Point of view from a black man on Trayvon/Zimmerman

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Point of view from a black man on Trayvon/Zimmerman

    Thoughts on this?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mooiI9wIagY

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from StalkingButler. Show StalkingButler's posts

    Re: Point of view from a black man on Trayvon/Zimmerman

    He's a conservative, his opinion doesn't matter.

    --

    Think for yourself, question authority.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from DamainAllen. Show DamainAllen's posts

    Re: Point of view from a black man on Trayvon/Zimmerman

    So a couple of things.

    First is that it isn't just black people that are upset by the verdict and claiming that is dishonest, people of all backgrounds, economic status, and races have opined on this and find the verdict to be a huge mistake.  

    His point about black on black violence is, of course, on point and correct.  However, this wasn't a case of black on black violence, and that issue is separate from the specific instance of the Zimmerman/Martin case.  More to the point, the issue of black on black violence doesn't disqualify blacks from being able to discuss race as it relates to the Zimmerman case or any other case.  And if he isn't trying to say that then his point is lost on me, but regardless the two issues are separate and trying to bring them together is just a way of changing the subject.  Both issues can be examined with proper attention.  And his suggestion that blacks need to tackle the issue of black on black violence as though this isn't one of the biggest issues int he community is flat out wrong.  Church leaders, local leaders, police, mayors, etc have all been working together to try to build the communities torn apart by violence, to influence policy makers to implement programs that takes kids off the streets and gives the the chance to do something with themselves besides become victims or perpatrators of violence.  

    It sounds nice, but in the end his rant misses the point and instead pulls the old "look over here" trick.  

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from FortySixAndTwo. Show FortySixAndTwo's posts

    Re: Point of view from a black man on Trayvon/Zimmerman

    In response to DamainAllen's comment:

    So a couple of things.

    First is that it isn't just black people that are upset by the verdict and claiming that is dishonest

     

    Which is why he said it's PRIMARILY black people who are upset. He, nor anyone in this thread so far said that it's just black peope that are upset.

    The rest of you post isn't worth commenting on as you seemed to have missed his point. Hell...ya missed the fact that he didn't say that it's just black people who are upset.

     

    people of all backgrounds, economic status, and races have opined on this and find the verdict to be a huge mistake.  

    His point about black on black violence is, of course, on point and correct.  However, this wasn't a case of black on black violence, and that issue is separate from the specific instance of the Zimmerman/Martin case.  More to the point, the issue of black on black violence doesn't disqualify blacks from being able to discuss race as it relates to the Zimmerman case or any other case.  And if he isn't trying to say that then his point is lost on me, but regardless the two issues are separate and trying to bring them together is just a way of changing the subject.  Both issues can be examined with proper attention.  And his suggestion that blacks need to tackle the issue of black on black violence as though this isn't one of the biggest issues int he community is flat out wrong.  Church leaders, local leaders, police, mayors, etc have all been working together to try to build the communities torn apart by violence, to influence policy makers to implement programs that takes kids off the streets and gives the the chance to do something with themselves besides become victims or perpatrators of violence.  

    It sounds nice, but in the end his rant misses the point and instead pulls the old "look over here" trick.  




     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from DamainAllen. Show DamainAllen's posts

    Re: Point of view from a black man on Trayvon/Zimmerman

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

    Which is why he said it's PRIMARILY black people who are upset. He, nor anyone in this thread so far said that it's just black peope that are upset.

    The rest of you post isn't worth commenting on as you seemed to have missed his point. Hell...ya missed the fact that he didn't say that it's just black people who are upset.

     



    That is a distinction without significance and again I'd say even the characterization that blacks are the folks primarily upset by the verdict is wrong.  Here is a poll that asks respondents how they feel they would have ruled, by race.  Its one poll but others have similar results, so there is no factual basis for his claim that "primarily" blacks are the ones upset when 34% of white respondents would have convicted Zimmerman of either murder or manslaughter.

     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Point of view from a black man on Trayvon/Zimmerman

    In response to DamainAllen's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

     

     

    Which is why he said it's PRIMARILY black people who are upset. He, nor anyone in this thread so far said that it's just black peope that are upset.

    The rest of you post isn't worth commenting on as you seemed to have missed his point. Hell...ya missed the fact that he didn't say that it's just black people who are upset.

     

     

     



    That is a distinction without significance and again I'd say even the characterization that blacks are the folks primarily upset by the verdict is wrong.  Here is a poll that asks respondents how they feel they would have ruled, by race.  Its one poll but others have similar results, so there is no factual basis for his claim that "primarily" blacks are the ones upset when 34% of white respondents would have convicted Zimmerman of either murder or manslaughter.

     

     

     



    So, is the point of this that most black people do not understand what "not guilty" means, and are acting primarily on their race?

    I'm not sure what race has to do in a case that is not about race, and particularly where the defendant is NOT WHITE.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Point of view from a black man on Trayvon/Zimmerman

    "Church leaders, local leaders, police, mayors, etc have all been working together to try to build the communities torn apart by violence, to influence policy makers to implement programs that takes kids off the streets and gives the the chance to do something with themselves besides become victims or perpatrators of violence."

    Ah, the statist liberal notion of "programs" ...... It is not the solution, it is the problem. Liberal government bureaucratic "programs" have been in effect in the inner cities for decades...The beneficiaries of these programs are mostly white liberals, who get on the padded public sector payroll for life to  "counsel" inner city youth, to no avail.  Billions spent on welfare and social services....The government dependency programs and welfare exacerbate the cultural rot, and ruin the family ties and private sector job opportunities that can help actually solve the problem.

    The liberal experiment with "programs" has failed, see Detroit or Chicago...But liberal black leaders would rather stir up racial tensions rather than look to see what does work to help poor blacks stuck in inner cities.

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from DamainAllen. Show DamainAllen's posts

    Re: Point of view from a black man on Trayvon/Zimmerman

    In response to skeeter20's comment:

    In response to DamainAllen's comment:

     

    In response to FortySixAndTwo's comment:

     

     

     

    Which is why he said it's PRIMARILY black people who are upset. He, nor anyone in this thread so far said that it's just black peope that are upset.

    The rest of you post isn't worth commenting on as you seemed to have missed his point. Hell...ya missed the fact that he didn't say that it's just black people who are upset.

     

     

     



    That is a distinction without significance and again I'd say even the characterization that blacks are the folks primarily upset by the verdict is wrong.  Here is a poll that asks respondents how they feel they would have ruled, by race.  Its one poll but others have similar results, so there is no factual basis for his claim that "primarily" blacks are the ones upset when 34% of white respondents would have convicted Zimmerman of either murder or manslaughter.

     

     

     



    So, is the point of this that most black people do not understand what "not guilty" means, and are acting primarily on their race?

    I'm not sure what race has to do in a case that is not about race, and particularly where the defendant is NOT WHITE.



    Black people understand plenty what not guilty means, and in the mind of millions of people regardless of race, "not guilty" doesn't jive with the murder of an unarmed kid, who was committing no crime, who wasn't in "the wrong place at the wrong time" by a man who never identified himself or took any steps to engage Martin beyond calling the police on him and then chasing him down after he ran away, obviously concerned that something wasn't right with the man in the truck following him.  

    If George Zimmerman had rolled up to Trayvon and did the following:

    "Hey, my name is George and I am the neighborhood watch captain, I just wanted to make sure you were okay.   Where are you heading?"

    If he done that, instead of immediately deciding that Martin MUST BE UP TO NO GOOD (for some reason, but it CLEARLY wasn't Trayvon's race) Martin would still be alive.  Martin is dead because Zimmerman set in motion a confrontation that was premised by the idea that Martin was doing something wrong and potentially criminal by walking down the street in the neighborhood where his father lived, where he had every right to be.  Period.  That's why people are upset and beleive an injustice was committed, because of the two people involved one had the power to control the outcome and perform his duties, but good old colorblind George Zimmerman just KNEW that kid was up to something, based on his "gut" or his criminal justice studies, or the fact that trayvon was wearing a hooded sweatshirt.  But god knows it wasn't because he was black.  That would be absurd.  

     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from StalkingButler. Show StalkingButler's posts

    Re: Point of view from a black man on Trayvon/Zimmerman

    And if he isn't trying to say that then his point is lost on me

    His point is that the only reason that you know Travon's name is that his death was one that could be easily exploited for political purposes. His point is that since Travon's death 18 different 17 year old young men have been gunned down in Chicago and we never heard a peep about them. His point is that there is a much bigger problem going on here than one untrained and unwise hispanic walking a neighborhood watch and killing a young man who would still be alive today had either one of the reacted differently.

     

    --

    Think for yourself, question authority.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Point of view from a black man on Trayvon/Zimmerman

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

     

    "Church leaders, local leaders, police, mayors, etc have all been working together to try to build the communities torn apart by violence, to influence policy makers to implement programs that takes kids off the streets and gives the the chance to do something with themselves besides become victims or perpatrators of violence."

    Ah, the statist liberal notion of "programs" ...... It is not the solution, it is the problem. Liberal government bureaucratic "programs" have been in effect in the inner cities for decades...The beneficiaries of these programs are mostly white liberals, who get on the padded public sector payroll for life to  "counsel" inner city youth, to no avail.  Billions spent on welfare and social services....The government dependency programs and welfare exacerbate the cultural rot, and ruin the family ties and private sector job opportunities that can help actually solve the problem.

    The liberal experiment with "programs" has failed, see Detroit or Chicago...But liberal black leaders would rather stir up racial tensions rather than look to see what does work to help poor blacks stuck in inner cities.

     

     




     

    Nothing like a whackjob wingnut disparaging church leaders who try and help their communities.

    White wingnuts set themselves up as some kind of arbiter of what is wrong in black communities and pontificate about how no amount of help, either from church leaders or local police or mayors will solve the problem. Their 'solutions' are formed by opinions gleaned from the echo chambers written by angry-white-guys who are scared of 'losing their country' and who actively engage in further alienating and disenfranchising minority communities.



    Cant blame conservative policies for the disaster that is occurring within inner cities. The pork barrel public sector loving Democratic Party machine has been in charge in Chicago and Detroit for decades. White liberals are responsible.

     
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  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from DamainAllen. Show DamainAllen's posts

    Re: Point of view from a black man on Trayvon/Zimmerman

    In response to StalkingButler's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]And if he isn't trying to say that then his point is lost on me

     

    His point is that the only reason that you know Travon's name is that his death was one that could be easily exploited for political purposes. His point is that since Travon's death 18 different 17 year old young men have been gunned down in Chicago and we never heard a peep about them. His point is that there is a much bigger problem going on here than one untrained and unwise hispanic walking a neighborhood watch and killing a young man who would still be alive today had either one of the reacted differently.

     

    --

    Think for yourself, question authority.

    [/QUOTE]

    Thats an absurd point then and its veracity is easily tested and disposed of.  Why do we know who Natalie Holloway was?  Kids go missing everyday and are never found.  That too is major problem we face in the United States, but what was so special about her case that coutless hours of cable news coverage was dedicated to it, that multiple prime time specials were aired about it?  Especially when during that same time hundreds of other children went missing and received not a peep from Nancy Grace and others?  

    Trayvon Martin's case became a big deal because following the initial reports, it seemed obvious to most people that an arrest would be made.  And then for 6 weeks nothing happened and as that time passed people became agitated and angry.  People generally aren't going to get up in arms over the unsolved murder of a drug dealer or other criminal.  But when people see a innocent victim not get justice (as was the case with the young girl who sang at Obama's inaguration who was killed a week later in Chicago, or numerous other children who were not involved in crime and were murdered).  The media fixated on this case for numerous reasons but most are basic (murder of an innocent black kid, racial motivations for his murder abounded, and this peculiar Stand your ground law that most folks hadn't really heard of)  It was perfect theater for a media that can barely report news, because the story sold itself.  All the media needed was to find the commenters to talk about it and away we went.  This was after all a local crime, not an act of terror, not a financial crisis, and yet it dominated the news for weeks and weeks.  The reason why is obvious, and when people say this case wasn't about race their being fools.  If this was about some white guy murdering a white kid, or black on black violence you'd never hear about it.  

     

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