Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    So, here's another study (from Princeton) on the heels of others from Stanford and Cornell showing that excessive methane leakage from fracking wells basically negates the climate benefit of developing natural gas as a 'bridge fuel', i.e. alternative to burning coal for power.


    http://dataspace.princeton.edu/jspui/bitstream/88435/dsp019s1616326/1/Kang_princeton_0181D_10969.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://dataspace.princeton.edu/jspui/bitstream/88435/dsp019s1616326/1/Kang_princeton_0181D_10969.pdf


    Of the 19 fracking (AOG) wells researched in PA, all were found to emit significant methane emissions, with 3 classed as 'super-emitters', even among supposedly 'plugged' wells.  There are up to 900,000 fracking wells in PA alone.


    Methane traps up to 86 times more greenhouse gasses than CO2 over a 20-year period.  The Stanford study concluded, "A review of more than 200 earlier studies confirms that U.S. emissions of methane are considerably higher than official estimates." 


    Personally, I believe natural gas CAN be a viable source of energy, but ONLY if the drillers are able to recapture leaking methane and stop causing more harm to the atmosphere than it actually helps.  This is not even about groundwater contamination but the overall cumulative effects of the health hazards created by gas development.  Energy efficiency is a worthy goal, but in many, many cases, fracking has so far proven very inefficient...especially when estimated over the long-term.


    Meanwhile, employees of the PA Dept. Of Health were ordered NOT to talk to residents sickened from fracking activity near their homes.  The drillers are actively preventing doctors from telling patients what fracking chemicals are making them sick, preventing more legislative studies on the negative health effects of fracking and suing people who try to talk about their fracking-related illnesses after settling for damages with the gas companies.  (A jury in Texas awarded $2.9 million to a family who were sickened.  This is punctuated by a TX state inspector who also got sick when he went to collect air samples from the fracking site - the AG's office sued, and the company settled for $108K.)


    There is simply no excuse for oil and gas drillers not to look for and extract fossil fuels as safely and ecologically sound as possible.  If they can't do it right, they shouldn't do it at all.  Unfortunately, they ruin it for the many developers who truly care about the effect they have on the local environment and install safeguards to protect against methane leakage.


     



    "When you're born, you get a ticket to the freak show. When you're born in America, you get a front-row seat."  - GC

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    Fracking inefficient? What planet are you from?

    Let’s look first at some of the benefits of shale gas production. Natural gas is outcompeting coal as a cheap fuel for producing electricity and the result is that U.S. carbon dioxide emissions are down sharply to a level last seen around 1992. In addition, a study comparing the costs and benefits of coal with those of conventional and shale gas in the February 2013 issue of Energy Policy finds that burning natural gas produces far less in the way of air pollutants like sulfur dioxide, nitrogen oxides, soot, and mercury. The authors conclude that a shift from coal to gas would “reduce the overall likelihood of health problems affecting the nervous system, inner organs, and the brain.”

    Shale gas production in 2010 supported 600,000 jobs and that is projected to grow to 870,000 by 2015 and contribute nearly $120 billion to the overall economy. In addition, shale gas production is revitalizing a number of U.S. manufacturing sectors including the steel, chemical, and fertilizer industries. Thanks to cheap shale gas, Canada’s TD Bank estimates that American residential consumers will save around $75 billion in home heating and electricity costs in 2013, the equivalent to about $650 per household.

    The green energy advocates are fighting a losing battle...they have been proven wrong again and again....no more 'fracking' of taxpayers money, with excessive leakage of money into the pockets of public sector cronies...

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:


    Fracking inefficient? What planet are you from?


    Let’s look first at some of the benefits of shale gas production. Natural gas is outcompeting coal as a cheap fuel for producing electricity and the result is that U.S. carbon dioxide emissions are down sharply to a level last seen around 1992. In addition, a study comparing the costs and benefits of coal with those of conventional and shale gas in the February 2013 issue of Energy Policy finds that burning natural gas produces far less in the way of air pollutants like sulfur dioxide, nitrogen oxides, soot, and mercury. The authors conclude that a shift from coal to gas would “reduce the overall likelihood of health problems affecting the nervous system, inner organs, and the brain.”


    Shale gas production in 2010 supported 600,000 jobs and that is projected to grow to 870,000 by 2015 and contribute nearly $120 billion to the overall economy. In addition, shale gas production is revitalizing a number of U.S. manufacturing sectors including the steel, chemical, and fertilizer industries. Thanks to cheap shale gas, Canada’s TD Bank estimates that American residential consumers will save around $75 billion in home heating and electricity costs in 2013, the equivalent to about $650 per household.


    The green energy advocates are fighting a losing battle...they have been proven wrong again and again....no more 'fracking' of taxpayers money, with excessive leakage of money into the pockets of public sector cronies...





    Because for you, it's all about money and never about public safety, public health, or environmental (much less corporate) responsibility.


    "Efficiency" in this case refers to the energy wasted to produce energy.


    You can't argue the issue when you keep changing the subject.


    You can't even admit to the problem - that methane gas is also a damaging pollutant.


    If this kind of waste were government-related, you would be apoplectic; but this is corporate waste, so you're fine with it and to he!! with the consequences.


     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    While clueless zealots focus on supposed "net climate benefit" to the planet,  in the real world, the fracking revolution could defang Russia....

    Forbes:

    NATO Secretary General Anders Fogh Rasmussen recently announced that the Russian intelligence service was covertly funding European environmental NGOs to support their campaign against fracking. The former Danish Prime Minister stated that he had “met allies who can report that Russia, as part of their sophisticated information and disinformation operations, engaged actively with so-called non-governmental organizations – environmental organizations working against shale gas – to maintain European dependence on imported Russian gas.”

    The accusations do not seem too far-fetched. Russia is very keen on dissuading Europe from exploiting its shale reserves. Disregardful of their own massive fracking projects in Siberia, Vladimir Putin uses environmental arguments to push an EU-wide fracking ban. In a similar fashion, he tries to discourage the US from exporting of Liquefied Natural Gas (LNG) to Europe. This is an option some European politicians such as Britain’s Foreign Secretary William Hague suggested as a way to reduce European energy dependency from Russia. It is currently on the table in the negotiations on the trade agreement between the European Union and the United States (TTIP). Instead of building the infrastructure for transatlantic LNG exports, Putin actually advises the US to concentrate on the Asian market, which according to him would be more profitable for American companies.

    Moscow’s goal clearly is to keep the EU dependent on Russia. And indeed, large parts of Europe heavily rely on Russian gas imports: Finland, Lithuania and Bulgaria get all their gas, while and it is the source for about 40 percent of Germany’s supply. That is why EU leaders remain reluctant to impose sanctions on the country, despite the near-universal condemnation of Russian actions in Ukraine. Poland’s Prime Minister Tusk recently warned Chancellor Merkel that “German dependence on Russian gas could effectively limit European sovereignty.”

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ronreganfan. Show ronreganfan's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    So, here's another study (from Princeton) on the heels of others from Stanford and Cornell showing that excessive methane leakage from fracking wells basically negates the climate benefit of developing natural gas as a 'bridge fuel', i.e. alternative to burning coal for power.

     

    http://dataspace.princeton.edu/jspui/bitstream/88435/dsp019s1616326/1/Kang_princeton_0181D_10969.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://dataspace.princeton.edu/jspui/bitstream/88435/dsp019s1616326/1/Kang_princeton_0181D_10969.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://dataspace.princeton.edu/jspui/bitstream/88435/dsp019s1616326/1/Kang_princeton_0181D_10969.pdf

     

    Of the 19 fracking (AOG) wells researched in PA, all were found to emit significant methane emissions, with 3 classed as 'super-emitters', even among supposedly 'plugged' wells.  There are up to 900,000 fracking wells in PA alone.

     

    Methane traps up to 86 times more greenhouse gasses than CO2 over a 20-year period.  The Stanford study concluded, "A review of more than 200 earlier studies confirms that U.S. emissions of methane are considerably higher than official estimates." 

     

    Personally, I believe natural gas CAN be a viable source of energy, but ONLY if the drillers are able to recapture leaking methane and stop causing more harm to the atmosphere than it actually helps.  This is not even about groundwater contamination but the overall cumulative effects of the health hazards created by gas development.  Energy efficiency is a worthy goal, but in many, many cases, fracking has so far proven very inefficient...especially when estimated over the long-term.

     

    Meanwhile, employees of the PA Dept. Of Health were ordered NOT to talk to residents sickened from fracking activity near their homes.  The drillers are actively preventing doctors from telling patients what fracking chemicals are making them sick, preventing more legislative studies on the negative health effects of fracking and suing people who try to talk about their fracking-related illnesses after settling for damages with the gas companies.  (A jury in Texas awarded $2.9 million to a family who were sickened.  This is punctuated by a TX state inspector who also got sick when he went to collect air samples from the fracking site - the AG's office sued, and the company settled for $108K.)

     

    There is simply no excuse for oil and gas drillers not to look for and extract fossil fuels as safely and ecologically sound as possible.  If they can't do it right, they shouldn't do it at all.  Unfortunately, they ruin it for the many developers who truly care about the effect they have on the local environment and install safeguards to protect against methane leakage.

     

     



    "When you're born, you get a ticket to the freak show. When you're born in America, you get a front-row seat."  - GC



    Not net climate benefit?

    is that the reason we frack? To generate a net climate benefit?

    i thought it was so we didn't need to send troops  to the Mid East. 

    Hey, how many btu's went I to the creating of this dubious report?

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    More subject-changing from the usual tools who can't seem to address a simple issue:

    If fracking leaks enough methane from its wells to negate or even exceed the tentative environmental benefit of using natural gas in the first place...

    ...then fracking is really just all about a select few getting rich on the nation's latest fossil fuel addiction.

    And consumers might save a few bucks now but end up paying more in the long run in environmental costs and using more gas to keep cool as the planet warms.

    Because we all know just how quickly energy companies raise rates when supply flags and how slowly they lower rates when supply is booming....

     

     

     
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  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to WhatNowDoYouWant's comment:

    Only focusing on money? Of course. Look who we're dealing with.

     

    From upon that high seat known as arm chair, they see farther than 98% of climate scientists in the field. You see, long ago, the Church was wrong when it said the Earth was flat. Therefore, they are free to equate the political opinion that 98% of scientists in the field are wrong with a fact that disproves global warming. Also, China isn't doing anything about the problem, even though in reality China along with the rest of the developed world (including OIL COMPANIES) recognize the reality of what's happening and are taking what measures they can.

    Also, jobs. We need jobs. Jobs, no matter the cost. You see, how else are we going to pay for our children's cancer treatments that are necessitated by all the other junk we're pumping out into the environment?

    Finally, we're manly. How else are we going to prove it but by driving the biggest most fuel-inefficient SUVs we can get our hands on? We need cheap oil so as not to be like that wussy progressive in that hybrid car. Compensating, you see......

     



    In other words, they're just spewing a lot of methane.

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ronreganfan. Show ronreganfan's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:


    More subject-changing from the usual tools who can't seem to address a simple issue:


    If fracking leaks enough methane from its wells to negate or even exceed the tentative environmental benefit of using natural gas in the first place...


    ...then fracking is really just all about a select few getting rich on the nation's latest fossil fuel addiction.


    And consumers might save a few bucks now but end up paying more in the long run in environmental costs and using more gas to keep cool as the planet warms.


    Because we all know just how quickly energy companies raise rates when supply flags and how slowly they lower rates when supply is booming....


     


     




    You are setting up a false premise.


    the reason to frack is not to get at more eco-friendly fuel, but to get at fuel,period.


     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from ronreganfan. Show ronreganfan's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to high-road's comment:

    It's hilarious to watch wingnuts go all beserky if anyone even proposes making fracking more efficient ... it's as if they like the fact that private corporations are fouling our environment.



    I didn't know we were complaining about making fracking more efficient.

    but, you and your ilk are complaining about fracking, period.

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ronreganfan. Show ronreganfan's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to WhatNowDoYouWant's comment:

    Only focusing on money? Of course. Look who we're dealing with.

     

    From upon that high seat known as arm chair, they see farther than 98% of climate scientists in the field. You see, long ago, the Church was wrong when it said the Earth was flat. Therefore, they are free to equate the political opinion that 98% of scientists in the field are wrong with a fact that disproves global warming. Also, China isn't doing anything about the problem, even though in reality China along with the rest of the developed world (including OIL COMPANIES) recognize the reality of what's happening and are taking what measures they can.

    Also, jobs. We need jobs. Jobs, no matter the cost. You see, how else are we going to pay for our children's cancer treatments that are necessitated by all the other junk we're pumping out into the environment?

    Finally, we're manly. How else are we going to prove it but by driving the biggest most fuel-inefficient SUVs we can get our hands on? We need cheap oil so as not to be like that wussy progressive in that hybrid car. Compensating, you see......

     



    In other words, they're just spewing a lot of methane.

     



    Wow. So all of history is wrong and therefore backs up you current point?

    that's some theory you got there.

     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hansoribrother. Show Hansoribrother's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    Of course the study focuses on greenhouse gases and global warming climate change.


    Climate change is not the only reason to find more natural gas through fracking. There are others that are more important.



    • Reduce the use of coal. Coal is dirtier than natural gas and emissions from coal burning plants have far more carcinogens, heavy metals and other stuff that is bad for people.

    • Stay warm in winter. Global warming has not advanced far enough so that millions of people have to heat their environment to stay alive during cold months. If we are going to reduce coal burning, we need a plentiful alternative.

    • Economic benefits. Jobs associated with fracking pay well and contribute to a growing economy. Keeping the cost of electricity down also provides economic benefits.


    Methane emissions are not really good to have even if it had nothing to do with global warming climate change. It contributes to smog. If there is a way the emissions can be reduced they should. There is no reason not to frack just because methane emissions from it reach some level that negates what this author calls a "climate benefit".


    There are more "climate benefits" that any some might imagine are associated with global warming climate change.


    YET ANOTHER SCARE MONGERING FUND RAISING STUDY BY CLIMATE KOOKS

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to WhatNowDoYouWant's comment:

    Only focusing on money? Of course. Look who we're dealing with.

     

    From upon that high seat known as arm chair, they see farther than 98% of climate scientists in the field. You see, long ago, the Church was wrong when it said the Earth was flat. Therefore, they are free to equate the political opinion that 98% of scientists in the field are wrong with a fact that disproves global warming. Also, China isn't doing anything about the problem, even though in reality China along with the rest of the developed world (including OIL COMPANIES) recognize the reality of what's happening and are taking what measures they can.

    Also, jobs. We need jobs. Jobs, no matter the cost. You see, how else are we going to pay for our children's cancer treatments that are necessitated by all the other junk we're pumping out into the environment?

    Finally, we're manly. How else are we going to prove it but by driving the biggest most fuel-inefficient SUVs we can get our hands on? We need cheap oil so as not to be like that wussy progressive in that hybrid car. Compensating, you see......

     



    In other words, they're just spewing a lot of methane.

     



    The ol' bait and switch tactic....
    So 98% of climate scientists , who you delude yourself into thinking all swallow the climate change scare scenarios.....

    ......are also suddenly experts in economics , technology and politics,  and all want to shut down the economic boom of fracking immediately, and switch to solar panels and windmills even though this will bankrupt the US and cause massive economic disruption? And 98% all think supposed methane leakage from fracking will result in cancer in kids?

    You are losing it....

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from ComingLiberalCrackup. Show ComingLiberalCrackup's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to ronreganfan's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

     

    ...then fracking is really just all about a select few getting rich on the nation's latest fossil fuel addiction.

     

    And consumers might save a few bucks now but end up paying more in the long run in environmental costs and using more gas to keep cool as the planet warms.

     Because we all know just how quickly energy companies raise rates when supply flags and how slowly they lower rates when supply is booming....

     

    A "select few getting rich"? Same old leftist tripe. The fracking revolution is a miracle of the private sector, that is why you despise it so much
    Thanks for coming out of the closet and displaying your State-worshipping bent....your disdain for the private sector, the market economy and the free enterprise system...

    It is all about top down dictates for you....the EPA and the Government will run the energy industry, with the same ruthless inefficiency with which  they are now running  the health care system..

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to Hansoribrother's comment:

    Methane emissions are not really good to have even if it had nothing to do with global warming climate change. It contributes to smog. If there is a way the emissions can be reduced they should. There is no reason not to frack just because methane emissions from it reach some level that negates what this author calls a "climate benefit".

    Which is also the basic finding of the study...that methane - a far more dangerous pollutant - is escaping these wells at a rate more excessive than anyone realized.

    And I agree with you.  Methane leaks are not a good enough reason to stop fracking.  (The study takes no position on this, btw.)

    However, the leakage means that drillers are taking shortcuts just to get the fuel, and that should be unacceptable.  Not only are they wasting gas they could be harnessing to operate the wells, but they're contributing more pollutants than the fuels that gas aims to replace.

    As I said at the beginning and for years now, drilling is fine with me as long they do it safely and responsibly.  And they aren't willing to police themselves and be accountable for their actions, then someone needs to do it for them.



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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from ronreganfan. Show ronreganfan's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to WhatNowDoYouWant's comment:

    In response to ronreganfan's comment:

    You are setting up a false premise. the reason to frack is not to get at more eco-friendly fuel, but to get at fuel,period. I didn't know we were complaining about making fracking more efficient.but, you and your ilk are complaining about fracking, period. Wow. So all of history is wrong and therefore backs up you current point? that's some theory you got there.


     

     

    Now, a documentary is called 2MASS J05233822-1403022, but shifts could only come from the animal being inside another living thing. The new coaster isn’t projected to open until 2016, what we mean by “star.” To be the world’s tallest and fastest you need to squeeze hydrogen pretty hard. Thunder stolen by another ride is very sensitive to its mass.

     

    Jack White, whose second solo album, Lazaretto, is out this week ,is a bit off, too. Things are always difficult at the boundaries. "When I was first told about the data that came back from the tag that was on the shark," filmmaker Dave Riggs says in the upcoming documentary," she wasn't going to be doing any sprinting through the terminal in those heels." It was obviously eaten. It’s also the least massive, and coolest. Now mind you, it’s not like this limit is hard and fast

     

    In the spring of that year, Adams covered several White Stripes songs in concert but changed the lyrics to suit exhaustive research. Their shark was likely a meal for Gojira, the lumbering prehistoric beast who hit Japanese movie screens in 1954. As I mentioned above, the rate at which fusion occurs are hard to find, harder to study, and still confound our best scientists.

     

     

     

    Or in other words, you aren't making sense. Lay off these:

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     



    WhatNonsense is slipping gears again. How, sad.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from ronreganfan. Show ronreganfan's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to ronreganfan's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

     

    ...then fracking is really just all about a select few getting rich on the nation's latest fossil fuel addiction.

     

    And consumers might save a few bucks now but end up paying more in the long run in environmental costs and using more gas to keep cool as the planet warms.

     Because we all know just how quickly energy companies raise rates when supply flags and how slowly they lower rates when supply is booming....

     

    A "select few getting rich"? Same old leftist tripe. The fracking revolution is a miracle of the private sector, that is why you despise it so much
    Thanks for coming out of the closet and displaying your State-worshipping bent....your disdain for the private sector, the market economy and the free enterprise system...

    It is all about top down dictates for you....the EPA and the Government will run the energy industry, with the same ruthless inefficiency with which  they are now running  the health care system..




    More change the subject and attack the messenger, because you got nothing else.

    I don't 'hate' fracking.  I hate small-minded idiots who can't admit there might be better ways of doing it for the sake of everyone involved.

    Again, if the drillers can't drill responsibly and safely, then they should find another line of work.

     



    The reason we need to frack is to get more ngas. Progressives have been fighting this crazy battle against fossil fuels for decades without ever offering a solution.  It is like their plan is to just make energy so costly that the average working man has to sit in the dark and walk to work.

     

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to ronreganfan's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to ronreganfan's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

     

    ...then fracking is really just all about a select few getting rich on the nation's latest fossil fuel addiction.

     

    And consumers might save a few bucks now but end up paying more in the long run in environmental costs and using more gas to keep cool as the planet warms.

     Because we all know just how quickly energy companies raise rates when supply flags and how slowly they lower rates when supply is booming....

     

    A "select few getting rich"? Same old leftist tripe. The fracking revolution is a miracle of the private sector, that is why you despise it so much
    Thanks for coming out of the closet and displaying your State-worshipping bent....your disdain for the private sector, the market economy and the free enterprise system...

    It is all about top down dictates for you....the EPA and the Government will run the energy industry, with the same ruthless inefficiency with which  they are now running  the health care system..




    More change the subject and attack the messenger, because you got nothing else.

    I don't 'hate' fracking.  I hate small-minded idiots who can't admit there might be better ways of doing it for the sake of everyone involved.

    Again, if the drillers can't drill responsibly and safely, then they should find another line of work.

     



    The reason we need to frack is to get more ngas. Progressives have been fighting this crazy battle against fossil fuels for decades without ever offering a solution.  It is like their plan is to just make energy so costly that the average working man has to sit in the dark and walk to work.

     




    Wrong again.

    And I'll repeat because you aren't paying attention, as usual:

    Fracking is fine.  Irresponsible fracking is NOT.  

    Drilling is OK.  Drilling arbitrarily and leaking methane gas is NOT.

    Fossil fuels can be burned for power more efficiently and more safely; you and others just don't want to do it.

    All you care about is money.  Ok, then in the long run, renewables pay for themselves many times over and with none or very little of the carbon emissions talked about here.

     

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from ronreganfan. Show ronreganfan's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to ronreganfan's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to ronreganfan's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

     

    ...then fracking is really just all about a select few getting rich on the nation's latest fossil fuel addiction.

     

    And consumers might save a few bucks now but end up paying more in the long run in environmental costs and using more gas to keep cool as the planet warms.

     Because we all know just how quickly energy companies raise rates when supply flags and how slowly they lower rates when supply is booming....

     

    A "select few getting rich"? Same old leftist tripe. The fracking revolution is a miracle of the private sector, that is why you despise it so much
    Thanks for coming out of the closet and displaying your State-worshipping bent....your disdain for the private sector, the market economy and the free enterprise system...

    It is all about top down dictates for you....the EPA and the Government will run the energy industry, with the same ruthless inefficiency with which  they are now running  the health care system..




    More change the subject and attack the messenger, because you got nothing else.

    I don't 'hate' fracking.  I hate small-minded idiots who can't admit there might be better ways of doing it for the sake of everyone involved.

    Again, if the drillers can't drill responsibly and safely, then they should find another line of work.

     



    The reason we need to frack is to get more ngas. Progressives have been fighting this crazy battle against fossil fuels for decades without ever offering a solution.  It is like their plan is to just make energy so costly that the average working man has to sit in the dark and walk to work.

     




    Wrong again.

    And I'll repeat because you aren't paying attention, as usual:

    Fracking is fine.  Irresponsible fracking is NOT.  

    Drilling is OK.  Drilling arbitrarily and leaking methane gas is NOT.

    Fossil fuels can be burned for power more efficiently and more safely; you and others just don't want to do it.

    All you care about is money.  Ok, then in the long run, renewables pay for themselves many times over and with none or very little of the carbon emissions talked about here.

     

     



    Shifting the subject again?

    The title of the thread is centered on the statement that there is no net climate benefit to fracking.

    That means, the study was centered on a non-existent claim that the reason for fracking is to save the planet, or some other progressive nonsense that can only be achieved by forcing people into poverty and servitude to the elite class.

    I am all for renewables, when the actually work and are as cost effective as current energy sources.

    So, stop it with your nonsense.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from MattyScornD. Show MattyScornD's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to ronreganfan's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to ronreganfan's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

    In response to ronreganfan's comment:

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:

     

     

    ...then fracking is really just all about a select few getting rich on the nation's latest fossil fuel addiction.

     

    And consumers might save a few bucks now but end up paying more in the long run in environmental costs and using more gas to keep cool as the planet warms.

     Because we all know just how quickly energy companies raise rates when supply flags and how slowly they lower rates when supply is booming....

     

    A "select few getting rich"? Same old leftist tripe. The fracking revolution is a miracle of the private sector, that is why you despise it so much
    Thanks for coming out of the closet and displaying your State-worshipping bent....your disdain for the private sector, the market economy and the free enterprise system...

    It is all about top down dictates for you....the EPA and the Government will run the energy industry, with the same ruthless inefficiency with which  they are now running  the health care system..




    More change the subject and attack the messenger, because you got nothing else.

    I don't 'hate' fracking.  I hate small-minded idiots who can't admit there might be better ways of doing it for the sake of everyone involved.

    Again, if the drillers can't drill responsibly and safely, then they should find another line of work.

     



    The reason we need to frack is to get more ngas. Progressives have been fighting this crazy battle against fossil fuels for decades without ever offering a solution.  It is like their plan is to just make energy so costly that the average working man has to sit in the dark and walk to work.

     




    Wrong again.

    And I'll repeat because you aren't paying attention, as usual:

    Fracking is fine.  Irresponsible fracking is NOT.  

    Drilling is OK.  Drilling arbitrarily and leaking methane gas is NOT.

    Fossil fuels can be burned for power more efficiently and more safely; you and others just don't want to do it.

    All you care about is money.  Ok, then in the long run, renewables pay for themselves many times over and with none or very little of the carbon emissions talked about here.

     

     



    Shifting the subject again?

    The title of the thread is centered on the statement that there is no net climate benefit to fracking.

    That means, the study was centered on a non-existent claim that the reason for fracking is to save the planet, or some other progressive nonsense that can only be achieved by forcing people into poverty and servitude to the elite class.

    I am all for renewables, when the actually work and are as cost effective as current energy sources.

    So, stop it with your nonsense.




    What is nonsensical is that you don't realize gas companies have been pushing natural gas extraction via fracking as the solution or 'bridge' from dirty coal and oil power to more sustainable means.

    Even here, CLC has claimed loudly of the climate 'benefits' of fracking, as have other proponents of no-holds-barred exploration for natural gas.

    One need look no further than the industry orgs to hear them trumpeting natural gas as an environmental boon...the gas producers association, heartland institute, etc.

    They have their studies, and academia has theirs as per the OP.  That's the topic.  Try to keep up....

     

     
  24. This post has been removed.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from ronreganfan. Show ronreganfan's posts

    Re: Yet Another Study Showing 'No Net Climate Benefit' From Fracking Due To Methane Leakage

    In response to MattyScornD's comment:


    In response to ronreganfan's comment:


    In response to MattyScornD's comment:


    In response to ronreganfan's comment:


    In response to MattyScornD's comment:


    In response to ComingLiberalCrackup's comment:


    In response to MattyScornD's comment:


    In response to ronreganfan's comment:


    In response to MattyScornD's comment:



     


     


    ...then fracking is really just all about a select few getting rich on the nation's latest fossil fuel addiction.


     


    And consumers might save a few bucks now but end up paying more in the long run in environmental costs and using more gas to keep cool as the planet warms.


     Because we all know just how quickly energy companies raise rates when supply flags and how slowly they lower rates when supply is booming....


     



    A "select few getting rich"? Same old leftist tripe. The fracking revolution is a miracle of the private sector, that is why you despise it so much
    Thanks for coming out of the closet and displaying your State-worshipping bent....your disdain for the private sector, the market economy and the free enterprise system...


    It is all about top down dictates for you....the EPA and the Government will run the energy industry, with the same ruthless inefficiency with which  they are now running  the health care system..





    More change the subject and attack the messenger, because you got nothing else.


    I don't 'hate' fracking.  I hate small-minded idiots who can't admit there might be better ways of doing it for the sake of everyone involved.


    Again, if the drillers can't drill responsibly and safely, then they should find another line of work.


     




    The reason we need to frack is to get more ngas. Progressives have been fighting this crazy battle against fossil fuels for decades without ever offering a solution.  It is like their plan is to just make energy so costly that the average working man has to sit in the dark and walk to work.


     





    Wrong again.


    And I'll repeat because you aren't paying attention, as usual:


    Fracking is fine.  Irresponsible fracking is NOT.  


    Drilling is OK.  Drilling arbitrarily and leaking methane gas is NOT.


    Fossil fuels can be burned for power more efficiently and more safely; you and others just don't want to do it.


    All you care about is money.  Ok, then in the long run, renewables pay for themselves many times over and with none or very little of the carbon emissions talked about here.


     


     




    Shifting the subject again?


    The title of the thread is centered on the statement that there is no net climate benefit to fracking.


    That means, the study was centered on a non-existent claim that the reason for fracking is to save the planet, or some other progressive nonsense that can only be achieved by forcing people into poverty and servitude to the elite class.


    I am all for renewables, when the actually work and are as cost effective as current energy sources.


    So, stop it with your nonsense.





    What is nonsensical is that you don't realize gas companies have been pushing natural gas extraction via fracking as the solution or 'bridge' from dirty coal and oil power to more sustainable means.


    Even here, CLC has claimed loudly of the climate 'benefits' of fracking, as have other proponents of no-holds-barred exploration for natural gas.


    One need look no further than the industry orgs to hear them trumpeting natural gas as an environmental boon...the gas producers association, heartland institute, etc.


    They have their studies, and academia has theirs as per the OP.  That's the topic.  Try to keep up....


     




    Can't you separate "marketing " from reality?


    You talk about fracking as if there were tons of solutions, and the energy companies settled on fracking.  That is how the progressive mind works.  Everything is a committee of no-nothing's, wringing their hands about this problem or that problem.  That's not how business works.


    The way energy companies work, as opposed to how the progressive mind works, is the use technological advances to produce more energy.  The marketing spin comes after that.


    you want to know the real reason for fracking?


    "Here's the part that most people don't seem to realize: Without fracking, the entire North American oil and gas industry would come to a screaming, painful halt. This is the reality we all need to face, regardless of protesters who abhor the fracturing process."


    http://www.energyandcapital.com/archives" rel="nofollow">http://www.energyandcapital.com/archives

     
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