Beasts of the East

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bisson1. Show Bisson1's posts

    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : the thing about the canucks doesn't really help with your point. The canucks are built to dominate weak teams, and struggle against good teams
    Posted by juniorfalcon19[/QUOTE]

    How's that?
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : How's that?
    Posted by Bisson1[/QUOTE]

    relatively weak down the middle....very top heavy, no top end shut down D man to speak of. 
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from OatesCam. Show OatesCam's posts

    Re: Beasts of the East

    The Flyers lost Carle, too. Their defense looks sketchy at best. I think Semin is a major loss for the Caps. Even with his flaws he has lethal skills as a shooter. Without him and his timely goals they don't beat the Bruins, and he was their number 2 scorer. Ribero probably makes up for him, but the Caps also lost Wideman. Again, he has flaws, but he was their top-scoring top-minutes defensman. You don't lose him and have no impact. The Bruins missed Wideman when he left.

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : Oh, you could make a case, and the eternal pessimists always assume that other teams' moves will work like gangbusters.  Or ghostbusters.  We could refer to pessimists as Egons. Flyers: had a strong year after enormous turnover and even though they were incorporating a number of rookies into the line-up in Read, Couturier, and Schenn, and they have a core of players 27 and under that's comparable to the Bruins's: Giroux, Simmonds, Voracek, Read, Couturier and Schenn up front, Carle, Coburn, Meszaros, Schenn, Grossman and Gustafson on D.  The loss of Jagr hurts a bit, but JVR was almost a non-factor for them last year.  As that young group continues to gel and collect experience, esp. Couturier, Schenn and Voracek, the Flyers could get signficantly better without adding any new players.   But development is never a sure thing. Capitals: Addition by subtraction with Semin out, though replacing him with Ribiero seems like a wash on almost every front.  They had a down year "rescued" by beating the Bruins - I don't expect Ovechkin and Backstrom to struggle that mightily this year.  And they clearly feel like Zach Hamill is the man to give them much needed secondary scoring.... Devils lost Parise and have little to replace him.  Worse.  But they should never have gotten as far as they did last year anyway. Pens losing Staal was a blow, for sure.  They're terribly thin at forward, and it seems clear they ramped up for a big FA move that never materialized.  They're marginally worse than they were on paper, but they will have a healthy Crosby to start the year. Rangers are better at the top with Nash.  It remains to be seen what they've really lost by dealing Dubinsky and Anisimov.
    Posted by Bookboy007[/QUOTE]
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : relatively weak down the middle....very top heavy, no top end shut down D man to speak of. 
    Posted by juniorfalcon19[/QUOTE]

    Kesler and Sedin are pretty good to have down the middle for your top two lines with Malholtra on the 3rd or 4th.

    Top end shut down D men don't grow on trees, many teams don't have one.
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]The Flyers lost Carle, too. Their defense looks sketchy at best. I think Semin is a major loss for the Caps. Even with his flaws he has lethal skills as a shooter. Without him and his timely goals they don't beat the Bruins, and he was their number 2 scorer. Ribero probably makes up for him, but the Caps also lost Wideman. Again, he has flaws, but he was their top-scoring top-minutes defensman. You don't lose him and have no impact. The Bruins missed Wideman when he left. In Response to Re: Beasts of the East :
    Posted by OatesCam[/QUOTE]
    They also lost Cody Eakins in the deal for Ribiero. He's hardly a throw away player (or maybe he is, we'll see).
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]I think the Bruins are the best team in the East, especially with Horton likely back to start the year. They were excellent last year and are icing a very similar team. Thomas is probably out, but Rask is in and Seguin and others could very well have career years. I have doubts about Hamilton, but if he can handle the big leagues they will be the best, deepest, most balanced team. Looking at their competition: Flyers:  Lost Carle, Van Reimsdyk and Jagr. Added Schenn. Penguins:  Lost Staal, added Sutter. Caps:  Lost Semin. Devils:  Lost Parise. Rangers:  Lost Dubinski and Anisimov, added Nash. Also Gaborik had major surgery. The five teams closest to the Bruins in talent all possibly got worse. I'm not sold that the Rangers are better with Nash and without Dubinski based on the way they played last year. At least against the Bruins who are so strong at center. And for all the talk of the Rangers top talent, the Bruins top-6 easily outscores the Rangers. The Bruins bottom six is even more superior.
    Posted by OatesCam[/QUOTE]

    Oates:
    Just to comment on your list here:
    Philly- JVR-Carle and Jagr.  Of that I believe JJ is the biggest loss.  I still think they will be a beast.  Their defense I think got better with Shenn over Carle.  I think the Philly faithful will like him more.  Plus Philly can flat out score.  I don't think they are done either.  As they stand right now they are a contender no questions.  All that youth they have adds up for what they may or may not have lost.
    Caps- Addition by subtraction.  I can't stand Ribero...but he can create offense and they finally have a legit #2 center.  They are also very young and have a solid back end and a good young combo in net. 
    Pitt-  I think it all depends on who they end up with.  I love Staal and think he will be missed.  I think Pitts back end isnt great and they have the Crosby health issue as well.  I don't like the concusion era.  Sutter is a very nice add on. 
    Devils- No argument.  Won't be better. Parise is a significant loss. 
    Rangers- I don't like their style at all but they are just a solid hockey club.  Their top 4 dmen scare me...great goalie.  Adding Nash to a list of fwds that include Richards/Cally/Gabby(when he returns)/Stepan/Kreider/Hagelin is pretty impressive. 

    My early prediction for the Bruins will rest on our depth down the middle and getting a youthful Hamilton a lot of ice time paired with Chara(Or so I hope).  What better on the job training then playing with the most important player in league.  Rask in my eyes has a lot of pressure and it will gives us an idea of what we should/will offer to him contract wise.  I hope Horton comes back healthy and hungry...I think his play gets Lucic going...I think the Bruins will be better then last year. 

    I gotta think Florida bounces back to reality.  I think Ottawa could go either way.  I think Montreal will be tougher to play against and have a great goalie but still are small...I think the Leafs stink...I believe Buffalo is a toss up.  I like some of the gritty guys they added...I believe Myers is the key...
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49-North. Show 49-North's posts

    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : the thing about the canucks doesn't really help with your point. The canucks are built to dominate weak teams, and struggle against good teams
    Posted by juniorfalcon19[/QUOTE]

    The stats don't really back up your point.

    Last season, the Canucks were 15-8-5 (35pts) vs. the other 7 West playoff teams.

    The Bruins were 17-11-2 (36pts) vs. the other 7 East playoff teams. 

    Virtually a saw-off.

    I do agree that the Bruins are built more for playoff success than the Canucks.  That being said, I think the main difference between the two teams in the '11 Finals was in net, and less so amongst the skaters.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : The stats don't really back up your point. Last season, the Canucks were 15-8-5 (35pts) vs. the other 7 West playoff teams. The Bruins were 17-11-2 (36pts) vs. the other 7 East playoff teams.  Virtually a saw-off. I do agree that the Bruins are built more for playoff success than the Canucks.  That being said, I think the main difference between the two teams in the '11 Finals was in net, and less so amongst the skaters.
    Posted by 49-North[/QUOTE]

    Apparently you havent watched hockey in the last 4 years.  Teams are trying to do what Boston did.  Just ask the LA Kings.  4 lines deep...big, mean and great goaltending.  Ask yourself this about the Canucks.  Do they have any of these qualities?  Soft, gentle and bad goaltending...and have done nothing this offseason. 
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from OatesCam. Show OatesCam's posts

    Re: Beasts of the East

    Yeah, I think all the teams on my list will still be good. My point was more that some are saying the Bruins fell behind this off season while other surged ahead. I don't really think that's the case.

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : Oates: Just to comment on your list here: Philly- JVR-Carle and Jagr.  Of that I believe JJ is the biggest loss.  I still think they will be a beast.  Their defense I think got better with Shenn over Carle.  I think the Philly faithful will like him more.  Plus Philly can flat out score.  I don't think they are done either.  As they stand right now they are a contender no questions.  All that youth they have adds up for what they may or may not have lost. Caps- Addition by subtraction.  I can't stand Ribero...but he can create offense and they finally have a legit #2 center.  They are also very young and have a solid back end and a good young combo in net.  Pitt-  I think it all depends on who they end up with.  I love Staal and think he will be missed.  I think Pitts back end isnt great and they have the Crosby health issue as well.  I don't like the concusion era.  Sutter is a very nice add on.  Devils- No argument.  Won't be better. Parise is a significant loss.  Rangers- I don't like their style at all but they are just a solid hockey club.  Their top 4 dmen scare me...great goalie.  Adding Nash to a list of fwds that include Richards/Cally/Gabby(when he returns)/Stepan/Kreider/Hagelin is pretty impressive.  My early prediction for the Bruins will rest on our depth down the middle and getting a youthful Hamilton a lot of ice time paired with Chara(Or so I hope).  What better on the job training then playing with the most important player in league.  Rask in my eyes has a lot of pressure and it will gives us an idea of what we should/will offer to him contract wise.  I hope Horton comes back healthy and hungry...I think his play gets Lucic going...I think the Bruins will be better then last year.  I gotta think Florida bounces back to reality.  I think Ottawa could go either way.  I think Montreal will be tougher to play against and have a great goalie but still are small...I think the Leafs stink...I believe Buffalo is a toss up.  I like some of the gritty guys they added...I believe Myers is the key...
    Posted by shuperman[/QUOTE]
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]Yeah, I think all the teams on my list will still be good. My point was more that some are saying the Bruins fell behind this off season while other surged ahead. I don't really think that's the case. In Response to Re: Beasts of the East :
    Posted by OatesCam[/QUOTE]

    Yeah I agree...Bruins will be in the mix for sure in regards to beasts.  My three fears are always the same.
    1. Finding Big Z some help in the top 4. 
    2. Pure game changer.  I think Seguin is taking strides to be that guy for me.
    3. Health, our run was due to a big health factor, if you look at LA they also remained healthy.   Health of teams always is the biggest factor...
    I think a healthy hungry Bruin team has lots to offer this year if there is a season.  They better negotiate while playing. 
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49-North. Show 49-North's posts

    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : Apparently you havent watched hockey in the last 4 years.  Teams are trying to do what Boston did.  Just ask the LA Kings.  4 lines deep...big, mean and great goaltending.  Ask yourself this about the Canucks.  Do they have any of these qualities?  Soft, gentle and bad goaltending...and have done nothing this offseason. 
    Posted by shuperman[/QUOTE]

    So... what happened this past playoff season vs. the Caps?  Does the same formula work every year?  Look at the Bruins playoff 1st rounds in 2011 and 2012, and see how either one could have gone the other way, with one more/less goal in that first series.  There are too many variables to simply say "build this type of team and you'll win".

    What about the Detroit teams?  They were deep, but big and mean? Certainly not any more so than their competition. 

    The elements of playoff success that are often not mentioned are: health, team-determination/discipline, external effects (early-round upsets of key rivals), and players peaking during the playoffs (I think of TT in 2011). 

    To say that you can prescribe playoff success with four internal attributes (deep, big, mean, good goaltending) is overly simplistic, and ignores the external effects which ALWAYS impacts the playoffs. 
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from juniorfalcon19. Show juniorfalcon19's posts

    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : The stats don't really back up your point. Last season, the Canucks were 15-8-5 (35pts) vs. the other 7 West playoff teams. The Bruins were 17-11-2 (36pts) vs. the other 7 East playoff teams.  Virtually a saw-off. I do agree that the Bruins are built more for playoff success than the Canucks.  That being said, I think the main difference between the two teams in the '11 Finals was in net, and less so amongst the skaters.
    Posted by 49-North[/QUOTE]

    i actually think the biggest difference was the number one d pairing. I think it's tough to argue that that wasn't the case. Look what the Sedin's were able to do against Chara/Seidenberg (nothing)
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    I think the B's will hover around the 4 or 5th seed all season. I think Nash scores in 40-50g range just with the jubilation of playing for a contender. I see Philly, NYR & Pitts fighting for 1st in the East despite who lost who & who gained who. The B's will have their work cut out for them just to stay close to these teams.

    I hope Kel is right & CJ does put Hamilton with Chara. Both Hal Gill & Don Sweeney have said they learned to play defence from Ray Bourque. I don't see putting Dougie with Norris trophy winner & candidate in the past 3-4 seasons can hurt the guy. You can teach how to create offense, but you need the talent to finish it. DH seems to have that. You can teach defense & you don't need a lot of talent to learn it, but you can learn it faster by having a good teacher. 

    I wish I could say that Seguin will have a breakout yr & get 90pts, but with CJ's system & how he gives out ice time I find that unlikely. Seguin is the one guy on that team that I wish CJ would just say "Go play like you can!" & set him loose on the league. He has speed, a shot & a skill set that this franchise hasn't had in years. Without the strength I put Seguin in the Claude Girioux category & he's just getting started himself. I wouldn't be a bit surprised to see him win an Art Ross within the next 3 yrs. (Girioux) I still hate the Flyers, but I love watching Claude play hockey. 
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]I think the B's will hover around the 4 or 5th seed all season. I think Nash scores in 40-50g range just with the jubilation of playing for a contender. I see Philly, NYR & Pitts fighting for 1st in the East despite who lost who & who gained who. The B's will have their work cut out for them just to stay close to these teams. I hope Kel is right & CJ does put Hamilton with Chara. Both Hal Gill & Don Sweeney have said they learned to play defence from Ray Bourque. I don't see putting Dougie with Norris trophy winner & candidate in the past 3-4 seasons can hurt the guy. You can teach how to create offense, but you need the talent to finish it. DH seems to have that. You can teach defense & you don't need a lot of talent to learn it, but you can learn it faster by having a good teacher.  I wish I could say that Seguin will have a breakout yr & get 90pts, but with CJ's system & how he gives out ice time I find that unlikely. Seguin is the one guy on that team that I wish CJ would just say "Go play like you can!" & set him loose on the league. He has speed, a shot & a skill set that this franchise hasn't had in years. Without the strength I put Seguin in the Claude Girioux category & he's just getting started himself. I wouldn't be a bit surprised to see him win an Art Ross within the next 3 yrs. (Girioux) I still hate the Flyers, but I love watching Claude play hockey. 
    Posted by nitemare-38[/QUOTE]
    Who do you expect to win the division then? I don't think the Sens have been consistently good enough to award them the division. The Sabres didn't appear to improve with their deals. The Leafs and the Habs are.........well, they're the Leafs and the Habs. 3rd seed (at worst) is there for the taking.
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    and who on earth in the south is going to overtake the Bs? 2nd is the worst anyone could realistically predict
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : So... what happened this past playoff season vs. the Caps?  Does the same formula work every year?  Look at the Bruins playoff 1st rounds in 2011 and 2012, and see how either one could have gone the other way, with one more/less goal in that first series.  There are too many variables to simply say "build this type of team and you'll win". What about the Detroit teams?  They were deep, but big and mean? Certainly not any more so than their competition.  The elements of playoff success that are often not mentioned are: health, team-determination/discipline, external effects (early-round upsets of key rivals), and players peaking during the playoffs (I think of TT in 2011).  To say that you can prescribe playoff success with four internal attributes (deep, big, mean, good goaltending) is overly simplistic, and ignores the external effects which ALWAYS impacts the playoffs. 
    Posted by 49-North[/QUOTE]

    Good reply
    Detroit breaks the mold everytime and I won't argue that.  But they have a group that year in and year out finds a way to get it done.  They have great leadership combined with skill.  Why did the Bruins lose to the Capitals.  Health.  I know its an excuse that I don't like playing but teams that stay healthy win cups.  Bergie scores everytime in game 7.  Horton...McQ and TT wasnt brilliant. Heck the Bruins werent even mean...and lacked the hunger and drive to win.  Shouldnt have happened.
    But if the last 3 cup teams played a certain way...and lots of teams following that mold I would think it means something.  I can tell you one thing though...teams found the blueprint on how to beat Vancouver.  And to say they are as playoff ready as a team that won I think is a stretch.  Vancouver hasnt had success...they reached the cup finals and have lost 4 years running when favored to win the cup.  I sound like I am repeating what many others have said.  I think Vans window has come and gone.  Teams take runs at their best players bc they can...There are very few guys on Van that I would wanna jump into a trench with and battle it out.  The 2010 version of Van was a much better team.  The Bruins team in every aspect is a better team then Van.  I realize you must play the games but as a Van fan you cant be happy with what they have done to get this team ready to play next year.  I dislike Van more then any team and I realize that blinds me.  But there is just so much drama with that team that makes them easy to dislike. 
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]Well, I'll just say that I hope the eternal optimism expressed by all the posters viewing 2013 through Bruins-colored glasses are proven to be correct!
    Posted by SoxFanInIL[/QUOTE]

    At the risk of being laballed a fellow pessimist three things have to occur for the B's to be among the top 3 in the East. The team has to remain relatively healthy, Caron and Hamilton have to prove to be solid and consistent for the full season, and Rask has to play for 55-60 games. If any one of these do not happen, it will be a very disapointing 2013.

    That said, GO BRUINS!!!!!!!!
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : the thing about the canucks doesn't really help with your point. The canucks are built to dominate weak teams, and struggle against good teams
    Posted by juniorfalcon19[/QUOTE]

    Ya sounds pretty rubish to me, they were good enough to go to the seventh game of the stanely cup. They had to beat someone good????Unless you think the entire west is garbage. But then again they just beat the defending champs in the playoffs that year it was just an easy pushover team... you know

    Then this year in the playoffs they lost to the stanely cup champs deff. cant beat winning teams. Nice post
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    B's around 4th or 5th? They play in one of the weakest divisions in the NHL. If they don't win the division I'd be shocked. Top 3 without a doubt.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from juniorfalcon19. Show juniorfalcon19's posts

    Re: Beasts of the East

    weird, thought i said "are," and not "were." the last time they played a good team in a 7 game series they lost 4 games to 1. 

    So, last year, played a good team, got swept by them. I was really only talking about the current make up of the team. But because you didn't read it carefully let's take a look back 

    2011: beat the Blackhawks (they were NOT good that year) in game 7 OT, Beat the preds 4 games to 2 (preds were nothing special) and smoked the Sharks (they were OK), played a GOOD team in the bruins and were beat, although it was game 7. 

    2010: Beat a 6 seed Kings taht were not very good, lost to a GOOD team in the chicago blackhawks

    2009: beat a crappy st louis, then got smoked by chicago who got destroyed by detroit, so it's not like chicago was an elite team. 

    Need any more?
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]B's around 4th or 5th? They play in one of the weakest divisions in the NHL. If they don't win the division I'd be shocked. Top 3 without a doubt.
    Posted by Bisson1[/QUOTE]

    Very true. I get the feeling, however, that the likes of MTL, Buffalo, and Ottawa will not be quite the pushovers in the upcoming season as in years past. Good thing TO is still an ECHL caliber team.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from juniorfalcon19. Show juniorfalcon19's posts

    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : Very true. I get the feeling, however, that the likes of MTL, Buffalo, and Ottawa will not be quite the pushovers in the upcoming season as in years past. Good thing TO is still an ECHL caliber team.
    Posted by jmwalters[/QUOTE]

    has montreal done one single thing to get better? come to think of it have the sabres or senators done anything either?
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : has montreal done one single thing to get better? come to think of it have the sabres or senators done anything either?
    Posted by juniorfalcon19[/QUOTE]

    Montreal has gotten bigger, Buffalo completely underperformed last season (many pundits actually expected them to challenge the B's for 1st), and Ottawa is one year older with many up and comers. Yes, they will all be better. The B's are essentially the same, less TT and with the addition of Hamilton and Caron full time.

    This is not to say the B's will not win their division, they likely will, but they can't expect these teams to be perennial pushovers either.
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : Who do you expect to win the division then? I don't think the Sens have been consistently good enough to award them the division. The Sabres didn't appear to improve with their deals. The Leafs and the Habs are.........well, they're the Leafs and the Habs. 3rd seed (at worst) is there for the taking.
    Posted by dezaruchi[/QUOTE]
    Will be better this year. And don't forget the Sens almost put the B's in as the 8th seed. It was touch & go for awhile in mid-march. So I wouldn't under estimate either the Sens or the Sabers. 
     
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    Re: Beasts of the East

    In Response to Re: Beasts of the East:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Beasts of the East : Good reply Detroit breaks the mold everytime and I won't argue that.  But they have a group that year in and year out finds a way to get it done.  They have great leadership combined with skill.  Why did the Bruins lose to the Capitals.  Health.  I know its an excuse that I don't like playing but teams that stay healthy win cups.  Bergie scores everytime in game 7.  Horton...McQ and TT wasnt brilliant. Heck the Bruins werent even mean...and lacked the hunger and drive to win.  Shouldnt have happened. But if the last 3 cup teams played a certain way...and lots of teams following that mold I would think it means something.  I can tell you one thing though...teams found the blueprint on how to beat Vancouver.  And to say they are as playoff ready as a team that won I think is a stretch.  Vancouver hasnt had success...they reached the cup finals and have lost 4 years running when favored to win the cup.  I sound like I am repeating what many others have said.  I think Vans window has come and gone.  Teams take runs at their best players bc they can...There are very few guys on Van that I would wanna jump into a trench with and battle it out.  The 2010 version of Van was a much better team.  The Bruins team in every aspect is a better team then Van.  I realize you must play the games but as a Van fan you cant be happy with what they have done to get this team ready to play next year.  I dislike Van more then any team and I realize that blinds me.  But there is just so much drama with that team that makes them easy to dislike. 
    Posted by shuperman[/QUOTE]
    Very much so!! The B's showed the NHL world what the Canucks are truly made of & LA came in followed it to a T! Grab a blanket, set a police car on fire get some smores, gather around the fire & sing "Kumbuya" come play-off time. The perfect ritual for Canuck fans! 
     

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