Game 5 Penalties

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Crowls2424. Show Crowls2424's posts

    Game 5 Penalties

    I have read some other posts about the Bruins effort and lack of aggression in Game 5, so I was surprised to go back and see the final Power Play stats:
    Flyers 1-9
    Bruins 0-2

    What?  Nine Power-plays surrendered by the team lacking effort, and only two surrendered by the desperate/emotional team?  That just doesn't make any sense. 

    I thought the following calls were dubious at best:
    - 1st Period (18:33): Miroslav Satan: 2 Minutes for Tripping Darroll Powe- I honestly thought when the ref's hand goes up that we were going to see a "diving call"

    - 2nd Period (11:56): Marc Savard: 2 Minutes for Roughing Kimmo Timonen- Pronger does this on every shift, Timonen totally takes a dive to embellish.

    - 2nd Period (17:00): Steve Begin: 2 Minutes for Boarding Claude Giroux- I thought this one was 50/50, looks to me like Giroux embellishes the hit.

    - 2nd Period (19:22): Andrew Ference: 2 Minutes for Cross checking Ville Leino- after 2 in row on the B's and the Gagne PPG, I thought this one could have been let go.

    - 3rd Period (7:56): Blake Wheeler: 2 Minutes for Tripping Chris Pronger- players get their skates tangled up, complete "phantom" call

    I did not detail the extra 2 minutes on Lucic during the Savard/Richards scrum or the extra 2 minutes on Stuart at the end of the game, just safe to say that the Bruins have consistently picked up the extra penalties in scrums in both rounds of playoffs this year.

    I think the Bruins were too flat for this game, lacked emotion and compete-level.  I would include the coach in that analysis as well.  I don't have the best perspective by watching the game at home, but I would like to think that Claude was all over the officials for the steady stream of calls on the Bruins.  My guess is that he simply looked confused and unhappy.  What ever happened to the days of Pat Burns or even Milbury getting the ref's "attention" to voice displeasure with the calls.  Laviolette has clearly done a better job of this and the results speak for themselves, PP opportunities 9-2 in his favor. 
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from islamorada. Show islamorada's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    The Bruins played scared from the drop of the puck to start the game.  It seemed as if the Bs were chasing the puck.  The play in the neutral zone was dictated by the Flyers defensemen playing up.  The Bs offense was not a threat so the game plan will not change in game 6.  Adhering to the Orr days "offense is the best defense".  The Bs team need to play with no fear of losing.  Anticipating the play and checking would help considerably.  
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from LoveRealHockey. Show LoveRealHockey's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Game 5 Penalties:
    I have read some other posts about the Bruins effort and lack of aggression in Game 5, so I was surprised to go back and see the final Power Play stats: Flyers 1-9 Bruins 0-2 What?  Nine Power-plays surrendered by the team lacking effort, and only two surrendered by the desperate/emotional team?  That just doesn't make any sense.  I thought the following calls were dubious at best: - 1st Period (18:33): Miroslav Satan: 2 Minutes for Tripping Darroll Powe- I honestly thought when the ref's hand goes up that we were going to see a "diving call" - 2nd Period (11:56): Marc Savard: 2 Minutes for Roughing Kimmo Timonen- Pronger does this on every shift, Timonen totally takes a dive to embellish. - 2nd Period (17:00): Steve Begin: 2 Minutes for Boarding Claude Giroux- I thought this one was 50/50, looks to me like Giroux embellishes the hit. - 2nd Period (19:22): Andrew Ference: 2 Minutes for Cross checking Ville Leino- after 2 in row on the B's and the Gagne PPG, I thought this one could have been let go. - 3rd Period (7:56): Blake Wheeler: 2 Minutes for Tripping Chris Pronger- players get their skates tangled up, complete "phantom" call I did not detail the extra 2 minutes on Lucic during the Savard/Richards scrum or the extra 2 minutes on Stuart at the end of the game, just safe to say that the Bruins have consistently picked up the extra penalties in scrums in both rounds of playoffs this year. I think the Bruins were too flat for this game, lacked emotion and compete-level.  I would include the coach in that analysis as well.  I don't have the best perspective by watching the game at home, but I would like to think that Claude was all over the officials for the steady stream of calls on the Bruins.  My guess is that he simply looked confused and unhappy.  What ever happened to the days of Pat Burns or even Milbury getting the ref's "attention" to voice displeasure with the calls.  Laviolette has clearly done a better job of this and the results speak for themselves, PP opportunities 9-2 in his favor. 
    Posted by Crowls2424

    I don't think the officiating was bad at all, actually, in spite of the variance in penalties called.

    The Begin hit was a cheap shot, sorry.  The play was ended and the Flyer had his back to Begin when he got crunched in the boards.  Should have got 4 minutes for that one.

    The Ferrence hit was also a definite penalty as was the trip on Pronger.

    Savard took exception to a clean hit from Richards and cross-checked him.  I think Savard was lucky Lucic was out there or Richards would have done a number on him.  Don't get me wrong though, I like that Savard plays with a bit of an edge, especially after what he's gone thru.

    Bruins were uncharacteristically (at least for the playoffs) undiscplined last night.  Can't afford to play like that.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from philathrilla. Show philathrilla's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Game 5 Penalties:

    I thought the following calls were dubious at best:

    Steve Begin: 2 Minutes for Boarding Claude Giroux- I thought this one was 50/50, looks to me like Giroux embellishes the hit.
    Posted by Crowls2424


    Did you type this with a straight face?  Claude Giroux was hurt and played sparingly in the 3rd period because of the boarding and Begin should have received more than 2.  Luckily, it's reported that he should be able to play Wednesday.  So just how does one embellish getting his face plastered to the plexi glass?
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from rolerhoky19. Show rolerhoky19's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:
    In Response to Game 5 Penalties : I don't think the officiating was bad at all, actually, in spite of the variance in penalties called. The Begin hit was a cheap shot, sorry.  The play was ended and the Flyer had his back to Begin when he got crunched in the boards.  Should have got 4 minutes for that one. The Ferrence hit was also a definite penalty as was the trip on Pronger. Savard took exception to a clean hit from Richards and cross-checked him.  I think Savard was lucky Lucic was out there or Richards would have done a number on him.  Don't get me wrong though, I like that Savard plays with a bit of an edge, especially after what he's gone thru. Bruins were uncharacteristically (at least for the playoffs) undiscplined last night.  Can't afford to play like that.
    Posted by LoveRealHockey


    I dissagree with you on this..

    One the Sobotka double minor, if you watch the replay, sobotoka does aggressivly lift hartnell's stick,  it ends up being hartnells own stick that hits him in the face..

    Two, I agree with you on the hit by begin, but see a complete miss about 2-4 minutes later when lucic was hit from behind in the zone.

    Three, the trip on pronger, he went into the corner awkwardly and was going down before wheeler ever had a stick near his feet, he was trying to do to much as once (get to the puck and turn to play it) and tripped himself up.. there was no trip there at all..

    The calls were way to one sided last night to call it a well officiated game. I do not generally complain about officiating, and I hate more then anything ot hear fans complain about good calls. but those were 3 clearly missed calls in my opinion.
     
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    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:
    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties : I dissagree with you on this.. One the Sobotka double minor, if you watch the replay, sobotoka does aggressivly lift hartnell's stick,  it ends up being hartnells own stick that hits him in the face.. Two, I agree with you on the hit by begin, but see a complete miss about 2-4 minutes later when lucic was hit from behind in the zone. Three, the trip on pronger, he went into the corner awkwardly and was going down before wheeler ever had a stick near his feet, he was trying to do to much as once (get to the puck and turn to play it) and tripped himself up.. there was no trip there at all.. The calls were way to one sided last night to call it a well officiated game. I do not generally complain about officiating, and I hate more then anything ot hear fans complain about good calls. but those were 3 clearly missed calls in my opinion.
    Posted by rolerhoky19

    You're right on the Lucic hit, forgot about that one.  On the Hartnell penalty, I think the official was in the wrong position, and from the angle where he called it, it wasn't obvious that it was Hartnell's stick.  Given that his eye was bloody, it probably sealed the fate.

    On the Pronger play, I still think it was a penalty, but I've seen worst not called.
    I don't think the officiating was great, but I don't think it was the reason the Bruins lost that game.
     
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    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:
    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties : You're right on the Lucic hit, forgot about that one.  On the Hartnell penalty, I think the official was in the wrong position, and from the angle where he called it, it wasn't obvious that it was Hartnell's stick.  Given that his eye was bloody, it probably sealed the fate. On the Pronger play, I still think it was a penalty, but I've seen worst not called. I don't think the officiating was great, but I don't think it was the reason the Bruins lost that game.
    Posted by LoveRealHockey

     

    Oh I agree with you on that.. I still think the pronger call was bad,  there was an angle that to me showed pretty clearly he was going down before wheeler got a stick in there.. So agree to disagree. but they bruins were not getting chances through, and the officiating was not helping,  its not like we lost 3-2 on a bad call.. The bruins were never really in this game after Satan's scoring chance in the first..
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from BigD7. Show BigD7's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:
    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties : You're right on the Lucic hit, forgot about that one.  On the Hartnell penalty, I think the official was in the wrong position, and from the angle where he called it, it wasn't obvious that it was Hartnell's stick.  Given that his eye was bloody, it probably sealed the fate. On the Pronger play, I still think it was a penalty, but I've seen worst not called. I don't think the officiating was great, but I don't think it was the reason the Bruins lost that game.
    Posted by LoveRealHockey


    According to TSN, rules state that if a player causes another players stick to hit himself in the face, it is still a penalty... I'm not joking.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from mattbs. Show mattbs's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    I could live with the BS calls against Boston but it sure wasn't called both ways.  For one I thought the hit from behind should have been called and there was also alot of obstruction that was not called.  I will not dwell on the refs because the only thing worst than them was the Boston players.  Awful or totally burnt out.
     
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    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    That would be the hot from behind on Savard.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from No4BobbyOrr-GOAT. Show No4BobbyOrr-GOAT's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    Officiating was horrible, but was used to keep the nastiness in check, any time the B's were mounting something and it got rough the hand went up.

    Sobotka's pen there is nothing you can do about it other than keep yourf'n stick on the ice.

    Asham's too many men was the third such violation and first penalty call, could have easily been 5 or 6 calls and one non call resulted in a goal during entrance to B's zone, another hit the player standing there and no call.

    Satan was skating and his stick tapped Powe in back of leg and pow he was down, totally laughable, Satan did not even know what was happening.

    Savard penalty too many non calls to call this.

    Begin hit no different than 10 other plays both ways. Hard hit yes, only McGuire would think this was a def penalty as he still hasn't crawled out of Pronger's hole or the Flyers' collective holes.

    Ference def xcheck as many others, called one on Briere but wish they would call them all then, but the B's have to know cut out the shiite it will be called against them.

    Richards hit was not so clean as it was above the shoulders at the head and is why Sav retaliated when no call. Luc is going to get the extra penalty even if he stands at center, it is just how it works for him, so he might as well get a few shots in and make it worth while. Richards was not going to fight, the flyers have a push and instigate but don't fight.

    McGuire was between the benches saying at end that Carcillo was challenging the B's, but notice when push came to shove he didn't drop gloves with Stuart or Luc or any others.

    Discipline was in the eyes of the refs and could as easily been the other way, a lot of stuff got let go one way and the is the quickest way for frustration to take over.

    The B's had chances that trickled thru the crease and a post that would have changed the game, every time they mounted some O it was negated by a penalty.

    Yes the next game they have to turn the other cheek and drive the net with shots on net, they need to get shots and quality shots.

    Rask has to be far better than the last 2 games, far better

    9 Goals 65 shots and .861 save %, last night I would have pulled him after 3rd goal or for 3rd period and rested him for next game and this would have had TT ready if he falters next game.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from philathrilla. Show philathrilla's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:
    Officiating was horrible, but was used to keep the nastiness in check, any time the B's were mounting something and it got rough the hand went up.

    Richards hit was not so clean as it was above the shoulders at the head and is why Sav retaliated when no call. Luc is going to get the extra penalty even if he stands at center, it is just how it works for him, so he might as well get a few shots in and make it worth while. Richards was not going to fight, the flyers have a push and instigate but don't fight.
    Posted by No4BobbyOrr-GOAT


    The only thing worse than the officiating is the excuse that it was more of a factor than the Bruins committing them.

    Richards hit "above the shoulders at the head" against Savard?  I wonder if there's a condition people have where imaginary visions cloud what was clearly seen by everyone else.

    Richards or the Flyers aren't fighters?  That's a good one.  Tell you what Bobby, you take Savard while I put my money on Richards any day of the week, any week of the year and you'll get a chance to see who becomes the mop.  You're clearly dillusional.
     
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    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:
    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties : The only thing worse than the officiating is the excuse that it was more of a factor than the Bruins committing them. Richards hit "above the shoulders at the head" against Savard?  I wonder if there's a condition people have where imaginary visions cloud what was clearly seen by everyone else. Richards or the Flyers aren't fighters?  That's a good one.  Tell you what Bobby, you take Savard while I put my money on Richards any day of the week, any week of the year and you'll get a chance to see who becomes the mop.  You're clearly dillusional.
    Posted by philathrilla



    Phila,
    the calls were 9-2 against the bruins with the bruins being the home team, that is a poorly officiated game.. And savard is not a scrapper at all 0 career fighting majors, so you can keep your money on richards, but he didnt seem to want anything to do with Lucic when it came time to answer.  Similarly Carcillo has been challenged several times but only seems to want to engage with savards and krejci and hunwicks.. (and ps my money is on hunwick in that case)..He has been challenge by thornton, and Stuart and continues to look to the refs for protection when these guy call on him..

    the hit on savard was indeed questionable, the hit on krejci was clean the other day, but it was a  "green light" hit... that was a lousy pass that chara made to him, and he should have held that puck at that point..
     
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    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    Not at all happy with refs or Bruins. They all know Carcillo is egging them into a penalty. Philla Thilla sounds like a home boy to me. i agree with comments that Julien can lose focus at times, but his coaches need to help out too. Put Wheeler on Bergie's wing; add marchand to sabotka, and Philly will get a thrilla in the godzilla. I'm really losing it in this series.Don't think any ref has called Pronger for anything like "interference" or crosscheck, he must really qualify for the lady bing.
     
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    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:
    And savard is not a scrapper at all 0 career fighting majors
    Posted by rolerhoky19


    So it appears that Savard's cross check to Richards' jaw and the rabbit punches would seem even more cowardly, wouldn't it?  I agree.

    you can keep your money on richards, but he didnt seem to want anything to do with Lucic when it came time to answer.
    Posted by rolerhoky19


    Came time to answer what, the clean check on Savard?  Thanks for the reminder on Lucic.  I mean, you and I both know that it takes a big man to see a teammate dishing out rabbit punches to someone not reacting to them and join in on the festivities.  I agree, give Mr. Lucic a point in the manhood column.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Mutant211. Show Mutant211's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    To me, the call where Sobotka "tripped" an already falling Pronger was the worst.  Yes, the Bruins lost their composure as the game went along, but the officiating was lopsided.  I didn't see the memo, but apparently the rules regarding obstruction have changed this postseason.  The Flyers have gotten quite proficient at the rolling pick, just as the Sabres were in the first round.

    As far as the Savard/Richards/Lucic scrum, Richards was heard telling Savard that he would put him out for "another six weeks."  Of course Savard and Lucic are going to react to a high hit on Savard.  The funny part was how big tough Richards turtled like Claude Lemieux when he saw that it was Lucic who had ahold of him.  It was also pretty funny how Gagne suddenly decides to get tough when there is a linesman between him and Lucic.

    As far as the Begin hit on Giroux, it was a bad hit.  Begin should have let up.  Giroux didn't help his cause, exposing his back to protect the puck.  We have seen this all to many times in recent years.  Players from all teams do it.  Players never used to do that before the age of helmets, because they knew if they did, they would get their faces driven into the boards.  It is a symptom of the sense of invincibility that players get from wearing all of their body armor.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from 86redsox. Show 86redsox's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    I forgot, is wed or thurs free taser night in philly?
     
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    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:
    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties : So it appears that Savard's cross check to Richards' jaw and the rabbit punches would seem even more cowardly, wouldn't it?  I agree. Came time to answer what, the clean check on Savard?  Thanks for the reminder on Lucic.  I mean, you and I both know that it takes a big man to see a teammate dishing out rabbit punches to someone not reacting to them and join in on the festivities.  I agree, give Mr. Lucic a point in the manhood column.
    Posted by philathrilla


    Yeah, you can keep your opinion on Richards clean play if you want, but no one took offense to the hit he threw on krejci, there was alot more objection to the hit thrown on savard so maybe you should look with a little more objective of an eye..
    Similar to you commenting on the begin hit, that hit was as much giroux's fault as a dirty hit by begin.. he made the pass and then sat there to admire it while turning into the boards instead of putting himself in a position to protect himself.  That hit wasnt a "square in the numbers case" where they were both going to the boards and giroux was vounerable.. He got hit the way he did cause he was sleeping..
    what about the non boarding call on a hit lucic absorbed 2 minutes later.. The play of carcillo in general??  And lucic's role on that line heavily to get in there hit bodies create space and to stand in there for savard, the guy is coming off a heavy concussion of course they are going to take exception to any hit they feel is boarderline..
    No game that gets called 9 penalties to 2 can ever be looked on as a well officiated game.. its that simple.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from bennyjo30. Show bennyjo30's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    It's not the calls that makes me upset. Most of the calls that were made were justified. It's the inconsistency of those calls that gets me angry. When you see the refs call a crosscheck on Ference and then see crosscheck after crosscheck that is not called... that's just one example. It's the playoffs, and it's important to stay consistent. And in my opinion, if it's questionable, don't call it. Let them play, and call the penalties that are true, obvious penalties.

    With or without those penalties though, the Bruins were just all around flat. They scored 0 goals and only 1 of the 4 scored on them was a PPG. I barely even noticed Chara on the ice. When Wideman's stick broke, he left his back towards Gagne and basically STOPPED skating, allowing Gagne to score! There were 100 things he could've done differently. They turned over the puck more times than I can count. They really couldn't get into the offensive zone and get any good quality scoring chances. The Flyers came out after Game 3 saying they couldn't figure out how to get past the Bruins trap. Well, it's pretty clear that they figured it out, and now the Bruins can't figure out their trap. The Bruins definitely need to make some changes.

     
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    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:
    When Wideman's stick broke, he left his back towards Gagne and basically STOPPED skating, allowing Gagne to score! There were 100 things he could've done differently.
    Posted by bennyjo30


    I disagree.  Other than for Wideman to literally kick the puck away from Gagne, there was only 1 other thing to do and that would have been to take either a penalty or give up a penalty shot anyways.

    Game 6 should be entertaining.  May the better team win.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from rolerhoky19. Show rolerhoky19's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:
    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties : I disagree.  Other than for Wideman to literally kick the puck away from Gagne, there was only 1 other thing to do and that would have been to take either a penalty or give up a penalty shot anyways. Game 6 should be entertaining.  May the better team win.
    Posted by philathrilla


    I think there are several options (i don't think the penalty shot was ever a threat as by the time gagne was in the zone widemen was long gone since he quit).. kick the puck away, turn and play gagne with out the stick (completely legal as long as he does not long) fall to the puck and make a hand pass (resulting in a face off..)

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Crowls2424. Show Crowls2424's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:
    I thought a lot of the calls were because of the B's undisciplined play. It was definitely one of the most frustrating games I've watched this year. I thought for sure Chara was going to get a diving penalty after little Danny Briere shoved him. The B's defense looked like they were auditioning for the Keystone Cops. The only thing missing was that tinkling piano music from the old silent film comedies.
    Posted by Davidorr


    So, in your mind the Briere penalty shouldn't have been called?  Does that mean that the game you watched, the Flyers committed no penalties other than the too-many-men call?  Thanks for the analysis.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from JYaso. Show JYaso's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    The Bruins lost because they were outplayed and out hustled and are playing not to make mistakes.  See the Carolina Series last year as an example of Julien falling in love with his system.  Well, the same reason why they lost last year is creeping its ugly head again.  The Flyers have figured out how to attack the Bruins System just like Carolina Did last year and now Claude and his staff can't figure out how to combat what Philly is taking away from them.

    As far as officiating-- 9 to 2 says it all.  The officals need to get some balls and start calling the Flyers for that constant obstruction/interference when the Bruins try to dump and chase.  I counted 8 times under the current rules that Pronger should have been called for this.  Also, the embelishing needs to be called-- call it once and they will stop-- don't call it and keep watching as the Flyers make a mockery of the refs.  When there is a scrum--even out the penalties unless something is so blatent.

    PS:  For all you losers who keep on saying trade Krecji during the offseason--- SHUT UP!
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joeinfla. Show Joeinfla's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:  Similarly Carcillo has been challenged several times but only seems to want to engage with savards and krejci and hunwicks.. (and ps my money is on hunwick in that case)..He has been challenge by thornton, and Stuart and continues to look to the refs for protection when these guy call on him..


      Ahh.......did you watch the winter classic? kinda remember Carcillo turning out
     Thorntons lights.How quickly you forget.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from No4BobbyOrr-GOAT. Show No4BobbyOrr-GOAT's posts

    Re: Game 5 Penalties

    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties:
    In Response to Re: Game 5 Penalties : I disagree.  Other than for Wideman to literally kick the puck away from Gagne, there was only 1 other thing to do and that would have been to take either a penalty or give up a penalty shot anyways. Game 6 should be entertaining.  May the better team win.
    Posted by philathrilla


    How about skate and pass the puck with hand to def partner and get said whistle.
    How about skate and knock puck back to Rask.
    ...fall on puck.
    ...skate to puck and straddle it and flatten the bum when he tries to pick it up.
    ...just fn skate etc etc etc
    & yo  Thrilla Sav will take him in Manilla, send all your pansies out, not one of em will drop the gloves. Carstilletto, prongless etc are all good with the gloves sticks etc at least homisarek in Mon would drop em, there is no class in Philly and never was. Bunch of backstabbing cheapshot artists right back to the days of barbie and beans, van wimp and the moose, your probably too young to know them, but you cheer for the same tools in your arsenal now. Same thing back then they were the dirtiest in the league all year long and all of a sudden they never drew a penalty come playoff time, certainly never got the suspensions they should have.

    So phillathrilla go take a pilla, it is the only thing you will be able to get up for next game. Go troll somewhere else.
     
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