Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Thesemenarecowards. Show Thesemenarecowards's posts

    Re: Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?

    He is not overrated and is definitely not vastly overrated.  He has some limitations due to his size but he has been one of the best offensive zone players in the league for 7-8 years now. To have had the career he has had when coming out of UVM the perception was he was too small for his game to translate to the NHL, is remarkable.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?

    I had the pleasure of following his minor league career as he played in my hometown.  If anything, he's been consistently underrated for most of his hockey career. He's had to overcome not being drafted, not being given a real chance with Calgary, and basically his size in general. I'd use many words to describe him but overrated would never be one of them.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?

    He's blocked at least three top notch scoring chances in this series. Not sure what's going on that his +/- is the worst on Tbag with a rocket (next worst is only -4), because he's not your prototypical one dimensional guy.  At Even, he was mid-pack on the Tbags in the reg. season.  Maybe it's a match-up thing in the playoffs - he's up against offensive lines head to head, and that's taking a toll.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from bostonian128. Show bostonian128's posts

    Re: Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?

    In Response to Re: Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?:
    [QUOTE]Leave your stat sheets behind and *gasp* watch his actually play the game. He's one of the best players in the NHL.  The only people that question this are those who don't understand hockey.
    Posted by Not-A-Shot[/QUOTE]

    St. Louis  - watch him off the puck and you'll see someone playing disciplined and hard working hockey  - thanks to rule changes and the influence of international hockey - we can watch a guy like him - in the tradition of Yvan Cournoyer and Matts Naslund - a joy to watch.

     
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from stingerjp. Show stingerjp's posts

    Re: Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?

    The consensus seems to be people who are in love with his offensive skills.  You can't deny his offensive talent. His offensive skills are a danger on the power play and nobody can debate that.  However, my main point is that on 5on5, he is a minus player.  Nobody has given any evidence to convince me otherwise. 

    1-People have blamed his D(10 years worth of bad D?)
    2- Bad teams? Won a cup one year and not too shabby this year, yet still a minus
    3- some have said he works hard- still a minus player
    4- some have said he breaks up scoring chances- still a minus player
    5- NAS quoted: people don't know anything about hockey if you don't like him...Not a strong argument but i'd suggest people who fall in love with his scoring are not judging his entire game.

    Once again to be clear- 5 on 5, does he help or hurt??? 
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?

    In Response to Re: Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?:
    [QUOTE]The consensus seems to be people who are in love with his offensive skills.  You can't deny his offensive talent. His offensive skills are a danger on the power play and nobody can debate that.  However, my main point is that on 5on5, he is a minus player.  Nobody has given any evidence to convince me otherwise.  1-People have blamed his D(10 years worth of bad D?) 2- Bad teams? Won a cup one year and not too shabby this year, yet still a minus 3- some have said he works hard- still a minus player 4- some have said he breaks up scoring chances- still a minus player 5- NAS quoted: people don't know anything about hockey if you don't like him...Not a strong argument but i'd suggest people who fall in love with his scoring are not judging his entire game. Once again to be clear- 5 on 5, does he help or hurt??? 
    Posted by stingerjp[/QUOTE]

    Watch him play.  You can't find "great defensive play" on your stat sheet.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?

    Let me try putting it this way, stinger - and this is, I think, pretty much what NAS is saying:  watch St. Louis for any length of time and you'll see that he regularly makes the kind of defensive plays that keep his plus/minus from getting worse.  It's not often that it's his guy tapping it in, making the great feed.  When you watch him play, you can see that, relative to the breakdowns around him, or in terms of him doing what he should be doing in their system at both ends of the ice, he is a positive influence.

    Put another way, if you put almost any other player on the Bags in his spot, he'd have an even worse plus/minus.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Camperpete. Show Camperpete's posts

    Re: Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?

    No he is not. However Tampa is!

    In Response to Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?:
    [QUOTE]Like most hockey fans, I wish my team(the B's!) could get players with skills like St. Louis. He can flat score and is one of the playoffs top scorers this postseason. However, after further review i am starting to wonder about him. After watching Marchand score a goal with St Louis next to him(not into him), i'm starting to wonder if Martin is just an offensive force.  Is his team better off with him out there?  Here are my main points- 1-He has the worst plus/minus (-8)out of 269 players in the playoffs this year, even though he is the leading scorer! Crazy isn't it? 2- St Louis is -3 for entire series vs Boston and was -2 last night 3- He has not been in the + for any of the 5 games, even with a 2 point game in Game 1! Offensively, the guy has skills but outside of the powerplay, does he make his team better? Does he play D at all? The guy has great talent, but does his talents make the team better outside of the powerplay? I think the numbers speak for themself
    Posted by stingerjp[/QUOTE]
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hockguy0818. Show Hockguy0818's posts

    Re: Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?

    In Response to Re: Is Martin St. Louis vastly overrated?:
    [QUOTE]Silly thread.  He's rarely played on good teams in his career and has backboned that organization's team. I always felt LeCavalier was the overrated one.
    Posted by RidingWithTheKing[/QUOTE]
    I respectfully disagree. Vinny's had a really good career. He was a key member on the 03-04 team that won the cup, I believe he was 3rd or so on the team in playoff scoring (behind Richards and St. Louis). I think the Cooke hit has had an impact on his play since 2008. When his career ends (assuming he finishes out the contract), he'll likely have between 500-550 goals. Never the less, for a guy picked first overall, he's had a solid career, one worthy of being selected first overall.
     
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