Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    People would have said that about JT Superstar before he was dealt.  He's the only reason anyone goes to the rink in Boston.

    They dealt him.  For fifty sticks of hockey card gum and a German goalscoring facemask.  They got better.

    I'll just repeat my Sparta analogy here: The Bruins are a great team because every guy looks after his responsibility to be where he's supposed to be as a commitment to the other players on the ice.  The wingers go to where the D expect them to be.  The C goes to where the wingers can make the pass.  They support the puck, they cycle, they put the puck into spaces where they know their teammates will be heading.  It's like the great Red Army teams - like they have one mind.  Except not, because offensively, guys have the freedom to try things as long as they don't leave their teammates exposed.  I like this.  I think this is beautiful hockey, like the insides of an antique watch when it's going to plan.

    I don't like exceptionalism.  I don't like the idea that Ovechkin or Jagr or Thornton or Seguin should be given latitude and fewer defensive responsibilities because they're way better at scoring than their teammates.  I don't believe it produces better results.  Maybe it did in the 70s and 80s, but Jacques Lemaire always seemed to imply that the Devils played the same way as his Scab teams did in the 70s.

    Ovechkin's a great goalscorer.  I would appreciate him more if I felt he was scoring 50 while also working hard to help his team win in all areas.  Otherwise, I feel a little like the total has a bit of a tarnish on it, like the goal total has been the point and not using his talent to help his team win. 

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Don-Bruino. Show Don-Bruino's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

    In response to Don-Bruino's comment:

    It tells the total tale, my friend. All those big minuses are bad teams with no leadership.

    Washington, all minus players. Ovi biggest minus player of all. Ovi 50-goal scorer can't lead his team.

    When will Leonsis and McPhee wake up?

    Ovi couldn't lead a herd of sheep.



    Chara, Murray, Axelsson and Ward.  No leadership?



    Weren't we discussing Ovi and Bergeron?

    What do these other guys have to do with it? Are you saying Ovi has never had  teammates with leadership qualities?

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from 50belowzero. Show 50belowzero's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    I guess Oates is getting tired of Ovi's floating as well,said he gave up on the Stars 4th goal and that he should be trying hard all the time.48 goals are great,no problem there,but give me Iginla and his 30 and work ethic everyday, all week long. 

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chowdahkid-. Show Chowdahkid-'s posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    Heard on the radio today that Ovechkin in the month of March had the grand total of zero points ..............during 5 on 5 play.

    How awful is that during the Caps fight for a playoff spot ?

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from marco0863. Show marco0863's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to Chowdahkid-'s comment:

    Next up on the list of replies to this thread ?

    If he were a Bruin............autocup.



    Maybe you've heard of them maybe not

    Gretzky and messier (arguably the best 2 way player ever) 

    Both were -25 years they didn't make playoffs. They were both to blame

    Oh I know " different time" 

    Autononsense

     

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from chetgnat. Show chetgnat's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    If anyone ever deserved to have their 'C' ripped right off the jersey in front of their teammates, it was this clown.

    At the very least he should show up some day and notice the 'C' is gone. And I'm talking in between games, not seasons. He should be embarrassed, because what is he going to do? Not try unless he's on a PP or has a chance at a breakaway? Well, you've got exactly the same player except without a 'C' on his jersey. He can best be used to influence the team in a positive way by using him as an example.

    There's something wrong with him that will never be fixed and Oates needs to find the sac to do what needs to be done.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from BadHabitude. Show BadHabitude's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to marco0863's comment:

     

    Maybe you've heard of them maybe not

    Gretzky and messier (arguably the best 2 way player ever) 

    Both were -25 years they didn't make playoffs. They were both to blame

    Oh I know " different time" 

    Autononsense

     




    OK.  Exactly what point are you trying to make?  

    It's OK to be a minus player if you ever scored more than 30 goals in the NHL?

    Plus minus is an inherently flawed stat, however it does say something about the player and their defensive work ethic doesn't it?

    Is it possible that good goal scorers just mail it in some seasons?

    Bobby Orr was never a minus in his entire career and a plus 597 over his entire career.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from marco0863. Show marco0863's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    Def work ethic. . Mess was one of the best... it says nothing

    Neely was always a minus before he joined bruins

    Ovie in boston forget that -31 would never happen and he'd score as many if not more

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from 50belowzero. Show 50belowzero's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to marco0863's comment:

    Def work ethic. . Mess was one of the best... it says nothing

    Neely was always a minus before he joined bruins

    Ovie in boston forget that -31 would never happen and he'd score as many if not more



    But what makes you think Ovi would backcheck any harder for Claude? He has an inherint instinct at any time to not give a sh-it,if you think playing hardball with Ovi is going to work i bet he'll just take his $10 mil and say shove it,poor example for teammates.He's held to a different standard for work ethic,Hunter made him play defence and he didn't like it,he was one happy player when Hunter declined the contract extension.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from chetgnat. Show chetgnat's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to marco0863's comment:

    Def work ethic. . Mess was one of the best... it says nothing

    Neely was always a minus before he joined bruins

    Ovie in boston forget that -31 would never happen and he'd score as many if not more



    False beyond belief because he would be benched for not trying and then traded. That crap's just not tolerated on the Bruins. They've had Hortons and Ryders who essentially disappear for weeks at a time, but only because they still put in legitimate efforts on the defensive end and never blatantly give up on plays. Ovi's sort of game weakens a team overall. The Capitals are scarewed.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from 50belowzero. Show 50belowzero's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to chetgnat's comment:

     

    False beyond belief because he would be benched for not trying and then traded. That crap's just not tolerated on the Bruins. They've had Hortons and Ryders who essentially disappear for weeks at a time, but only because they still put in legitimate efforts on the defensive end and never blatantly give up on plays. Ovi's sort of game weakens a team overall. The Capitals are scarewed.



    Married to terror?

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from marco0863. Show marco0863's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to chetgnat's comment:

    In response to marco0863's comment:

    Def work ethic. . Mess was one of the best... it says nothing

    Neely was always a minus before he joined bruins

    Ovie in boston forget that -31 would never happen and he'd score as many if not more



    False beyond belief because he would be benched for not trying and then traded. That crap's just not tolerated on the Bruins. They've had Hortons and Ryders who essentially disappear for weeks at a time, but only because they still put in legitimate efforts on the defensive end and never blatantly give up on plays. Ovi's sort of game weakens a team overall. The Capitals are scarewed.



    Horton ? Big reason we won cup.. ryder was good in 2011 playoffs. Nvm reg season . If julien never benched ryder then why would he bench a probable future hall of famer. 

    Oh btw.  Kasper benched neely once to o.... crazy ur right only in boston. 

     

     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from chetgnat. Show chetgnat's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to marco0863's comment:

    In response to chetgnat's comment:

    In response to marco0863's comment:

    Def work ethic. . Mess was one of the best... it says nothing

    Neely was always a minus before he joined bruins

    Ovie in boston forget that -31 would never happen and he'd score as many if not more



    False beyond belief because he would be benched for not trying and then traded. That crap's just not tolerated on the Bruins. They've had Hortons and Ryders who essentially disappear for weeks at a time, but only because they still put in legitimate efforts on the defensive end and never blatantly give up on plays. Ovi's sort of game weakens a team overall. The Capitals are scarewed.



    Horton ? Big reason we won cup.. ryder was good in 2011 playoffs. Nvm reg season . If julien never benched ryder then why would he bench a probable future hall of famer. 

    Oh btw.  Kasper benched neely once to o.... crazy ur right only in boston. 

     

     



    a) Ryder was benched for a game or two. scratched iirc.

    b) the Kasper thing was a disaster, but only because Neely had earned the right to extra respect. at that time, he really was kind of coasting, but that was after establishing himself as one of the best Bruins of all time for all the right reasons, and after suffering career-threatening injuries. he kind of had no choice but to coast some nights. on top of that Kasper didn't have the gravitas to pull it off. he was a mediocre player and had no coaching experience. Oates is a HOFer. completely different situations.

    c) Horton? child please. i'm not referring to the playoffs, which is where he fortunately earned his money for his time here. but for weeks and even months during the season he basically phoned it in. but even so, he still played within the team structure and never simply "gave up" on plays like Ovi. Ovi is a different animal in that sense. Ovi is a loser, and he should be treated like a loser, certainly not like a Captain unless you want your team to emulate him. captains are only worthwhile if they inspire the lesser players to work even harder. Ovi's have the opposite effect.

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    I don't think the problem with Ovechkin is effort at all. His game is what it is, he's a goal scorer, and he's one of the best at it. I think the problem with him is who he plays with. One day it's Nicklas Backstrom, the next it's Jay Beagle. He's had Semin,Perreault,Johansson, Chimera,Knuble,Grabovski, Ribiero etc..Add that to the fact that he's had so many coaches, so many different systems etc..Heck, Boudreau went from an offensive system to a defensive system in a matter of a year, then he goes to the most extreme system with Hunter for a short period of time. He does have his flaws, he'll never win a Selke, but he does what he's paid to do, score goals.

    That organization has had an identity crisis for some time now. He's been the only constant, well, him and the fact that Mike green is pretty much a pylon out there. If your looking to fix the Capitals, Ovechkin is the least of their problems. Put Stamkos on the Caps and you'd have the same results.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from marco0863. Show marco0863's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    That team has no depth. Little structure.  Maybe dale Hunter would have made a good difference if he stayed on as coach

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from 50belowzero. Show 50belowzero's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    Ovi is good on the PP,no even strength goals the entire month of March and no backchecking, he's the team captain and a poor one at that.Team is fighting for its playoff life and Ovi has no time to backcheck and lives for the PP.I don't know but something has to change because Oates is likely gone,thats why he's calling Ovi out.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from bostonfan191646. Show bostonfan191646's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    Yup. You're right Marco. Mark Messier, one of the better two way players ever was a -25 for one season, in 2000-2001 with the Rangers. Those Rangers were 33-43-5-1. a far cry from the caps 34-29-13 this year. The rangers scored 250 goals, and were scored on 290 times. Worse than the 217-231 of the Caps this year. Pretty sure Messier didn't lead the NHL in goals, and finish in dead last in plus minus. (ovechkin has 48 goals and is a minus 36, on pace to do that). It's different. Ovechkin doesn't work hard to win games, he works hard to score goals. Pass. 

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from marco0863. Show marco0863's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to chetgnat's comment:

    In response to marco0863's comment:

    In response to chetgnat's comment:

    In response to marco0863's comment:

    Def work ethic. . Mess was one of the best... it says nothing

    Neely was always a minus before he joined bruins

    Ovie in boston forget that -31 would never happen and he'd score as many if not more



    False beyond belief because he would be benched for not trying and then traded. That crap's just not tolerated on the Bruins. They've had Hortons and Ryders who essentially disappear for weeks at a time, but only because they still put in legitimate efforts on the defensive end and never blatantly give up on plays. Ovi's sort of game weakens a team overall. The Capitals are scarewed.



    Horton ? Big reason we won cup.. ryder was good in 2011 playoffs. Nvm reg season . If julien never benched ryder then why would he bench a probable future hall of famer. 

    Oh btw.  Kasper benched neely once to o.... crazy ur right only in boston. 

     

     



    a) Ryder was benched for a game or two. scratched iirc.

    b) the Kasper thing was a disaster, but only because Neely had earned the right to extra respect. at that time, he really was kind of coasting, but that was after establishing himself as one of the best Bruins of all time for all the right reasons, and after suffering career-threatening injuries. he kind of had no choice but to coast some nights. on top of that Kasper didn't have the gravitas to pull it off. he was a mediocre player and had no coaching experience. Oates is a HOFer. completely different situations.

    c) Horton? child please. i'm not referring to the playoffs, which is where he fortunately earned his money for his time here. but for weeks and even months during the season he basically phoned it in. but even so, he still played within the team structure and never simply "gave up" on plays like Ovi. Ovi is a different animal in that sense. Ovi is a loser, and he should be treated like a loser, certainly not like a Captain unless you want your team to emulate him. captains are only worthwhile if they inspire the lesser players to work even harder. Ovi's have the opposite effect.

     



    Ovi is a loser? Based on what. .. 

    Ryder coukd have been benched easily 10 games.

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from marco0863. Show marco0863's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to bostonfan191646's comment:

    Yup. You're right Marco. Mark Messier, one of the better two way players ever was a -25 for one season, in 2000-2001 with the Rangers. Those Rangers were 33-43-5-1. a far cry from the caps 34-29-13 this year. The rangers scored 250 goals, and were scored on 290 times. Worse than the 217-231 of the Caps this year. Pretty sure Messier didn't lead the NHL in goals, and finish in dead last in plus minus. (ovechkin has 48 goals and is a minus 36, on pace to do that). It's different. Ovechkin doesn't work hard to win games, he works hard to score goals. Pass. 



    Point proven ... its a team stat

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to 50belowzero's comment:

    Ovie in boston forget that -31 would never happen and he'd score as many if not more



    But what makes you think Ovi would backcheck any harder for Claude? 

    Probably was said about Savard before he came to Boston.

    Ovi is going to work i bet he'll just take his $10 mil and say shove it,poor example for teammates.




    Leonsis thinks that is a steal compared to how many fannies Ovechkin puts in the seats and how much money he makes off #8s apparel.

    If I were a 3rd or 4th line grinder and I had a choice to score another 50 goals along with that big phat salary - I would take it all day long.

    Good job good effort Caps

     

    Ovechkin and Oates aren't responsible for the cr@p defense or goaltending McPhee puts on that ice every night. Count them, 4 Cap players, can't clear the damn puck LoL

 
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to marco0863's comment:


    Ovi is a loser? Based on what. ..  



    Losing.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from 50belowzero. Show 50belowzero's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to Bookboy007's comment:

    In response to marco0863's comment:


    Ovi is a loser? Based on what. ..  



    Losing.



    Lol

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from 50belowzero. Show 50belowzero's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to SanDogBrewin's comment:

     

    Good job good effort Caps

     

    Ovechkin and Oates aren't responsible for the cr@p defense or goaltending McPhee puts on that ice every night. Count them, 4 Cap players, can't clear the damn puck LoL



    San, i'll agree that the Caps D won't be confused with the 77-78 Scabs but Ovi as the Captain should lead by example,the only example he seems to set is its ok to float and shirk your defensive responsibilities.I like Ovi but Captain material he is not.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    5, 7, 11, 32

    Those are all of the Caps retired number.

    Current jersey numbers over 50:

    52, 56, 58, 59, 61, 70, 74, 81, 83, 84, 88, 90, 92, 94

    Say what you will about jersey numbers, but I put a lot of stock in them.  Guys who pick the higher numbers without earning them have ego problems in my view.  It's not universal, but I think it's common.

     

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Ovechkin is a -31. Repeat -31!

    In response to 50belowzero's comment:



    San, i'll agree that the Caps D won't be confused with the 77-78 Scabs but Ovi as the Captain should lead by example,the only example he seems to set is its ok to float and shirk your defensive responsibilities.I like Ovi but Captain material he is not.



    Jean Beliveau couldn't do anything if his team was putting Brouliette, Brown, Wilson and Erskine on the ice at the same time.

     
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