HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from perrysound. Show perrysound's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    In response to 50belowzero's comment:

     



    But TT is a UFA at the end of the year, so NYI really get nothing unless he plays this year. 

     

     



    I don't think he is.

    [/QUOTE]

    http://capgeek.com/islanders

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from perrysound. Show perrysound's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    In response to 50belowzero's comment:

     

     



    But TT is a UFA at the end of the year, so NYI really get nothing unless he plays this year. 

     

     

     



    I don't think he is.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    http://capgeek.com/islanders

     

     Sorry for the double post, didn't think the first oen went through.

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from cowboys9. Show cowboys9's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    Isles can "toll" his contract for the next season , which would mean TT , if he wants to play in the NHL , would owe the Isles one more year of service.. So no he would not be a UFA next year.. 

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from heyoo. Show heyoo's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    Isles are one of the few teams that can actually sign players in the offseason most teams are going to have cap issues. Doubt they will waste the money on a third goalie with two goalies making over 4mil. They only made the trade for Thomas to cover the cap minimum this season. I would hate to be an isles fan your team traded for a pretend contract to make the minimum cap allowance when there was plenty of names on the ufa market this season. Teams like the isles should be swept undr the rug. 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    In response to dezaruchi's comment:

    In response to cowboys9's comment:

    Healy is still bitter at the Bruins.... Recall he and Paul Kelly were in charge of the PA not too long ago, and both were ousted when Ference led the charge to have both of them kicked out, if you recall ...No surprise here.. As for the Bruins move , it is allowed in the CBA , so it is a little sour grapes... And obviously it was a good deal for the Isles, and the panel still argued that it was done to get to the Cap floor...nonsense.. Isles were already above the cap floor , this just gave them more room to make a deal... Good deal for both teams .. win win...

    If this was a Leaf move it would be lauded as brilliant... Whatever... I am sure PC is not losing sleep...

    I actually recall Healy making veiled threats that Ference "was going to get his" and that he "wasn't liked in the B's dressing room". To Ron MacLean's credit, he called out Healy for the dressing room remark saying that's not a fair statement to make unless he was willing to back it up with proof. Healy wasn't willing. Ron Mac certainly made him look like a fool that Saturday night.



    Sheds allot more light on Healys venom towards the Bruins.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from lucdufour. Show lucdufour's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    In response to heyoo's comment:

    Isles are one of the few teams that can actually sign players in the offseason most teams are going to have cap issues. Doubt they will waste the money on a third goalie with two goalies making over 4mil. They only made the trade for Thomas to cover the cap minimum this season. I would hate to be an isles fan your team traded for a pretend contract to make the minimum cap allowance when there was plenty of names on the ufa market this season. Teams like the isles should be swept undr the rug. 




    The Isles will have spending room even if they have 2 goalies over 4 million per.  The possibility does exist that the Isles will not resign Nabakov and go with Thomas even though the former will be cheaper.  I know I would based off recent history.  Plus, Thomas will bring more to the gate and a new arena than Nabokov would.  

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Davinator. Show Davinator's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    To me, the choice of "tolling" forward the last year of his contract is ridiculous....the man signed a contract and should be held accountable for the last year....until he playes again with someone.

    Should he decide not to play, he is not paid, there is no cap hit and the clock ticks.

    The player(and his contract) are tradable and his rights are held with his new team with no 'best before date'.

    Unless I am mistaken, the deal expires after next year IF TT doesn't play...

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from lambda13. Show lambda13's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    In response to Davinator's comment:

    To me, the choice of "tolling" forward the last year of his contract is ridiculous....the man signed a contract and should be held accountable for the last year....until he playes again with someone.

    Should he decide not to play, he is not paid, there is no cap hit and the clock ticks.

    The player(and his contract) are tradable and his rights are held with his new team with no 'best before date'.

    Unless I am mistaken, the deal expires after next year IF TT doesn't play...



    I believe the Islanders have his rights until he plays one year for them under his contract regardless of when it is done. He won't be eligible to play in the NHL until he satisfies his final year of the contract.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    Frustratingly, lost a post on this for some strange technical reason.  So in a rare move, I'll be brief.

    Isles are obviously planning to toll the deal.  Why else insist that the trade be a 2014 or 2015 pick?  They anticipate not knowing if they have to pay it before next year.  Thomas has said he wants to come back next year. They may be planning to cut ties with Nabokov, who is a pending UFA, and they may intend to re-sign him  with the leverage of Thomas returning, and they may re-sign him with the intent of platooning him with Thomas to let TT show he can still provide top notch netminding before they trade him for more than a 2nd rounder.

    Players have to love this.  Thomas is a cap hit with no real dollars attached (out of players' share).  Visnovsky is out with no real dollars attached (suspended - out of players' share).  The deal frees money for players  in Boston and frees the Isles to move Visnovsky to a place where he'll play.

    The fear is that players can just walk away from contracts rather than retire - so some of the legacy back-diving deals where you walk away from $1M and a $5M cap hit.  Then the cap hit can be traded around so teams with money issues can make the floor without paying real dollars and teams that have overspent can go back to the buffet.  But this isn't different than if, as many suspected, Chiarelli had traded a fully-operational TT in the off-season, except that TT is sitting out.  You could see the Isles add a pile of aged veterans with huge cap hits and dimestore salaries, then sit them out most nights or play them as fourth liners.

    Short of completely tying a team to a player when he signs an over-35 deal, there's really no way to stop this short of accusing the team and player of colluding in the "leave of absence" and punishing them severely.  In Boston's case, no one in their right mind thinks PC went to TT and told him to diss Obama, support Chick-Fil-A, and then hold a year-long Tea Party in Colorado.  Take away the team's right to trade a player for hockey reasons and you've gone beyond policing the Cap.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    [Edit] That was brief?!?!

     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from islamorada. Show islamorada's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    I am not assured of the Isles tolling the deal.  Yes the offering was of a pick in 2015 was an option but only if TT decided he needed to make more money.  Reasonable in that TT is a free enterprise capitalist as a libertarian.  Nonetheless TT is a wild card trade in the long run for the Isles.  The picks mean nothing if he does not play. I think he has had it with the hockey world.  BTW he only said he was playing next year in order to reward the Bs fans and yes management for his treatment in his career in Boston.  The deal is strictly a Cap decision by the Isles.  

    Lastly this is not circumventing the Cap imo.  This was known discussion piece in the CBA undoubtedly as TT announced his Colorado hibernation before the CBA was in full swing.

    I posted this before as I respect Spector's point of view.   

    SPECTOR’S NOTE: Thomas is not expected to report to the Islanders this season. The club reportedly has no intent of “tolling” his contract forward to next season if Thomas doesn’t report. The move is to ensure they remain cap compliant should Lubomir Visnovsky have to return home to Slovakia, as his son is undergoing surgery this weekend.

    In response to Bookboy007's comment:

     

    Frustratingly, lost a post on this for some strange technical reason.  So in a rare move, I'll be brief.

    Isles are obviously planning to toll the deal.  Why else insist that the trade be a 2014 or 2015 pick?  They anticipate not knowing if they have to pay it before next year.  Thomas has said he wants to come back next year. They may be planning to cut ties with Nabokov, who is a pending UFA, and they may intend to re-sign him  with the leverage of Thomas returning, and they may re-sign him with the intent of platooning him with Thomas to let TT show he can still provide top notch netminding before they trade him for more than a 2nd rounder.

    Players have to love this.  Thomas is a cap hit with no real dollars attached (out of players' share).  Visnovsky is out with no real dollars attached (suspended - out of players' share).  The deal frees money for players  in Boston and frees the Isles to move Visnovsky to a place where he'll play.

    The fear is that players can just walk away from contracts rather than retire - so some of the legacy back-diving deals where you walk away from $1M and a $5M cap hit.  Then the cap hit can be traded around so teams with money issues can make the floor without paying real dollars and teams that have overspent can go back to the buffet.  But this isn't different than if, as many suspected, Chiarelli had traded a fully-operational TT in the off-season, except that TT is sitting out.  You could see the Isles add a pile of aged veterans with huge cap hits and dimestore salaries, then sit them out most nights or play them as fourth liners.

    Short of completely tying a team to a player when he signs an over-35 deal, there's really no way to stop this short of accusing the team and player of colluding in the "leave of absence" and punishing them severely.  In Boston's case, no one in their right mind thinks PC went to TT and told him to diss Obama, support Chick-Fil-A, and then hold a year-long Tea Party in Colorado.  Take away the team's right to trade a player for hockey reasons and you've gone beyond policing the Cap.

     




     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BadHabitude. Show BadHabitude's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    There's a question I've been thinking about since this thread started - really, when you get down to the very bottom of it, aren't the hnic guys saying that there is no circumstance where trading TT is legit (ie nothing other than cap circumvention)?  I think that's the basis of what they're saying.  and if you look at it that way, isn't it absurd to suggest that you can't trade a guy who you have under contract?  True, he's currently not playing, but isn't the same sort of thing if he were injured?  yes, it's more complicated than I've just stated, but I think that's basically it.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from islamorada. Show islamorada's posts

    Re: HNIC Hot Stove: accuse the Bruins of cap circumvention

    Agreed, the discussion of TT in the summer was centering on whether or not he could be traded to a team in need of passing the Cap floor.  The floor was changed during the CBA!  Teams were relieved of need to gain the Cap floor.  Consequently the Isles were in trouble only recently with Visnovsky's demand to stay in Europe.  The trade was made, and importantly he was under contract.  As you say Badhab, it was not like the Kovy deal in any shape or form.  

     

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