Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from StalkingButler. Show StalkingButler's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    For people who buy on the individual market - not through exchanges or employers.

    Obama said that you could keep your insurance if you wanted to. He never said that you would want to.

     

     
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  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

     

     

     



    Missed the point entirely

     



    Like you actually had one.

    You're full of it.

     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from StalkingButler. Show StalkingButler's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    It's called the "Affordable Care Act." The problem is that when they say "affordable" they mean "bend over and take it."

    From now on I'm referring to this monstrosity as the "Bend Over and Take It Act." or BOTIA.

     

     

     

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to xXR3S1NXx's comment:

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    I look forward to the day when I'll have to wait 6 months to get an MRI....should be fun times

     



    I had a relative that died because of that. He lived on prince edward island and the wait for an MRI was over a year and a half because they have 1, yes 1, MRI machine on the island. even on the mainland the wait was over 8 months. And when you have a disease that is killing you every second you arnt getting treatment, 8 months is far too long to wait.

     

     



    That is indeed tragic, if true.  I have family in the maritimes, too, and while PEI isn't far off-shore, it's sparse and rural which can add to its isolation.  (Same goes for parts of NS and NB.) Certain cancers are also over-represented on the island due to pesticide use - incidental perhaps, but salient.

     

     

     

     

     

     



    It is indeed very true matty. My grandpa lived with MS for quite a while getting treatment here in the US at the VA hospital. My great uncle ( the one who lived in PEI) was believed to of had late onset MS, and because of the level of healthcare treatment in canada, my grandpa ended up living almost 5 years longer than my great Uncle.Even though my grandpa had been diagnosed with MS 18 years earlier than my Great uncle.

     



    Sorry to hear that.

    With respect, however, it may be a stretch to say more healthcare would have saved or prolonged your great uncle's life.  Maybe it would; maybe it wouldn't.  There are many factors at play with such a diagnosis that make it hard to assess quality of care vs. quantity of care.

    Repeat: I'm not trying to excuse anyone or anything, and I'm not a doctor...just noting that the treatment of such conditions is very rarely a straight line.

     

     

     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to GreginMeffa's comment:

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    Yup...another Boston hospital has $37.7M in charges for International business. That's a total of $88M for just TWO US hospitals.

     

     




    I just saw that University of Pittsburgh Medical Center (UPMC) made a BILLION $$$ in, "excess revenue", not to be confused with profit, as they are non-profit, and its a blue state and a school.  Shhhhhh!

     

    Excess revenue.  Thats precious.

     



    Check so-called 'non-profit' hospitals all over the U.S. for similar numbers, blue state or red. "Bitter Pill" covered this area quite well.

    Thanks for bringing it up, though.  

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hansoribrother. Show Hansoribrother's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In a speech earlier today, Obama pleaded with Congress to keep interest rates on student loans low.

    "So I’m assuming a lot of people here have federal student loans.  The interest rates will double unless Congress acts by July 1st.  And just to give you some sense of perspective -- for each year that Congress doesn’t act, the average student with these loans will rack up an additional $1,000 in debt -- an extra thousand dollars.  That’s basically a tax hike for more than 7 million students across America -- more than 160,000 students here in North Carolina alone.  Anybody here can afford to pay an extra $1,000 right now?"

    That is what Obamcare is - a tax hike. Who can afford it? What is that going to do to the economy? It will kill it worse than $5/gal gasoline. This is not about US healthcare vs the rest of the world. It is about the cost of healthcare insurance HERE.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

     

     

     



    Missed the point entirely

     

     



    Like you actually had one.

     

    You're full of it.

     



    Oh...ok...

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

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    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

     

     

     



    Missed the point entirely

     

     



    Like you actually had one.

     

    You're full of it.

     

     



    Oh...ok...

     



    Glad we agree...

     

     

     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

     

     

     



    Missed the point entirely

     

     



    Like you actually had one.

     

    You're full of it.

     

     



    Oh...ok...

     

     



    Glad we agree...

     

     

     



     photo pick-up-on-the-sarcasm_zpsfe7b9669.jpg

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

     

     

     



    Missed the point entirely

     

     



    Like you actually had one.

     

    You're full of it.

     

     



    Oh...ok...

     

     



    Glad we agree...

     

     

     

     



     photo pick-up-on-the-sarcasm_zpsfe7b9669.jpg

     



    Heh.

    You're still full of it.  Now, it's just stinkier

    .

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

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    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

     

     

     



    Missed the point entirely

     

     



    Like you actually had one.

     

    You're full of it.

     

     



    Oh...ok...

     

     



    Glad we agree...

     

     

     

     



     photo pick-up-on-the-sarcasm_zpsfe7b9669.jpg

     

     



    Heh.

     

    You're still full of it.  Now, it's just stinkier

    .



    Right...I made those numbers up. Whatever ya need to believe. Have a good one sweetcheeks!

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    Name calling....that's such a grown-up thing

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

    Right...I made those numbers up. Whatever ya need to believe. Have a good one sweetcheeks!

    The numbers might be real.

    But your conclusions are BS.  I tried to clarify and/or call you on them, and you dodged.  Typical.

    Take a whiff, cupcake...!!

     

     

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

    Name calling....that's such a grown-up thing



    Have a good one sweetcheeks!

     

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

    Right...I made those numbers up. Whatever ya need to believe. Have a good one sweetcheeks!

     

     

    The numbers might be real.

    But your conclusions are BS.  I tried to clarify and/or call you on them, and you dodged.  Typical.

    Take a whiff, cupcake...!!

     

     

     



    I didn't dodge anything. Your questions had nothing to do with anything. 

    Doesn't matter what the cost of the same procedure in their native land would be. The point was that people are coming here in droves to get medical procedures done. To the tune of $88M for just TWO hospitals.

    If universal coverage is so great why the need to come here?

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    In response to bigdog2's comment:

    they pour in by the millions (legal and illegal) so they won`t die while waiting for a simple procedure that might save their life.

     


    Sure.

     




     

    Sat in a Washington airport last night next to a guy from Brazil.  He has been at Johns Hopkins for the last 3 weeks and was trying to get home for a week before he had to turn around and come back.  His 11-year old son was sick for ONE YEAR and couldn`t get needed care.  After a year of hell they found a baseball sized, malignant, tumor on the base of the boy`s spine.  He left his home and moved his family into a slum-shack outside of Baltimore.  He has no money, he`s lost his job from being in the US for a month, and he can`t pay for any of the treatments his kid is getting.  I will pray for his son.  This should never happen to a child.  I am happy that we have a facility like Johns Hopkins for this EXACT situation. 

    "Sure" is right.

     




     

    You said "millions."



     




     

    Yes I did.



    McKinsey and Co. report from 2008 found that between 60,000 to 85,000 medical tourists were traveling to the United States for the purpose of receiving in-patient medical care.[80] The same McKinsey study estimated that 750,000 American medical tourists traveled from the United States to other countries in 2007 (up from 500,000 in 2006).[81] The availability of advanced medical technology and sophisticated training of physicians are cited as driving motivators for growth in foreigners traveling to the U.S. for medical care,[80] whereas the low costs for hospital stays and major/complex procedures at Western-accredited medical facilities abroad are cited as major motivators for American travelers.[81] 

    ********************

    Looks like you only have another 900k+ or so patients to go to reach even your first hypothetical "million" based on this evidence.

    Good luck with all that.

    Meanwhile, the same evidence shows medical tourism from the U.S. at up to 10x the rate as those coming in.

     

     

     

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

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    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

    Right...I made those numbers up. Whatever ya need to believe. Have a good one sweetcheeks!

     

     

    The numbers might be real.

    But your conclusions are BS.  I tried to clarify and/or call you on them, and you dodged.  Typical.

    Take a whiff, cupcake...!!

     

     

     

     



    I didn't dodge anything. Your questions had nothing to do with anything. 

     

    Doesn't matter what the cost of the same procedure in their native land would be. The point was that people are coming here in droves to get medical procedures done. To the tune of $88M for just TWO hospitals.

    If universal coverage is so great why the need to come here?

     



    More BS.

    You portrayed those millions were from "single-payer systems".  Can you back up that claim?  I'll bet a good portion came from impoverished nations like the DR, Haiti, Latin America, et al.

    I posted above an example above showing how medical tourism from the U.S. far and away outnumbers people coming here.

    Perhaps if you showed how that $51M is a percentage of the total FY12 revenue and then accounted for so-called "civilized" nations, you might have had an honest argument.  Instead, you're being unnecessarily obtuse and prickish.

    Your question and ensuing snark were likewise crapulent.  I stated how there are many reasons for medical tourism, and you said I "missed the point".  If you think so...

    ...or maybe your tight-held beliefs are buckling under the weight of your ignorance.

     

     

     

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

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    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

    At one of the Boston hospitals I work for there was $51M in charges for the International payer line for FY12. That's a hell of a lot of people coming from those "civilized" countries that have single payer systems. Seems odd that people from these "civilized" counties would come here when those other countries have a much better healthcare system than the US. 

     



    Were all of the charges for people from single-payer systems?  What would the costs of the same procedures have run in their native lands on average?

     

    There could be many reasons for medical tourism, both to and from the U.S.

    As with most things, people will pay whatever they can afford.

    Many foreign state-run plans will also pay for expenses incurred in the states.

     

     

    Right...I made those numbers up. Whatever ya need to believe. Have a good one sweetcheeks!

     

     

    The numbers might be real.

    But your conclusions are BS.  I tried to clarify and/or call you on them, and you dodged.  Typical.

    Take a whiff, cupcake...!!

     

     

     

     



    I didn't dodge anything. Your questions had nothing to do with anything. 

     

    Doesn't matter what the cost of the same procedure in their native land would be. The point was that people are coming here in droves to get medical procedures done. To the tune of $88M for just TWO hospitals.

    If universal coverage is so great why the need to come here?

     

     



    More BS.

     

    You portrayed those millions were from "single-payer systems".  Can you back up that claim?  I'll bet a good portion came from impoverished nations like the DR, Haiti, Latin America, et al.

    Can you back that up? 

    Well, since our International business is self pay I would say your assertion that a good portion is coming from impoverished nations is a bad one.

     

    I posted above an example above showing how medical tourism from the U.S. far and away outnumbers people coming here.

    Yes, you did show something from 2007...that's great....what does that have to do with what I brought up???

    Perhaps if you showed how that $51M is a percentage of the total FY12 revenue and then accounted for so-called "civilized" nations, you might have had an honest argument.  Instead, you're being unnecessarily obtuse and prickish.

    What does the percent of International for our total book of business have to do with anything? NOW who's moving the goalposts? Again, the point was to show in total dollars that TONS of people are coming from these universal coverage countries. Sorry you don't like it

    Your question and ensuing snark were likewise crapulent.  I stated how there are many reasons for medical tourism, and you said I "missed the point".  If you think so...

    ...or maybe your tight-held beliefs are buckling under the weight of your ignorance.

     Hahaha...you don't like the answers so it's "crapulent"....hahaha...gotcha.

     

     




     
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  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    Considering the costs associated with medical procedures it's easy to see that a few million dollars doesn't equate to a lot of patients here in the US.

     

     

    PROCEDURE  COST IN U.S. COST ABROAD Orthopedic     Hip Replacement $40,000 - $65,000 $7,000 - $13,000  Hip Resurfacing $50,000 - $60,000 $8,000 - $12,000 Knee Replacement $45,000 - $60,000 $7,500 - $12,000 Neurology     Spinal Fusion $80,000 - $100,000 $6,000 - $10,000  Total Spinal Disc Replacement $100,000 - $150,000 $8,000 - $12,000 Discectomy $20,000 - $24,000 $5000 - $7,000 Cardiology     Angioplasty $50,000 - $65,000 $5,000 - $7,000 Heart Bypass $90,000 - $120,000 $10,000 - $18,000 Heart Valve Replacement $125,000 - $175,000 $13,000 - $18,000 Gynecology     Hysterectomy $18,000 - $25,000 $4,000 - $7,000 Cosmetic     Face & Neck Lift $8,000 - $15,000 $2,500 – $4,000 Breast Augmentation $6,000 - $12,000 $3,500 - $5,000 Tummy Tuck $6,000 - $12,000 $3,800 - $5,200 Liposuction/Area $2,000 - $3,000 $800 - $1,200 Dental     Dental Implants/Tooth $3,000 - $5,000 $800 – $2,000 Dental Crowns $800 – $1,200 $200 – $600

     

    http://www.medretreat.com/procedures/pricing.html

       



    $88M is a "few"??? 

     
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  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Not only will the ACA drive premiums up in Ca. 64 to 146% the IRS will police it!

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    462's head is getting buffeted by all this reality.

    He's gonna need some dramamine.



    Your non answer says it all. Have a great weekend Airborne!!!

     
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