Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    Seriously, is this team just trying to get worse and worse?

    http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=431209

    Guess this means it's only a matter of time before PC fleeces the Flames now.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    Look at what Burke did for Vancouver and Anaheim and post-mortem TO.

    How could you consider this to be a bad move?

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Fletcher1. Show Fletcher1's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    Anaheim and Vancouver were very successful for Burke, but I'm not so sure that Toronto was.  I think he treaded water there at best.  A few really bad seasons on his watch, some lousy FA signings, and two top 10 draft picks traded away.  And no playoffs victories.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    OK someone has to explain to me very simply - what exactly did Burke do in Anaheim, Vancouver and Toronto that was so amazing?

    He added a total of four players to the Ducks prior to their Cup win - Pronger, Neidermayer, Beauchemin and Tyler Wright. Pronger and Neidermayer were big parts of that run, but the basic team was already there.

    And what did he accomplish in Vancouver? Yes he brought the Sedins and Kesler to the club, and that did what exactly? Get them to a SCF loss 7 years after he was fired? That's an accomplishment that Burke deserves credit for? While he was there they had one playoff series win.

    And TO? Again, what has he accomplished? Took a team over for five years that, again after he was fired, was finally able to win a whopping 3 playoff games?

     

    Sorry, but I honestly think Burke is all reputation and simply is not very good at his job.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    I think burke helped shape all those he touched.  Had burke been given the chance last year who knows what would have happened.  He was heavily critized for the kessel deal.  I still think its more even then some suggest.  The sedins changed the identity in van for over a decade.  The ducks won a cup and still have the guys he brought in there who just signed long term deals.  He essentially set every team up prior to exiting.  

    I think he is annoying especially during his time in leaf land but i think calgary has hit rock bottom.  Similar to where van was, anaheim was and the leafs.  A cup, a cup finals(with essentially his team) and the leafs made the playoffs and look to be better this year.  I think the lupol, dion kessel, franson trades along with some fie drafting shaped that team.  

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to shuperman's comment:

    I think burke helped shape all those he touched.  Had burke been given the chance last year who knows what would have happened.  He was heavily critized for the kessel deal.  I still think its more even then some suggest.  The sedins changed the identity in van for over a decade.  The ducks won a cup and still have the guys he brought in there who just signed long term deals.  He essentially set every team up prior to exiting.  

    I think he is annoying especially during his time in leaf land but i think calgary has hit rock bottom.  Similar to where van was, anaheim was and the leafs.  A cup, a cup finals(with essentially his team) and the leafs made the playoffs and look to be better this year.  I think the lupol, dion kessel, franson trades along with some fie drafting shaped that team.  




    Who? There's not one player that Burke brought to that team that is still a member of the Ducks aside from Beauchemin, who actually left after Burke did and then came back.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to red75's comment:

    In response to shuperman's comment:

     

    I think burke helped shape all those he touched.  Had burke been given the chance last year who knows what would have happened.  He was heavily critized for the kessel deal.  I still think its more even then some suggest.  The sedins changed the identity in van for over a decade.  The ducks won a cup and still have the guys he brought in there who just signed long term deals.  He essentially set every team up prior to exiting.  

    I think he is annoying especially during his time in leaf land but i think calgary has hit rock bottom.  Similar to where van was, anaheim was and the leafs.  A cup, a cup finals(with essentially his team) and the leafs made the playoffs and look to be better this year.  I think the lupol, dion kessel, franson trades along with some fie drafting shaped that team.  

     




     

    Who? There's not one player that Burke brought to that team that is still a member of the Ducks aside from Beauchemin, who actually left after Burke did and then came back.



    For some reason im thinking he drafted getz and perry.  

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to shuperman's comment:

     


    For some reason im thinking he drafted getz and perry.  

     



    He didn't. They were drafted in 2003 - Burke was still with the Canucks.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from BadHabitude. Show BadHabitude's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    I don't think much of Burke, but he might be better than Feaster.

     

     
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to BadHabitude's comment:

    I don't think much of Burke, but he might be better than Feaster.

     

     



    Anyone is better then feaster.  

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to red75's comment:

    OK someone has to explain to me very simply - what exactly did Burke do in Anaheim, Vancouver and Toronto that was so amazing?

    He added a total of four players to the Ducks prior to their Cup win - Pronger, Neidermayer, Beauchemin and Tyler Wright. Pronger and Neidermayer were big parts of that run, but the basic team was already there.

    And what did he accomplish in Vancouver? Yes he brought the Sedins and Kesler to the club, and that did what exactly? Get them to a SCF loss 7 years after he was fired? That's an accomplishment that Burke deserves credit for? While he was there they had one playoff series win.

    And TO? Again, what has he accomplished? Took a team over for five years that, again after he was fired, was finally able to win a whopping 3 playoff games?

     

    Sorry, but I honestly think Burke is all reputation and simply is not very good at his job.




    I see it differently.

    No interest in fighting about it.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to shuperman's comment:


    Anyone is better then feaster.  

     



    Joe would even be better.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

     


    I see it differently.

     

    No interest in fighting about it.



    Fair enough

     

    And Stanley could even be an improvement on Feaster.

     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from stan17. Show stan17's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to BadHabitude's comment:

    I don't think much of Burke, but he might be better than Feaster.

     

     




    He is clearly an upgrade over Feaster, heck MOC would be better than Feaster.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    Burke did build on each team he was at but will probably be remembered for his lack of "truculence" in Toronto LoL

    Feister, fiesta, Fool...whatever you want to call him, he's terrible!

    Calgary are now the Islanders of recent past, just going stay awful for awhile.

     





     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to SanDogBrewin's comment:

    Burke did build on each team he was at but will probably be remembered for his lack of "truculence" in Toronto LoL

    Feister, fiesta, Fool...whatever you want to call him, he's terrible!

    Calgary are now the Islanders of recent past, just going stay awful for awhile.

     





     



    Sad part is unlike the nyi calgary has a great fan base.   They should be dumping all good talent and restocking the shelves.  Cammalleri will be a nice pickup as will Giordano.  Without these two they are an avg ahl team.  

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to stan17's comment:[/QUOTE]

    He is clearly an upgrade over Feaster, heck MOC would be better than Feaster.[/QUOTE]

    LoL



     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to SanDogBrewin's comment:

    In response to stan17's comment:

    He is clearly an upgrade over Feaster, heck MOC would be better than Feaster.[/QUOTE]

    LoL



    [/QUOTE]


    It's funny because it's true.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from perrysound. Show perrysound's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    Burkie's MO is to start building at the Farm level. He'll get a Farm coach that is on the same page as the Pro coach and start building from there. He'll employ Long-term-thinking that requires much patiences. I doubt he'll try to 'tank' for a draft pick. He didn't in Toronto in his first year when he clearly could have, as everyone would have given him a pass if he did. Instead he went out and got Gerber who won a bunch of games for them and moved them out of Lottery position. Funny, because he was going to jettison all of the existing players anyway, so why he didn't just ride out the year is beyond me. He will start trying to improve the team NOW. 

    I personally don't agree with this thought process, as most of the teams that have won it recently have had a good supply of high draft picks at the core of the group. The Bruins might be the exception to that statement, but Chara was a high draft pick, just not theirs. 

    I think he is an exceptionally good team builder, from top to bottom, and that is where Calgary will benefit greatly. It might be that the Flames will be really bad anyway, regardless of what he tries to do. But you can count on one thing, he won't sit still waiting for good players to fall into his lap. 

    And as for his previous teams, they might not have won a lot, but they are in the playoffs year in year out. As a business owner, that would make me happy. 

     

                   
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from 49-North. Show 49-North's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    Burkie made what was probably the finest pre-draft moves ever, in order to get the #2 and #3 picks, while convincing Atlanta that Patrik Stefan was a legit #1.  Can you imagine any team getting two picks in the first 3 in today's NHL?  (Not counting draft picks collected before the final drafting order is determined).

    That being said, the NHL is all about "what have you done for me lately?"  Burkie's record on this isn't so great, though he gets a decent chunk of credit for the Leafs' crawl back to respectability.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to red75's comment:

    OK someone has to explain to me very simply - what exactly did Burke do in Anaheim, Vancouver and Toronto that was so amazing?

    He added a total of four players to the Ducks prior to their Cup win - Pronger, Neidermayer, Beauchemin and Tyler Wright. Pronger and Neidermayer were big parts of that run, but the basic team was already there.

    And what did he accomplish in Vancouver? Yes he brought the Sedins and Kesler to the club, and that did what exactly? Get them to a SCF loss 7 years after he was fired? That's an accomplishment that Burke deserves credit for? While he was there they had one playoff series win.

    And TO? Again, what has he accomplished? Took a team over for five years that, again after he was fired, was finally able to win a whopping 3 playoff games?

     

    Sorry, but I honestly think Burke is all reputation and simply is not very good at his job.



    Red, when you say all he did was add Pronger and Niedermayer, those were two pretty significant parts, wouldnt you say? I'd say adding those two to the backend had a significant role in their cup victory.
    As for the Sedins? Do you realize what he did to get the two back to back picks that high? He just happened to draft the two best players out of it to. The top pick was Stefan, and 4th was Brendl. Every other G.M knew what he was doing and he was still able to pull it off. I'd say that was pretty impressive.

    In Toronto, he inherited a mess left behind by Ferguson.  A bad team with a bunch of overpaid players with no-movement clauses. Turned it in to Phaneuf and Kessel In getting Phaneuf he dealt quantity for quality. The Kessel deal, I'd say right now it doesnt look as bad as it did a year ago.

    Also, his construction of the silver medal U.S.A team. he took alot of flak for that roster and proved them wrong.

    I like him. He's a gambler, who leaves teams in a better situation than when he inherited them. He's outspoken, brash and a quote machine.

    On a final note Red, and it has nothing to do with his hockey resume, but you might want to check out the article he wrote in last weeks issue of Sports Illustrated. He is an advocate for the gay and lesbian community. Outspoken, educated and not afraid to stand up for what he belives in, is a guy I wouldnt mind having in my corner.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to kelvana33's comment:

     

    In response to red75's comment:

     

     

     

    OK someone has to explain to me very simply - what exactly did Burke do in Anaheim, Vancouver and Toronto that was so amazing?

    He added a total of four players to the Ducks prior to their Cup win - Pronger, Neidermayer, Beauchemin and Tyler Wright. Pronger and Neidermayer were big parts of that run, but the basic team was already there.

    And what did he accomplish in Vancouver? Yes he brought the Sedins and Kesler to the club, and that did what exactly? Get them to a SCF loss 7 years after he was fired? That's an accomplishment that Burke deserves credit for? While he was there they had one playoff series win.

    And TO? Again, what has he accomplished? Took a team over for five years that, again after he was fired, was finally able to win a whopping 3 playoff games?

     

    Sorry, but I honestly think Burke is all reputation and simply is not very good at his job.

     

     



    Red, when you say all he did was add Pronger and Niedermayer, those were two pretty significant parts, wouldnt you say? I'd say adding those two to the backend had a significant role in their cup victory.
    As for the Sedins? Do you realize what he did to get the two back to back picks that high? He just happened to draft the two best players out of it to. The top pick was Stefan, and 4th was Brendl. Every other G.M knew what he was doing and he was still able to pull it off. I'd say that was pretty impressive.

     

     

    In Toronto, he inherited a mess left behind by Ferguson.  A bad team with a bunch of overpaid players with no-movement clauses. Turned it in to Phaneuf and Kessel In getting Phaneuf he dealt quantity for quality. The Kessel deal, I'd say right now it doesnt look as bad as it did a year ago.

    Also, his construction of the silver medal U.S.A team. he took alot of flak for that roster and proved them wrong.

    I like him. He's a gambler, who leaves teams in a better situation than when he inherited them. He's outspoken, brash and a quote machine.

    On a final note Red, and it has nothing to do with his hockey resume, but you might want to check out the article he wrote in last weeks issue of Sports Illustrated. He is an advocate for the gay and lesbian community. Outspoken, educated and not afraid to stand up for what he belives in, is a guy I wouldnt mind having in my corner.

     




    Niedermayer was a freebie though since that's the only place he wanted to go. By my recollection, he was only interested in playing with his brother. The Kessel deal still looks awful especially considering he probably won't be there after this season. They currently don't have the cap space for Kadri and Franson (5M to sign both).

     

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    I think it's awesome that he always goes to bad teams.  It's no fun for him to keep up with the status quo.  He wants a wreck.

    I used to see him at Portland Pirates games.  No way he ever remembered my name, but knew my face.  I'd chat him up about the state of hockey in general, NHL and USA.  He was honest, accomodating and never pulled a get-out-of-this-chat move.

    He's absolutely one of my favorite people in hockey.

     

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Fletcher1. Show Fletcher1's posts

    Re: Is Calgary trying to get the first pick?

    In response to kelvana33's comment:

     

    On a final note Red, and it has nothing to do with his hockey resume, but you might want to check out the article he wrote in last weeks issue of Sports Illustrated. He is an advocate for the gay and lesbian community. Outspoken, educated and not afraid to stand up for what he belives in, is a guy I wouldnt mind having in my corner.



    I was gonna mention this too, and like Nas, I think pretty highly of Burke on a personal level.  

    I love that he goes to the worst teams, I love his candor, and he seems like a very decent human being at the end of the day.  I knew Brendan Burke (very loosely) through some mutual friends at Miami-Ohio and followed his story pretty closely.  No matter your political leanings, I think people would admire Burke's honesty and compassion in dealing with the loss of his son, and the impact of such a macho sports guy taking up the cause of tolerance within the traditionally awkward intersection of hockey and homosexuality.  People like him bring about change.

    However, I do think some of the luster has worn off his GM status while in Toronto.  I still think the Kessel deal was a mistake, or at least a big overpayment.  Signings of players like Komisarek and Tim Connelly were awfully puzzling and you could never figure out if Burke was rebuilding or trying to assemble a Cup-winner, at great expense.  

    The 'truculence' thing became kind of silly, and I feel like Mr. No Nonsense employed quite a few excuses to pass the buck on laying blame in Toronto.  His insincere chagrin over Colton Orr comes to mind, where he blamed the state of the game and the league for the fact that he had to bury a terrible signing in the minors, as if it was impossible to foresee that Colton Orr might become a useless piece in an NHL lineup (and an expensive one to boot).  For all of the "buck stops here" tough talk, Burke didn't seem willing to take much responsibility for a very questionable 5-year tenure in Toronto, that fell well below his own stated expectations.

    We'll see what happens in Calgary.  I might even be rooting for him a little bit...

     

     
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