Horton, Marchand & Thomas

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from nitemare-38. Show nitemare-38's posts

    Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    My co-poster NAS & I were having another discussion on another thread. Not trying to "stir the pot"; but I said that the 3 players that are on the title are the 3 most clutch performers; that have been in a B's uniform in the past 30 yrs. NAS didn't say anything about Horts & Timmy; but he doesn't put BM there. I'm not saying he's wrong; but just for fun who agrees with all three; 2 of 3, 1 of 3, or 0 of 3. If you take one away; who do you replace him with. Now; lets try to be serious & come up with some good ones.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    In Response to Horton, Marchand & Thomas:
    [QUOTE]My co-poster NAS & I were having another discussion on another thread. Not trying to "stir the pot"; but I said that the 3 players that are on the title are the 3 most clutch performers; that have been in a B's uniform in the past 30 yrs. NAS didn't say anything about Horts & Timmy; but he doesn't put BM there. I'm not saying he's wrong; but just for fun who agrees with all three; 2 of 3, 1 of 3, or 0 of 3. If you take one away; who do you replace him with. Now; lets try to be serious & come up with some good ones.
    Posted by nitemare-38[/QUOTE]
    I think you make it 4 clutch players by adding Bergeron to the mix. I saw where NAS replied you were insane to think that but I can't easily come up with any better clutch Bruins in the past 30 years.......Oates, Neely and Bourque were great Bruins that never won it all so I have trouble with saying they were as clutch as the players you've named.......
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from 50belowzero. Show 50belowzero's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    Here are my three clutch performers:
    1. TT
    2. Chara / Seidenberg shutdown combo
    3. BM
    I had to make Big Z & Seidenberg one as together they were clutch
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Fletcher1. Show Fletcher1's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    But, to make the case of the clutch performer, I think you have to look at the guys that really raised their game when it counted most.  Horton was great, but I think he just did what he does, and frankly, got some very fortunate bounces of the puck to pop in some easy game winners.  Nothing wrong with that at all -- that's what going to the net and being in good position will do for you.  I just think that Horton played the same way he played all year and opportunities became goals for him.

    Marchand, whether you love him or hate him (I'm somewhere in the middle) raised his game to a new level.  The shorthanded goal where he flew down the wing and blew by Kesler (best defensive center in the NHL?) was unbelievable.  I had no idea he had that in him.  Big goals in a game 6 and game 7, and was one guy Vancouver just couldn't handle.  He wasn't playing that way in January.  He raised his game.

    Other candidates are certainly Thomas, Seidenberg, and Bergeron, or lesser guys like Peverly and Kelly who just seemed to play better and better. 
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from huntbri. Show huntbri's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    3 out of 3.  Thomas was clutch the whole play-offs - when the chips were down he played his best.  Horton scored 3 big game winning goals in games that often in the Bruins past, would have ended up the wrong way, so he too was clutch.  Marchand was definitely clutch in the Stanley Cup Finals there is no question about that.  Without him, his attitude (sand paper) and his goals, they do not win - period!!  As far as clutch players in the Bruins recent past - 80's and 90's.  I think there were some clutch players there in Neely, Bourque, Park and Middleton.  The problem is they always seemed to have to face a powerhouse team and I think in most cases their supporting cast was not strong enough for them to compete.  I don't think they lost because those guys were not clutch. 

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuturmouthwhenimtalkingtoyou. Show shuturmouthwhenimtalkingtoyou's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    I wouldn't change any but Dan Paille gets honorable mention. It got to a point where I was excited by a penalty to see what Dan would do on the penalty kill. Would it be a huge hit, a breakaway scoring chance or would he just dominate possession in the opponent's zone? There's something about that kid's game that I love to watch especially in the playoffs.

    And of course, Seidenberg NOT kicking the puck into his own net in overtime, which is exactly what would have happened the previous 39 years.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from WalkTheLine. Show WalkTheLine's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    Krejci anyone?
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chappy28. Show Chappy28's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    I think in reality it all comes down to Thomas.  There have been plenty of top notch players on the Bruins who it would be tough to say they weren't clutch.  But the fact is that you can be as clutch as you want, but the team does not win with a 'clutch' goalie.

    We went to game 7 3 times on the way to the cup....there were plenty of times where our 'clutch' forwards did not come through with a goal at the right time and the Bruins lost the game.  The difference between our current Stanley Cup winning team and teams of past years is Tim Thomas standing on his head and leading us to the cup.

    The fact that Ray Bourque and Cam Neely did not win cups does not make them any less clutch, just less fortunate in terms of their circumstances.  How can you say Cam Neely is not at least as clutch as Nathan Horton?  He scored big goals in big games throughout his career while Horton on the other hand was considered a career underachiever until last year, and even last year he never reached the expectation of him scoring 30 goals over the course of the season.

    This is hockey not basketball or baseball.  It takes a whole team but the most important role is goalie...you can't win in the playoffs without clutch goaltending
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    In Response to Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas:
    [QUOTE]I think in reality it all comes down to Thomas.  There have been plenty of top notch players on the Bruins who it would be tough to say they weren't clutch.  But the fact is that you can be as clutch as you want, but the team does not win with a 'clutch' goalie. We went to game 7 3 times on the way to the cup....there were plenty of times where our 'clutch' forwards did not come through with a goal at the right time and the Bruins lost the game.  The difference between our current Stanley Cup winning team and teams of past years is Tim Thomas standing on his head and leading us to the cup. The fact that Ray Bourque and Cam Neely did not win cups does not make them any less clutch, just less fortunate in terms of their circumstances.  How can you say Cam Neely is not at least as clutch as Nathan Horton?  He scored big goals in big games throughout his career while Horton on the other hand was considered a career underachiever until last year, and even last year he never reached the expectation of him scoring 30 goals over the course of the season. This is hockey not basketball or baseball.  It takes a whole team but the most important role is goalie...you can't win in the playoffs without clutch goaltending
    Posted by Chappy28[/QUOTE]
    Tell that to the Wings or even last year's Chicago squad.........
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from rolerhoky19. Show rolerhoky19's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    I would put bergeron ahead of marchand.   First goal of the game, short handed goal, 4 points I believe.. Marchand potted an empty netter keep that in mind..

    And if you really want to talk clutch (or perhaps big game)  I would go with the oldest guy in the NHL leading all players in scoring in the final round..
     
  11. This post has been removed.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from biggskye. Show biggskye's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

       IMO, it is more accurate to say Marchand had a clutch performance in the playoffs.
    I believe it takes more than one playoff run, to determine if a player is a clutch performer.
    Fernando Pissani scored 14 goals in the 05/06 playoffs. Does this make him a clutch performer?
    Since he has a TOTAL of 15 playoff goals in his entire career, I would say; not a chance.
    I think I will wait a few more years, before making an assessment.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BsLegion. Show BsLegion's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas


    I like the idea of " Raising game to another level" .
    Clutch is too soon for a bunch of these guys and this includes Thomas, Horton, Krejci or whomever raised their level of play.
    As for Bergeron I think putting him as a clutch player is worthy , He's won the triple crown so to speak, WJC gold, Olympic Gold and now the Stanley Cup.
    We can argue Mark Recchi being clutch also winning a cup with 3 different teams.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from number08. Show number08's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    Neely was clutch, a Montreal killer -just didn't have enough supporting cast after Bourque.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    My favorite Bruin ever, Rick Middleton, had 45 goals all time in the playoffs but he had some poor showings in 77', 78' and 79' when he was needed. Nifty's one great showing 33 points in 17 games during the 83' playoffs didn't help as the Bs ran into the Islanders.

    I will go with consistency through all the rounds Thomas and Marchand definitely stay in as 2 of the 3 but Krejci was the most consistent. Lucic and Horton were pretty much nothing without David.

    Horton's game winners were crucial without a doubt but he did run cold for games. Krejci also led the Bruins in game 2, after a game 1 loss, during the Eastern Conference finals without Bergeron in the lineup.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    Well, not Glen Wesley and not Andy Moog.  Beyond that, it's apples and oranges.  One group of guys went all the way, other great players played great hockey but didn't win it all.  Tell me how to compare them fairly.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from BsLegion. Show BsLegion's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    In Response to Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas:
    [QUOTE]Well, not Glen Wesley and not Andy Moog.  Beyond that, it's apples and oranges.  One group of guys went all the way, other great players played great hockey but didn't win it all.  Tell me how to compare them fairly.
    Posted by Bookboy007[/QUOTE]

    Watching a replay of Cup final against Oilers in '88 and Moog was just horrible ! Why didn't they put Lemelin in ?  He was great in eliminating the Habs that same year . What happened ?
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from nitemare-38. Show nitemare-38's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    In Response to Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas : Watching a replay of Cup final against Oilers in '88 and Moog was just horrible ! Why didn't they put Lemelin in ?  He was great in eliminating the Habs that same year . What happened ?
    Posted by BsLegion[/QUOTE]
    Legion the story I got was that Lemelin was exhausted. He said that Andy was far more fresh & it was a better that he started in the final. I read this yrs ago in an article when Reggie was a goalie coach with Philly. I'll see if I can find a link.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from BsLegion. Show BsLegion's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    In Response to Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas : Legion the story I got was that Lemelin was exhausted. He said that Andy was far more fresh & it was a better that he started in the final. I read this yrs ago in an article when Reggie was a goalie coach with Philly. I'll see if I can find a link.
    Posted by nitemare-38[/QUOTE]

    thanks!
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from nitemare-38. Show nitemare-38's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    In Response to Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas:
    [QUOTE]My favorite Bruin ever, Rick Middleton, had 45 goals all time in the playoffs but he had some poor showings when he was needed in 77', 78' and 79' when he was needed. Nifty's one great showing 33 points in 17 games during the 83' playoffs didn't help as the Bs ran into the Islanders. I will go with consistency through all the rounds Thomas and Marchand definitely stay in as 2 of the 3 but Krejci was the most consistent. Lucic and Horton were pretty much nothing without David. Horton's game winners were crucial without a doubt but he did run cold for games. Krejci also led the Bruins in game 2, after a game 1 loss, during the Eastern Conference finals without Bergeron in the lineup.
    Posted by SanDogBrewin[/QUOTE]
    Didn't DK only assist on one of Nate's GWG's?
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    Nite,

    The part that you're forgetting is that these guys have had one good playoff season.  And during that playoff season, Thomas played great, Horton had some great goals and Marchand too part in some very important goals (scoring and assisting).

    You know, Ray Bourque scored the game winner in the 1996 All Star game.  I'm going to guess that he had a few other important goals and assists and wall-like defensive moves in crunch time over the course of his 20 years.

    This topic is dumb.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from nitemare-38. Show nitemare-38's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    In Response to Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas:
    [QUOTE]Nite, The part that you're forgetting is that these guys have had one good playoff season.  And during that playoff season, Thomas played great, Horton had some great goals and Marchand too part in some very important goals (scoring and assisting). You know, Ray Bourque scored the game winner in the 1996 All Star game.  I'm going to guess that he had a few other important goals and assists and wall-like defensive moves in crunch time over the course of his 20 years. This topic is dumb.
    Posted by Not-A-Shot[/QUOTE]
    Well thats your opinion. I didn't expect everyone to agree that's the reason I started it. I think the different names you get all have legit arguments. The Bourques, Neely's & Middleton's all have been clutch performers too & they're still legends to me; but at the same time I think the 3 names I've chosen have put themselves in an elite catagory. If everyone agreed to to my picks there'd be no reason to start the thread.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from SoxFanInIL. Show SoxFanInIL's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    In Response to Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas:
    [QUOTE]   IMO, it is more accurate to say Marchand had a clutch performance in the playoffs. I believe it takes more than one playoff run, to determine if a player is a clutch performer. Fernando Pissani scored 14 goals in the 05/06 playoffs. Does this make him a clutch performer? Since he has a TOTAL of 15 playoff goals in his entire career, I would say; not a chance. I think I will wait a few more years, before making an assessment.
    Posted by biggskye[/QUOTE]

    I don't want to start an argument, but if you are going to try to diminish Marchand's performance because of one playoff run, does that mean you re-think Thomas because he had one outstanding playoff run?  Of course not.

    TTs performance in 2011 resulted in a Cup win.  No one is calling him a clutch playoff performer for the other years.  In Marchand's case, he's a ROOKIE who started on the 4th line and was tremendous in his first NHL playoff.  I say that makes him a clutch playpoff performer until he stinks the place out for a couple years.

    Oh, and Horton has played a grand total of 1 playoff as well.

    If we are going to start talking about sustained performance, I might be ready to nominate Ryder in this list.

    I say all 3 of these guys on this list are no-brainers, even if it was only for 2011.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from biggskye. Show biggskye's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    In Response to Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas : I don't want to start an argument, but if you are going to try to diminish Marchand's performance because of one playoff run, does that mean you re-think Thomas because he had one outstanding playoff run?  Of course not. TTs performance in 2011 resulted in a Cup win.  No one is calling him a clutch playoff performer for the other years.  In Marchand's case, he's a ROOKIE who started on the 4th line and was tremendous in his first NHL playoff.  I say that makes him a clutch playpoff performer until he stinks the place out for a couple years. Oh, and Horton has played a grand total of 1 playoff as well. If we are going to start talking about sustained performance, I might be ready to nominate Ryder in this list. I say all 3 of these guys on this list are no-brainers, even if it was only for 2011.
    Posted by SoxFanInIL[/QUOTE]
    I did not mention Thomas or Horton, for the same reason I will not anoint Marchand, as a "clutch performer".
    I agree that they all had a GREAT playoff, and I am not trying to diminish anything. I just think you need a longer period of time to determine if a player should be known as clutch. Maybe he just got hot, at the right time (see Pisanni).
    I'm just glad that the bruins put us in the position to have this discussion :)
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from biggskye. Show biggskye's posts

    Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas

    In Response to Re: Horton, Marchand & Thomas:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: TTs performance in 2011 resulted in a Cup win.  No one is calling him a clutch playoff performer for the other years. Posted by SoxFanInIL[/QUOTE]
       I guess you and I will never agree about this.
    You give him credit this year because he was 1st in gaa, and 1st in save%, but two years ago, you pretty much blamed him for Boston losing. That year, he finished 1st in gaa, and 2nd in save%.
    To me, those are numbers that are starting to make TT, look like a "clutch" player.
     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share