question for hockey minds

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ignaceontario. Show ignaceontario's posts

    question for hockey minds

    when was the last time 36 goal scorer was traded under the age of 21. so sign phil he will be the next 50 goal bruin and in this day and era thats impressive
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ssags111. Show ssags111's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    Why so high on Kessel? 

    We don't lose any goal scoring by trading him, with Sturm coming back, that's at least 25 of Kessel's goals right there, expect Lucic to improve from his 17 goals, there's a couple more, expect Recchi to to have a big year as he scored 10 in 18 games last year. Add in Bergeron progress from his concussion, he might return to a 25-30 goal guy but he will at least be better than his 8 from last year plus the continuing growth of Bitz and Wheeler will chip in a few more.  Kessel one flash in a pan year is more than covered.

    Getting rid of Kessel now is the better option than losing Kobesaw and Sturm (or other player) now to cover the salary demands Kessel wants.  Kessel is a one way player and I'll go further by saying it is Savy that is making Kessel great. Savy can make anyone a better player as evident with his track record in Atlanta and Boston. 

    The Bruins made all the right moves this off season, they signed Krecji first and kept the grit in the corners instead of trading away a few players for Kessel's one way game and his salary demands.  I'll take Kobesaw's style, heart, toughness and 25 goals anyday over Kessel.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from ocram. Show ocram's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    GOALS win hockey games, despite people liking the grittiness of players such as Kobasew.  Don't get lost in the style points.

    What if you subtract Kobasew's 20, add Kessel's 36 and give a chance to youngsters with grit such as Sobotka and/or Marchand a chance?  Wouldn't that give you more scoring ability (Kessel) along with the sandpaper of Sobotka/Marchand? Also add Sturm's goals, and improvements from other players like Lucic, Wheeler, etc.. this team will be ALOT better!

    Getting rid of Kessel to me, this would be another in the long line of 2 - 5's for a 10 types of trade that the bruins are notorious for. 

    Don't delay with draft picks, Let's go for a Stanley Cup!
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from JWensink. Show JWensink's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds:
    GOALS win hockey games, despite people liking the grittiness of players such as Kobasew.  Don't get lost in the style points. What if you subtract Kobasew's 20, add Kessel's 36 and give a chance to youngsters with grit such as Sobotka and/or Marchand a chance?  Wouldn't that give you more scoring ability (Kessel) along with the sandpaper of Sobotka/Marchand? Also add Sturm's goals, and improvements from other players like Lucic, Wheeler, etc.. this team will be ALOT better! Getting rid of Kessel to me, this would be another in the long line of 2 - 5's for a 10 types of trade that the bruins are notorious for.  Don't delay with draft picks, Let's go for a Stanley Cup!
    Posted by ocram


    You think scoring goals is so important? OK-Lucic was outscored by almost everyone on the top three lines. Why don't you tell everyone why you would want to trade Lucic before Ryder or Recchi?   
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ocram. Show ocram's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    flawed argument, Lucic is a young player on the rise and on the 1st line.  Ryder & Recchi are proven veteran commodities who are declining.

    my question to you is.. Do you think Marchand/Sobotka can give you at least 80% of Kobasew?  If they can than why wouldnt you keep Kessel over Kobasew?
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from JWensink. Show JWensink's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds:
    flawed argument, Lucic is a young player on the rise and on the 1st line.  Ryder & Recchi are proven veteran commodities who are declining. my question to you is.. Do you think Marchand/Sobotka can give you at least 80% of Kobasew?  If they can than why wouldnt you keep Kessel over Kobasew?
    Posted by ocram


    OK here you go- Who would you rather keep on this team Milan Lucic or Phill Kessel????? Sealed
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from BradyBruin. Show BradyBruin's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    Because Kobasew has put up over 20+ with consistancy and it would take moving more than Kobasew to keep kessel. You have a ton of scoring depth - don't desolve it to keep a 22yr old (When the season starts) with one great season under his belt - he has more to prove before he is worth breaking up this team to keep.
    I wouldn't say Ryder is declining - last season was one of his best - I expect growth from him - he is still relatively young.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from No4BobbyOrr-GOAT. Show No4BobbyOrr-GOAT's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds:
    Why so high on Kessel?  We don't lose any goal scoring by trading him, with Sturm coming back, that's at least 25 of Kessel's goals right there, expect Lucic to improve from his 17 goals, there's a couple more, expect Recchi to to have a big year as he scored 10 in 18 games last year. Add in Bergeron progress from his concussion, he might return to a 25-30 goal guy but he will at least be better than his 8 from last year plus the continuing growth of Bitz and Wheeler will chip in a few more.  Kessel one flash in a pan year is more than covered. Getting rid of Kessel now is the better option than losing Kobesaw and Sturm (or other player) now to cover the salary demands Kessel wants.  Kessel is a one way player and I'll go further by saying it is Savy that is making Kessel great. Savy can make anyone a better player as evident with his track record in Atlanta and Boston.  The Bruins made all the right moves this off season, they signed Krecji first and kept the grit in the corners instead of trading away a few players for Kessel's one way game and his salary demands.  I'll take Kobesaw's style, heart, toughness and 25 goals anyday over Kessel.
    Posted by ssags111


    You don't get his 36 goals back. Savard is a great setup man but no other Bruin has scored 30 with him let alone 36. Murray got 28 and 17 after scoring 44 with Joe. Sturm hit his 27, so Kessel scores 36 and is only 21. Everyone keeps saying all our other youth are going to improve so why wouldn't Kessel. His progression rate has been 11 - 19 - 36 G so his next step is about 68 and prorate that over 60 games will be a 50 goal season.  He may not hit 50, but I wouldn't be surprised with the depth of this team that he wouldn't.

    You don't trade a potential 50 goal scorer and say we are getting better, we'll get the goals from elsewhere, it doesn't happen.

    As Wensink & yourself say trading Kobasew will be a big loss. His 25 -30 goals will be a loss but it's his never quit attitude that will be missed more. I would prefer not to lose him either. Send Sturm(Salary) down after Kessel comes back and all will be good and we will have a player standing in the wings.

    Do not compare Sturm to Kessel, same style but has never acheived and never hit 30. Can't even compare him to Kobasew as he doesn't have the grit and tenaciousness and goals output is similar. Kobie is 4 years younger and makes 1.2M less.

    Ryder is another option because of his salary 4M, but he is a big contributor and also a playoff factor.

    Do I keep Kessel over any of these 3, yes, no brainer. I will not like to lose any of these  or anyone else but it needs to be done. You have never seen a good scorer traded for nothing, unless a trade deadline dump and this is not a trade deadline.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ocram. Show ocram's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    Lucic is locked up for 2009-2010, so its not a Kessel/Lucic either or proposition.  



    After this season the Bruins as you know them will be different.  Managment will have to break up this team due to expiring contracts/salary demands and cap restraints.  I want to win a cup this season! In my opinion, having another scorer like Kessel gives us a better chance to win. I can replace expensive grit with younger cheaper grit.






    ill trade my

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from No4BobbyOrr-GOAT. Show No4BobbyOrr-GOAT's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds:
    Because Kobasew has put up over 20+ with consistancy and it would take moving more than Kobasew to keep kessel. You have a ton of scoring depth - don't desolve it to keep a 22yr old (When the season starts) with one great season under his belt - he has more to prove before he is worth breaking up this team to keep. I wouldn't say Ryder is declining - last season was one of his best - I expect growth from him - he is still relatively young.
    Posted by BradyBruin


    We have depth, but that didn't get er done last year. Yes our growth will help, but wouldn't you like to see our best scorer grow with this team. It will not necessarily take more to keep Kessel, we do not know exactly what Chia has up his sleeve.

    As to breaking up this team to keep?? We would also be breaking this team up to let him go!
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from JWensink. Show JWensink's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds:
    Lucic is locked up for 2009-2010, so its not a Kessel/Lucic either or proposition.   After this season the Bruins as you know them will be different.  Managment will have to break up this team due to expiring contracts/salary demands and cap restraints.  I want to win a cup this season! In my opinion, having another scorer like Kessel gives us a better chance to win. I can replace expensive grit with younger cheaper grit. ill trade my
    Posted by ocram


    What a BS response from you- The answer is MILAN LUCIC! Because goal scoring is only one factor in the NHL. Kessel had almost 20 more goals than Lucic, but isn't even close as to who is more important to this team. You are busted.
    And please don't compare AHL guys with someone like Kobasew who is a legit cap friendly 20-25 goals a year guy with heart and grit. I'm glad your not the GM.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from bgrif008. Show bgrif008's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    Im sooooooo tired of the kessel talk.....I hope they trade him....Someone else will score his goals, because PK wont be there to do it. Seriously, the B's dont need him as bad as everyone thinks. Is he a good player yes, will he help the team, sure. But the way everyone is acting, its like the B's dont stand a chance without him. And YES, Savard is sweet and he makes kessel what he is.....Sturm and Savard on a line will do just fine. Quit pinning the B's hopes on one player.....especially PK.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BruWingFan. Show BruWingFan's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    Everyone talks of Sturm replacing Kessel's production.

    Gee, what would the B's be like if we added Sturm's 25 goals along with Kessels 40?

    IMO it's easier to replace a Kobasew than a Kessel. Besides that, what happens should Sturm re-injure his knee? Boston hasn't exactly been kind to wonky knees in the past now have they?




     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from ocram. Show ocram's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    Why is it BS? especially when I can have both Lucic & Kessel in 2009-2010!  They are both important players for different reasons.

    hardly busted.

    come at me with something better

    Im not denegrating Kobasews game, my point is that it is alot easier to replace a Kobasew than a Kessel.  Marchand/Sobotka could be budding future Kobasews, If I have to choose I choose Kessel! Salary cap league reality




     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from duinne. Show duinne's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    In Response to question for hockey minds:
    when was the last time 36 goal scorer was traded under the age of 21. so sign phil he will be the next 50 goal bruin and in this day and era thats impressive
    Posted by ignaceontario


    Salary cap Salary cap Salary cap Salary cap.

    It's easy to say "sign Phil." The Bruins have said, ad nauseum, that they want to sign Phil. HOW exactly, do they sign Phil, if he won't sign a cap-friendly contract?
    And to be accurate, he's not under the age of 21. He turns 22 in October.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from islamorada. Show islamorada's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    Tough to answer when the phrase "for hockey minds" used in framing the question. Nonetheless, Cam Neely was traded when he was 22 and then scored 36 goals with the Bruins. The trade was one of the worse in NHL history.  If there is an answer, it would have to be in the so-called modern era of ice hockey. 
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from rolerhoky19. Show rolerhoky19's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    One, Neely was traded after a 14 goal season.. prior to his 36 goal season, and would never have had the career in Vancouver that he had in Boston as they would not have utilized him that way.. the kessel progression 11-19-36 next 68?? stupidest line of thought I have ever seen..  There is a huge gap between scoring 36 goals with Savard as your center and being a legit threat to score 50 on your own, the kid hasnt put up back to back 30 goal seasons yet, hasn't had 2 20 goal seasons or even a 40 goal season.. 50 goal scorers are rare, and the real deal 50 goal scorers are dominate players way beyond anything we have seen from kessel...

    this is the entire list of 50 goal seasons since 2000, aside from cheechoo and hedjuk (who also had outstanding centermen),  Phil isnt in the class of any of these guys..

    Alexander Ovechkin Washington Capitals
    2008-09
    56
    79
    Alexander Ovechkin Washington Capitals
    2007–08
    65
    82
    Ilya Kovalchuk Atlanta Thrashers
    2007–08
    52
    79
    Jarome Iginla Calgary Flames
    2007–08
    50
    82
    Dany HeatleyOttawa Senators
    2006–07
    50
    82
    Vincent LecavalierTampa Bay Lightning
    2006–07
    52
    82
    Jonathan CheechooSan Jose Sharks
    2005–06
    56
    82
    Dany HeatleyOttawa Senators
    2005–06
    50
    82
    Jaromir JagrNew York Rangers
    2005–06
    54
    82
    Ilya KovalchukAtlanta Thrashers
    2005–06
    52
    78
    Alexander OvechkinWashington Capitals
    2005-06
    52
    81
    Milan HejdukColorado Avalanche
    2002–03
    50
    82
    Jarome IginlaCalgary Flames
    2001–02
    52
    82
    Pavel BureFlorida Panthers
    2000–01
    59
    82
    Jaromir JagrPittsburgh Penguins
    2000–01
    52
    81
    Joe SakicColorado Avalanche
    2000–01
    54
    82
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from dkrejci46. Show dkrejci46's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds:
    GOALS win hockey games, despite people liking the grittiness of players such as Kobasew.  Don't get lost in the style points. What if you subtract Kobasew's 20, add Kessel's 36 and give a chance to youngsters with grit such as Sobotka and/or Marchand a chance?  Wouldn't that give you more scoring ability (Kessel) along with the sandpaper of Sobotka/Marchand? Also add Sturm's goals, and improvements from other players like Lucic, Wheeler, etc.. this team will be ALOT better! Getting rid of Kessel to me, this would be another in the long line of 2 - 5's for a 10 types of trade that the bruins are notorious for.  Don't delay with draft picks, Let's go for a Stanley Cup!
    Posted by ocram


    noooo, defense wins hockey games, it seems to be that most teams that win the cup are well balanced and don't have a 50 goal guy. Who was the last team to win the cup with a 50 goal scorer on their team? its been a while
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    We have no control over the Kessel situation.  Let him walk and grab the picks.  Its how teams win in this NHL...The Bruins have enough team depth that will make up for his goal scoring.  Do you think Kessel gets all these goals if he wasnt playing with the best playmaker in hockey?  I seriously doubt it. 
    Kessel signs lets say for example the Leafs...there is a good chance that will be a lottery pick...very good chance.  The Bruins could easily trade their #1 pick at the deadline for someone like Kovalchuk...Kessel wasnt going to even start the season b/c he is recovering.  They could stand pat with what they have or possibly add someone like Sykora to play on the top line.  He hasn't signed yet and wouldnt be a bad fit...He is looking to prove something and get one more contract...sign him on the cheap 1 year deal and hope he takes off alongside Lucic and Savard.  At the deadline we add a stud scorer if need be.  This team will be on top of the eastern conference.

    Let him walk...watch what he does in Toronto...he will be a bust...he has no one there to play with and doesnt have the sac to play as the lead man...I seriously think I could chip in 20 playing with savard...skate to the net get goal...seems simple enough with the wizard out there passing...

    Bruins will be fine...and like I said he might not be back until X-mas...
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from JWensink. Show JWensink's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds:
    We have no control over the Kessel situation.  Let him walk and grab the picks.  Its how teams win in this NHL...The Bruins have enough team depth that will make up for his goal scoring.  Do you think Kessel gets all these goals if he wasnt playing with the best playmaker in hockey?  I seriously doubt it.  Kessel signs lets say for example the Leafs...there is a good chance that will be a lottery pick...very good chance.  The Bruins could easily trade their #1 pick at the deadline for someone like Kovalchuk...Kessel wasnt going to even start the season b/c he is recovering.  They could stand pat with what they have or possibly add someone like Sykora to play on the top line.  He hasn't signed yet and wouldnt be a bad fit...He is looking to prove something and get one more contract...sign him on the cheap 1 year deal and hope he takes off alongside Lucic and Savard.  At the deadline we add a stud scorer if need be.  This team will be on top of the eastern conference. Let him walk...watch what he does in Toronto...he will be a bust...he has no one there to play with and doesnt have the sac to play as the lead man...I seriously think I could chip in 20 playing with savard...skate to the net get goal...seems simple enough with the wizard out there passing... Bruins will be fine...and like I said he might not be back until X-mas...
    Posted by shuperman


    Did you say KOVALCHUK? OH YEH! Now thats what I'm talkin about.
    Phil who?
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from ssags111. Show ssags111's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds:
    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds : You don't get his 36 goals back. Savard is a great setup man but no other Bruin has scored 30 with him let alone 36. Murray got 28 and 17 after scoring 44 with Joe. Sturm hit his 27, so Kessel scores 36 and is only 21. Everyone keeps saying all our other youth are going to improve so why wouldn't Kessel. His progression rate has been 11 - 19 - 36 G so his next step is about 68 and prorate that over 60 games will be a 50 goal season.  He may not hit 50, but I wouldn't be surprised with the depth of this team that he wouldn't. You don't trade a potential 50 goal scorer and say we are getting better, we'll get the goals from elsewhere, it doesn't happen. As Wensink & yourself say trading Kobasew will be a big loss. His 25 -30 goals will be a loss but it's his never quit attitude that will be missed more. I would prefer not to lose him either. Send Sturm(Salary) down after Kessel comes back and all will be good and we will have a player standing in the wings. Do not compare Sturm to Kessel, same style but has never acheived and never hit 30. Can't even compare him to Kobasew as he doesn't have the grit and tenaciousness and goals output is similar. Kobie is 4 years younger and makes 1.2M less. Ryder is another option because of his salary 4M, but he is a big contributor and also a playoff factor. Do I keep Kessel over any of these 3, yes, no brainer. I will not like to lose any of these  or anyone else but it needs to be done. You have never seen a good scorer traded for nothing, unless a trade deadline dump and this is not a trade deadline.
    Posted by No4BobbyOrr-GOAT


    Because it isn't going to be just Kobasaw being traded.  Kessel wants 4-5 million, Kobasaw's salary is 2.5 (something like that) and the B's are up against the cap. So, who else are you going to trade to keep ONE guy?  One guy that is weak in his own end, one guy that has only had one good year, one guy that was benched during an important playoff series to get him to wake up, one guy that is easily pushed off the puck and has zero grit, one guy that is obviously a disgruntled guy.  You really think Kessel is worth two core guys? I don't  No way no how.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from No4BobbyOrr-GOAT. Show No4BobbyOrr-GOAT's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds:
    One, Neely was traded after a 14 goal season.. prior to his 36 goal season, and would never have had the career in Vancouver that he had in Boston as they would not have utilized him that way.. the kessel progression 11-19-36 next 68?? stupidest line of thought I have ever seen..  There is a huge gap between scoring 36 goals with Savard as your center and being a legit threat to score 50 on your own, the kid hasnt put up back to back 30 goal seasons yet, hasn't had 2 20 goal seasons or even a 40 goal season.. 50 goal scorers are rare, and the real deal 50 goal scorers are dominate players way beyond anything we have seen from kessel... this is the entire list of 50 goal seasons since 2000, aside from cheechoo and hedjuk (who also had outstanding centermen),  Phil isnt in the class of any of these guys.. Alexander Ovechkin Washington Capitals 2008-09 56 79 Alexander Ovechkin Washington Capitals 2007–08 65 82 Ilya Kovalchuk Atlanta Thrashers 2007–08 52 79 Jarome Iginla Calgary Flames 2007–08 50 82 Dany Heatley Ottawa Senators 2006–07 50 82 Vincent Lecavalier Tampa Bay Lightning 2006–07 52 82 Jonathan Cheechoo San Jose Sharks 2005–06 56 82 Dany Heatley Ottawa Senators 2005–06 50 82 Jaromir Jagr New York Rangers 2005–06 54 82 Ilya Kovalchuk Atlanta Thrashers 2005–06 52 78 Alexander Ovechkin Washington Capitals 2005-06 52 81 Milan Hejduk Colorado Avalanche 2002–03 50 82 Jarome Iginla Calgary Flames 2001–02 52 82 Pavel Bure Florida Panthers 2000–01 59 82 Jaromir Jagr Pittsburgh Penguins 2000–01 52 81 Joe Sakic Colorado Avalanche 2000–01 54 82
    Posted by rolerhoky19


    Idiot I was doing a mathematical progression, use an f'n brain and see if you can figure it out. The following year he'll score a 130.

    Phil isn't in the class of any of these guys? He may very well become that.

    You belong to the group that said our other Phil was a poor pickup from Chi in the 60's, he went from scoring in the 20's for them, scored 43 and then 76. These progressions are not unheard of.  Guy Lafleur went from scoring 21 to 53. Gretzky 55 to 92.  Bure 34 to 60. Now PK is not one of 'these' guys and I don't think he will become one of them, but he will become a 50 goal scorer.

    Cam was going to become the player he was no matter what, he picked up hockey at 13, was not picked for his team and worked harder every year, he would have exploded no matter where he was played. He went from 14 to 36 because he was going to score goals You can't keep a monster locked in the closet for ever.  Lucic is from this exact mold and I think he will score close to K's 36 this year as his improvement in scoring has been on the same progression as Phil's.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from No4BobbyOrr-GOAT. Show No4BobbyOrr-GOAT's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds:
    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds : Because it isn't going to be just Kobasaw being traded.  Kessel wants 4-5 million, Kobasaw's salary is 2.5 (something like that) and the B's are up against the cap. So, who else are you going to trade to keep ONE guy?  One guy that is weak in his own end, one guy that has only had one good year, one guy that was benched during an important playoff series to get him to wake up, one guy that is easily pushed off the puck and has zero grit, one guy that is obviously a disgruntled guy.  You really think Kessel is worth two core guys? I don't  No way no how.
    Posted by ssags111


    It all depends on the LTI on how many we might have to lose, it could be 0, we 'don't know' yet.

    Yes 1 guy who will score 50. I would hate it but Kessel would be kept over Kobasew. I would also let Ference go, his cap is 1.4 but his salary is 1.645 and he will be getting a raise next year as well, better to get a youthful D for him as next year we will probably lose him to the cap anyway. This way our D will get growth from the farm.

    Our D on the farm is not ready-blah blah blah. There are a couple that can replace Ference and his Injuries right now, so bring em up, where do you think Hunwick came from and he wasn't showing his offensive promise down there either, he's scored more up here.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from ssags111. Show ssags111's posts

    Re: question for hockey minds

    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds:
    In Response to Re: question for hockey minds : It all depends on the LTI on how many we might have to lose, it could be 0, we 'don't know' yet. Yes 1 guy who will score 50. I would hate it but Kessel would be kept over Kobasew. I would also let Ference go, his cap is 1.4 but his salary is 1.645 and he will be getting a raise next year as well, better to get a youthful D for him as next year we will probably lose him to the cap anyway. This way our D will get growth from the farm. Our D on the farm is not ready-blah blah blah. There are a couple that can replace Ference and his Injuries right now, so bring em up, where do you think Hunwick came from and he wasn't showing his offensive promise down there either, he's scored more up here.
    Posted by No4BobbyOrr-GOAT



    I see your point I just don't agree.  Kessel isn't worth more than Krecji.  There os more to hockey than being a fancy goal scorer.  Just like I would take Datsyuk over Ovechkin anyday, I would take a complete player over Kessel.

    Sure the pontential is there for Kessel to be great and score 50 but the potential is there for him to fall flat on his face without a premier playmaker like Savvy feeding him the puck too.  To me guys like Savvy and Krecji are worth way more than fancy pants goal scorers the Kessel.  Now if Kessel was the complete package like lets say Iginla or even had a hint of Iginla in him then I wouldn't argue with you at all but he will never have the whole package. I can't even put him in the Steve Y category because Steve didn't come into the league as lacking of the whole package as Kessel. And I think Steve Y is a good comparision. I just don't think Kessel is much to talk about.  He had a great year, 36 goals is fantastic.  Would I like to resign him..of course but not at the expense of losing too many core players.

    To me if you want to win Cups, you build around players like Pavel Datsuk, you want to put fans in the seats you draft Ovechkin.  Ovechkin and Kessel are both fancy pant goal scorers that will never guide their teams to the Cup but only follow the their teammates and the true leadeship of the team to the Cup.
     
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