Not One Person -- the second line

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chappy28. Show Chappy28's posts

    Not One Person -- the second line

    Yes, Marchand is having a tough time.  To me it just seems like his hands aren't there with him this year.  Unlike some, I think he is trying to play like he has in the past, but his stick is failing him, and he is losing control of the puck trying to pull off the same moves that had worked for him in the past.  And it's not that the D is stopping him, he is just flat out losing the puck.  unforced errors.

    However, I don't want to blame that line's lack of productivity on any one player because frankly they all look subpar compared to what we have come to expect of them.  Last year, that line (Bergeron-Marchand-Segs) was arguable our best line all year from both a production and a defensive responsibility standpoint.  It combined Bergeron's defensive prowess with two fast, creative wingers who would both set eachother up and weren't afraid to shoot.  Now the line just looks slow and unaggressive.  They throw it in deep and muck in the corners until they turn it over and go the other way.  Where last year Bergeron would send Marchand and Seguin streaking up the ice on breaks, this year Marchand is streaking up the ice while Bergeron and Erickson are still way too deep in their own zone -- at which point Marchand tries to make a move and the puck flies off his stick, rush over.

    I think it is time to shake up the 2nd and 3rd lines to get some chemistry going.

    Bergie needs a more offensive minded winger that is going to take the puck to the net

    Bergeron-Marchand-Soderberg

    Kelly-Smith-Erickson

    OR

    Bergeron-Smith-Marchand

    Kelly-Erickson-Soderberg

    I hesitate to split up Marchand and Bergy based on the chemistry and opportunistic counter attack  that they have displayed in the past couple years.

     

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from nrguy. Show nrguy's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    Marchand has been playing awful but he's showing signs of waking up. The Swede is still adjusting/recovering from his concussion. No need to break it up if these are the lines that you're planning to use in the playoffs.

    It's not like the Bs are last in the division.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chappy28. Show Chappy28's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    In response to nrguy's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Marchand has been playing awful but he's showing signs of waking up. The Swede is still adjusting/recovering from his concussion. No need to break it up if these are the lines that you're planning to use in the playoffs.

    It's not like the Bs are last in the division.

    [/QUOTE]

    The third line is outscoring the second.  I think we are winning despite an ineffective second line, just imagine what we could do if we had all lines clicking.  In my opinion, being in first place makes it that much easier to play with some combos now as opposed to waiting until we are in desparation mode at the end of the season.  The first line can continue to carry the load while we figure out how to get the rest going.  I mean, our leading scorer from last year has what?  four goals?

    To me line changes are about maximizing the output of the talent in the room.  Winning or not we should want to find the "optimal" lines where individual styles are adding up to make the entire line more effective.

    For example, Krecji-Luc-Iginla/Kreji-Luc-Horton line has been sucessful by putting a pass first playmaker (Krecji) with a big shoot first winger (Horton/Iginla), and another big winger who is a beast in the corners and can pass or shoot (Lucic).  That's the formula that drives the chemistry, and it has worked well for a number of years.

    The thought for the second line was that Erickson and Bergeron would be good on the same line because they are both defensively responsible and skilled, but the result has been a line that is too concerned with defense such that they don't generate enough offence.  Might as well just have them as the third line defensive shutdown specialists --- but to me that is a waste of Bergeron's and probably Erikson's talent.  That's what we have Chris Kelly for.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    In response to Chappy28's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to nrguy's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Marchand has been playing awful but he's showing signs of waking up. The Swede is still adjusting/recovering from his concussion. No need to break it up if these are the lines that you're planning to use in the playoffs.

    It's not like the Bs are last in the division.

    [/QUOTE]

    The third line is outscoring the second.  I think we are winning despite an ineffective second line, just imagine what we could do if we had all lines clicking.  In my opinion, being in first place makes it that much easier to play with some combos now as opposed to waiting until we are in desparation mode at the end of the season.  The first line can continue to carry the load while we figure out how to get the rest going.  I mean, our leading scorer from last year has what?  four goals?

    To me line changes are about maximizing the output of the talent in the room.  Winning or not we should want to find the "optimal" lines where individual styles are adding up to make the entire line more effective.

    For example, Krecji-Luc-Iginla/Kreji-Luc-Horton line has been sucessful by putting a pass first playmaker (Krecji) with a big shoot first winger (Horton/Iginla), and another big winger who is a beast in the corners and can pass or shoot (Lucic).  That's the formula that drives the chemistry, and it has worked well for a number of years.

    The thought for the second line was that Erickson and Bergeron would be good on the same line because they are both defensively responsible and skilled, but the result has been a line that is too concerned with defense such that they don't generate enough offence.  Might as well just have them as the third line defensive shutdown specialists --- but to me that is a waste of Bergeron's and probably Erikson's talent.  That's what we have Chris Kelly for.

    [/QUOTE]

    The second line players will have many more points when all is said and done. I also don't think they are winning despite the second line, theyre still pretty good on the whole sheet of the ice.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    Julien tried Smith with Eriksson earlier in the year and it worked.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from bgrif008. Show bgrif008's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    I dont know what to thing about Eriksson. I still have yet to see what I was expecting. Also, he doesnt seem any more physical than Seguin. He just doesnt seem to be of the Bruins mold. I dont think he'll stick around for the long term with the B's if his game doesnt change a bit.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from islamorada. Show islamorada's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    Smith and Marchand should have some experimentation with either Kelly or Bergeron.  Eriksson and Soderberg as well.  

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from OrrandPapiRGods. Show OrrandPapiRGods's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    In response to Chappy28's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Yes, Marchand is having a tough time.  To me it just seems like his hands aren't there with him this year.  Unlike some, I think he is trying to play like he has in the past, but his stick is failing him, and he is losing control of the puck trying to pull off the same moves that had worked for him in the past.  And it's not that the D is stopping him, he is just flat out losing the puck.  unforced errors.

    However, I don't want to blame that line's lack of productivity on any one player because frankly they all look subpar compared to what we have come to expect of them.  Last year, that line (Bergeron-Marchand-Segs) was arguable our best line all year from both a production and a defensive responsibility standpoint.  It combined Bergeron's defensive prowess with two fast, creative wingers who would both set eachother up and weren't afraid to shoot.  Now the line just looks slow and unaggressive.  They throw it in deep and muck in the corners until they turn it over and go the other way.  Where last year Bergeron would send Marchand and Seguin streaking up the ice on breaks, this year Marchand is streaking up the ice while Bergeron and Erickson are still way too deep in their own zone -- at which point Marchand tries to make a move and the puck flies off his stick, rush over.

    I think it is time to shake up the 2nd and 3rd lines to get some chemistry going.

    Bergie needs a more offensive minded winger that is going to take the puck to the net

    Bergeron-Marchand-Soderberg

    Kelly-Smith-Erickson

    OR

    Bergeron-Smith-Marchand

    Kelly-Erickson-Soderberg

    I hesitate to split up Marchand and Bergy based on the chemistry and opportunistic counter attack  that they have displayed in the past couple years.

     [/QUOTE]
    I agree, keep Marchand and Bergeron together. Would like to see Soderberg get a shot on the other wing too as you suggest.
    Long term though I certainly haven't given up on Erickson, he's better than average overall, and we'll see his output around 65 points which isn't bad for a Julien team.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from bogie6. Show bogie6's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    We.ve talked about this in other threads, and some interesting comments have emerged. JMWalters, solid contributions recalled a report from Dallas that Eriksson was a typical "Swedish" style player, which we all know Don Cherry hated because of "softness", and that's what we are all seeing. Someone else commented that Iginla's hands are not what they were, and were less than helpful with Crosby last year. That may also be what we are seeing sporadically. The possible solution is to mix the lines to take better advantage of the skills that are prevalent with this Bruins team. Injuries have provided longer looks at the defense alternates, and they are all performing quite well even with their "learning" mistakes. Here's some " maybes" that should stir the pot; Spooner to replace Iginla, with Iginla replacing Thornton, and being available for PP; Soderberg to replace Eriksson in a swap to Kelly's line. Soderberg gives Bergie's line added size and centering skill; Spooner gets to add his speed and scoring to complement Kreji; and Iginla gives Campbell and Paille more skill and equal toughness for the rest of this year.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from stevegm. Show stevegm's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    We have a lot of discussions re "changing up the lines".  Many feel CJ's patience is a negative.  Personally, I feel Claude and the current B's hierarchy exhibit "stability", and that's big part of the overall success.  I like the style of determined tinkering much better than knee jerk.

    I've always felt like throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks is wastefull and unintelligent.  It's also been proven over and over again to be ineffective.  Otherwise there's little value in expertise. 

    A fair amount of stability is especially necessary in an environment as fickle and shallow as these guys operate in.  I feel the team operates that fine line between entitlement/complacency really well.   

    Not jumping on anyones line suggestions, just offering up some positive aspects to working with reasonable patience on line combinations.  

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from OrrandPapiRGods. Show OrrandPapiRGods's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    In response to stevegm's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    We have a lot of discussions re "changing up the lines".  Many feel CJ's patience is a negative.  Personally, I feel Claude and the current B's hierarchy exhibit "stability", and that's big part of the overall success.  I like the style of determined tinkering much better than knee jerk.

    I've always felt like throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks is wastefull and unintelligent.  It's also been proven over and over again to be ineffective.  Otherwise there's little value in expertise. 

    A fair amount of stability is especially necessary in an environment as fickle and shallow as these guys operate in.  I feel the team operates that fine line between entitlement/complacency really well.   

    Not jumping on anyones line suggestions, just offering up some positive aspects to working with reasonable patience on line combinations.  

    [/QUOTE]

    Good post! I agree. I would like to see the next Julien tweak to be trying Soderberg with Bergeron.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Madhouse27. Show Madhouse27's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    Because of his vision situation, Soderberg needs to be on the left wing. For our speculative puproses, that kind of limits him to being switched with Marchand. So with that in mind, I'd probably rather see Carl and Loui together with Kelly and put Smith up with Marchy and Bergeron. Depending on how things worked out, we could leave it or swap the two centers. I'm still convinced the Swedes being together could lead to some good chemistry and hopefully more offense from both the 2nd and 3rd lines. 

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from wallydouglas. Show wallydouglas's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    I mentioned it before that iginla and erickson trade places for 2 reasons, iginlas toughness with bergeron line and erikson feeding off of krecji, just a suggestion, but somehow someway they need to get smith up on line 1 or 2, this kid has talent.

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from NeelyOrrBourque. Show NeelyOrrBourque's posts

    Re: Not One Person -- the second line

    In response to wallydouglas' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I mentioned it before that iginla and erickson trade places for 2 reasons, iginlas toughness with bergeron line and erikson feeding off of krecji, just a suggestion, but somehow someway they need to get smith up on line 1 or 2, this kid has talent.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I wouldn't be against this if CJ wanted to try see how it goes, but I truly beleive that the B's are waiting to see if Iginla is just having a tough start as usual. They're still amongst the leaders in the East, so I don't think, they don't think there's any need for some drastic changes in the lineup. I think they're using Smith perfectly right now. He's on the PP & getting decent ice on the 3rd line. I don't want Marchand switched; I want him scratched. I think that's the best way to get thru to him. It worked for Lucic.

     
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