Games canceled through Dec. 30

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Games canceled through Dec. 30

    No suprise here, but now where getting to the point where if there is no deal done soon the next will be games canceled through Jan 15...After that, Jan.30...I think those will be the last ones canceled, then it's the season...Bettman is on record as saying a season must be at least 48 games long. I know the last time a season was canceled it was Feb 11 or something...Going by how contentious the last meeting ended, after all that hope, I say if Wednesdays meeting does not result in an agreement by the beginning of next week then the season is cooked..

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from stevegm. Show stevegm's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    Don't think we need to see an agreement right away to save the year.  Neither side will be feeling the real heat for at least another 3 weeks....and there's still another 3 weeks after that to put a deal together.  I'll be absolutely shocked if the season gets scrapped.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from adkbeesfan. Show adkbeesfan's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    if there's no deal by new years... a 45 game schedule becomes unlikely, and so does a season. think about it... games start jan 15 end april 10 = 86 actual days. that amounts to a lot of 4 game weeks and some 3 game weeks. if this does happen, farm systems will be a huge factor in determining the outcome of the shortened season. gotta think the physical toll of so many games in a short time would provide younger players a chance to get in an spell the vets. makes for a very different nhl season, if there is one of course.   

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from lambda13. Show lambda13's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    Could they extend the end of the season? Or is that a definite no?

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from stan17. Show stan17's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    I'll be shocked if there is a season. I hope an abbreviated season happens but I'll be shocked if it happens.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from heyoo. Show heyoo's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    I think it is very unlikely that there will be a season. Both sides are locked in and will not budge on  certain specifics that both consider deal breakers. If something does not happen by jan 15 then it is next season you should start worrying about.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49-North. Show 49-North's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    I'm beginning to think that a deal from the pair of BigHeads Fehr & Bettman is impossible.  Can anyone envision a scene where these two stand together at a press conference smiling and shaking hands announcing that "we have a deal -- let the games begin"? 

    I was pessimistic from the start, given the nature of these two massive walking ego-machines, and I'm even more so now.

    The only thing I can think of that will forge a deal now, is that there is a "rational majority" among owners and players sending a message to their respective leaders that: "get a deal done, because if we lose the season, you'll be out of a job".

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    In response to 49-North's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I'm beginning to think that a deal from the pair of BigHeads Fehr & Bettman is impossible.  Can anyone envision a scene where these two stand together at a press conference smiling and shaking hands announcing that "we have a deal -- let the games begin"? 

    I was pessimistic from the start, given the nature of these two massive walking ego-machines, and I'm even more so now.

    The only thing I can think of that will forge a deal now, is that there is a "rational majority" among owners and players sending a message to their respective leaders that: "get a deal done, because if we lose the season, you'll be out of a job".

    [/QUOTE]

    You know that Bettman is the mouthpiece for the owners, but isn't behind the lockout, right?

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    In response to heyoo's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I think it is very unlikely that there will be a season. Both sides are locked in and will not budge on  certain specifics that both consider deal breakers. If something does not happen by jan 15 then it is next season you should start worrying about.

    [/QUOTE]


    Profound.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    In response to 49-North's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I'm beginning to think that a deal from the pair of BigHeads Fehr & Bettman is impossible.  Can anyone envision a scene where these two stand together at a press conference smiling and shaking hands announcing that "we have a deal -- let the games begin"? 

    I was pessimistic from the start, given the nature of these two massive walking ego-machines, and I'm even more so now.

    The only thing I can think of that will forge a deal now, is that there is a "rational majority" among owners and players sending a message to their respective leaders that: "get a deal done, because if we lose the season, you'll be out of a job".

    [/QUOTE]


    Well, twice now I was real optimisitic only to see it fail both times. Maybe now, who knows, even though it ended bad last time they still made significant progress. The fact they are meeting at all could be seen as a positive.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from islamorada. Show islamorada's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    In response to stevegm's comment:Don't think we need to see an agreement right away to save the year.  Neither side will be feeling the real heat for at least another 3 weeks....and there's still another 3 weeks after that to put a deal together.  I'll be absolutely shocked if the season gets scrapped.

    Sorry disagree on the bold words of the preposition, a preseason will have to be at least 7 to 10 games before the season then a 50 games a tight schedule with 3 to 4 games a week. Not good for the players, injuries, so me thinks like now maybe by the 20th of December.  

    I am still very hopeful stevegm, I was watching game 6 of the 2011 Stanley Cup finals, thinking this is way better than even football ala Patroiots.  The Bs team has so young and many of those younsters are a prime age.....cup runners for sure.  Get it on NHL/NHLPA. Marketeers are hedging now, so sign and deliver the goods to the fans like meself.  

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from stevegm. Show stevegm's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    In response to islamorada's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to stevegm's comment:Don't think we need to see an agreement right away to save the year.  Neither side will be feeling the real heat for at least another 3 weeks....and there's still another 3 weeks after that to put a deal together.  I'll be absolutely shocked if the season gets scrapped.

    Sorry disagree on the bold words of the preposition, a preseason will have to be at least 7 to 10 games before the season then a 50 games a tight schedule with 3 to 4 games a week. Not good for the players, injuries, so me thinks like now maybe by the 20th of December.  

    I am still very hopeful stevegm, I was watching game 6 of the 2011 Stanley Cup finals, thinking this is way better than even football ala Patroiots.  The Bs team has so young and many of those younsters are a prime age.....cup runners for sure.  Get it on NHL/NHLPA. Marketeers are hedging now, so sign and deliver the goods to the fans like meself.  

     

    [/QUOTE]


    I don't think you'd ever see a 7-10 game exhibition schedule.  those games and the overall training camp will be compressed to accomodate the necessary schedule.  we already have a useable model from the 95 lockout.  A deal was made Jan 11, and the first regular season games started on the 20.  what makes you think that isn't still possible?

     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from islamorada. Show islamorada's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    Good answer, 95' could be the model.  I won't look up the number of games lost to injury in 95' projected into the shorten schedule and compare to other seasons, that would open up a debate on whether or not the method was correct to establish my point.  Rationally though, many players are in better condition than 95', many more are playing in Europe/AHL, but the fact remains many are also not in hockey condition.  Logically more injuries could occur.  Thus if in fact the January 2nd date is correct for a hypotetical start of the season,  it seems the CBA deal must be struck before the 20th of December.  That's all folks.  Cheers!  Hope it ends soon.  

     

     

    In response to stevegm's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to islamorada's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to stevegm's comment:Don't think we need to see an agreement right away to save the year.  Neither side will be feeling the real heat for at least another 3 weeks....and there's still another 3 weeks after that to put a deal together.  I'll be absolutely shocked if the season gets scrapped.

    Sorry disagree on the bold words of the preposition, a preseason will have to be at least 7 to 10 games before the season then a 50 games a tight schedule with 3 to 4 games a week. Not good for the players, injuries, so me thinks like now maybe by the 20th of December.  

    I am still very hopeful stevegm, I was watching game 6 of the 2011 Stanley Cup finals, thinking this is way better than even football ala Patroiots.  The Bs team has so young and many of those younsters are a prime age.....cup runners for sure.  Get it on NHL/NHLPA. Marketeers are hedging now, so sign and deliver the goods to the fans like meself.  

     

    [/QUOTE]


    I don't think you'd ever see a 7-10 game exhibition schedule.  those games and the overall training camp will be compressed to accomodate the necessary schedule.  we already have a useable model from the 95 lockout.  A deal was made Jan 11, and the first regular season games started on the 20.  what makes you think that isn't still possible?

     

    [/QUOTE]


     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    An NHL season is 80 games minimum.  Anythng less is a farce.  A 40 something game schedule?  How serious would you take the NHL playoffs if they started at the end of January?  I take more offense to them saying, "Hey, it's not a real season, but a half of a season, but they'll watch it anyway" than I do from them canceling the whole season outright. 


    Yeah, I'll probably still go and I'll surely watch, but I won't be as happy about it.

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from lambda13. Show lambda13's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    NAS I'm glad you admit that you'd watch despite being unhappy about it, I too would watch. I'd rather have some hockey to watch then none as well.

    Game 7 was on last night. What a great game.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    An NHL season is 80 games minimum.  Anythng less is a farce.  A 40 something game schedule?  How serious would you take the NHL playoffs if they started at the end of January?  I take more offense to them saying, "Hey, it's not a real season, but a half of a season, but they'll watch it anyway" than I do from them canceling the whole season outright. 


    Yeah, I'll probably still go and I'll surely watch, but I won't be as happy about it.

     

    [/QUOTE]
    The NBA had a shortened season last year.  It wasn't the same, but still better than no NBA season.  I wouldn't be surprised if the NHL cancels the entire season.  If this isn't settled soon, it will be almost impossible for them to have even an abbreviated season.  It is also very difficult for the players to play many back to back games.  

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from BsLegion. Show BsLegion's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    In response to susan250's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    An NHL season is 80 games minimum.  Anythng less is a farce.  A 40 something game schedule?  How serious would you take the NHL playoffs if they started at the end of January?  I take more offense to them saying, "Hey, it's not a real season, but a half of a season, but they'll watch it anyway" than I do from them canceling the whole season outright. 


    Yeah, I'll probably still go and I'll surely watch, but I won't be as happy about it.

     

    [/QUOTE]
    The NBA had a shortened season last year.  It wasn't the same, but still better than no NBA season.  I wouldn't be surprised if the NHL cancels the entire season.  If this isn't settled soon, it will be almost impossible for them to have even an abbreviated season.  It is also very difficult for the players to play many back to back games.  

    [/QUOTE]


    Let's just say the sooner the NHL imposes a drop dead date the sooner the PA will stop negociating and changing the proposed CBA .  Right now Fehr is telling them , they waited this long , let's continue to wait it out and maybe the owners will gve us more.  

    It's like a child asking for icecream, you keep saying no but then give them 1scoop ,   the child will ask and ask till you give them 2 scoops. Then you do !  what do you think comes next ? ...... not till you put your foot down and say this is final they'll keep asking . 

    No icecream for you !

     

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from 50belowzero. Show 50belowzero's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    In response to BsLegion's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to susan250's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    An NHL season is 80 games minimum.  Anythng less is a farce.  A 40 something game schedule?  How serious would you take the NHL playoffs if they started at the end of January?  I take more offense to them saying, "Hey, it's not a real season, but a half of a season, but they'll watch it anyway" than I do from them canceling the whole season outright. 


    Yeah, I'll probably still go and I'll surely watch, but I won't be as happy about it.

     

    [/QUOTE]
    The NBA had a shortened season last year.  It wasn't the same, but still better than no NBA season.  I wouldn't be surprised if the NHL cancels the entire season.  If this isn't settled soon, it will be almost impossible for them to have even an abbreviated season.  It is also very difficult for the players to play many back to back games.  

    [/QUOTE]


    Let's just say the sooner the NHL imposes a drop dead date the sooner the PA will stop negociating and changing the proposed CBA .  Right now Fehr is telling them , they waited this long , let's continue to wait it out and maybe the owners will gve us more.  

    It's like a child asking for icecream, you keep saying no but then give them 1scoop ,   the child will ask and ask till you give them 2 scoops. Then you do !  what do you think comes next ? ...... not till you put your foot down and say this is final they'll keep asking . 

    No icecream for you !

    The way i see it, the only negotiating the NHLPA has done is wait to see what the NHL will offer. Its like the players say "we'll take this and that" but "we don't want that or this", and then they wait. The NHL's best offer might have come and gone, we'll soon find out.The drop dead date could be near.[/QUOTE]



     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49-North. Show 49-North's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to 49-North's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I'm beginning to think that a deal from the pair of BigHeads Fehr & Bettman is impossible.  Can anyone envision a scene where these two stand together at a press conference smiling and shaking hands announcing that "we have a deal -- let the games begin"? 

    I was pessimistic from the start, given the nature of these two massive walking ego-machines, and I'm even more so now.

    The only thing I can think of that will forge a deal now, is that there is a "rational majority" among owners and players sending a message to their respective leaders that: "get a deal done, because if we lose the season, you'll be out of a job".

    [/QUOTE]

    You know that Bettman is the mouthpiece for the owners, but isn't behind the lockout, right?

    [/QUOTE]


    Somehow, I don't think the Owners pay Bettman $7.5m to be a 'mouthpiece'.  While he clearly receives direction from them, the owners put him & Daly in charge of the bargaining process.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    In response to 49-North's comment:
    [QUOTE]
    Somehow, I don't think the Owners pay Bettman $7.5m to be a 'mouthpiece'.  While he clearly receives direction from them, the owners put him & Daly in charge of the bargaining process.

    [/QUOTE]

    Somehow I don't think they pay him $7.5M a year for his lockout prowess.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from WalkTheLine. Show WalkTheLine's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    Bettman and Fehr both have huge sway over their respective groups. I believe they are given direction but have a lot of latitude during negotiations. They are paid to advise and their consituents so far have listened to that advice to achieve whatever their goals are. BUT...at the end of the day Bettman and Fehr are employees and their bosses can overrule them. Ultimately whatever happens, good or bad, it's on the owners and players. It's their call.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    In response to lambda13's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    NAS I'm glad you admit that you'd watch despite being unhappy about it, I too would watch. I'd rather have some hockey to watch then none as well.

    Game 7 was on last night. What a great game.

    [/QUOTE]


    Just like in the fake '95 season, it would feel like a really long exhibition.  I was happy to watch the games because I love hockey, but I didn't have nearly the same emotion.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from lambda13. Show lambda13's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    I don't remember '95 all that well. I wasn't really old enough to fully understand what was going on.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/hockey/stalled-lockout-talks-put-media-in-play-as-leaks-surface/article6344601/

     "According to the report, the NHL governor proposed a nine-year collective agreement (with an opt-out after seven years for either side), a six-year limit on player contracts (with an option for eight-year deals for players who have been with a franchise for five years) and a "simple buyout option, "where the buyouts money would count against the salary cap.

    ESPN also spoke with two players who felt such an offer would be worth a vote of the NHL Players' Association. "

     

    Slight glimmer of hope. At this point though my hockey thoughts are to my beer league, 2013 WJC and how Bruins prospects are doing.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Davinator. Show Davinator's posts

    Re: Games canceled through Dec. 30

    Surely, when Fehr was hired by the NHLPA to bargain the CBA, he asked the union if they were prepared to lose an entire season over the issues they deemed most valuable?

    I don't think they'd be scrambling to salvage a half season...

     

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