Brendan Shanahan

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from user_3957105. Show user_3957105's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    To be fair Shupe, Messier delivering elbows at will as you mention seems to undercut your argument somewhat.

    Messier can be called many things; hall of famer, cup winner, conn smythe winner, hart winner, one of the best leaders of all time....and the list goes on.

    What he is not is a fighter and you could probably count on one hand the amount of scraps he has had, none of which would qualify as a pugilist opponent. Yet he is also known for his many cheap shots (such as elbows and sticks to the face) which he could get away with not because of his fighting ability but because he had Semenko, McClleland, and McSorley to back him up. The lack of an instigator penalty did not dissuade him from this type of action one bit. And, yes, I was a HUGE fan of the 80's Oilers. If the current Penguin team had been playing in the 80's Cooke would still be up to his antics, perhaps even more so since he has had the backing of several toughguys the Pens have been employing in recent years (Godard, Engelland, Rupp, Asham etc).

    The difference between then and now is not the instigator rule but, as I have previously stated, the evolution of the game. The increased size, speed, and equipment of the players has added to the carnage of impact so increased regulation is necessary, in my point of view, to protect players from excess that can led to permanent injury.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan:
    To be fair Shupe, Messier delivering elbows at will as you mention seems to undercut your argument somewhat. Messier can be called many things; hall of famer, cup winner, conn smythe winner, hart winner, one of the best leaders of all time....and the list goes on. What he is not is a fighter and you could probably count on one hand the amount of scraps he has had, none of which would qualify as a pugilist opponent. Yet he is also known for his many cheap shots (such as elbows and sticks to the face) which he could get away with not because of his fighting ability but because he had Semenko, McClleland, and McSorley to back him up. The lack of an instigator penalty did not dissuade him from this type of action one bit. And, yes, I was a HUGE fan of the 80's Oilers. If the current Penguin team had been playing in the 80's Cooke would still be up to his antics, perhaps even more so since he has had the backing of several toughguys the Pens have been employing in recent years (Godard, Engelland, Rupp, Asham etc). The difference between then and now is not the instigator rule but, as I have previously stated, the evolution of the game. The increased size, speed, and equipment of the players has added to the carnage of impact so increased regulation is necessary, in my point of view, to protect players from excess that can led to permanent injury.
    Posted by jaywall


    I disagree.  Players protected themselves more.  Wanna run me from behind...meet mr elbow.  Gordie Howe was the master of it.  A lot of HOFers are far from angels as mentioned in Stevens, Messier, Cam, Howe etc etc. 
    Instigator rule protects Cookes.  Sure those teams have meat heads.  But Cooke would have to answer the bell eventually if not immediately which happened more often. 
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from user_3957105. Show user_3957105's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan : I disagree.  Players protected themselves more.  Wanna run me from behind...meet mr elbow.  Gordie Howe was the master of it.  A lot of HOFers are far from angels as mentioned in Stevens, Messier, Cam, Howe etc etc.  Instigator rule protects Cookes.  Sure those teams have meat heads.  But Cooke would have to answer the bell eventually if not immediately which happened more often. 
    Posted by shuperman[/QUOTE]

    Cooke actually did "answer the bell." It just took a few weeks. He took his medicine and stood toe to toe with the Thornton, our toughest. This did not change the evental outcome i.e. the loss of Savard. Alternatively, I am not sure Messier would have been so brazen with his elbows had he played for a less tough team. But, it was a different time with different circumstance.

    At any rate, nice discussion now time to prep for the game tonight. Should be a good one.....
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from bigvig. Show bigvig's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    I totally agree with the instigator rule.  Its a chickensh*t rule and promotes dirty play because those dishing it out KNOW there can be no immediate repercussions for their actions.  The league got MUCH dirtier after the instigator rule was put in place.  You WONT see teams signing guys like Georges Laraque because they do away with it.  You cant keep a guy with NO SKILL on your team simply to fight.  Teams are understanding this now.  They are too much of a liability where points are at a premium. 
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from 86redsox. Show 86redsox's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    "You cant keep a guy with NO SKILL on your team simply to fight."

    jody shelley.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from seobrien. Show seobrien's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    Of course Shanny is gonna make some rulings people don't agree with or will scream favoritism about. I just think that it is a brilliant move to put your face to your rulings (within a day or 2 no less) and highlight the play in question then explain your decisions and how you arrived at them. As opposed to just hiding behind the curtain crying that you are bound by the rulebook when in fact you're making it up as you go, a`la his predecessor.
    Long overdue and a step towards cleaning up a certainly tarnished legacy by Campbell.




     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan:
    [QUOTE]I totally agree with the instigator rule.  Its a chickensh*t rule and promotes dirty play because those dishing it out KNOW there can be no immediate repercussions for their actions.  The league got MUCH dirtier after the instigator rule was put in place.  You WONT see teams signing guys like Georges Laraque because they do away with it.  You cant keep a guy with NO SKILL on your team simply to fight.  Teams are understanding this now.  They are too much of a liability where points are at a premium. 
    Posted by bigvig[/QUOTE]

    big,
    I'm confused. You think it should be in place or shouldnt be. 
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from bigvig. Show bigvig's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    SHOULD NOT!

    Shelley is one of the very few guys still left in the league, making a "regular" roster spot, whose sole purpose is enforcer.  Thats a position that is going the way of the dinosaur.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan:
    [QUOTE]SHOULD NOT! Shelley is one of the very few guys still left in the league, making a "regular" roster spot, whose sole purpose is enforcer.  Thats a position that is going the way of the dinosaur.
    Posted by bigvig[/QUOTE]

    I agree. With cap space at a premium teams cant afford having these 2 minute a game players.  My bet on Shelley is that he is bought out same with colton orr.  It will be nice when actual hockey players are in the lineup. 
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49-North. Show 49-North's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    I knew that there would be some flack, but nonetheless...

    The League must be perceived to be free of any conflicts of interest.  Even if every decision seems to be 'on the up and up', the perception from observers that Campbell's decisions (or those from his office) could possibly be influenced by the fact that his son plays in the league is enough that he should have relinquished his position. 

    This is not to say that Campbell should not work for the NHL, but only that his position should not be one that could influence the competitive balance in games.  There are many jobs that Campbell could have taken in the League office, as soon as his son became an NHL regular, that would have completely removed any question of conflict.

    That what should have happened.

    Clearly, a similar situation does not exist with Shanahan.  I have no issues with Shanahan's past ties with the Devils, Blues, Wings, etc.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from bigvig. Show bigvig's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    Sure you dont, because your team hasnt been demolished by someone with six degrees of separation from Shanny....YET!  Youre SUCH a hypocrite.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ronstar8. Show Ronstar8's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan:
    [QUOTE]Sure you dont, because your team hasnt been demolished by someone with six degrees of separation from Shanny....YET!  Youre SUCH a hypocrite.
    Posted by bigvig[/QUOTE]

    ^Amen to that!
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan:[QUOTE] whose sole purpose is enforcer.  Thats a position that is going the way of the dinosaur.
    Posted by bigvig[/QUOTE]

    ^Please make it soon^...Oh and Shup why don't we wait till Shanahan actually makes a questionable judgement on a Detroit incident before we assume anything...
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan : ^ Please make it soon ^ ...Oh and Shup why don't we wait till Shanahan actually makes a questionable judgement on a Detroit incident before we assume anything...
    Posted by SanDogBrewin[/QUOTE]

    Im sure he will make a questionable call on more than just the redwings.  Thats my point. Shanny has played with a lot of guys around the league who are still there.  Shanny to date has done well.  That was my point.  And more or less to tell 49 to clue in.  Did they not remove Campbell from the finals?

    I mean for all he has cried about Bruins being suspended he forgets his team did some things along the way that deserved suspensions as well.  heck I pointed out Bruins ones that could have been called and other teams as well.  The league is far from perfect.  But it was a great postseason.  I don't think there is a "*" by the bruins run.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from bogie6. Show bogie6's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    IMO Shanahan will continue to be objective and by the book. Are you all going to applaud NAS for his suggestion that Thorny is one of the less skilled, and therefore less vital players for the Bruins?? Last night notwithstanding, some teams will still dress stupid "goons", but if they have no one on the opposing team to focus on, let's see better hockey.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chowdahkid-. Show Chowdahkid-'s posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan:
    [QUOTE]IMO Shanahan will continue to be objective and by the book. Are you all going to applaud NAS for his suggestion that Thorny is one of the less skilled, and therefore less vital players for the Bruins?? Last night notwithstanding, some teams will still dress stupid "goons", but if they have no one on the opposing team to focus on, let's see better hockey.
    Posted by bogie6[/QUOTE]

    I'm pretty sure that you and him aren't the only ones who know this. But okay if that's what you want .......clap, clap, clap.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from adkbeesfan. Show adkbeesfan's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    am i mistaken, or wasn't campbell not allowed to make ANY rulings concerning the bruins BECAUSE there was a conflict of interest? this duty was passed on to someone else on the disciplinary committee/front office. i'm almost positive of this, someone please confirm/deny. also, if there was any bias towards the bruins, why was burrows allowed to play in game 2 of the scf? THAT decision was ridiculous!   
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan:
    [QUOTE]am i mistaken, or wasn't campbell not allowed to make ANY rulings concerning the bruins BECAUSE there was a conflict of interest? this duty was passed on to someone else on the disciplinary committee/front office. i'm almost positive of this, someone please confirm/deny. also, if there was any bias towards the bruins, why was burrows allowed to play in game 2 of the scf? THAT decision was ridiculous!   
    Posted by adkbeesfan[/QUOTE]
    adk,

    I mentioned that as well.  Campy wasnt part of the decision making for the finals.  And I highly doubt he has ever made a ruling on the Bruins with Campy in the lineup.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan:
    [QUOTE]IMO Shanahan will continue to be objective and by the book. Are you all going to applaud NAS for his suggestion that Thorny is one of the less skilled, and therefore less vital players for the Bruins?? Last night notwithstanding, some teams will still dress stupid "goons", but if they have no one on the opposing team to focus on, let's see better hockey.
    Posted by bogie6[/QUOTE]

    bogie,

    everyone knows I am against dressing clowns.  I think Thorton played an important role in the finals and I hate admitting it.  But he is a leader.  So I think his role is more clearly defined than other Clowns.  Plus Thorton has some hockey ability. Very little but some.  Meaning I have no issuing dressing him when other clowns are dressed.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    Can't find the link but Senior Vice President of Hockey Operations Mike Murphy did the ruling on the Burrows chomp and Rome suspension because Greg Campbell was involved in the finals.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from adkbeesfan. Show adkbeesfan's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    this was not only for the finals though, this was a season long. campbell DID NOT rule on marchand(suspension), paille(suspension), ference(no suspension), and chara(no suspension). i think they were all appropriate decisions btw.   
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan:
    [QUOTE]Can't find the link but Senior Vice President of Hockey Operations Mike Murphy did the ruling on the Burrows chomp and Rome suspension because Greg Campbell was involved in the finals.
    Posted by SanDogBrewin[/QUOTE]

    If he was involved in the finals and couldnt rule on either side how was he involved?  He likely was involved in the process but I thought I read somewhere that he was taken out of the finals.  Obviously I could be wrong and as you know San I dont always read thoroughly. :-)
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chowdahkid-. Show Chowdahkid-'s posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Brendan Shanahan : bogie, everyone knows I am against dressing clowns.  I think Thorton played an important role in the finals and I hate admitting it.  But he is a leader.  So I think his role is more clearly defined than other Clowns.  Plus Thorton has some hockey ability. Very little but some.  Meaning I have no issuing dressing him when other clowns are dressed.
    Posted by shuperman[/QUOTE]

    Oh Oh . I think this post is setting up a battle of mega powers.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from I-Like-Hockey. Show I-Like-Hockey's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    All rulings regarding Bruins players last year were left up to Murphy, not Campbell.

    Didnt Campbell effectively step down b4 the Cup Finals started anyways?
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from adkbeesfan. Show adkbeesfan's posts

    Re: Brendan Shanahan

    ILH...that's what i thought also, campbell played NO PART of any decision concerning the bruins ALL SEASON.
     

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