Flames Draft A Dwarf?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    John Gaudreau was drafted by Calgary in the 4th round. The kid is 5' 6-137 pounds. I've seen lots of players under 160 get drafted but never have I seen a draftee that's under 140. How much weight does Calgary think this kid can put on? I'm interested in seeing how he does in Calgary's rookie camp although his showing up seems pretty eff-in dangerous. I'm trying to imagine him up against Chara and I'm just not seeing it. Good luck kid.......
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    The Flames once drafted a guy who was 141 and 5'5 at the time of the draft. He finished his playing career at 180 and 5'6.

    His name was Theoren Fleury.

    That worked out OK for them.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    The Flames once drafted a guy who was 141 and 5'5 at the time of the draft. He finished his playing career at 180 and 5'6. His name was Theoren Fleury. That worked out OK for them.
    Posted by red75

    Red, Fleury was listed at 5' 6-182 pounds when he was drafted. I think that 45 pounds is a considerable difference. Thanks for bringing him up. I may have never heard of him otherwise........BTW, where'd those numbers come from?
    http://www.nhl.com/ice/draftsearch.htm?year=1987&round=All&team=CGY&supl=N
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    I read 141 on the book I went to... 5'5 was a typo instead of 5'6... the NHL Official Guide and Record book 1993.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    And the 1994 edition has his entry weight at 181, fyi. Screwed up edition?
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    rocco grimaldi was taken early in the 2nd round as well.  5'6 160.  I saw him being interviewed.  Zero chance dude is 160 lbs.  More like 140.  We gotta remember they are just kids.  Gerbe is 5'5 but he has weight. 
    Most of these kids arent even close to being done growing. If they can add 15-20 lbs they will be fine.  The rest depends on skill, heart and maybe the most important, an opportunity. 
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    rocco grimaldi was taken early in the 2nd round as well.  5'6 160.  I saw him being interviewed.  Zero chance dude is 160 lbs.  More like 140.  We gotta remember they are just kids.  Gerbe is 5'5 but he has weight.  Most of these kids arent even close to being done growing. If they can add 15-20 lbs they will be fine.  The rest depends on skill, heart and maybe the most important, an opportunity. 
    Posted by shuperman

    Shupe, the point I'm making is if this kid puts on 20, he'll still be short of 160. That's just too small in today's game. A friend of mine(and former Bruin), Andrew McKim, was a small player who excelled in the AHL but couldn't make his game translate as an NHL'er. He told me that I could only imagine what it was like going into the corner with Scott Stevens(who eventually broke Andrew's jaw with a check).Like I said, I wish the kid good luck but have trouble seeing him make it through rookie camp.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    The Flames once drafted a guy who was 141 and 5'5 at the time of the draft. He finished his playing career at 180 and 5'6. His name was Theoren Fleury. That worked out OK for them.
    Posted by red75


    One in 5,400.  (30 teams, nine rounds 20 years)

    I don't like those odds.  I'd be a dollar on it, just because, but not a fourth round pick.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    rocco grimaldi was taken early in the 2nd round as well.  5'6 160.  I saw him being interviewed.  Zero chance dude is 160 lbs.  More like 140.  We gotta remember they are just kids.  Gerbe is 5'5 but he has weight.  Most of these kids arent even close to being done growing. If they can add 15-20 lbs they will be fine.  The rest depends on skill, heart and maybe the most important, an opportunity. 
    Posted by shuperman

    Good point about opportunity. Marty St. Louis may have never made it had Calgary not traded him to T-Bay.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from bogie6. Show bogie6's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    could be they are following Chiarelli's decisions on drafting players who still require 3 plus years in Minor hockey. I , for one, was intrigued when Seguin was first pictured last summer, and was as tall as Horton. Even with that, his 18 year old physique was no match for most NHL players. In addition, watching Kesler, in street clothes, he is a very strong physical body, and Bergeron went toe to toe for 7 games indicating how strong Bergie is. i have always held that hockey builds incredible strength and stamina, when compared to most other sports, excluding these wacko extreme fighting circus exhibitions.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Fletcher1. Show Fletcher1's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    Yeah, that seems a tad slight, even in the "new NHL".  Sullivan on Nashville is one other guy who comes to mind who is really light, around 160, who has made it.  Being around 140 seems impossible though.  I've seen Gerbe a couple of times in person and he has tree-trunk legs and a pretty wide frame.  he dodges and ducks 90% of the hits, but when he has to take one he is at least thick enough to absorb it.

    Isn't Gaudreau coming to Boston to play at Northeastern this year?  I'd like to see him and Oleksiak next to each other...
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf? : Shupe, the point I'm making is if this kid puts on 20, he'll still be short of 160. That's just too small in today's game. A friend of mine(and former Bruin), Andrew McKim, was a small player who excelled in the AHL but couldn't make his game translate as an NHL'er. He told me that I could only imagine what it was like going into the corner with Scott Stevens(who eventually broke Andrew's jaw with a check).Like I said, I wish the kid good luck but have trouble seeing him make it through rookie camp.
    Posted by dezaruchi

    I wasnt disagreeing with you.  I think most of these picks will have a hard time making the NHL and especially the guys we mentioned. I believe there is more opportunity now for small guys but they still have an up hill battle.  If its an equal playing field the larger player will be taking 95% of the time and maybe higher.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from OatesCam. Show OatesCam's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    I think size is irrelevant.  Yes a player that is under 140bls would have a hard time battling Chara in a physical match up.  But almost every player will lose that match up, if you are 140 or 210.  You still lose. For this little player, winning with strength will not be his game.  There are other ways to win in hockey, the way the Martin St Louis, Wayne Gretzky and so many other skill players to.  You need to be big to play a power game, but not a skilled game.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from bruinsfan4778. Show bruinsfan4778's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    The GM with one of the worst draft histories is Jay Feaster...in Tampa and now Calgary...hope the kid can do it and gets a shot, but i wont hold my breath.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    I think size is irrelevant.  Yes a player that is under 140bls would have a hard time battling Chara in a physical match up.  But almost every player will lose that match up, if you are 140 or 210.  You still lose. For this little player, winning with strength will not be his game.  There are other ways to win in hockey, the way the Martin St Louis, Wayne Gretzky and so many other skill players to.  You need to be big to play a power game, but not a skilled game.
    Posted by OatesCam

    Oates, I shudder to think what's going to happen if Raffi Torres gets a 140 pounder lined up while he's looking the other way. Most guys will lose battles with Chara, some might get seriously injured. 70 pounds is a huge difference but 125(Chara-265) is crazy.
     
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    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    I think size is irrelevant.  Yes a player that is under 140bls would have a hard time battling Chara in a physical match up.  But almost every player will lose that match up, if you are 140 or 210.  You still lose. For this little player, winning with strength will not be his game.  There are other ways to win in hockey, the way the Martin St Louis, Wayne Gretzky and so many other skill players to.  You need to be big to play a power game, but not a skilled game.
    Posted by OatesCam


    St. Louis and Gretzkys dont grow on trees.  Obviously they werent drafted to be pwr fwds.  But the guys that are drafted for that also have skill to their game and an obvious edge.  These fwds basically need to be a top 6 fwd in todays NHL.  I am not saying they won't.  But they weren't drafted in the 1st round so me thinks that their skill level can't be that great or they would be in the top picks.  Now, there is always a diamond in the ruff.  Maybe one of these guys proves everyone wrong. 
    I played with a guy at the University of New Brunswick (Derek Cormier) who was about 5'5 and maybe 160.  But he had the fastest 3 steps I have ever scene.  He had a rocket shot and you couldnt knock him down.  He was like one of those balloon punching bags that keep bouncing back. 
    He has played in europe since 1995.  In todays game he likely would have had a chance to make it. 
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf? : Oates, I shudder to think what's going to happen if Raffi Torres gets a 140 pounder lined up while he's looking the other way. Most guys will lose battles with Chara, some might get seriously injured. 70 pounds is a huge difference but 125(Chara-265) is crazy.
    Posted by dezaruchi


    You obviously meant a clean hit by Torres.  Better have or I will fight you.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf? : You obviously meant a clean hit by Torres.  Better have or I will fight you.
    Posted by shuperman

    I'd expect nothing less(of you). Torres......I'm iffy on him.
     
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    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf? : I'd expect nothing less(of you). Torres......I'm iffy on him.
    Posted by dezaruchi


    Even after watching the finals?  He played hard, played well and I would still welcome him to the Bruins.  Imagine that animal on the 3rd or 4th line next year.  he would eliminate habs one at a time. 
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from OatesCam. Show OatesCam's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    I think the same thing would happen to the little guy as happened to Brent Seabrook when hit by a (clean?) Torres hit: He would probably get injured.  The same would have happened to Boychuck if Torres connected in the Final, and he's  6'5".  I'm not saying the draft pick is good, I'm just saying there is nothing to indicate that small players are injured more often or less likely to score.  Sometimes small players learn at a young age how to avoid hits while a player like, say Eric Lindros, doesn't develop that skill and gets smoked all the time.  And he could get knocked down like anyone else in the NHL.  Big guys are also more prone to brain injury from head contact, because their their body doesn't move as much with the impact.  Much of the damage is done when your head stops moving.  A little guy might go flying, but their head doesn't snap back at the end of the hit.

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf? : Oates, I shudder to think what's going to happen if Raffi Torres gets a 140 pounder lined up while he's looking the other way. Most guys will lose battles with Chara, some might get seriously injured. 70 pounds is a huge difference but 125(Chara-265) is crazy.
    Posted by dezaruchi

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from LUCICmilan17. Show LUCICmilan17's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf? : St. Louis and Gretzkys dont grow on trees.  Obviously they werent drafted to be pwr fwds.  But the guys that are drafted for that also have skill to their game and an obvious edge.  These fwds basically need to be a top 6 fwd in todays NHL.  I am not saying they won't.  But they weren't drafted in the 1st round so me thinks that their skill level can't be that great or they would be in the top picks.  Now, there is always a diamond in the ruff.  Maybe one of these guys proves everyone wrong.  I played with a guy at the University of New Brunswick (Derek Cormier) who was about 5'5 and maybe 160.  But he had the fastest 3 steps I have ever scene.  He had a rocket shot and you couldnt knock him down.  He was like one of those balloon punching bags that keep bouncing back.  He has played in europe since 1995.  In todays game he likely would have had a chance to make it. 
    Posted by shuperman




    Shupe did you guys ever scrimage University of Maine? I know now it seems every year UNB comes for an exibition in orono. Just wonderin IF you did did you play against maine forward cal ingraham? Smallest hockey player I ever saw but he was awsome and despite his small size was strong on his skates.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf? : Shupe did you guys ever scrimage University of Maine? I know now it seems every year UNB comes for an exibition in orono. Just wonderin IF you did did you play against maine forward cal ingraham? Smallest hockey player I ever saw but he was awsome and despite his small size was strong on his skates.
    Posted by LUCICmilan17

    yeah i played against the maine black bears.  but this was back in the mid
    90's(man where does time go).
    paul kariyas brother was there.  who wasnt a big guy but had unreal speed and hands.  maine sold out that game, I remember UNH as well.  What an environment for hockey.  They threw sharks on the ice after a goal.   
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from nitemare-38. Show nitemare-38's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf? : Shupe, the point I'm making is if this kid puts on 20, he'll still be short of 160. That's just too small in today's game. A friend of mine(and former Bruin), Andrew McKim, was a small player who excelled in the AHL but couldn't make his game translate as an NHL'er. He told me that I could only imagine what it was like going into the corner with Scott Stevens(who eventually broke Andrew's jaw with a check).Like I said, I wish the kid good luck but have trouble seeing him make it through rookie camp.
    Posted by dezaruchi


    I played against Andrew in AAA Midget & he was bantam age! Bugger lit me up like a Christmas tree! Yea he was somebody that everyone thought could make it big! I thought so too.  
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from No4BobbyOrr-GOAT. Show No4BobbyOrr-GOAT's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    McKim never got a real shot in Bos with Sutter, kids like that need quality mins and not 4th line mates.

    Fleury still has not reached 5'6 without his skates or cowboy boots on and 160 or 180 he was fully dressed skates and even goalie equipment to reach that.


    Talent is not about crashing and banging, St.Louis I am pretty sure has never knocked anyone down and yet he was crushed in Bos.  The diff is that he got up and carried on as usual even tho he was smaller after that hit.  The key is whether the kid can fight thru it, he is not to engage in body battles his job is to win stick battles, jitterbug around and help his team score.

    Samsonov is still around 13 years later, not big production now but still showcases his speed and talent every blue moon.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from thedauber1. Show thedauber1's posts

    Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?

    In Response to Re: Flames Draft A Dwarf?:
    rocco grimaldi was taken early in the 2nd round as well.  5'6 160.  I saw him being interviewed.  Zero chance dude is 160 lbs.  More like 140.  We gotta remember they are just kids.  Gerbe is 5'5 but he has weight.  Most of these kids arent even close to being done growing. If they can add 15-20 lbs they will be fine.  The rest depends on skill, heart and maybe the most important, an opportunity. 
    Posted by shuperman


    you really can't tell just by taking a glance, hockey players store an awful lot of weight in their legs
     
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