Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from WhichOnesPink. Show WhichOnesPink's posts

    Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

    What a bunch of lies. No one is against govt intervention ENTIRELY. There is some level of govt intervention that is needed for any country to survive. But there should be a limit to how much govt intervention there is. THAT is the point of most conservatives. If we let it run amok where will it end? At some point the govt could have their hand in everything if we the people don't push back. Or would you prefer the govt to have their hand in EVERYTHING? Maybe you would.
     
  2. This post has been removed.

     
  3. This post has been removed.

     
  4. This post has been removed.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from BetheKoolaid. Show BetheKoolaid's posts

    Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

    In Response to Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?:
    . They act like Pavlov's dog to the anti-gov't rhetoric. The sad thing is, it's only rhetoric. Posted by airborne-rgr[/QUOTE]

    Angryman's therapist says it helps him to say "wacko wingnut" at least 25 times a day.
    The usual lame supposed 'hypocrisy' card.
    Ted Kennedy and liberals fought to cut the defense budget every year, yet had no qualms about getting as much defense dollars to their state as they could. 

    The totally failed stimulus was bad enough, but apparently there is another provision in it, that you cant lobby for your state to get money from the feds. If you do, you cant criticize the almighty Obama Administration. You cant criticize the Solyndra scandal, paying off Obama insiders with tax money.

    If you drive to work, the almighty federal govt partly paid for the road..so YOU CANT CRITICIZE THE OBAMA ADMiNISTRATION, you must praise them

    But generally, if the federal government stupidly wants to pay for Biden's folly, multi billion dollar boondoggle of high speed trains, even if you vote against it,  it is logical to lobby for it to go thru your state.
    Nonetheless, credit goes to Ohio and Florida Wisconsin Governors,  all of whom have REFUSED free money for the high speed trains...
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

    I think this misses the mark somewhat...

    As I see it, the problem most repubs have with this deal (other than their expressed scorched earth strategy against anything Obama supports) is not necessarily about govt helping private industry or govt spending per se, because they have their own pet industries and money holes.

    It's because this deal is emblematic of the very real, lucrative, yet still rather speculative 'green' economy which was a main plank of Obama's election and  his domestic energy policy.  (One could also argue that big oil is directly behind the smearing, but I think that may just be incidental.)

    This is coupled with the widespread contention among rank-file repubs that renewable energies are a farce and some kind of hippie conspiracy.  For them, Solyndra is a symbol for why fossil fuels should be the only legitimate area of govt largesse re: the energy sector.

    As I've stated before - and as a working denizen of the energy sector myself - this position is myopic and self-perpetuating.  Aside from health care, energy will be THE primary driver of business costs in the next 25 years.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

    In Response to Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular? : Yep, great argument moron. "I'm against it, unless I'm for it." You couldn't have proven the ideological ignorance of the wingnuts any better. Sooo, when the wingnuts campaign on cutting gov't waste, you know they are lying right to your face yet you happily stick your nose in their crack and follow them anywhere. Geez, you are a loyal son-of-a-gun. Since you know they're lying and it's only rhetoric, what exactly do you expect from your representatives? If they know your so freakin stupid to believe the rhetoric, what incentive is there for them stop spending? They keep doing it and you idiots keep voting them in, expecting something different? That is, as you know, the definition of insanity.
    Posted by airborne-rgr[/QUOTE]

    Airhead, your argument is weak. First, your template is wrong.  Democrats are unified behind the proposition of large government/loss of freedom.  Republicans are all over the map.  The ideological diversity is on the right, not the left.  You cherry pick a republican and try to say all republicans think that.  Really.  Even with your GED you should be able to come up with a more convincing argument.
     
  8. This post has been removed.

     
  9. This post has been removed.

     
  10. This post has been removed.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from WhichOnesPink. Show WhichOnesPink's posts

    Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

    In Response to Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?:
    What a bunch of lies. No one is against govt intervention ENTIRELY. There is some level of govt intervention that is needed for any country to survive. But there should be a limit to how much govt intervention there is. THAT is the point of most conservatives. If we let it run amok where will it end? At some point the govt could have their hand in everything if we the people don't push back. Or would you prefer the govt to have their hand in EVERYTHING? Maybe you would.
    Posted by WhichOnesPink


    That's just a dumb argument.

    So who gets to decide the 'limit' of gov't intervention?

    The Solyndra loan was from a DOE program that was implemented under Bush.
    It was a wingnut program that a current Dem admin utilized.
    So who's fault is that?



    You really are a dumb fcuk. YOU asked the question "are wingnuts against govt intervention in general...?" Did you not? I mean, it's in the headline is it not?
    I merely answered you. And WHO gets to decide? Um...we the people. You know with the whole voting thingy. Sheesh
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from BetheKoolaid. Show BetheKoolaid's posts

    Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

    "real, lucrative, yet still rather speculative 'green' economy "

    The green scam is lucrative, all right...to public sector moochers, corruptocrats and crony capitalists friends of Obama.
    The rest of us taxpayers, not so much.

    Weird conspiracy theories  about the evil "big oil"... .
    Matty you have a vested interest in believing and selling the green energy turkey.
    Epic fail. Can solar panels be re-used as frisbees?
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

    In Response to Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?:
    [QUOTE]"real, lucrative, yet still rather speculative 'green' economy " The green scam is lucrative, all right...to public sector moochers, corruptocrats and crony capitalists friends of Obama. The rest of us taxpayers, not so much. Weird conspiracy theories  about the evil "big oil"... . Matty you have a vested interest in believing and selling the green energy turkey. Epic fail. Can solar panels be re-used as frisbees?
    Posted by BetheKoolaid[/QUOTE]

    Why open your mouth and remove all doubt that you have no earthly idea what you're talking about??

    That you couldn't address or rebut a single word of my statement shows you've got nothing and that just maybe I was right about your cognitive biases.

    My "vested interest" is also incidental, despite the fact that you have no basis to question my expertise on the matter. 

    Or maybe you should talk to your poster boys Perry or Romney about green energies and "crony capitalism", eh...??
     
  14. This post has been removed.

     
  15. This post has been removed.

     
  16. This post has been removed.

     
  17. This post has been removed.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from BetheKoolaid. Show BetheKoolaid's posts

    Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

    "you have no basis to question my expertise on the matter. "
     
    Just because you work in the government gravy train of 'green energy' doesnt make you any smarter.

    "The true engine of economic growth will always be companies like Solyndra,”  Obama said.

    Obviously Obama is flat wrong on that point.  The true engine of growth is free market – a lesson Solyndra found out the hard way.  With cheap Chinese solar panels flooding the market and a corresponding reduction in global demand, this “industry” was on an unsustainable course – not unlike the government subsidizing its expansion.

    A month before Solyndra went belly-up, Massachusetts-based Evergreen Solar – which received $58 million in taxpayer aid – also declared bankruptcy.  Months earlier, the company had moved 800 manufacturing jobs to China.

    “This is one of the most oversupplied industries I’ve ever seen,” an energy industry analyst noted at the time. “Evergreen is just the tip of the iceberg.”

    Losing “green jobs” to overseas competitors has been a hallmark of the Obama “stimulus.” Last February, an American University report revealed that 80 percent of the $2 billion appropriated in the bill for wind power projects had gone to foreign companies.

    “Most of the jobs are going overseas,” researcher Russ Choma told ABC. “According to our estimates, about 6,000 jobs have been created overseas, and maybe a couple hundred have been created in the U.S.”

    Meanwhile, America is littered with empty “green jobs” promises.

    In Nevada, one solar company received $55 million in federal and state tax credits – but hired just five new employees, while $61.5 million in “stimulus” funds were spent on geothermal projects that created only 25 new jobs. In Seattle, a $20 million weatherization grant that was supposed to create 2,000 jobs and retrofit 2,000 homes wound up producing only fourteen jobs and retrofitting three homes.

    Even if we accept the Obama administration’s rosy estimates that 225,000 jobs have been “saved or created” as a result of this $93 billion investment– that’s still a price tag of more than $410,000 per job.

    Taxpayers certainly deserve a full accounting on the Solyndra scandal, but it would be a mistake to assume that this scam is limited to one bad loan for $535 million. The true cost of government’s “green jobs” scam is much larger than that.



    Read more at NetRightDaily.com: http://netrightdaily.com/2011/09/green-jobs-scam-much-bigger-than-solyndra/#ixzz1clEFyzxW
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from sshore123. Show sshore123's posts

    Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

    In Response to Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular? : And after all that shouting, you do realize that Solyndra was a loan under a wingnut program initiated by a wingnut administration, right.
    Posted by airborne-rgr[/QUOTE]

    For the sake of accuracy your comment should have read...

    It was a loan issued via a program initiated by a wingnut administration.  The loan particular loan itself was shelved by said wingnut admin as the business model and predictions for the company's success was suspect at best.  The loan was approved by the current administration, ignoring numerous red flags about the viability of the firm. Said firm had ties to the current administration which gives rise to questioing the decision making process in granting the loan.

    Your point can still be made (repubs involving the gov't in "the market") without glossing over the issues some have with this particular loan
     
  20. This post has been removed.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

    In Response to Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?:
    [QUOTE]"you have no basis to question my expertise on the matter. "   Just because you work in the government gravy train of 'green energy' doesnt make you any smarter. "The true engine of economic growth will always be companies like Solyndra,”  Obama said. Obviously Obama is flat wrong on that point.  The true engine of growth is free market – a lesson Solyndra found out the hard way.  With cheap Chinese solar panels flooding the market and a corresponding reduction in global demand, this “industry” was on an unsustainable course – not unlike the government subsidizing its expansion. A month before Solyndra went belly-up, Massachusetts-based Evergreen Solar – which received $58 million in taxpayer aid – also declared bankruptcy.  Months earlier, the company had moved 800 manufacturing jobs to China. “This is one of the most oversupplied industries I’ve ever seen,” an energy industry analyst noted at the time. “Evergreen is just the tip of the iceberg.” Losing “green jobs” to overseas competitors has been a hallmark of the Obama “stimulus.” Last February, an American University report revealed that 80 percent of the $2 billion appropriated in the bill for wind power projects had gone to foreign companies. “Most of the jobs are going overseas,” researcher Russ Choma told ABC. “According to our estimates, about 6,000 jobs have been created overseas, and maybe a couple hundred have been created in the U.S.” Meanwhile, America is littered with empty “green jobs” promises. In Nevada, one solar company received $55 million in federal and state tax credits – but hired just five new employees, while $61.5 million in “stimulus” funds were spent on geothermal projects that created only 25 new jobs. In Seattle, a $20 million weatherization grant that was supposed to create 2,000 jobs and retrofit 2,000 homes wound up producing only fourteen jobs and retrofitting three homes. Even if we accept the Obama administration’s rosy estimates that 225,000 jobs have been “saved or created” as a result of this $93 billion investment– that’s still a price tag of more than $410,000 per job. Taxpayers certainly deserve a full accounting on the Solyndra scandal, but it would be a mistake to assume that this scam is limited to one bad loan for $535 million. The true cost of government’s “green jobs” scam is much larger than that. Read more at NetRightDaily.com: http://netrightdaily.com/2011/09/green-jobs-scam-much-bigger-than-solyndra/#ixzz1clEFyzxW
    Posted by BetheKoolaid[/QUOTE]

    "NetRightDaily"...?  Went running to one of your binkys, did you?  This article leans so far right, it's taking on water.  The sources and figures are all suspect.

    No matter, because nothing in this biased article or your statement really disputes what I said, which was not about the winners and losers in the renewable energy sector (of which there are many of both)...it was about repubs' ideological reaction to one particular bankruptcy in a sector in which repubs have picked their own winners and losers, namely Big Oil.

    Oil companies receive over $21 Billion in federal subsidies yearly, so a little perspective is in order here.  By contrast, China subsidized their major solar manufacturers alone over $30 Billion last year.  While we can't build the panels as cheaply, they still need to be installed and maintained by technicians - these are examples of the american jobs which have been created.

    And the above scenarios can be either partly or totally attributed to the decrease in consumer and business demand during this economic downturn.  Unfortunately, all of the gop consternation over this mess has now adversely affected ALL energy startup companies, including nuclear, gas, shale oil, etc.

    My larger point still holds true: that energy costs will be one of the principal factors affecting business costs in the near future to the tune of trillions of dollars.

     
  22. This post has been removed.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from BetheKoolaid. Show BetheKoolaid's posts

    Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

    "Give the customer what they want", not what's the easiest or the most convenient or what you think is best. The entire world has decided that they want green energy"

    The world wants green energy? Are you deluded? Green energy is stuffed down the throat of a public uninterested and unwilling to subsidize expensive failures
    The customers dont seem to want the incredibly failed  government boondoggle  Chevy Volt, which cost untold billions of tax dollars to produce, has sold millions of vehicles to Americans....well, thousands
    ,......well, hundreds...well ,about twelve.
     
  24. This post has been removed.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from KittyDuke. Show KittyDuke's posts

    Re: Solyndra; Are wingnuts against gov't intervention in general or just against this administration in particular?

    Think we ALL want CHEAPER energy first and foremost.

    We 'could' tap our own petroleum resources and drive down the price significantly but some mosquito might be killed in the process.

    America first, people first (sorry Bambi)
     

Share