Sleep question... especially for early risers

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from IPWBride. Show IPWBride's posts

    Sleep question... especially for early risers

    We are early risers due to commuting.  So we are out of the house 6:15am the latest.  Because DS needs to be awake no later than 6am... I have been trying to stay firm to his 6:30pm bedtime so he can get 11 hrs.  Our schedule is M and F with MIL and T, W, and Th at daycare.  My MIL does two naps and daycare does only 1.  Sat and Sun is total transition time - can be 2 or 1 nap and I follow his lead (yawns and fussiness).  This nap schedule seems to work as daycare is loads of fun and he can make it to 12pm whereas he gets tired quicker at home.

    My question.  For the past 3 nights, I've put him in bed at 6:30pm, which he loves (loves his crib, lovey and paci).  It used to take about 10 mins and he would be out.  Now... he's still awake at 8pm.  He's not fussing, just hanging out.  Since he's quiet, I wouldn't think anything about it, but he's also been waking at 5am.  So we're talking much less sleep than I think he needs.  Daycare says he's been fine during the day, not tired and gets a good nap for 1-2 hours mid day.

    Is it possible a 15 mth old can really do with only 9 hours of sleep at night and a max of 2 hour nap?  
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    This might be an incredibly ignorant question, but don't humans sleep when they need to no matter what age they are?  If you put him to bed at 6:30 and he contentedly plays until 8:00 (pain, illness, anxiety ruled out as a cause for his wakefulness), he wakes up at 5:00, and gets naps and he isn't getting run down, sick, or acting in any way like something is wrong...  Wouldn't one be safe to assume he's getting enough sleep?  I think if anyone of any age isn't getting enough sleep for their proper development and functioning it would manifest in any number of fairly obvious ways.

    Talk to your pedi, though, of course, if you're really anxious about it.  Otherwise, watch his behavior, hunger, and everything else.  If it's all good, he's got to be doing well with the sleep he gets.  Right?  It seems to me that if he weren't getting enough he'd fall right to sleep when you put him to bed at night. 

    ETA:  And, just because he isn't falling right to sleep at 6:30 right now doesn't mean when he hits a growth spurt or something else changes he won't start snoozing 10 minutes after you put him down like he has before.  As long as he's happy in bed when you put him down and he has the option of falling asleep he will when he needs to.  His body won't let him stay awake and play when it really needs more sleep if he's in his comfy, cozy bed.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from medfordcc. Show medfordcc's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    IPW, I think the Ferber total amount of sleep (including naps) for a 15 month old is 11 3/4 hours.  And I think he says that most kids will be within plus or minus an hour.  So 11 hours would be on the low side but not off the charts.
    I agree with Kar that if he's happy, that sounds good!  You could always try keeping him up until 7 to get more play time in.  Might tire him (and you...) out more as well!

    ETA: (does this mean that I'm editing this??  I think so...)  Anyway, I just wanted to add that we also go back and forth between two naps and one.  Most of the time it's one and it's pretty much always one at daycare, but sometimes when I'm with her she is clearly tired in the AM so I put her down.  Isn't that funny??  I never thought they would go back and forth like that...
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from misslily. Show misslily's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    IPW - it does seem like less sleep than they recommend.  I'm not sure how to fix it - it must be a little confusing to him to have 2 naps some days and one on others.  My DH says I'm a slave to the schedule - same naps and meal times every day - but I think it makes things less confusing for our twins.
    I know others have different naps on different days - I'm sure they will have some great suggestions.
    In the meantime - at least he's just in there babbling and happy! :)
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from dz76. Show dz76's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    I am always fascinated and impressed when I hear moms of twins say their twins are on the same schedule.  We're a very laissez faire household with kids sleeping when they seem tired and eating when they are hungry and how ever much they want to at that moment. While the twins' naps overlap at some point they start and end at different times from each other. 

    IPW - if your DS attitude seems fine and he's just chillin' at night before falling asleep, I'd not worry too much about it.  He's doing what his body tells him.  Besides which, I'm not sure how you'd get him to go to sleep on his own before he's ready.

    I've got a new(to our family) sleep question for my fellow working moms.  DH has finally (after 18 months so yay but it's more work for me) gotten a new job.  He started suddenly on Tuesday and it is not his permanent schedule plus it was a crazy week of doctor's appointment for kids and caregivers so we just cobbled together kid care this week.  But starting Monday, I'll be dropping kids off at least 3-4 days a week.  In order to make sure I get home by 8 to make my train, I'll need to leave our house by 6 (free child care is 1.5 half roundtrip away).  Which means the kids (and me) will be getting up 1-2 hours earlier than we're used to.  The question is what's the best way to transition to the earlier bedtimes I think all the kids will need?  Currently the babies go to bed at 8 and DD1 goes to bed at 9 which is doable since everyone gets home (already fed) at 7.  The 3.5 year old doesn't nap (hasn't for more than a year) and the babies (15 months) are good for a nap total 2-4 hours a day.  Does anyone know how much sleep a 3.5 year old needs?  Thanks!!!
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Trouble30. Show Trouble30's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    I would agree with Kar.  I haven't read the sleep books and I'm happy as long as my kiddos sleep thru the night while I'm sleeping. 

    But if it's any consolation this sounds like the same total number of hours my DD has been doing since at least 15 months old.  She is a night owl so down at around 10pm and up at about 8am and has been on one 2-hour nap since she turned 1-year-old. 

    And she's the happiest little girl, so I have to think that's enough despite what any expert might say.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    If it's less than recommended but he's happy, healthy, growing, has his sunny disposition every day, etc. doesn't that imply he's on the lower end of the curve for sleep needs?  I have to assume that he wouldn't be able to stay awake from 6:30 to 8:00 every night if he were in need of more sleep per day given the perfect opportunity he has to fall asleep.  If it were a physiological need for him to do so he would, even if the majority of other babies in his boat would be snoring long before he's done talking to himself. ;)
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ml2620-2. Show ml2620-2's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    Honestly, I'm just really impressed he can happily entertain himself in bed for 1.5 hours and as long as he wasn't fussing, I wouldn't change a thing and would not worry about it at all.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    Actually, that's a great point, ml.  Being able to entertain himself, totally by himself, quietly and happily every night for that long is a huge developmental and emotional success.  Celebrate it!  It's not his choice to fall asleep at 8:00 instead of when he's put down, it's driven by brain chemicals that accomodate all his physiological needs.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from IPWBride. Show IPWBride's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    I totally agree... I am beyond impressed that he can hang in the total dark with just a few stuffed friends and a music machine and chill out.  And I'm happy to keep that going for him.  He did have a stomach bug last week, but I'm guessing that was just going around and he got over it in 3-4 days.  He also has tantrums more than before, but he is also 15mths old and not really verbal yet with all kinds of wild opinions.  So I assume one goes with the other.  All and all, he's healthy and growing.  15mth doctor's appt tomorrow so we'll see just how healthy and growing.  He did wake up last night at 11:15pm really, really unhappy... crying really hard and flailing about.  (rare for him to wake overnight).  But I assumed a bad dream or fright.  After 5 mins of holding and shsshing... he settled back.  So I guess I'll just chill and follow his lead.  Per MissLilly... I do actually want him to get on the same nap schedule all 7 days... 1 a day.  I can do it on weekends... my MIL... we'll see.  
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from MM379. Show MM379's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    FWIW, my DS had always been between 9-10 hrs a night since like 9mos.  Maybe asking MIL to try to go down to 1 nap too?  Perhaps the different schedules different days could be contributing?
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from framerican51008. Show framerican51008's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    No offense, Kar, but if your first post was entirely accurate then none of us would get woken up in the middle of the night by a baby who should be sleeping!

    I do see part of your point though.  IPW - I think if DS were tired from staying up too late, you would know.  You know him best :o)  I would say if you start to see signs of being overtired, then you should worry, but maybe he does only need 9 hours at night.

    I've been wondering about that actually  - when (if at all) have those of you with older LOs noticed them going to sleep later?  DD goes to sleep by 7:15 at the latest.  Recently we've been aiming for 6:30 when possible.  At some point (in the next year or 2) will it start to get later?  Or does that sometimes not happen for years?
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    The overall pattern sounds like bedtime utopia.  I think I'd try to stick with what is, for the most part, working ideally.  You never know; changes could make things worse and then you might not be able to easily regain what you have now.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from medfordcc. Show medfordcc's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    Fram, our LO always went to bed at 7 or 7:15, too.  She started going to bed more like 8:00 at 14 or 15 months.
    It's so variable kid to kid, though.  Plus, she is NOT an early riser.  We are very, very lucky to either have my mom come to the house or we take her to daycare that is very close by (no commute), so she rarely gets up before 7.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from misslily. Show misslily's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    DZ - for the "same schedule" thing - it's not perfect. I put them down at the same time. DS falls asleep more quickly than DD. He often wakes up eariler too. So I give her an extra 30 minutes and then wake her up if she hasn't woken by herself.  Meals and snacks are given at the same time.  I'd go crazy otherwise trying to cater to everyone's individual needs.  If I had 2 kids of different ages I'd feed them on the same schedule too.  (Infants being the exception). I think family dinner is really important, and on weekends we all eat lunch together too.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    Fram, no offense taken, but I was talking about the pattern of his quiet playing after being put to bed until the same time every night and how it indicates he's getting enough sleep per day.  If he weren't, he wouldn't "waste" 1.5 hours a day he could be sleeping by playing quietly and restfully.  Of course, babies don't always sleep when they need to, but the fact that he's relaxed, quiet, and playing for 1 - 2 hours after he's put down instead of sleeping means he's physically getting enough sleep.  Otherwise, the pattern would be that he played for 30 minutes and then fell asleep...or whatever.  If he were screaming for 1 1/2 hours every night, that would be an entirely different ball of wax, but a pattern of restful contentedness per day at bedtime when he could easily fall asleep in that state if need be means he'd be sleeping at that time if he needed more sleep.

    ETA:  In other words, I think it would be virtually impossible for him to be all alone, undisturbed, relaxed and content in a quiet, dark, comfortable place he associates with sleep, and not fall asleep if he needed more than he's getting every day.  That's not to say that babies always sleep when they should.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from winter09wedding. Show winter09wedding's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    IPW- we have some of the same sleep weirdness. sometimes 2 naps, sometimes 1. he tends to sleep in on the weekends when he gets the chance, and after a 3 day weekend, he struggles to get up the following tuesday.

    that being said, DS is a bit older (almost 18 months) and is up until 7:30/8 (but up at 5:30). He also now knows the sign language for bath and sleep- so he uses those and we follow his lead (rather than a strict bedtime) to put him down. some days he gets a better nap at daycare, and sometimes less and wants to go to bed early.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from framerican51008. Show framerican51008's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    I see what you mean, Kar.  In this instance, he would be fussing if he were overtired, rather than sitting quietly.  I'd say if a week or two goes by and he doesn't show signs of exhaustion, then this is the new normal!  Why does everything have to constantly change? :o)
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from kargiver. Show kargiver's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    Thanks, Fram.  I'm glad you gave me an opportunity to explain what I meant.  I was hoping my point would allay her fears about his getting less than average amount of sleep per day for his age.  His brain chemistry wouldn't let him get less than he needs under these particular circumstances which are ideal as far as his falling asleep earlier goes.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from luckinlife. Show luckinlife's posts

    Re: Sleep question... especially for early risers

    IPW - Our little one when through a really weird time with the nap transitions (still going on).  She sometimes takes one and sometimes takes two but she was waking up super early - like at 4:30 in the morning and crying.  This happened for about 2 weeks on and off.  She would go back to sleep if I gave her a pacifier but sometimes only until 5:30 and then would refuse to stay down.  Over the past couple of weeks she has been sleeping in later than she ever has and not a peep from her and going to bed without any problem.  We also have early wake up - out of the house by 6:15 and early bedtime at 6:30. 

    I think it is likely just a phase and hopefully he will start sleeping in later soon.

    She also went through a time recently when she was protesting going to bed and standing up heaving over the side of the crib - so sad.  This has completely resolved as well.

    It is hard because every time she has one of these sleep periods were everything is off, I think my goodness I am never going to get good sleep again.  And then, things tend to turn around on their own after I have over-thought it to death!
     
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