Sitting On A Lead

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    yes, they use 1-2-2 quite often, and yes they try to force turnovers, but they don't frequently try to pin the player on he boards with three players closing the angles or checking. You can have a defensive turnover minded strategy and it not be the trap. What don't you understand? It's a specific play that for some reason people such as yourswelf have decided to to use as a term to refer to team defense period. It's not semantics

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Fletcher1. Show Fletcher1's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    C'mon Mean, the Bruins set up in that formation a lot and many other teams do too.  If you call that a trap (which I think is a stretch), it still is not a departure from what the Bruins usually do.  

    I guess, by that definition, they are a trap team in every game.  Not just the 3rd period yesterday.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from MeanE. Show MeanE's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to red75's comment:

    yes, they use 1-2-2 quite often, and yes they try to force turnovers, but they don't frequently try to pin the player on he boards with three players closing the angles or checking. You can have a defensive turnover minded strategy and it not be the trap. What don't you understand? It's a specific play that for some reason people such as yourswelf have decided to to use as a term to refer to team defense period. It's not semantics



    What don't you understand?  It's not about simply making the team dump the puck! You can't animate dots and think that if it is not exactly this way that it isn't a trap.  The 1-2-2 trap is a system, not a play!

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from MeanE. Show MeanE's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to Fletcher1's comment:

    C'mon Mean, the Bruins set up in that formation a lot and many other teams do too.  If you call that a trap (which I think is a stretch), it still is not a departure from what the Bruins usually do.  

    I guess, by that definition, they are a trap team in every game.  Not just the 3rd period yesterday.



    They are what they are!  Why is it a stretch?  I believe that Claude's System and teaching is one of a trap in the neutral zone.  You act like that is a bad thing?  

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to MeanE's comment:




    What don't you understand?  It's not about simply making the team dump the puck! You can't animate dots and think that if it is not exactly this way that it isn't a trap.  The 1-2-2 trap is a system, not a play!

     




    We'll agree to disagree then Mean - I think Fletch is right, by your defintion about 80 per cent of the league plays the trap.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Fletcher1. Show Fletcher1's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    Every team plays a system.  I mean, instead of having 5 guys haphazardly skate around, they all spread out and play positions.  The next step is layering the defense (1-2-2ish in many cases) and then trying to force the puck to the outside instead of allowing the defense to be penetrated right up the middle.  Due to the various rule changes, this falls under the sensible defensive system that most teams employ, more than it does a traditional trap.  It doesn't look or function much like the infamous Devils trap to me.

    Anyhow, they did not just switch to this system in the 3rd period last night.  This is the way they play.  This is the way most teams play.  If you want to call it a trap, fine, but realize what an expansive term you are turning that into.

    I thought they got in more trouble last night by not backchecking hard and making bad passes.  Not exactly symptoms of traditional trap play.  

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    "After the second period I told our guys we couldn't just sit back and defend," coach Claude Julien toldCSNNE.com. "In the third period it was about playing our best period, but there was some really bad decision-making by us that led to those goals. We gave that game to them."

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Fletcher1. Show Fletcher1's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to dezaruchi's comment:

    "After the second period I told our guys we couldn't just sit back and defend," coach Claude Julien toldCSNNE.com. "In the third period it was about playing our best period, but there was some really bad decision-making by us that led to those goals. We gave that game to them."



    Sounds right to me.  They lost because of poor execution, not playing the wrong system, IMO.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    That's a lot different than all of the claims of the B's going up 2-0 and sitting on the lead!

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from no1bruinsfan. Show no1bruinsfan's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    My interpretation of sitting on the lead is quite simple.  It changes a players approach from an aggressive attack or forecheck to a much more passive approach.  Case in point, in the first period last night the Bruins were much more aggressive chasing the puck down than they were in the second and third periods.  How many times did you see guys like Lucic come to almost a complete stop waiting for the Pens to come out of their zone.  As soon as the Pens scored the go ahead goal the Bruins became a much more aggressive team, pursuing the puck deep in the zone(well for the last few minutes of the game anyway).

     

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    The other day I was all caught up at work, then did some stuff to get ahead...I then proceeded to sit down and wouldnt you know it...I'm behind. I should have kept going.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from stinkman. Show stinkman's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to dezaruchi's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    "After the second period I told our guys we couldn't just sit back and defend," coach Claude Julien toldCSNNE.com. "In the third period it was about playing our best period, but there was some really bad decision-making by us that led to those goals. We gave that game to them."

    [That  says it all there Dez. 

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    Lots of different style traps that every team uses.  Doesnt mean its to protect a lead.  Tampa uses a 1-3-1 at the start of the game.  Puck pressure and force the other team to give up the puck.  

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from MeanE. Show MeanE's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    I still haven't heard one person tell me what the bruins did in the third.  Did they "trap"? What "play", "system", "strategy" did they employ?

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to MeanE's comment:

    I still haven't heard one person tell me what the bruins did in the third.  Did they "trap"? What "play", "system", "strategy" did they employ?




    I'll tell you what they did.  They played well for about 12 minutes and then the Penguins played better.  And then the Bruins lost the game.  It happens often in a hockey season.  The good news is that the regular season isn't a single elimination tournament and therefore the B's play again tomorrow night.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from 4everbruins. Show 4everbruins's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    IMO, sitting on a lead means you throttle back on your offensive zone attack. Watching the first couple of periods, the Bruins were in the Pens offensive zone and forechecking/cycling and attacking hard. As the game progressed, they seemed to be content with just trying to clog up the neutral zone.....and less interested in making an aggressive forecheck. Julian prides himself on a defensive system, so I'm not surprised the players go into this mode with a lead.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to MeanE's comment:

     

    I still haven't heard one person tell me what the bruins did in the third.  Did they "trap"? What "play", "system", "strategy" did they employ?

     




    As far as I know the Bruins overall defensive style doesn't have a name. Do you want me to invent one? How about the "Late career Bowman"? Don't like that? How about the "before he got to the Leafs Carlyle"? Or to be more accurate how about "Toe Blake"(he invented the 1-2-2 in the 50's long before the trap version of the 1-2-2- - CJ in many ways coaches a Blake style)?

     

     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to ipotnyc's comment:

    Last 6 games, 3rd period leads blown = 3 = 3 losess.  Habs, Caps, Pens.   (If Philly didn't self-destruct so quickly after the first period last Sat, I wouldn't have discounted them from coming back)

    This team has ONE problem they need to fix: learning how to hold a flickin' lead. 




    Last game, 3rd period leads blown = 1 = 1 loss.  100%!  Oh NO!   They've blown 100% of their 3rd period leads in the last 1 game.

    Seriously, instead of looking at the last six games, how about looking at the whole season? 

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from stevegm. Show stevegm's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    I only saw the last 30 minutes, but it looked pretty obvious to me, the B's would be very fortunate to get out with any points.  Like most losses, the result comes from many things, not just one.  They did sit back a bit, they did make some bad decisions, fatigue caught up to them, and the Pens amped up their play(just like most teams do when behind late in a winnable game).

    As far as "sitting on a lead"....it certainly happens, and it does with frequency throughout the league.  Already some very good interpretations within this thread.  

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chowdahkid-. Show Chowdahkid-'s posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to MeanE's comment:

    I still haven't heard one person tell me what the bruins did in the third.  Did they "trap"? What "play", "system", "strategy" did they employ?



    Tell us oh wise one, what is the answer ?

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from MeanE. Show MeanE's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to Chowdahkid-'s comment:

     


    Tell us oh wise one, what is the answer ?

     



    Since you want to name call....Listen,you wanna be, has been, beer league sieve, who thinks he is a goalie expert.  I never said that the Bruins sat on the lead, or lost the game because of the 1-2-2.  Others like Red, are the ones that profess they have the only right definition and know exactly what the trap is and that the Bruins didn't utilize it, blah, blah, blah.  My contention is that CJ's system is all about the 1-2-2 and that the Bruins utilize it very well to clog up the neutral zone, whether it is in the first or third period.  I have already stated that it is really just semantics.  The Bruins do not play an attacking style of play.  They are more about puck possession, creating turnovers based on positioning, and not chasing people around in the defensive zone, instead allowing them to come to you.  You can call it whatever you want.  I call it a trap in the neutral zone.  What happened against the Pens.  They simply ran out of gas.  Nothing more, nothing less.  My contention this whole time is that Red is so sure of herself that the Bruins didn't trap or don't trap all that much and she really shouldn't be, because the Bruins are a 'trap" team and they are very successful with it, and utilize it most of the time.  Everybody freaks out when you use "trap" because it brings negative thoughts of Devils clutch & grab boring hockey.  It's not devils trap, but it is a trap.  By the way, nice way to answer a question with a question, since you obviously don't have an answer.  My answer to the Bruins style in the 3rd period was survival mode.  They were simply trying to withstand the Pens pressure while they became increasingly gassed.  The ice was so tilted that they didn't even have the chance to set up the 1-2-2 in the neutral zone.  They sat back, because they had no choice but to sit back, the energy just wasn't there for them to do anything else.  No big deal, hopefully Sunday will give us a better feel for where the Bruins stack up against the Pens as they are on a back-to back as well even though they don't have to travel.  No excuses, it is what it is.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chowdahkid-. Show Chowdahkid-'s posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to MeanE's comment:

    In response to Chowdahkid-'s comment:

     

     


    Tell us oh wise one, what is the answer ?

     

     



    Since you want to name call....Listen,you wanna be, has been, beer league sieve, who thinkshe is a goalie expert.  I never said that the Bruins sat on the lead, or lost the game because of the 1-2-2.  Others like Red, are the ones that profess they have the only right definition and know exactly what the trap is and that the Bruins didn't utilize it, blah, blah, blah.  My contention is that CJ's system is all about the 1-2-2 and that the Bruins utilize it very well to clog up the neutral zone, whether it is in the first or third period.  I have already stated that it is really just semantics.  The Bruins do not play an attacking style of play.  They are more about puck possession, creating turnovers based on positioning, and not chasing people around in the defensive zone, instead allowing them to come to you.  You can call it whatever you want.  I call it a trap in the neutral zone.  What happened against the Pens.  They simply ran out of gas.  Nothing more, nothing less.  My contention this whole time is that Red is so sure of herself that the Bruins didn't trap or don't trap all that much and she really shouldn't be, because the Bruins are a 'trap" team and they are very successful with it, and utilize it most of the time.  Everybody freaks out when you use "trap" because it brings negative thoughts of Devils clutch & grab boring hockey.  It's not devils trap, but it is a trap.  By the way, nice way to answer a question with a question, since you obviously don't have an answer.  My answer to the Bruins style in the 3rd period was survival mode.  They were simply trying to withstand the Pens pressure while they became increasingly gassed.  The ice was so tilted that they didn't even have the chance to set up the 1-2-2 in the neutral zone.  They sat back, because they had no choice but to sit back, the energy just wasn't there for them to do anything else.  No big deal, hopefully Sunday will give us a better feel for where the Bruins stack up against the Pens as they are on a back-to back as well even though they don't have to travel.  No excuses, it is what it is.

     



    You are describing how the majority of teams in the NHL play. Thanks for this, but the majority of posters already know this.

    In the offensive end when the puck is loose they forecheck. When the opposition has full control of the puck in their own end they drop back in the neutral zone and set up the trap. 

    In the defensive end they collapse around the goalie taking away the scoring areas but still pressure the puck on the outside.

    It's what the majority of teams do. 

    Saying that Julien's system is "all about" the 1-2-2 is false. It is part of what they do. You're missing out on the forechecking part (which they didn't do very well against the Pens).


    P.S. Thanks for the props on being a goalie expert. I'll take it. Btw I play defense.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from MeanE. Show MeanE's posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to Chowdahkid-'s comment:

    In response to MeanE's comment:

     

    In response to Chowdahkid-'s comment:

     You are describing how the majority of teams in the NHL play. Thanks for this, but the majority of posters already know this.


    In the offensive end when the puck is loose they forecheck. When the opposition has full control of the puck in their own end they drop back in the neutral zone and set up the trap. 

    In the defensive end they collapse around the goalie taking away the scoring areas but still pressure the puck on the outside.

    It's what the majority of teams do. 

    Saying that Julien's system is "all about" the 1-2-2 is false. It is part of what they do. You're missing out on the forechecking part (which they didn't do very well against the Pens).

     


    P.S. Thanks for the props on being a goalie expert. I'll take it. Btw I play defense.




    If the majority of teams play Julien's defensive system, then why is it that many posters on this board talk about how players like Ryder and Pouliot can score more in other systems and not in Claude's?  If the majority of teams play Julien's system, then why does it seem that defenseman like Corvo and Kaberle have a hard time udnerstanding the zone play that the Bruins incorporate in their own end?  Again, Julien's system is about the 1-2-2 in the NEUTRAL ZONE!  While in the attacking zone, it is about cycling the puck, 3rd man high, and utilizing the d-men.  IMO, CJ's system stresses positioning and erring on the side of defense before offense.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chowdahkid-. Show Chowdahkid-'s posts

    Re: Sitting On A Lead

    In response to MeanE's comment:

     

    If the majority of teams play Julien's defensive system, then why is it that many posters on this board talk about how players like Ryder and Pouliot can score more in other systems and not in Claude's?  If the majority of teams play Julien's system, then why does it seem that defenseman like Corvo and Kaberle have a hard time udnerstanding the zone play that the Bruins incorporate in their own end?  Again, Julien's system is about the 1-2-2 in the NEUTRAL ZONE!  While in the attacking zone, it is about cycling the puck, 3rd man high, and utilizing the d-men.  IMO, CJ's system stresses positioning and erring on the side of defense before offense.

     



    Ryder and Pouliot can score more in other systems and not in Claude's? 

    More ice time and bigger roles on the offense for those teams. Both third line players with the Bruins. 


    that defenseman like Corvo and Kaberle have a hard time udnerstanding the zone play that the Bruins incorporate in their own end?

    Really, you have to have someone explain this to you ? Neither remind me of Rod Langway.

    The rest of your post ? 

    Aren't we saying the same thing ?

     

     
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