Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    In August of 2003, after days of “interrogation”, a prisoner was seized from his cell and taken out on a boat in the Caribbean:

    My first thought was, they mistook me for somebody else. My second thought was to try to look around, but one of the guards was squeezing my face against the floor. I saw the dog fighting to get loose. I saw [-------] standing up, looking helpless at the guards working on me. “Blindfold the motherf---r! He’s trying to look—” One of them hit me hard across the face and quickly put goggles on my eyes, earmuffs on my ears, and a small bag over my head. They tightened the chains around my ankles and my wrists; afterward I started to bleed. All I could hear was [-------] cursing, “F-ing this and F-ing that.” I thought they were going to execute me.

    The other guard dragged me out with my toes tracing the way, and threw me in a truck, which immediately took off. The beating party would last for the next three to four hours, before they turned me over to another team that would use different torture techniques. “Stop praying, mother---er. You’re killing people,” [-------] said, and punched me hard on my mouth. My mouth and nose started to bleed, and my lips grew so big that I technically could not speak anymore. The colleague of [-------] turned out to be one of my guards; [-------] and [-------] each took one of my sides and started to punch me and smash me against the metal of the truck. One of the guys hit me so that my breath stopped and I was choking. I felt like I was breathing through my ribs. …

    Inside the boat, [-------] made me drink salt water, I believe it was direct from the ocean. It was so nasty I threw it up. They put an object in my mouth and shouted, “Swallow, mother----er!” I decided inside not to swallow the organ-damaging salt water, which choked me as they kept pouring the water in my mouth. “Swallow, you idiot!” I contemplated quickly, and decided for the nasty, damaging water rather than death.

    [-------] and [-------] had been escorting me for about three hours in the high-speed boat. The goal of such trip was, first, to torture the detainee and claim that the “detainee hurt himself during transport,” and second to make the detainee believe he is being transferred to some far faraway secret prison. We detainees knew all about this; we had detainees who reported flying four hours and finding themselves in the same jail where they started.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

     

    Careful. The conservatives might get a little too excited - the wrong kind of excited. They might dirty their pants with joy.

     

     

    But yes, Gitmo must be closed. Obama doesn't have the stones to do it, I don't think. Didn't even go through with proper trials.

     



    Whether he has the stones or not, he must do it, and soon.  I could understand other matters taking priority - financial crisis, ending the Iraq War, etc. - but in his second term, he has no excuse.

     

    This place is an ungodly stain upon the nation's integrity and our whole notion of the rule of law.  That it was also one of the most effective jihadist recruitment tools in the past 10 years bears repeating.

    Now, it's just a f___ing embarrassment.  And since I voted for him, I'll share in the shame until it's closed.  And if he doesn't do it, but his hypothetical gop successor does, then I'll salute he/she instead.

    Such an ugly, cowardly, cruel place....

     

     
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  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    So, the progressives believe every word that passes the lips off any terrorist.  Glad to see something's never change.

    "guilty as hel, free as a brid" bill Ayres, long time Obama friend.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    The Muslim jihadists lie, and American progressives slurp it up.

    Weekly Standard:"the New York Times published two op-eds by former Guantanamo detainees on Sunday. One is by Lakhdar Boumediene and the other is by Murat Kurnaz. Both men claim they were innocents, wrongly detained then abused and tortured by American personnel. A closer look at what is known about the two provides ample reasons to doubt their stories. "

    To begin with, note that Boumediene has previously claimed he was tortured during both the Bush and Obama administrations. Boumediene was transferred from Guantanamo in May 2009, several months after the Obama administration took over. And Boumediene claimed that his torture continued right up until the moment he was freed. Here is how Boumediene described his time at Guantanamo under the Obama administration during an interview with Dan Rather:

    They lie, lie, lie. These [sic] lie. Nothing changed in Guantanamo. Nothing. The same rules…They torture me in the Obama time more than Bush. More than him.

    Does the New York Times believe that the Obama administration either authorized this alleged torture, or looked the other way while it was occurring? Recall that upon inspecting Guantanamo in February 2009, Attorney General Eric Holder called Guantanamo a “well-run” and “professional” detention facility.

    Thus, either Boumediene is lying about his experience at Guantanamo, or the Obama administration is callously pro-torture.

    Both Boumediene and Kurnaz claim they were subjected to harsh, coercive treatment at Guantanamo, yet they never admitted to the supposedly fictitious allegations levied against them. This contradicts one of the anti-Guantanamo crowd’s main talking points. It is often argued that harsh interrogations at Guantanamo and in the CIA’s interrogation facilities produced worthless intelligence because detainees will say anything to make torture stop. Thus, the argument goes, detainees will tell interrogators what they want to hear. The critics maintain that harsh interrogations only succeeded in eliciting false confessions from innocent men, or false intelligence from otherwise guilty men. (In fact, whether you approve of them or not, the purpose of coercive interrogations was to garner actionable intelligence that could be used to prosecute a war, not false confessions that could be used to prosecute detainees.) But here, if we are to believe Boumediene and Kurnaz, they were tortured, yet they did not tell their interrogators what they wanted to hear.

    In reality, there is no independent reason to believe that either Boumediene or Kurnaz were subjected to harsh interrogation techniques. The servicemen at Guantanamo are fond of saying that only two parties know the absolute truth about what occurs there: U.S. military personnel and the detainees. This creates an information vacuum, which the detainees and their advocates gladly fill with all sorts of stories.

    In the early days of Guantanamo, some interrogations did in fact rely upon harsh measures. This has been independently documented by a variety of sources. But those interrogations were specially authorized by senior Defense Department officials and were not the norm. There is no evidence that either Boumediene or Kurnaz was subjected to a specially approved interrogation plan.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    These poor, abused prisoners have 20-hour access to a new $750,000 soccer field and state-of-the art fitness equipment, as well as their own Muslim chef cooking Islamic meals for them after they work up an appetite at Club Gitmo. The detainees now have three recreational facilities — an indoor rec yard, an outdoor rec yard and a new soccer field. Special passageways let them pass into the rec yards without being escorted by the military. And yes, you the taxpayer are paying for all this. The terrorists also are issued prayer beads and rugs and called to prayer five times a day in Arabic. No one is allowed to interrupt them while they bow to Mecca. We even point them in the right direction with helpful black arrows affixed to their cell floors. They get their choice of Islamic books and videos stocked by a Muslim librarian. They even have their own clerics to preach to them in Arabic. Everyone gets a Quran, along with little hammocks to keep them from touching the ground when not in use. Detainees even convinced prison officials to no longer raise the American flag anywhere they could see it...

     
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  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    I'm glad to know CLC would be perfectly happy if his children were imprisoned forever on no charges - so long as they have access to a soccer field and rec yard.

    Are not prisoners of war imprisoned forever on no charges until the war is over?
    Even the Obama Adminstration realizes most of the prisoners at Gitmo would attempt to kill Americans as soon as they were released....
    So is indefinite imprisonment "torture" ? Is any imprisonment of an Al Qaeda member who worked with but didnt directly participate in terrorist acts , "torture"? 

    Is a 'suspect' and his extended family being smashed into tiny bits by an Obama drone "torture"?
    What is torture?

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    In response to skeeter20's comment:

    So, the progressives believe every word that passes the lips off any terrorist.



    How do you know everyone in Gitmo is a terrorist?

     

     

     

    The righties are sickening. Government is too corrupt and incompent to be trusted with anything, according to them. Except terrorism, apparently. Except when they fail to catch or predict terrorists, apparently.

     

     

    Make up your minds. Well, find them first. Then make them up.



    Well, some aren't, but those who are not terrorists go by another name:  guards.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

     

    These poor, abused prisoners have 20-hour access to a new $750,000 soccer field and state-of-the art fitness equipment, as well as their own Muslim chef cooking Islamic meals for them after they work up an appetite at Club Gitmo. The detainees now have three recreational facilities — an indoor rec yard, an outdoor rec yard and a new soccer field. Special passageways let them pass into the rec yards without being escorted by the military. And yes, you the taxpayer are paying for all this. The terrorists also are issued prayer beads and rugs and called to prayer five times a day in Arabic. No one is allowed to interrupt them while they bow to Mecca. We even point them in the right direction with helpful black arrows affixed to their cell floors. They get their choice of Islamic books and videos stocked by a Muslim librarian. They even have their own clerics to preach to them in Arabic. Everyone gets a Quran, along with little hammocks to keep them from touching the ground when not in use. Detainees even convinced prison officials to no longer raise the American flag anywhere they could see it...

     



    So, is this accused terroist in the OP telling the truth?

     

    Progressives can sling the baloney all they want, but it gets back to this:  Gitmo works.  Heck, even Obama and Holder beleive that.

     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sistersledge. Show Sistersledge's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    When I visited Gitmo it stunk for Marines and now it must really stink for the prisoners ...... I am now a peaceful person but if a person or a group of people are willing to murder and maim our country's innocent citizens I think the USA has every right in the world to protect its citizens by every means possible. I'm a firm believer in the quote " The greatest good for the greatest number " the policy of keeping  Gitmo open is just another WEAPON in our country's arsenal for keeping innocent human beings safe .

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

     

    These poor, abused prisoners have 20-hour access to a new $750,000 soccer field and state-of-the art fitness equipment, as well as their own Muslim chef cooking Islamic meals for them after they work up an appetite at Club Gitmo. The detainees now have three recreational facilities — an indoor rec yard, an outdoor rec yard and a new soccer field. Special passageways let them pass into the rec yards without being escorted by the military. And yes, you the taxpayer are paying for all this. The terrorists also are issued prayer beads and rugs and called to prayer five times a day in Arabic. No one is allowed to interrupt them while they bow to Mecca. We even point them in the right direction with helpful black arrows affixed to their cell floors. They get their choice of Islamic books and videos stocked by a Muslim librarian. They even have their own clerics to preach to them in Arabic. Everyone gets a Quran, along with little hammocks to keep them from touching the ground when not in use. Detainees even convinced prison officials to no longer raise the American flag anywhere they could see it...

     




    What difference does that make when they are being held against their will...and not even charged with a crime...some for years? You can't possibly be okay with that. That is not who we are as Americans.


    Never mind that approximately 86 of them have been approved for release yet are still sitting there because Yemen either doesn't want to take them back..or the Pentagon has not approved a plan to extradite them back to their country. So..meanwhile..these people sit in limbo and our tax dollars are paying for it?

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from miscricket. Show miscricket's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    I'm glad to know CLC would be perfectly happy if his children were imprisoned forever on no charges - so long as they have access to a soccer field and rec yard.




    And...at a cost of 800 million per year ( at least).

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    "Never mind that approximately 86 of them have been approved for release yet are still sitting there because Yemen either doesn't want to take them back.."

    What does that tell you that their native countries do not want them back?

    They are terrorist soldiers,  if released they will continue to try to kill Americans, the same jihad terror committed by the scum who bombed the Boston marathon.

    Soldiers are prisoners of war, who are released when the war is over. If they repent and promise on their word of parole to renounce Al Qaeada and jihad, let them go. None will do so...so they stay. Their choice.

     
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  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from macnh1. Show macnh1's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    Obama already closed Gitmo.....he promised he would so it must be true.

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from skeeter20. Show skeeter20's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    Big gov't is inept... except when you agree with it... then it is infallible.

     

    Yep, no cognitive dissonance there....




    I don't know anyone on the right who thinks government is infallible on any subject.  I think you are confusing that those on the right want t ohold government accountable for what they truly are responsible for.

     

    The left, on the other hand, see the government as the only dispenser of truth, justice and the 'merican way.  Which will last right up until a republican is back in office.

     
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  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    In response to A_Concerned_Citizen's comment:

    Big gov't is inept... except when you agree with it... then it is infallible.

     Yep, no cognitive dissonance there....



    Our government is inept! Proof is that the Marathon bombers were allowed in the country as supposed political refugees, immediately got 100K in welfare, and despite intelligence from the Russians, were able to plan and commit terror. Releasing the Gitmo prisoners would be inept and dangerous to Americans. The primary role of government is to protect us from our enemies.                                                                                                

     
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  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from StalkingButler. Show StalkingButler's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    So, if I understand this correctly, torture is illegal under US law. I suppose the Obama administration will be putting these torturers on trial?

     

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In August of 2003, after days of “interrogation”, a prisoner was seized from his cell and taken out on a boat in the Caribbean:

    My first thought was, they mistook me for somebody else. My second thought was to try to look around, but one of the guards was squeezing my face against the floor. I saw the dog fighting to get loose. I saw [-------] standing up, looking helpless at the guards working on me. “Blindfold the motherf---r! He’s trying to look—” One of them hit me hard across the face and quickly put goggles on my eyes, earmuffs on my ears, and a small bag over my head. They tightened the chains around my ankles and my wrists; afterward I started to bleed. All I could hear was [-------] cursing, “F-ing this and F-ing that.” I thought they were going to execute me.

    The other guard dragged me out with my toes tracing the way, and threw me in a truck, which immediately took off. The beating party would last for the next three to four hours, before they turned me over to another team that would use different torture techniques. “Stop praying, mother---er. You’re killing people,” [-------] said, and punched me hard on my mouth. My mouth and nose started to bleed, and my lips grew so big that I technically could not speak anymore. The colleague of [-------] turned out to be one of my guards; [-------] and [-------] each took one of my sides and started to punch me and smash me against the metal of the truck. One of the guys hit me so that my breath stopped and I was choking. I felt like I was breathing through my ribs. …

    Inside the boat, [-------] made me drink salt water, I believe it was direct from the ocean. It was so nasty I threw it up. They put an object in my mouth and shouted, “Swallow, mother----er!” I decided inside not to swallow the organ-damaging salt water, which choked me as they kept pouring the water in my mouth. “Swallow, you idiot!” I contemplated quickly, and decided for the nasty, damaging water rather than death.

    [-------] and [-------] had been escorting me for about three hours in the high-speed boat. The goal of such trip was, first, to torture the detainee and claim that the “detainee hurt himself during transport,” and second to make the detainee believe he is being transferred to some far faraway secret prison. We detainees knew all about this; we had detainees who reported flying four hours and finding themselves in the same jail where they started.



    If it's printed or opn the internet it must be true! right?

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from tvoter. Show tvoter's posts

    Re: Yes, We Tortured; Gitmo Must Be Closed, Mr. President.

    In response to WhatDoYouWantNow's comment:

    I'm glad to know CLC would be perfectly happy if his children were imprisoned forever on no charges - so long as they have access to a soccer field and rec yard.


    If they were enemies of the USA and a threat to innocent women and children...YES!

     
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