Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from joeschmo25. Show joeschmo25's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    As for Kessel for Jack Johnson I like that idea, but only if the #5 overall pick is thrown in. Yes some people may see that as a reach but not compared to Johnson's play so far, Kessel's play so far and the King's need of a dynamic goal scorer to play with Anze Kopitar. A player like Kessel in a market like Los Angeles will attract fans, he's got all the skills that bandwagon fans and even hardcore fans love, the difference being the hardcore fans know that it takes a complete player to lead a team to a Championship. And for those who may question me about Jack Johnson he's still only 22, and when you look at Bruins defenseman who played in the NCAA (Mark Stuart and Matt Hunwick) the time for development is longer. Also consider that Julien is a teaching coach, and can work with problem players (Johnson is in the middle of a contract negotiation problem with the Kings (the reason why they want to unload him in a package for a star forward)). If Johnson is given time to develop and not so much pressure then he will develop, and his billing is top 2 defenseman with perennail all star.
    I like Kessel and I think we should keep him, but if we can't get a contract signed with him by the draft and this offer is realistic to both sides then pull the trigger and watch the next star Bruin be picked with a 5th overall pick (My bet is either Evander Kane, Magnus Paajarvi Svennson or Brayden Schenn goes in that pick to whoever has it come draft time).
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ohno1957. Show ohno1957's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    rask to colorado..YES  kevin regan will be a VERY GOOD N.H.L. goalie in the next year or so sign a doug auld for a back up next year  FOR THE 3RD PICK... than trade kessel and kobasew to  L.A. FOR  brian boyle and doughty  frees up cap money and gets you some quality YOUNG PLAYERS with high upside this is a win win...... than pursue a mike kanuble via free agents
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Olsonic. Show Olsonic's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    Kessel for Heatley!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Edit: Damn, he has a 7.5 million dollar cap number........


    I can dream though.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from dkrejci46. Show dkrejci46's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    The Ottowa papers say that Heatley could head to Boston, the asking price would be bergeron and kessel, ummmmm, no thanks
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from joeschmo25. Show joeschmo25's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    I'm not in favor of the Heatley deal, seeing as his cap hit would send the Bruins out of whack even further AND Heatley is a problem causer. Wants out of Atlanta for something better, not a stupid idea by any means but how he went about it was idiotic. Gets to Ottawa, signs the huge extension then wants to jump ship, stupid. I'd rather a team like San Jose or Chicago deal for him, then we won't have to listen to this anymore. And the Bruins are going into the future as a younger team, why give away a dynamic 21 year old player and a 24 year old on the verge of a big comeback. People have wanted the Bruins to go after big name players via trade, and they've shown they don't need to. Let some other team blow up their development strategy for the next 5-10 years on a guy who most likely will quit on them as well.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Olsonic. Show Olsonic's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    yeah, bruins would be overpaying if the trade was Bergeron and Kessel for Heatley.


    But i could understand a package of Kessel + Rask for Heatley.
    Kessel + Hunwick might be overkill for a guy that wants out of Ottawa.. they aren't negotiating from a position of strength.

    Kessel + Sturm would be ideal. It replaces a lot of scoring that Ottawa would be losing, and its more economical for Boston to sign Heatley. Not to mention Savard and Heatley played very well together.

    (That Savard, Kovalchuk, Heatley line was one of the best in recent memory)
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from fp4778. Show fp4778's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    I simply cannot understand anyone even remotely suggesting that Rask be traded. He has the potential to be an elite NHL goaltender and this is the year he gets his first real shot at proving it. Even last year he was the best goalie in training camp. What happens if Thomas gets injured and there is no decent back up? You can load up on all the players you want but it always comes down to stellar goaltending in the playoffs. It would be insanity not to give Rask a good look next season.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Olsonic. Show Olsonic's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?



    Prospects, in all sports, are extremely over-rated, and i hate to burst the bubble of all of the people in the "Rask is untouchable" camp.. But we have a starting goalie and his name is Tim Thomas. It would be insanity to sign tim thomas for 4 years at 20 million dollars and then let Rask play come playoff time.

    If you seriously think PC just signed Thomas, and thinks Rask will start during TT's contract, you're mental. Considering that the only reason Phil kessel is on the block in the first place is because the Bruins don't have the cap space to sign him, do you think for a second that PC would have wasted those dollars on Thomas when they could have been spent on kessel? Hell no. When PC signed thomas, he did so because he was going to start. Not a goalie by commitee like teams do when their roster is filled with mediocre stoppers. They signed thomas and paid him big bucks, TO START.

    As DKrejci 46 pointed out, we will be paying Tim Thomas 6 million per year for 2010 and 2011. its a fact. Deal with it. he is your starting goalie, not Rask. And you don't sit on someone with that kind of value and put him on the bench. Getting a guy like Heatley for Rask would mean that the value on your roster actually gets to be on the ice when you are trying to win a Stanley cup.

     YOU CAN'T PLAY TWO GOALIES AT THE SAME TIME!
    Rask is probably going to be a good goalie, thats why they should trade him, because they can get someone excellent back. like heatley.

    And heatley could actually play.. on the ice...for the Bruins...

    Dead horse is dead.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from sparky1313. Show sparky1313's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    TT is not going to last here if Rask plays well. That's why there is not a no trade clause in his contract. PC is not dumb he knows, TT is doing well now, but, when will he come down to earth. Don't trade a goalie that may become something. Marc-andre' was not very good for a while, then with time he has grown into the role. If Rask grows in the next two years then TT is on a train to Ottowa. There is very little need to move players that are cheep right now, like Rask. An okay backup would be more than the $ they will pay Rask, and the kid will get his fair share of starts.
    Kessel will not be traded unless a sweetheart of a deal drops in PC's lap. PC holds all the cards. Who is going after Kessel? Anyone heard? Excactly, most GM's won't pay for a small , often hurt goal scorer that has nothing more than goals to offer. He will test the market , then come back at the B's and sign for Krejci's #s. Or the B's will match whatever offer then trade him all signed to a west coast team.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from dkrejci46. Show dkrejci46's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    Olsonic I respectfully disagree with your position of Rask. I really do think that Rask is untouchable right now. The Bruins are up against it in terms of the cap, and are in need of a back up goaltender. A good back up goaltender (and this is a position of growing value in the NHL, now that the days of goalies playing 75 games are pretty much gone) doesn't get much cheaper than 850K.

    I think you can play two goalies at once (although I do know what you meant when you said that) seeing as how the Bruins expect to easily make the playoffs. Thomas was definitely much much better when he wasn't playing absolutely every night. A goaltending TANDEM is huge. If Thomas plays 55 games say, and Rask plays 27, tahts 54 potential points that Rask will be fighting for. A good back up goaltender will help keep Thomas fresh (and we cannot throw out the possibility of an injury, or Rask being the best goaltender at the end of the year and getting playoff starts) for the playoffs. Rask is the perfect fit for next year.

    Now lets talk about what you could get for him. You say that prospects are over rated in sport, but that is exactly what we would be trading him for. You can't swing a deal of Tuukka for Heatly (who under performed last year, and is due tons of money that we don't have to spend) the cap room just isn't there, and the Sens already said that the starting price for Heatly would be Kessel and Bergeron. While that would clear enough cap room for him I would prefer to keep those two guys in town.

    The way Thomas' contract is set up, he will get the majority of the games this year, Tuukka will either resign as an RFA here for small money, or he leaves for compensation draft picks in the 1st and 3rd round or better. If he stays his starts will slowly be increased until the last year of the four year deal where Thomas makes 3 million, and his no-trade clause disappears. I would prefer that Thomas only be here for two more years but the contract is what it is.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from joeschmo25. Show joeschmo25's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    As much as I like Rask and his potential I don't deem him untouchable. I know he has the potential to be great, but it's the Bruins here. A young goalie cannot develop here (Raycroft and Toivonen the most recent examples) and a many goalies break down mentally and can't perform well here. The Bruins have done well in signing or trading for free agent goalies (Fernandez this season, Thomas, Alex Auld as examples).
    I don't know maybe Rask will be the breakthrough everybody is looking for, but for how the Bruins develop goalies I'll believe it when I see it. And for both him and Kessel you only move them (seperately of course, never in the same deal) IF you get an offer that knocks your socks off, as you should with any high potential prospect. It may seem like a reach but I would deal Kessel (if he's asking for $5+ million a year) for Jack Johnson AND the #5 overall pick. Right now Los Angeles needs a big time scorer, badly. And Johnson's contract situation is a bit hairy with reports saying that he wants $5 million a year- highly doubtful in my mind that an unproven defenseman like him would ask for it but Dean Lombardi won't confirm anything. I think there may be a discrepancy on the contract but not dealing with that much money. Add in Los Angeles' abudance of defenseman and Johnson becomes trade bait.
    That's the only deal I move Kessel to Los Angeles for.
    Other deals I personally would love would be if we could actually get the #3 overall pick for Kessel straight up, or Kessel to the St. Louis Blues for either Erik Johnson or Alex Pietrangelo (for those who don't know him he was the #4 overall pick in the 2008 draft. He's 6'4, loves to make big hits and can run a powerplay great.)
    Other than that I don't move Kessel, Rask would have to be wanted in similar offers for a trade to be warranted.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from joeschmo25. Show joeschmo25's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    And please people let's stop with the Heatley talk. the Bruins don't have that kinda cap room and to make room for it gives up players who are better suited in Boston's system than Heatley. Yes he's a dynamic player but come on we can't afford too many people with big salaries, we're not that kind of team.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BruinsCountry. Show BruinsCountry's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    I agree with dkrejci46 who wrote:  "The Ottowa (sic) papers say that Heatley could head to Boston, the asking price would be bergeron and kessel, ummmmm, no thanks"

    But with that hypothetical trade in mind Joe:  if B's traded Kessel (and his estimated $4 mill per year salary going forward) and Bergeron (and his $4.5 mill per year), that would reduce B's cap by approx $9 mill per year, which would mean they'd have no problems paying Heatley's $7 million per year. 

    Something not to overlook re: the various Heatley rumors is that Chiarelli was Asst. GM in Ottawa when Senators traded for Heatley.   Chiarelli knows Heatley as well as anyone.  If Chiarelli doesn't try to bring him to Boston, that should serve as a red flag to other NHL GM's IMHO.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Olsonic. Show Olsonic's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    "The Bruins are up against it in terms of the cap, and are in need of a back up goaltender. A good back up goaltender (and this is a position of growing value in the NHL, now that the days of goalies playing 75 games are pretty much gone) doesn't get much cheaper than 850K. "

    DKrejci46, what is Rask's  cap number next year? it tought it was like 3 million or something if he plays a certain number of games?


    "A good back up goaltender will help keep Thomas fresh (and we cannot throw out the possibility of an injury, or Rask being the best goaltender at the end of the year and getting playoff starts) for the playoffs."

    I have to agree with you on that one. I know a solid goalie tandem can do wonders for health come post-season. The point i'm really trying to make is about Value.  I just think that Rask has more value to the league as a starter than as a backup goalie to the Boston Bruins. For that reason, I think it is in the best interest of the Bruins to maximize his value by bringing in a player that can contribute for more games, including the playoffs. I don't think it would be very hard to find a goalie that could play like 15 games for the Bruins


    "Now lets talk about what you could get for him. You say that prospects are over rated in sport, but that is exactly what we would be trading him for. You can't swing a deal of Tuukka for Heatly (who under performed last year, and is due tons of money that we don't have to spend) the cap room just isn't there"

    Well, that isn't exactly what I suggested. I said kessel and Tuuka for Heatley. Heatleys cap hit is 7.5 so I would have to be right on Tuuka's hit for the numbers to make sense. But I should have been more clear: there is no way Rask for Heatley works straight up. I should also say that I think kessel and Sturm for heatley would be a brilliant trade. it replaces the goal scoring that Ottawa would want in return. It gives the bruins a more dynamic goal scorer that shows more grit and has better playmaking skills than kessel.


    " If he stays his starts will slowly be increased until the last year of the four year deal"

    And that is precisely the point I'm trying to make. Rask will be unable to fulfill his potential until the final year of Tim Thomas' contract. That means for three years, the Bruins won't be able to benefit from the real skill set that Rask has. But if you trade him (with in a package with Kessel), I think you could get a blue-chip player like Heatley, a player whose value could be used on the ice and not on the bench.

    Maybe I'm being a broken record, and maybe i'm just dead wrong, but I have to feel that teams would be willing to give you back something significant for a kessel Rask package (two players you can build a franchise around). And I think that player could contribute to a team during a playoff run where Thomas is almost garunteed to start every game.



    as i say this. maybe trading kessel and Rask in the same package is lunacy considering how much value they both have. Not many players could give you back that kind of talent. I do think heatley is one of those players though.




    *Wouldn't Marco Sturm+Kessel for Heatley save the bruins money?*
    *wouldn't Ottawa accept that trade?*
    *If the Bruins landed Heatley, could they actually be favorites to come out of the east?*
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from BruinsCountry. Show BruinsCountry's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    Just to be clear...it's late now!...I'm not in favor of a Kessel-Bergy trade for Heatley.  I'd only move Kessel for the right big, mobile, PPQB defenseman, and Jack Johnson ain't one of 'em!
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from joeschmo25. Show joeschmo25's posts

    Re: Kessel for Jack Johnson?.......Rask for 3rd overall pick?

    What Johnson could bring to the table is a strong, tough defenseman who can put up a decent amount of points, a general above average skillset across the board. Also with the #5 pick you could get one of Evander Kane, Brayden Schenn, Magnus Paarjarvi Svensson, Dmitri Kulikov (a reach at #5 but a possible trade down scenario), or Jared Cowen. Given that Axlesson is the only Swedish positional player in god knows how long that's made the trek over to Boston I'd advise against Svensson, but if Kane was available I'd take the plunge. I maintain that I'd like for this to happen IF they couldn't keep Kessel.
    I do give you credit for that point about Heatley though BruinsCountry, Chiarelli would know about Heatley. By now the entire league knows what he can do, and it would be great to have a dynamic talent like that with the Bruins. However announcing to the league that he wanted a trade shows a lack of class by Heatley and his camp. Just as a general thought GM's don't like it when players undermine their plans. If anybody heard Brian Burke on Wednesday afternoon he ripped into Heatley for making it public. By doing so Heatley's brought down his trade value to the Senators, who don't have to fufill his trade request should he try and control the situation.
    I think the Bruins do a great job at choosing their players according to skills, intelligence and character, so nobody on the current roster would make a public scene like that. However should the situation arise where a player undermined Chiarelli like that I don't think it would end well for the player.
     

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