The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

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    The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

     

     
     

    The plan, drawn up by the House Republican Study Committee, starts with repealing the 2010 health care reform law. It then aims to lower health care costs through a few mechanisms. Income and payroll tax deductions would be available to individuals ($7,500) and families ($20,000) for health coverage. Insurance plans could be sold across state lines. The federal government would pump $25 billion into state high-risk pools for people with preexisting conditions. Medical malpractice laws would be reformed to reduce doctors' risk of litigation.

    As for the merits of the bill itself, it wouldn't do much to help the low-income Americans who make up a substantial portion of the country's 48 million uninsured. First, by repealing Obamacare, it would eliminate income-based aid from Medicaid expansion and premium tax credits for coverage sold on the insurance marketplaces created by the law.

    But then by basing aid on tax deductions instead of credits, the Republican legislation would have limited benefits for people whose income is so low that they might pay nothing or little in income taxes.

    This doesn't help people who (Obamacare) helps. It helps people who vote Republican. A $20,000 income tax deduction doesn't help you if you're poor enough not to pay income tax. But it helps you a huge amount if you're paying at a very high level.

    Experts concur. "House GOP plan to be based on a tax deduction, not a credit?"tweeted Austin Frakt, a health economist at Boston University. "Poor people, meet underside of bus."

    Asked about those concerns, Scalise said the bill would lower the overall cost of health care, making coverage ultimately more affordable to the poor. He also said that the payroll tax deductions would still apply and that Obamacare, by putting people near or below the poverty line on Medicaid, wasn't helping them anyway.

    "The biggest concern I hear from low-income people that is the impediment for them getting health insurance is the cost. By putting forward solutions that actually lower the cost, it makes health care affordable for millions of people who are right now priced out of the market," Scalise said. "The president's solution is to dump them onto Medicaid. The most broken part of health care in America is Medicaid."

    Other elements of the GOP plan have also been questioned. High-risk insurance pools were funded as part of Obamacare, intended to help the transition to the law's 2014 reforms, but turned out to be more expensive than expected. The malpractice reforms being proposed were instituted in Texas, but they have not had a significant effect on health care costs.

    And while the Republican proposal would surely be killed in the Senate, the bill might not make it out of the House. Scalise acknowledged to reporters that he had not received a formal commitment from House GOP leadership to have a vote on the bill.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    Let's pass it just to see if any Dems in the next session shut down the government in order to de-fund it.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hansoribrother. Show Hansoribrother's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    How does anyone know what is in it? It has to pass first before we can find out what is in it.

    Funny how lefties are all pro-choice when it comes to abortion, but for everything else they want the governemnt to dictate our health care choices.

     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

     governemnt to dictate our health care choices.

     



    How is government dictating your health care choices?

     

    [/QUOTE]

    By giving people with no choice...a choice.

    Some people just don't like that, I guess.  They would rather people with limited options be reduced to none and those with none kept that way.

     

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    So if your poor you would have a hard choice to make; Food or your health.



    They'd argue that death is another alternative...one less mouth to feed and (supposedly) one less democratic vote.

    Fine by them.

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hansoribrother. Show Hansoribrother's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

     governemnt to dictate our health care choices.

     



    How is government dictating your health care choices?

     

    [/QUOTE]

    huh?

    Can you decide not to have healthcare insurance without a penalty?

    Who says what treatments are allowed and which are not?

    If I like my plan and/or my doctor can I keep them?

    Who dictates what is an acceptable insurance plan and therefore what treatments are reimburseable?

    It is only going to get worse. Many of the Obamacare advocates have already declared their desire for rationing of care which by its very defintion means that you won't be able to get want you want when you want it. Yes, that is true for insurance companies too. WHo is telling the insurance companies what they have to cover and what they don't????

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hansoribrother. Show Hansoribrother's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

     governemnt to dictate our health care choices.

     

     



    How is government dictating your health care choices?

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    By giving people with no choice...a choice.

     

    Some people just don't like that, I guess.  They would rather people with limited options be reduced to none and those with none kept that way.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    That is just utter nonsense.

    Without Obamacare everyone has a choice. They can choose to do nothing. If they can't afford insurance they can choose to pass up on non-essentials to buy it. Why should someone else pay for your insurance if you decide you want to buy cigarettes and booze before you buy insurance? If you really can't afford it you can get Medicaid. Beyond that you can go to the emergency room to get treatment

    Like anything else, if you want a cadillac you have to earn the money to buy it. Otherwise you get to ride the bus.

    WHy should people take care of themselves if people like you are going to be there to bail them out?

     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

     

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

     governemnt to dictate our health care choices.

     

     

     



    How is government dictating your health care choices?

     

     

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    By giving people with no choice...a choice.

     

     

    Some people just don't like that, I guess.  They would rather people with limited options be reduced to none and those with none kept that way.

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    That is just utter nonsense.

     

    Without Obamacare everyone has a choice. They can choose to do nothing. If they can't afford insurance they can choose to pass up on non-essentials to buy it. Why should someone else pay for your insurance if you decide you want to buy cigarettes and booze before you buy insurance? If you really can't afford it you can get Medicaid. Beyond that you can go to the emergency room to get treatment

    Like anything else, if you want a cadillac you have to earn the money to buy it. Otherwise you get to ride the bus.

    WHy should people take care of themselves if people like you are going to be there to bail them out?

    [/QUOTE]

    Except that model of health care is unsustainable.  Costs will keep going up, and fewer people will be able to afford it.  Even looking generously at inflation in the cost of services, health care has been spiking much faster than anything else.  Part of the reason is our aging population of boomers who are quite determined to a) get their share of govt largesse, and b) not have any of it cut under any circumstances (all while trying to vote down pension benefits and health care for the next generation).

    The people you refer to as "not taking care of themselves" are largely senior citizens who either can't work or can't get hired.  The rest are made up of the mentally incapacitated, children, single mothers, and the poor (working or not).

    So, which one of those groups do you want to untether??  Can't do it, and neither can congress, which is why we're in this situation.

    Your choice between the bus and a cadillac is false one, especially in places where there is no bus service.  A 5-year old civic or corolla might actually make a difference, though.

     

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    ".... some experts say that it wouldn't do much to help America's poor and uninsured."

    Yes, the favorite line used by the New York Times , "some experts", the usual leftist spin to make you believe that the real smart folks are on your side...

    Prior to ObamaCare, Gallup said 80% were satisfied with their health care, and even 61% with insurance.....

    The crisis was manufactured, which belies the idea the Republicans have to come up with an alternative to ObamaCare..

    To steal a line from Breaking Bad's Walter White, who said to his wife who was afraid his meth dealing would result in violence from his competitors:

    "There is no danger ...I am the danger!!"

    There was no health care crisis...ObamaCare is the crisis!

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

    If you are that poor you don't need to buy insurance - you get Medicaid.

    You and Matty - distortionaires

    Do you know what you're saying?

    The ACA provides for expansion of Medicaid.  If that is your solution, then you better inform the 20-odd states and their legs who are refusing to do so purely out of spite.

    Not only are they not helping their least advantaged people, they're trying to make it harder for them to get care.

    So, where's the distortion again...?!?

     

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    On it's face it sounds pretty stupid.

    If you barely make enough money to feed and house yourself, how is a tax deduction going to help you afford health insurance.

    And what would the neo-cons cut to offset the costs of their bill?

    Let me guess.... food stamps.

    So if your poor you would have a hard choice to make; Food or your health.

     



    What a bunch of crappp.

     

    No one has to make that choice unless they are grossly misinformed or just so irresponsible that they don't want to take care of themselves.

    If you are that poor you don't need to buy insurance - you get Medicaid.

    You and Matty - distortionaires

    [/QUOTE]

    Do you have any idea how much insurance costs if you are not covered by your employer?  Average annual health care costs for a family of four is over $20,000.  You don't have to be poor to be unable to afford an Escalade payment each month.

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

    ".... some experts say that it wouldn't do much to help America's poor and uninsured."

    Yes, the favorite line used by the New York Times , "some experts", the usual leftist spin to make you believe that the real smart folks are on your side...

    Prior to ObamaCare, Gallup said 80% were satisfied with their health care, and even 61% with insurance.....

    The crisis was manufactured, which belies the idea the Republicans have to come up with an alternative to ObamaCare..

    To steal a line from Breaking Bad's Walter White, who said to his wife who was afraid his meth dealing would result in violence from his competitors:

    "There is no danger ...I am the danger!!"

    There was no health care crisis...ObamaCare is the crisis!



    You've obviously never paid for your own insurance.

     

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

     

    The crisis was manufactured, which belies the idea the Republicans have to come up with an alternative to ObamaCare..

    There was no health care crisis...ObamaCare is the crisis!

     



    That's just a lie.  It was a lie 20 years ago, and it's a lie today.

    Or, perhaps you think all americans are in perfect health and really don't need health care?

    People have gotten less healthy as health care has gotten more expensive.  The trends are clear.

    Question:

    Do YOU have govt-sponsored health coverage?

     

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from andiejen. Show andiejen's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

    How does anyone know what is in it? It has to pass first before we can find out what is in it.

    Funny how lefties are all pro-choice when it comes to abortion, but for everything else they want the governemnt to dictate our health care choices.



    http://dailycaller.com/2013/09/18/republican-study-committee-to-release-obamacare-alternative/

    This will lead you to details of the Republican's Study Committee's bill alternative to Obamacare, courtesy of the Daily Caller.

     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: The GOP Alternative to Obamacare Won't Work Anyhow!

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

     

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

     governemnt to dictate our health care choices.

     

     

     



    How is government dictating your health care choices?

     

     

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    huh?

     

     

    Can you decide not to have healthcare insurance without a penalty?

    Who says what treatments are allowed and which are not?

    If I like my plan and/or my doctor can I keep them?

    Who dictates what is an acceptable insurance plan and therefore what treatments are reimburseable?

    It is only going to get worse. Many of the Obamacare advocates have already declared their desire for rationing of care which by its very defintion means that you won't be able to get want you want when you want it. Yes, that is true for insurance companies too. WHo is telling the insurance companies what they have to cover and what they don't????

     

    [/QUOTE]


    1. Obamacare sets national minimum standards. Every state you've ever lived in already did that.

     

    2. Being required to buy insurance isn't making a decision about whether or what health care you receive. It prevents you from screwing me over by gaming the system.

    3. Insurers already rationed; you haven't demonstrated rationing under Obamacare.

     

    Basically, words...   

    [/QUOTE]

    Insurers never rationed.  That is an unbelievable distortion.

    The IAPB boards are by definition, rationing boards, determining who gets coverego for what treatment, despite stated coverage.

    Your welcome.

     
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