I've seen three of the four NYR games (which doesn't say much considering it means I've seen one game where they weren't playing the Bruins), and I would say that pretty only wins beauty pageants.  Pretty sure Tortorella would say the same thing based on his comments to McGuire in his on the bench interview (I love his "WTF are you doing on my bench" look).

Blah blah blah stats are bad, m'kay blah blah blah.  I was just poking the bear because obviously the guy's a hat trick away from being a point/game player at this point and he's more than capable of that.  My problem with the whole rage against citing stats is: at what point do you measure an individual player's accountability for his team's success (or lack of), and how do you measure it?  Nash got a pass for years in Columbus because that has been a disfunctional organization without a goaltender (Mason's one year excepted): "superstar in a bad situation".  Now he's on a team that went to the East finals and topped the east in the regular season last year.  His goalie just won the Vezina and his centre is a former Conn Smythe winner.  Their main roster change in the offseason was making the deal to get him.  Now they have 9 goals in 4 games and only 2 points.  Nash's line has 5 of those 9, but the trio is getting paid almost as much as the entire GDP of Tuvalu.  As for being their best player so far...is that good enough if the team 1-3?  Weren't there a couple of weeks in 1996-97 when Brett Harkins was the best player on the Bruins?  Or Todd Elik?

Honestly, I'm asking.

So you haven't seen the turnovers and bad penalties? I think that's all he's been consistent with. I'm not sure if you feel I was bashing Nash when I said he's overpaid and no guarantee to put up big numbers in NY. Time will tell but I know I also said the BJ's would be as good (or better) without him. I stand by all comments and welcome any and all "I told you so's" when the season is over.  And is that eye thing a dig regarding how good your eyes said Corvo was because that's my recollection of the conversation. You said Corvo was far superior to Kaberle. I said he wasn't. I can't remember if one of us was right. Cheers and a high 5!

 

 

Brace yourself as this is a TLDR post.

Regarding Nash.

You have seen the turnovers and bad penalties. I guess you haven't seen the positives while searching for the negatives. I have seen the puck carrying and scoring chances he has created to go along with moving his feet better then anyone on that team so far. Glass half full ( me ) and glass half empty ( you ). 

Regarding Kaberle

Corvo far superior then Kaberle? I liked his play better as a Bruin and still do. Superior ?
C'mon dez . A bit of an exaggeration don't you think ?

Kaberle's play as a Bruin was disappointing. He was brought in to be a #2 defenceman and ended up #6 ( TOI ) by the time it was over. And I'm going to mention this because it's your main point on how successful Kaberle was as a Bruin. His 11 assists in the playoffs ? Isn't hockey great when you can touch the puck, have no real bearing on the goal and still get your name on the scoresheet. Could this have happened on any or most of those 11 assists ? You bet it did.

Thank God, Kaberle was a member of the Bruins in those playoffs ? His play was forgettable for me as were any of those assists.

P.S. Triple Cheers and a low five with a kick to the shins.

 

 

[/QUOTE]

If "far superior" is a stretch then let's agree that the conversation was essentially that you felt much better with Corvo in the lineup instead of Kaberle. Your assertion was that stats didn't matter in that situation because your eyes told you all you needed to know. Feel free to diminish Kaberle's contribution to a Cup win all you want. With Corvo, the discussion leans more towards just how much blame goes to him over the 1st round exit. He was a bum wasn't he? I know you figure let results be damned but some stats are worth looking at.

Regarding Nash, am I wrong in my assertion that he's been often guilty so far of overhandling the puck? Am I wrong in saying none of the 3 penalties he took were "good" penalties? The 2 he took against Boston were both lazy plays that were 190+ feet from his own net. After awhile, you need to see results to go along with good skating from a guy that takes up more than 10% of the team's cap space. Double Cheers with an added back slap (and I'm also covering my nuts because I couldn't help noticing that you started kicking)!

In response to Chowdahkid-'s comment:
[QUOTE]

In response to cowboys9's comment:

 

Blow out in Edmonton... 6-1 and that is first period for SanJose... For all the young talent Edmonton has... the attention to small details in their overall game is severely lacking In all of them.. great offensive skills , no doubt, but you have to play your position as well, and not turn pucks over at free will....For those wondering who got the best pick in the draft Boston or Edmonton.. It is not even close at this stage...

 

Two games into the season and both are ripping up the score sheets.  Seguin with his 1 point and Hall with 2.

With these stats I am still left wondering. Who's widening the gap to make it not even close ?

Nothing to do with stats.. I know who has points, thanks . Simply put right now in their development stage , Seguin is much more advanced in over all game on offence and defensive zone than Hall is...not even close...Hall is a turnover machine.. Julien would have a field day with this guy...you don't agree? 

Bruins powerplay is nothing to write home about but have any of you seen Washingtons power play? Terrible. Watch Ovechkin, he just stands near the circle on the off wing and looks disinterested while his teammates fight to keep the puck in the zone.

In response to dezaruchi's comment:

If "far superior" is a stretch then let's agree that the conversation was essentially that you felt much better with Corvo in the lineup instead of Kaberle. Your assertion was that stats didn't matter in that situation because your eyes told you all you needed to know. Feel free to diminish Kaberle's contribution to a Cup win all you want. With Corvo, the discussion leans more towards just how much blame goes to him over the 1st round exit. He was a bum wasn't he? I know you figure let results be damned but some stats are worth looking at.

Regarding Nash, am I wrong in my assertion that he's been often guilty so far of overhandling the puck? Am I wrong in saying none of the 3 penalties he took were "good" penalties? The 2 he took against Boston were both lazy plays that were 190+ feet from his own net. After awhile, you need to see results to go along with good skating from a guy that takes up more than 10% of the team's cap space. Double Cheers with an added back slap (and I'm also covering my nuts because I couldn't help noticing that you started kicking)!

[/QUOTE]

Posting how great it was having Kaberle in the lineup and in the same breath diminishing how Rick Nash plays ?

Didn't think this was a possible discussion to ever have.

Alright I give. Your eyes win.

Nash is over-rated. Kaberle was a gift from heaven for the Bruins. And Corvo's performance was "far less superior" to Kaberle's stint in Boston.

Quadruple Cheers, while scratching my head, mumbling expletives and biting my tongue.

LOL.... Dez loves his Kab, not the wine (Cabernet) . 

In response to kelvana33's comment:

I'm almost sad watching Ovechkin the guy looks like he's 35 years old, no emotion. Right now he's just not happy. Come to think of it.... who cares !

You bring up the PP. Habs success , PP, Canucks , PP.  I mentioned it on another post last night that special teams are playing a big part the beginning of this season.  Bruins PK , perfect , PP ,  they have to do something !!! What is it ? 1-12 ?

On another note the 2 teams mentioned above have had more 5 on 3 than any other teams I've watched.

In response to Chowdahkid-'s comment:

Posting how great it was having Kaberle in the lineup and in the same breath diminishing how Rick Nash plays ?

Didn't think this was a possible discussion to ever have.

Alright I give. Your eyes win.
Quadruple Cheers, while scratching my head, mumbling expletives and biting my tongue.

[/QUOTE]


Where did I say it was great having Kaberle? My saying you were wrong in your assertion that Corvo was a better Bruin certainly doesn't imply that I feel Kaberle was a Godsend. It means only what I said, that I think you were wrong in your evaluation of Corvo (ie. your eyes were playing tricks on you). Perhaps when you're finished putting words in my mouth you can explain in simple terms not only how Nash isn't over rated, but how he's worth every penny of his exorbitant contract so far. I'll leave you with just a simple cheers as you should be busy enough trying to turn this debate around that you won't have time to learn any new fangled high 5's.

PS. I couldn't help noticing your failure to address any of my direct questions regarding Nash's performance thus far. Perhaps you didn't notice them?

 

In response to BsLegion's comment:

I love the wine too. I'm a bad drunk. We all know that.

In response to dezaruchi's comment:

Where did I say it was great having Kaberle? My saying you were wrong in your assertion that Corvo was a better Bruin certainly doesn't imply that I feel Kaberle was a Godsend. It means only what I said, that I think you were wrong in your evaluation of Corvo (ie. your eyes were playing tricks on you). Perhaps when you're finished putting words in my mouth you can explain in simple terms not only how Nash isn't over rated, but how he's worth every penny of his exorbitant contract so far. I'll leave you with just a simple cheers as you should be busy enough trying to turn this debate around that you won't have time to learn any new fangled high 5's.

PS. I couldn't help noticing your failure to address any of my direct questions regarding Nash's performance thus far. Perhaps you didn't notice them?

 

[/QUOTE]

Yes I'm glad you noticed the words "great" and " gift from heaven" . It fell in line with me saying "far superior".  

And yes I didn't really pay attention to your comments on Kaberle. Plain and simple. I think he's a bum. No changing my thoughts with that. 

P.S. I'm getting the heck out of this discussion before you get really pissed and start with the responses others have gotten recently from you. This has happened way too much lately from where I'm sitting.

Let's just leave it as you're right and I'm wrong. I'm comfortable with that considering..........

No cheers, just have a nice day !

In response to Chowdahkid-'s comment:

 

Regarding Nash, am I wrong in my assertion that he's been often guilty so far of overhandling the puck? Am I wrong in saying none of the 3 penalties he took were "good" penalties? The 2 he took against Boston were both lazy plays that were 190+ feet from his own net. After awhile, you need to see results to go along with good skating from a guy that takes up more than 10% of the team's cap space. Double Cheers with an added back slap (and I'm also covering my nuts because I couldn't help noticing that you started kicking)!

 

Posting how great it was having Kaberle in the lineup and in the same breath diminishing how Rick Nash plays ?

Didn't think this was a possible discussion to ever have.

Alright I give. Your eyes win.
Quadruple Cheers, while scratching my head, mumbling expletives and biting my tongue.

 

Where did I say it was great having Kaberle? My saying you were wrong in your assertion that Corvo was a better Bruin certainly doesn't imply that I feel Kaberle was a Godsend. It means only what I said, that I think you were wrong in your evaluation of Corvo (ie. your eyes were playing tricks on you). Perhaps when you're finished putting words in my mouth you can explain in simple terms not only how Nash isn't over rated, but how he's worth every penny of his exorbitant contract so far. I'll leave you with just a simple cheers as you should be busy enough trying to turn this debate around that you won't have time to learn any new fangled high 5's.

 

PS. I couldn't help noticing your failure to address any of my direct questions regarding Nash's performance thus far. Perhaps you didn't notice them?

 

 

Yes I'm glad you noticed the words "great" and " gift from heaven" . It fell in line with me saying "far superior".  

And yes I didn't really pay attention to your comments on Kaberle. Plain and simple. I think he's a bum. No changing my thoughts with that. 

P.S. I'm getting the heck out of this discussion before you get really pissed and start with the responses others have gotten recently from you. This has happened way too much lately from where I'm sitting.

Let's just leave it as you're right and I'm wrong. I'm comfortable with that considering..........

No cheers, just have a nice day !

 

[/QUOTE]


Wow, I feel bad that you think you could ever fall victim to me mistreating you. From my perspective, you're always too even keeled for me to even consider berating you. Your observations are duly noted. I'll just stay out of your way from now on and certainly won't badger you for answers to direct questions. I'll leave you by pointing out that you can feel free to look back at this thread and easily spot when the conversation turned from a simple debate over the prowess of Rick Nash to questioning the quality of my eyesight. Far be it for me to defend my stance. I mean, I see you couldn't even be bothered  to explain how Nash is earning his salary. At least not when it's so much easier to fire a pot shot at me instead. So be it. My feelings aren't as easily hurt. I feel I work better that way.

A surprise so far.  The visiting Leafs are up 2-0 on the Rangers at the end of the first period.  Reimer's in for the Leafs against Lundqvist.  Rangers outshot Toronto 14-3.

Quite a few nice saves by Reimer also.

 

Max Pacioretty underwent an emergency appendicectomy tonight in Montreal - Out 3 to 4 weeks.

that wasn't nice , I had to edit. 

In response to RichHillOntario's comment:

Leafs have done a good job of keeping the Rags snipers outside the between-the-dots area(s). Also the Blueshirts are missing the depth of Dubinsky and Amisinov plus Kreider is havig some sophmore blues a bit. NY having trouble on offense with the top line loaded up.

 

Sounds crazy but Edmonton would be better off with the 18-30th pick of the draft so they do not have the pressure to draft these highly skilled players with their draft picks.  This team is in desperate need of some grit on the front and back end.

In response to cowboys9's comment:

And the final score is Rangers 5 - Leafs 2.  The line of Richards, Gaborik and Nash did the Leafs in with a 9 (?) point night.

In response to lucdufour's comment:

Well, that doesn't make any sense.  "They'd have been better off with crappy players who can check."

Partially so NAS.  The Oilers clearly lack a blend of finesse and grit.  Picture a team full of Seguins.  Yes, he is immensely talented but you cannot win if you don't have some toughness as part of your Top 6 forwards and Top 4 D men. RNH, Eberle, Hemsky, Gagner, Schultz, Nail, etc... is a very "soft" lineup.   Phoenix, who I think is the most boring team in the NHL, is much tougher to play with their crappy checkers than the Oilers who give you all the time and space that you want. 

I'm not saying that you don't want the first or second pick of the draft as you certainly take that---  You just need to complement these type of guys with skilled power forwards and some tough defensemen, and these type of players are usually guys not drafted #1 or #2.  

Unless you are in the penalty box, Edmonton has been easy to play against 5-on-5 so far--no denying that.

In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

If Taylor Hall was drafted by the Bruins he would not be a turnover machine simply because he would be playing for the Bruins....And posters on here would be writing how much more developed he is than that turnover machine Tyler Seguin in Edmonton.

When i watch players like Nugent-Hopkins,Eberle and Hall the last thing that comes to mind is the word soft. Super talented and learning on the job while on a bad team yes, also disgustingly gifted. Give it a couple years and it wouldn't shock me if all 3 were among the leaders in many offensive categories, with Nugent-Hopkins close to the top with Crosby and Malkin.

Fine. They are not soft; they just lack severe physical presence and defensive discipline all over the ice.   

I actually like Hall.  He is not in the same "soft" mold as the others that I mentioned. 

I too actually enjoy watching the Oilers because of their talent and individual skill level.  And yes, they can only "go up" after their recent past.  I just think they should trade one of these "highly skilled" players (as they already have 1 too many imho) for some assets they will address their immediate needs and give them more balance.   This way here you don't have to "give it a couple of years".   

In response to lucdufour's comment:

I said in another thread they should trade one (probably Eberle now that I think of it) for Subban in a package deal..By the time these kids mature they wont be able to pay all of them..

In response to dezaruchi's comment:

Wow, I feel bad that you think you could ever fall victim to me mistreating you. From my perspective, you're always too even keeled for me to even consider berating you. Your observations are duly noted. I'll just stay out of your way from now on and certainly won't badger you for answers to direct questions. I'll leave you by pointing out that you can feel free to look back at this thread and easily spot when the conversation turned from a simple debate over the prowess of Rick Nash to questioning the quality of my eyesight. Far be it for me to defend my stance. I mean, I see you couldn't even be bothered  to explain how Nash is earning his salary. At least not when it's so much easier to fire a pot shot at me instead. So be it. My feelings aren't as easily hurt. I feel I work better that way.

[/QUOTE]

Yes dez, it's all about me.

It's easier to walk away from so much anger then have to listen to it. It must be tough to live with a short fuse.

In response to kelvana33's comment:

It's funny you said this. My brother and I ( both fans of the OHL ) just talked about Hall and Seguin last night.

Bruins fans ?

Some wear their colours sometimes to a point where comments come out about opposing players ( and their own ) that are totally ridiculous.

Taylor Hall , a turnover machine and soft ? The knock against him going into the draft was he put his body on the line too much. And if trying to be creative in manufacturing scoring chances in the offensive end is called being a turnover machine, I'll take this type of player every time. Players who can only cycle are a dime a dozen. 

He is dynamic and a heck of a hockey player, as Seguin is.   

Sorry Dez to slip a comment into your discussion.  I totally agree with the below statement witnessed in the last game with the Rangers.  Nash is overplaying the puck ie. Columbus style.  I hope he continues to struggle but I think Nash will develp more in the next month or so.  The Rangers picked up Arnott to create more balance up front.  The trade did create an imbalance at this point.  

 

In response to dezaruchi's comment:

If "far superior" is a stretch then let's agree that the conversation was essentially that you felt much better with Corvo in the lineup instead of Kaberle. Your assertion was that stats didn't matter in that situation because your eyes told you all you needed to know. Feel free to diminish Kaberle's contribution to a Cup win all you want. With Corvo, the discussion leans more towards just how much blame goes to him over the 1st round exit. He was a bum wasn't he? I know you figure let results be damned but some stats are worth looking at.

Regarding Nash, am I wrong in my assertion that he's been often guilty so far of overhandling the puck? Am I wrong in saying none of the 3 penalties he took were "good" penalties? The 2 he took against Boston were both lazy plays that were 190+ feet from his own net. After awhile, you need to see results to go along with good skating from a guy that takes up more than 10% of the team's cap space. Double Cheers with an added back slap (and I'm also covering my nuts because I couldn't help noticing that you started kicking)!