Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from lucy7368. Show lucy7368's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    Facts! Logic! What message board is this?[/Quote]

    Be careful. Things like facts and logic can get you burned at the stake around these parts.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from lucy7368. Show lucy7368's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]
    Do you think we should all get paid the same regardless of job, education, skill? So do you think the bathroom attendent handing out towels should make as much as a CEO for example?[/Quote]

    That's not the best example. Some CEOs aren't as useful as the guy who hands out towels.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from lucy7368. Show lucy7368's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    Then you haven't been listening very well. I don't know anyone who likes paying taxes. Doesn't matter which side they are on.[/Quote]

    I am happy to pay taxes. Nice to meet you.

    And, before you ask, I don't pay extra. I can't pay extra. One year, I forgot to take a deduction to which I was entitled, and they sent me an adjusted refund check that was more than I thought I should be getting.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from lucy7368. Show lucy7368's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]Why is being poor in America a crime to the right?[/Quote]

    Well, obviously, because poor people are stupid and lazy. Being stupid and lazy is also a crime.

    Really, it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Being poor makes me lazy, as I can't afford to do anything.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from kmatthew68. Show kmatthew68's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    No, by all means let raise taxes on those who employee people. This is the PERFECT time to do it. Always makes perfect sense to raise taxes in a bad economy.....sigh
    And lower taxes are not what has caused our economy to be in the state it is. Anyone who took econ 101 knows that.
    And lastly, it's not that people want to give these ultra rich people a huge tax cut. It's that they believe no one should get a tax increase. Nice spin on your part though. See, increasing taxes on one segment of the population is what one could define as discrimination. Shouldn't we ALL get to keep the current tax cuts? Afterall we ALL got a tax cut, not just the rich as the left would like people to believe. Either we all get a tax cut or we all get a tax increase. Fair is fair....or do the dems not believe in that anymore???[/Quote]


    This post really does sum up the differences between the Left and the Right now a days. The Right has ideology, the Left has facts. I have heard Palin and McCain say a number of times over the last few days that they want to cut taxes for everyone including the rich because this spurs job growth. Look, if there was any evidence that this was true I would be for it to, except we have mounds of evidence that cutting taxes does not in fact spur job growth. The last 8 years should be proof enough, Bush cut taxes massively for the wealthiest earners in this country, and we didn't get more jobs. In fact, this decade has been the worst decade for job growth since the great depression, and those jobs that have been created are lower paying. These are just facts.

    Democrats and their policies are just far better for the Average American then Republican Policies.
    http://articles.latimes.com/2005/apr/03/opinion/oe-kinsley3
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from gabootwo2006. Show gabootwo2006's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]


    This post really does sum up the differences between the Left and the Right now a days. The Right has ideology, the Left has facts. I have heard Palin and McCain say a number of times over the last few days that they want to cut taxes for everyone including the rich because this spurs job growth. Look, if there was any evidence that this was true I would be for it to, except we have mounds of evidence that cutting taxes does not in fact spur job growth. The last 8 years should be proof enough, Bush cut taxes massively for the wealthiest earners in this country, and we didn't get more jobs. In fact, this decade has been the worst decade for job growth since the great depression, and those jobs that have been created are lower paying. These are just facts.

    Democrats and their policies are just far better for the Average American then Republican Policies.
    http://articles.latimes.com/2005/apr/03/opinion/oe-kinsley3[/Quote]


    One question: If these CEO's of companies are employing millions of Americans and expand product, jobs and industry across the land. What would help them more in growing those three major aspects of the economy? Tax cuts where they would have more money to expand business, hire more workers, and make more product or Tax Increases where money for expansion, creating more jobs, and creating more product is tightened due to the action? Your argument doesn't hold up!!!

    Tax cuts help expand business and allows it to grow, allows businesses to hire more workers and allows businesses to create more product. It is simple economics.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from gabootwo2006. Show gabootwo2006's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    Can the rich and wealthy in America come together and put together a lawsuit against Obama's proposed policies claiming DISCRIMINATION AGAINST THE RICH, WEALTHY AND SUCCESSFUL in America? Just a thought! LOL!!!!
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from kmatthew68. Show kmatthew68's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?



    Tax cuts help expand business and allows it to grow, allows businesses to hire more workers and allows businesses to create more product. It is simple economics.[/Quote]


    I find that people who usually talk about simple economics or refer to economics 101 are usually familiar with neither. My answer is simple, show me the evidence. We have had 8 years of a Republican President who cut taxes massively for those at the top, and we've had either stagnant wages for the middle class, little or no job growth, and increased prices of commodities, although the wealthy have done rather well. It's pretty simple, the wealth didn't trickle down, they simply kept it.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from bobc33. Show bobc33's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    do you know john locke was a big influence on the people who wrote the consitution right? do you know what economic system he favored? do you know by 'happiness' they really mean 'property'? we all have the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of property. our capitalist sysytem isn't designed to help people obtain property but to make it harder for them to obtain property. people with bad credit are forced to pay more in the way of interest, does that really make sense? the people who can afford the least, are forced to pay the most. again i'm not saying are system is the worst, or that america is bad, just that capitalism has its faults like all economic ideologies.[/Quote]

    Yes, it really makes sense, it makes perfect sense. What would you propose instead?
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from ecafsc. Show ecafsc's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    I am happy to pay taxes. Nice to meet you.

    And, before you ask, I don't pay extra. I can't pay extra. One year, I forgot to take a deduction to which I was entitled, and they sent me an adjusted refund check that was more than I thought I should be getting.[/Quote]

    So you're happy to pay higher taxes even though you can't afford to pay higher taxes??? Um....ok....sure you are.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ecafsc. Show ecafsc's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]Can the rich and wealthy in America come together and put together a lawsuit against Obama's proposed policies claiming DISCRIMINATION AGAINST THE RICH, WEALTHY AND SUCCESSFUL in America? Just a thought! LOL!!!![/Quote]

    Oh no, no. Don't you know it's not ok to discriminate. Unless of course it's dems doing the discriminating. Then it's ok. Carry on : )
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ecafsc. Show ecafsc's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]


    We have had 8 years of a Republican President who cut taxes massively for those at the top, and we've had either stagnant wages for the middle class, little or no job growth, and increased prices of commodities, although the wealthy have done rather well. It's pretty simple, the wealth didn't trickle down, they simply kept it.[/Quote]

    Care to share how "massive" that tax cut for the wealthy was? You do realize Bush cut taxes for everyone and NOT just the wealthy right?
    The wealth DOES trickle down.....as in the paychecks we get for working for the companies that these people at the top own. See how that works?
    Increase their taxes and they have less money to pay for salaries. Less money to pay for salaries means layoffs. Layoffs means people lose their jobs. People losing their jobs means less money. Less money means inability to pay bill and buy things. Let consumers spending means less money being made by merchants. Less money being made by merchants means less money to pay salaries. Less money for salaries means more layoffs. And the cycle continues.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Mattyhorn. Show Mattyhorn's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    Wow. A stupid question begets stupid answers...

    ...imagine that.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from gabootwo2006. Show gabootwo2006's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    F'ing cruel you are!!
    I was just hoping the poor dumb Obama women supporters could get free implants. I date a few and was looking to... redistribute the wealth. YES WE CAN !

    Change you can believe in ![/Quote]


    Change you can believe in. How true that is because that will be only money left in our pockets after Obama is done with us. Tax, Tax, Tax, Spend, Spend, Spend us into total distruction as a country.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from kmatthew68. Show kmatthew68's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    Care to share how "massive" that tax cut for the wealthy was? You do realize Bush cut taxes for everyone and NOT just the wealthy right?
    The wealth DOES trickle down.....as in the paychecks we get for working for the companies that these people at the top own. See how that works?
    Increase their taxes and they have less money to pay for salaries. Less money to pay for salaries means layoffs. Layoffs means people lose their jobs. People losing their jobs means less money. Less money means inability to pay bill and buy things. [/Quote]

    My question to you remains. Why is that wages have not gone up under Bush, and the last 8 years have been the worst for job creation since the 1930's. Obama plans to raise taxes for the top 2% to Clinton Administration levels. Do you remember the Clinton Administration, record growth and wages and jobs created?
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ecafsc. Show ecafsc's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    My question to you remains. Why is that wages have not gone up under Bush, and the last 8 years have been the worst for job creation since the 1930's. Obama plans to raise taxes for the top 2% to Clinton Administration levels. Do you remember the Clinton Administration, record growth and wages and jobs created?[/Quote]


    My wages have gone up. My friends wages have gone up. If your wages haven't gone up that might have something to do with you.
    Clinton didn't just raise taxes on the top 2%.
    BTW, do you have a link proving your assertion regarding worst job creation since 1930s?
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from lnmonster. Show lnmonster's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    I'll try once more. Capitalism has the natural effect of concentrating wealth in the hands of the people who are the best capitalists. Left unchecked, it deteriorates into economic feudalism, in which a few own most of everything and eveyone else has very little. As more and more people have less and less money to spend, the economy winds down. You get a depression, as we found out in the '30s.

    Any number of forces can work against this trend, and progressive taxation is one of them. It isn't socialism to tax poorer people at a lower rate than richer people, it isn't even really income redistribution. It's just progressive taxation. This is what Obama is proposing. Making capitalism sustainable is a GOOD thing; doing so prevents socialism from looking good by comparison, as it did in the first half of the 20th century when capitalism was unchecked and hence unsustainable.

    Right now the US federal tax system (with revenues mostly from income taxes and FICA, in approximately equal amounts) is fairly flat. The poorest pay 15% of every dime they earn in FICA. The wealthiest pay 15% of their income in divident and capital gains tax. Those of us in the middle pay more then either extreme.

    The richest 1% pay 22% of the income taxes and FICA, BUT they make 22% of the money. In other words, the tax rate paid by the top 1% of income earners is the same as the bottom 99%. That is NOT progressive taxation. All Obama is proposing is that we make the tax system a little more progressive.

    I suspect the conservatives will argue that the taxes poor people pay (FICA) doesn't count because that money supposedly funds entitlement programs, but this is BS. FICA money has been used for general operation of the federal government for decades, and when the money comes out of your paycheck, it affects the employee and the economy exactly the same, no matter which bookkeeping account the money supposedly goes into.

    So this argument should be over. We had progressive taxation and times were good and the middle class grew. For the past decade we've had a flat tax system and the economy is tanking. Yes other factors contribute, but for the good of the nation, it's essential to discard the flat tax and replace it by a mildly progressive tax. That's all Obama is saying, making John McCain's cries of "socialist" look even more hysterical.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from ecafsc. Show ecafsc's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]Wage growth has been negative since the 80s. I highly doubt your wages have gone up. Unless you are very good at a professional sport.[/Quote]

    Let me try this again. My wages have gone up every year. You, like the other poster, must not being doing a good job and therefore you're not getting pay increases. That's unfortunate for you.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Reubenhop. Show Reubenhop's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    Let me try this again. My wages have gone up every year. You, like the other poster, must not being doing a good job and therefore you're not getting pay increases. That's unfortunate for you.[/Quote]

    Maybe you should look beyond your little world to how others are doing. Bush sought to maker the rich richer so it would trickle down to the rest of us. He succeeded as to the first part of his premise only.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from ecafsc. Show ecafsc's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    Maybe you should look beyond your little world to how others are doing. Bush sought to maker the rich richer so it would trickle down to the rest of us. He succeeded as to the first part of his premise only.[/Quote]

    Oh now the subject is being changed. The claim was that wages have NOT gone up. That's bullshiit. I'm tired of the left wing talking points about Bush making the rich richer. Tax cuts were given to EVERYONE. Enough already with the claim that ONLY the rich got tax cuts. Total crap and you know it. Stop whining and work harder and maybe you'll get an increase to your wages. People shouldn't be rewarded JUST for showing up. You actually have to do the work. You know....EARN it. Doesn't anybody subscribe to this philosophy anymore? Or is the entitlement attitude spreading to everyone?
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from ecafsc. Show ecafsc's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    So then you should be proud of yourself.

    But it doesn't change the fact that you are in a tiny monority, and it is not possible for everyone to be in your shoes. It's not materially possible for everyone to live the "good life", like an american with money.

    So don't get used to it, people.[/Quote]

    I don't accept that "it is not possible for everyone to be in my shoes". Everyone has just as much of a chance to do the right things and work hard and reap the benefits. There is a reason people come to this country in droves to make a better life. I don't know too many examples of people going to other countries (in the amount that they do coming to the US) to "make a better life". The US is known for that. Anything is possible in this country. You just have to WANT it.
    The problem with this country is we also make it too easy to NOT do anything. We enable laziness.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from June09. Show June09's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    (quote) One question: If these CEO's of companies are employing millions of Americans and expand product, jobs and industry across the land. What would help them more in growing those three major aspects of the economy? Tax cuts where they would have more money to expand business, hire more workers, and make more product or Tax Increases where money for expansion, creating more jobs, and creating more product is tightened due to the action? Your argument doesn't hold up!!!

    Tax cuts help expand business and allows it to grow, allows businesses to hire more workers and allows businesses to create more product. It is simple economics. (quote)

    I haven't read through all 4 pages yet, so I'm sorry if this has already been addressed. This would be great IF it actually happened. I'm sure there are businesses that use tax cuts and any extra income to invest in their current employees and expand their business. Unfortunately, I think the trend for CEO's and those in power is to take any extra money whether through tax cuts or higher profits, and invest it in themselves and their buddies.

    It's not true that everyone that has made a lot of money or is the head of a company has worked hard to get there. Some got to the top by cheating and lying whether it was in school or in business. Some got there because of mommy or daddy. It's a crime that those that have worked hard for their position, power, and money have to pay the price for those that take advantage of it. But isn't that how it works? We're only as strong as our weakest player?

    I don't think everyone should make the same amount of money no matter what their job, but to suggest that the amount of money someone makes is directly proportional to how hard they do or don't work is absurd. I work a second job in a restaurant. You know who works the hardest? The dishwasher. You know who probably gets paid the least? The dishwasher. Now, I don't hand him my money at the end of the night, but I do do whatever I can on my end to make his job easier. It's not about handing people money to make everything fair and even, it's about respecting each and every person, the job they do, and recognizing how that job contributes to the overall success of the business.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from pajamaslavedancer. Show pajamaslavedancer's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    Let me try this again. My wages have gone up every year. You, like the other poster, must not being doing a good job and therefore you're not getting pay increases. That's unfortunate for you.[/Quote]

    Your wages have not gone up every year. I can prove that.
    First normalize your supposed increase by removing nominal effects. Then remove the effects of career advancement. What you'll find is that adjusted for the effects of career advancement and inflation your actual WAGE has gone down. Unless you are a CEO or baseball player, something like that. Maybe pop diva? Is that you Mariah? I wondered what happened to you.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from anotherman. Show anotherman's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    Care to share how "massive" that tax cut for the wealthy was? You do realize Bush cut taxes for everyone and NOT just the wealthy right?
    The wealth DOES trickle down.....as in the paychecks we get for working for the companies that these people at the top own. See how that works?
    Increase their taxes and they have less money to pay for salaries. Less money to pay for salaries means layoffs. Layoffs means people lose their jobs. People losing their jobs means less money. Less money means inability to pay bill and buy things. Let consumers spending means less money being made by merchants. Less money being made by merchants means less money to pay salaries. Less money for salaries means more layoffs. And the cycle continues.[/Quote]
    ecafsc:

    It's not as simple as you lay it out to be, that giving tax breaks to wealthy individuals and corporations will guarantee the creation of jobs. There is whole list of factors that you leave out of the picture, including:

    1) Health insurance that corporations bear the brunt of, with the remainder being paid by employees, in a typical set-up; the rising costs of health insurance (which are well documented) is becoming a burden on the economy that hurts our global competitiveness in trying to retain and grow business.

    2) The phenomenon of outsourcing and offshoring of jobs: it's been widely reported that technology companies have abused the H1B visa program to hire immigrants over American citizens, to save on having to pay out benefits to the latter, particularly in the Information Technology sector.

    3) The decline of affordability of higher education: a college education is imperative in this globalized and competitive economy, in order for young people to gain access to lucrative careers and well-paying jobs; if companies cannot find well trained and educated American workers for those jobs, they will look elsewhere (meaning outside of the US and/or bring in foreigners).

    All these factors mentioned above play a pivotal role in the direction our economy is headed, and that also includes your aforementioned tax breaks. How the government and Congress respond to these challenges and address these issues are critical to the future of this country.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from ecafsc. Show ecafsc's posts

    Why is being rich in America a crime to the left?

    [Quote]

    Your wages have not gone up every year. I can prove that.
    First normalize your supposed increase by removing nominal effects. Then remove the effects of career advancement. What you'll find is that adjusted for the effects of career advancement and inflation your actual WAGE has gone down. Unless you are a CEO or baseball player, something like that. Maybe pop diva? Is that you Mariah? I wondered what happened to you.[/Quote]

    Anything else you need to remove to try and spin your stance??? LOL
    Career advancement is all part of it. If you're someone who wants to stay in the same job for 30 years then don't whine about not getting wage increases.
     
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