegal immigrants were from Mexico; 22% were from other Latin American countries, primarily from Central America;[3] 13% were from Asia; 6% were from Europe and Canada; and 3% were from Africa and the rest of the world.[3]"

     

    Must be 11 million cuz.......um, ah.......obama said so.

     

     




     

    Must be 20 million cuz....um, ah...... a big internets DAWG says so.


    And yet you cite things saying it was 11 mil in 2008 and anywhere between 5 and 20 in 2005.

     

     

     

     




     

     

    Exactly dummy!  If those numbers are from 2005, just imagine what they are now!  Let`s see.......we have the worst president in the history of earth, we have nobody guarding the border, we are giving free HC to all, free food stamps to all, free EBT cards to all, and free phones to all.  Let`s not forget 99 weeks of free money too........and YOU CAN VOTE!!!

    Geee...........those illegal numbers must have shrunk........LOL!

    Let me guess, you believe they have ......right?
      




     

    The numbers don't matter - they aren't coming to the US because our health-care system is first-rate.  You don't see hospitals in border cities flooded with dying immigrants.  They are here for other reasons, and eventually need emergency care.

    There's an argument to be made that we do have the most advanced medical abilities in the world, but who cares if 90% of the population is priced out of taking advantage of them?  It's not the extremely poor who are traveling to Mexico and Costa Rica for MRIs or surgical operations - it's middle class families who either don't have insurance, can't afford the ridiculous deductible, or need to keep it all under the radar to avoid insurance rates increases.

    Maybe we have the most advanced medical capabilities in the world, but we also have the most broken system.

     

     



    Most broken system? It wasnt broken, but ObamaCare will break it.

     

    Prior to ObamaCare, poll after poll showed huge majorities of Americans were satisfied with their health care coverage. 81 to 91 percent satisfaction.  Government-run health care as an option was never popular, and still isnt.

    The purpose of enacting ObamaCare changes every 5 minutes...From "cost savings" LOL...to protecting the poor (for which we already have innumerable programs) ...to "keeping the uninsured from ripping us off"...liberals playing tough guy! Sorry, for the image of Dems as tough enforcers and protectors of tax dollars...picture Don Knotts.

    The real reason is to screw up the system so bad that single payer will be the next solution.

    [/QUOTE]

    That's a fantasy - the majority of those satisfied were either receiving government care or were so insulated from the costs by their employers that they had no idea of the real costs of health care.  Cost savings and preventing absorption of uninsured care are the same thing.  Obamacare was never about protecting the poor - they are already protected by Medicaid.

    This is from a fox news article from 2004 - health care costs would rise 50% between 2004 and 2008...

    One-third of Americans told pollsters that the U.S. health care system should be completely rebuilt, far more than residents of Australia, Canada, New Zealand, or the U.K. Just 16 percent of Americans said that the U.S. health care system needs only minor changes, the lowest number expressing approval among the countries surveyed.

    ...

    Four in 10 U.S. adults told researchers that they had gone without needed care because of the cost, including skipping prescriptions, avoiding going to the doctor, or skipping a recommended test or treatment.

     

    Meanwhile, 26 percent of Americans surveyed said that they had faced more than $1,000 in out-of-pocket health care costs in the last year, compared with 14 percent of Australians, and 4 percent of Britons.

    Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/story/2004/10/29/us-trails-others-in-health-care-satisfaction/#ixzz2VM7Qoiem

     
  24. This post has been removed.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to slomag's comment:


    Not to mention the fact that unless that 25-year-old is making $80K plus a year, he is eligible for subsidies.  The reality is he is probably paying less than $92/month for a far better plan.



    Subsidies just mean someone else is paying a share of his as well!!

    What happened to the promise of "every one will see a 2500.00 savings on their health insurance premiums"??

    Not only no savings but, they are going up for most people.

    But, I totally expect your 47% to make excuses and rationalize. in 3-2-1

     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share