Alfredsson and J.P. Barry vs. Bryan Murray. Very different takes.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Alfredsson and J.P. Barry vs. Bryan Murray. Very different takes.

    http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=429792

    Alfredsson

    "When I did my last contract for four years ending in the (2012-13) season, I was asked to help the team manage the salary cap by adding on a extra year to my contract," he said in an opening statement. "I agreed. Each side fully expected I would retire and not play the 2012-13 season."

     

    However, after the 2012 season, I told the Sens I wanted to play another season. I also asked to look at a possible extension this upcoming season at a fair amount to balance out the two years for both of us. They agreed. Sadly, the contract negotiations went nowhere. But I played out the season as I had promised and I believe this past season, in my view, was a very special one." "In late June this year, I decided I had it in me to play one more season," he added. "I told management I was willing to return and I reminded them of our agreement from the year before." Alfredsson surprised many a few days later when he signed a one-year, $5.5 million contract with the Red Wings."

     

    Bryan Murray

     

    "I can say this: I'm disappointed," Murray told The Sun after hearing what was said at the news conference. "It seems Alfie isn't totally informed of what went on. That had to do with J.P. - didn't tell me the truth during the week. He kept saying 'I can't get in touch with Alfie. I will get back to you with a number.'

     

    "He never got back to me. I never heard back from him after the phone call on Tuesday (July 2). Alfie called me himself on Thursday night to tell me that he was leaving. I said to J.P. during the earlier conversations I can't pay you $7 million. That's what they asked for for the year.

     

    "I offered $4.5 million. I said, 'Both of us hopefully are flexible and we will talk.' (Barry) said he would get back to me. I just took for granted that would happen and it never happened. I never heard back. I have not J.P. since the $7 milliion (demand in New York) Saturday meeting we had. It was $12 million for two years and $7 million for one. That's disappointing."

    JP Barry

    "I decided not to respond in July when Bryan chose to criticize my role as an agent in this process. It was an emotional day. I get it. "The fact is this was a negotiation concerning impending free agency. We made multiple offers and invited them to negotiate. They provided a number on the weekend prior to July 5 and said this is all they can do due to internal budget restrictions. It wasn't a market offer in our estimation. They wanted Daniel to take a below market deal again after he had done the same several times previously and we didn't feel that was appropriate."

     

    If you are a Sens fan who do you blame ?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Alfredsson and J.P. Barry vs. Bryan Murray. Very different takes.

    I couldn't care less, but if I was a Senators fan, I would "blame" Murray and probably Melnyk.  Melnyk is on record as saying they couldn't meet Alfredsson's salary demands and trade for Bobby Ryan.  I don't now what they've planned to pay Jared Cowan, but they're $11M+ under the cap right now with 14 forwards, so they would really have about $13M for Alfredsson and Cowan.  If Alfredsson takes $5.5M to stay in Ottawa and Cowan gets less that $7M (which is laughably high), they could afford everyone under the Cap.  Melnyk, though, is also on the record as saying the Senators are not a Cap team - they won't spend to the Cap unless he feels they'll bring back the playoff revenue to justify it.  Melnyk talks like he's Ed Snyder, but he spends like Peter Puck.  It's his business, so hey, more power to him, but it isn't strictly true to say they couldn't afford both players.

    Murray also damns himself by putting a number on the table.  We know one part of Alfredsson's story is true: he was paid $1M last year playing out his old contract.  He was touch and go to return, so the planned retirement seems credible, too.  His cap hit on that last deal was just over $4.8M.  Murray admits that his opening offer was $4.5, which was actually a reduced cap hit for the Senators and therefore lower than the average salary Alfredsson has earned over the last 8+ years.  Maybe that was fair for one year - it proved not to be market by $1M - but when the Captain played out the string on a deal paying him rookie money, and when he has expressed that he thinks it would be fair of the Sens to overpay a bit on the next deal to even things out, coming in with that offer could easily be interpreted as the Senators not being willing to see last year as a gift horse.

    Both sides look dumb, though.  Alfredsson basically saying he was willing to help the team circumvent the cap with a planned retirement makes me think he deserves to play for $1M if that's what he signed for - don't moan about it in public.  Murray blaming Barry is juvenile.  And in the end, a player expecting "make-up money" is kidding himself - I don't think he would have signed the same deal he took in Detroit with Ottawa because he felt like they owed him market plus make whole money. 

     

     

    Are you not entertained?!?!

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Crowls2424. Show Crowls2424's posts

    Re: Alfredsson and J.P. Barry vs. Bryan Murray. Very different takes.

    Alfredsson made about $45M over the 8 years since the 2004-05 Lockout, pretty nice haul.  He is 40 years-old and no longer an elite talent, seems like the Sens offer was very fair.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Alfredsson and J.P. Barry vs. Bryan Murray. Very different takes.

    In response to Crowls2424's comment:

    Alfredsson made about $45M over the 8 years since the 2004-05 Lockout, pretty nice haul.  He is 40 years-old and no longer an elite talent, seems like the Sens offer was very fair.



    For most people, absolutely - no argument - but Alfredsson's point is about context.  This is a guy who has never had a cap hit over $5M and has played out every contract.  He had a couple years where he was paid $7M, but it was always balanced out by years when he was paid $3M or $1M.  We're talking about a guy who has more career points than Jarome Iginla in fewer games.  He has 10 fewer points than JT Superstar in 53 more games, and JT hasn't had a cap hit lower than $7M for at least six years.  There are two seasons where he finished top 10 in scoring, when only guys who had or have monster contracts of at least $7M out-performed him.  24 points this year will make him the second highest scoring Swede in NHL history.  A decent season and he passes Michel Goulet into the top 50 scorers of all time.  A good season, and he can pass Bobby Hull.  He's been the Senators' captain for years, and he'll be their first Hall of Famer.  He's been the key to their brand, yet Spezza has the $7M contract and cap hit.  The situation is very similar to Ray Bourque being consistently below market in Boston because he wanted to build a winner and he wasn't all about the money.  I admire that, so I can see how me might feel that, when things changed and he ended up playing for less than Shawn Thornton last year, the Sens should be willing to go above market - if $4.5 is fair market value, then $7.5M this year would mean Alfredsson got paid fair market value averaged over the last two years.  I'm guessing that's why Barry offered $7.

    Part of me says hey, if you weren't comfortable taking a lower salary to win, you shouldn't have taken the contract.  Pretty straightforward.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Alfredsson and J.P. Barry vs. Bryan Murray. Very different takes.

    Who do I blame? 

    I blame anyone who talks in public about closed door negotiations.  I see no benefit for either side outside "I'll get HIM."

     

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Alfredsson and J.P. Barry vs. Bryan Murray. Very different takes.

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    Who do I blame? 

    I blame anyone who talks in public about closed door negotiations.  I see no benefit for either side outside "I'll get HIM."

     




    Reporters were bound to ask a lifelong Sen why he chose to bolt and the fans certainly deserve an answer from the franchise that let it happen. I'm sure both sides would've loved to stay quiet on the subject because it seems like a bit of bad PR for both.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Alfredsson and J.P. Barry vs. Bryan Murray. Very different takes.

    Handshake deals are a thing of the past. Get yours while you can.




     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Alfredsson and J.P. Barry vs. Bryan Murray. Very different takes.

    Not entirely, kel.  Bruins had one with Rask and honoured it when he did pretty much all he could to show he's a franchise goalie.  Much to shupe's chagrin.

    dez - you could talk about the reasons without giving details of the negotiations, I think.  Alfredsson could simply have said "it was touch and go that I would come back last year, and when I did, we talked all year about an extension for this year, but the fit just wasn't there for either of us."  From all accounts, he didn't need to win any hearts and minds - the fans still loved him.  And they may not like Murray in this, but they'll probably forget that when the Michalek-Spezza-Ryan line is rolling.  The whole thing is jackassery.

     

     

    Are you not entertained?!?!

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from stan17. Show stan17's posts

    Re: Alfredsson and J.P. Barry vs. Bryan Murray. Very different takes.

    There's no one to blame, it's called "business".

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Alfredsson and J.P. Barry vs. Bryan Murray. Very different takes.

    In response to Bookboy007's comment:

    Not entirely, kel.  Bruins had one with Rask and honoured it when he did pretty much all he could to show he's a franchise goalie.  Much to shupe's chagrin.

    dez - you could talk about the reasons without giving details of the negotiations, I think.  Alfredsson could simply have said "it was touch and go that I would come back last year, and when I did, we talked all year about an extension for this year, but the fit just wasn't there for either of us."  From all accounts, he didn't need to win any hearts and minds - the fans still loved him.  And they may not like Murray in this, but they'll probably forget that when the Michalek-Spezza-Ryan line is rolling.  The whole thing is jackassery.

     

     

    Are you not entertained?!?!



    How do you figure? He signed a one year deal and proved himself. He got that contract because of the way he played. Had he not been as good he would have never gotten the new deal he has now. I saw that that as Tuuka rolling the dice on himself.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from islamorada. Show islamorada's posts

    Re: Alfredsson and J.P. Barry vs. Bryan Murray. Very different takes.

    Very succinctly put.  Bingo!

     

    In response to stan17's comment:

    There's no one to blame, it's called "business".




     
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