Skating Clowns At A New Level

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from SoxFanInIL. Show SoxFanInIL's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

     

    In response to dezaruchi's comment:

     

     


    Grown men can decide for themselves what's good for them. I never wore a shield because the loss of peripheral vision seemed much more dangerous. I also know there were very few concussions or eye injuries in the helmetless NHL that I grew up watching. Now high sticks and head shots occur on an almost nightly basis. 

     

     



    Can't compare then and now.  It's a whole different world.

     

     

    As for grown men being able to decide, I disagree.  Seatbelts save lives, right?  If my stupid car didn't ding ding ding ding ding ding while I was driving, I wouldn't put mine on.




    Just one anecdote, but after playing since the 60's, without serious injury I was playng in an old man's senior league last December with a visor and I took a shot to my jaw while looking for a tip.

     

    Shattered my jaw, ... surgery, Titamium plates, lost teeth. Nice scar thats worse than any I got playing goal all those years, along with some nerve damage.  Its the worst injury Ive ever had, and there was a period of time that I thought there were going to be concussion problems.

    Then I watched Crosby get his and films of Eaves' (1 year concussion) and Roenick's. 

    Very similar plays. It doesnt matter if you play in the NHL or Joes beer league, that deflected (or straight) shot to the mouth/jaw/eye whatever can be devastating.

     

    I think players at any level that dont wear a visor are insane. I also understand why most wont wear a cage, Ive been around the culture long enough, but you can still get really hurt in a visor in any league and have it be completely random... no one's fault at all.

    I wouldnt want to see cages mandatory, but in the event of someone using it as a weapon, well, there's rules against head butting and its usually a game misconduct.  And not wearing a visor because the loss of peripheral vision is "more dangerous" is highly debatable, to put it nicely.

     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Crowls2424. Show Crowls2424's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to NeelyOrrBourque's comment:

     

     

    Any fight where one guy taps the other guy and says "nice job" after a fight is bad for the sport.

    2 guys that fight out of hate is great for the sport. 

     

    Staged fights need to go, and there is nothing more staged that removing each other's helmets.  Thought for a second that Gallant and Barch were going to start making out...guess they did like most goons do....after the fight.

     

     

     



    Rick Tochett & Neely did it. So did Probert & McSorley. Your statement is wrong!

    [/QUOTE]


    My statement is an opinion.  Tell me more about Neely & Ulfie or Neely & Claude or Neely and just about every other guy he fought.  Lots of "atta boys" there?

     

    [/QUOTE]

    And your opinion is dumb by using the word "Any" which means that just because 2 guys shows respect to the other guy after a firece fight that had lots of hatred & actually fought for a good reason, but yet still showed some respect after the fight & that's bad for the sport? Dumb! If you wanna say "Most" fights that say "nice job" at the end of it is bad for the sport. That at least makes a little more sense. If every fight said "nice job" at the end of it? Then every fight would be staged & the hatred wouldn't be there. I agree with you.

    Oh one more thing? Ulfie never tried to fight which is what made him such a disgusting hockey player. Claude Lemieux was a joke of a hockey player! Who respected those guys? Players that are like them maybe. 

    [/QUOTE]


    You know hockey season is on the brink when you start arguing about "any" vs. "most".  Strong child-like argument though, you sound like my 6 year-old.

    Maybe I should just give you an "atta boy"?  Nope, no respect for you.

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to SoxFanInIL's comment:

    I think...



    "Could ya cut the hearts out of the fans any more guys?

     

    Really, get fitted for some black and gold dresses.

     

    I cant believe I subjected myself to that gutless ballet dancing, again. On a night when emotions couldnt be higher. Gutless. Heartless.

     

    I am so done watching this team.

     

    Enjoy your golf games after game 4 of the "playoffs."

     

    Puzzys."

    That's what you think.  If you don't remember, it's right here.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from NeelyOrrBourque. Show NeelyOrrBourque's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to Crowls2424's comment:

    In response to NeelyOrrBourque's comment:

     

     

     

    Any fight where one guy taps the other guy and says "nice job" after a fight is bad for the sport.

    2 guys that fight out of hate is great for the sport. 

     

    Staged fights need to go, and there is nothing more staged that removing each other's helmets.  Thought for a second that Gallant and Barch were going to start making out...guess they did like most goons do....after the fight.

     

     

     

     



    Rick Tochett & Neely did it. So did Probert & McSorley. Your statement is wrong!

     


    My statement is an opinion.  Tell me more about Neely & Ulfie or Neely & Claude or Neely and just about every other guy he fought.  Lots of "atta boys" there?

     



    And your opinion is dumb by using the word "Any" which means that just because 2 guys shows respect to the other guy after a firece fight that had lots of hatred & actually fought for a good reason, but yet still showed some respect after the fight & that's bad for the sport? Dumb! If you wanna say "Most" fights that say "nice job" at the end of it is bad for the sport. That at least makes a little more sense. If every fight said "nice job" at the end of it? Then every fight would be staged & the hatred wouldn't be there. I agree with you.

    Oh one more thing? Ulfie never tried to fight which is what made him such a disgusting hockey player. Claude Lemieux was a joke of a hockey player! Who respected those guys? Players that are like them maybe. 




You know hockey season is on the brink when you start arguing about "any" vs. "most".  Strong child-like argument though, you sound like my 6 year-old.

Maybe I should just give you an "atta boy"?  Nope, no respect for you.

 



Well I hope your 6 yr old knows the difference between 80% & 100% better than his old man some day. Tongue Out

 
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Crowls2424. Show Crowls2424's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to NeelyOrrBourque's comment:

    In response to Crowls2424's comment:

     

    In response to NeelyOrrBourque's comment:

     

     

     

     

    Any fight where one guy taps the other guy and says "nice job" after a fight is bad for the sport.

    2 guys that fight out of hate is great for the sport. 

     

    Staged fights need to go, and there is nothing more staged that removing each other's helmets.  Thought for a second that Gallant and Barch were going to start making out...guess they did like most goons do....after the fight.

     

     

     

     

     



    Rick Tochett & Neely did it. So did Probert & McSorley. Your statement is wrong!

     

     

     

     


    My statement is an opinion.  Tell me more about Neely & Ulfie or Neely & Claude or Neely and just about every other guy he fought.  Lots of "atta boys" there?

     



    And your opinion is dumb by using the word "Any" which means that just because 2 guys shows respect to the other guy after a firece fight that had lots of hatred & actually fought for a good reason, but yet still showed some respect after the fight & that's bad for the sport? Dumb! If you wanna say "Most" fights that say "nice job" at the end of it is bad for the sport. That at least makes a little more sense. If every fight said "nice job" at the end of it? Then every fight would be staged & the hatred wouldn't be there. I agree with you.

    Oh one more thing? Ulfie never tried to fight which is what made him such a disgusting hockey player. Claude Lemieux was a joke of a hockey player! Who respected those guys? Players that are like them maybe. 




    You know hockey season is on the brink when you start arguing about "any" vs. "most".  Strong child-like argument though, you sound like my 6 year-old.

    Maybe I should just give you an "atta boy"?  Nope, no respect for you.

     



  • Well I hope your 6 yr old knows the difference between 80% & 100% better than his old man some day. Tongue Out




    20% of fights are " 2 guys shows respect to the other guy after a firece fight that had lots of hatred & actually fought for a good reason, but yet still showed some respect after the fight"???

    Great sentence by the way.

    You are out of your mind.  Two-skilled hockey players that show mutual respect following a tilt, I can live with, but this is an edge case, more like 1-2%.  The majority "atta boy" of moments are delivered by the goons who danced with each other for 30 seconds and followed the code, and it's not even close.  I think it's bad for the game. 

    The Neely/Tocchet grab azz moment, as best I could research, was Tocchet giving Neely a tap because he busted him open.  Great fight between two excellent hockeys that could throw,  I'm fine with that.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QM02LYmk-7Q

     

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    So Bernier and Miller went at it last night, and pulled off their own helmets (You can see in the coverage Bernier skating across his own blueline with his helmet already off). They scrap and get penalties for leaving the crease, fighting and a game misconduct. But no taking off the helmet penalty.

     

    Why the double standard for Keepers?

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    Because, Red, goalies taking off their helmets isn't a problem.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

     

    Because, Red, goalies taking off their helmets isn't a problem.

     



    I know, except the rule has no stated exception for keepers. Just pointing out the indiscrepancies in the rule. They say it's to avoid head injuries from players hitting the ice without a helmet, which is something that can happen to a goalie as well. If the reason for the rule was what they said it was, they'd have called the goalies as well.

     

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Stuke50. Show Stuke50's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level


    I saw Little Big Man mouth off. Bottom line. The rules committee will be making a change to the removal of over players helmet.

    No Skating Clowns = Cheap Shot European Style Pus*y Hockey.  eg. Kessel !!!

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Griswal65. Show Griswal65's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to SoxFanInIL's comment:

    In response to Not-A-Shot's comment:

     

    In response to dezaruchi's comment:

     

     


    Grown men can decide for themselves what's good for them. I never wore a shield because the loss of peripheral vision seemed much more dangerous. I also know there were very few concussions or eye injuries in the helmetless NHL that I grew up watching. Now high sticks and head shots occur on an almost nightly basis. 

     

     



    Can't compare then and now.  It's a whole different world.

     

     

    As for grown men being able to decide, I disagree.  Seatbelts save lives, right?  If my stupid car didn't ding ding ding ding ding ding while I was driving, I wouldn't put mine on.




    Just one anecdote, but after playing since the 60's, without serious injury I was playng in an old man's senior league last December with a visor and I took a shot to my jaw while looking for a tip.

     

    Shattered my jaw, ... surgery, Titamium plates, lost teeth. Nice scar thats worse than any I got playing goal all those years, along with some nerve damage.  Its the worst injury Ive ever had, and there was a period of time that I thought there were going to be concussion problems.

    Then I watched Crosby get his and films of Eaves' (1 year concussion) and Roenick's. 

    Very similar plays. It doesnt matter if you play in the NHL or Joes beer league, that deflected (or straight) shot to the mouth/jaw/eye whatever can be devastating.

     

    I think players at any level that dont wear a visor are insane. I also understand why most wont wear a cage, Ive been around the culture long enough, but you can still get really hurt in a visor in any league and have it be completely random... no one's fault at all.

    I wouldnt want to see cages mandatory, but in the event of someone using it as a weapon, well, there's rules against head butting and its usually a game misconduct.  And not wearing a visor because the loss of peripheral vision is "more dangerous" is highly debatable, to put it nicely.

     




    I agree, the visor dims your senses and reaction time out there... Much more clarity and peripheral vision without it.

     

       

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to Griswal65's comment:

     

    I agree, the visor dims your senses and reaction time out there... Much more clarity and peripheral vision without it.




     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from DaveyN. Show DaveyN's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    well that should end that one.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    Got to go with NAS on this one - I think the vision argument is a cop out. Of the last 10 Hart winners, 8 wore visors - Thornton and St. Louis being the exceptions. 9 of the last 10 Norris trophies have been won by a player wearing a visor, Chara the exception. Selke? 8 of 10 (Two by Brinda'mour). Calder? 7 of 10, but two were goalies and the other was Jackman. Art Ross? 8 of 10 (Thornton and St. Louis again, though only one of St. Louis's wins, he wore it the second time). Pearson/Lindsay? 9 of 10 (St. Louis again). The argument doesn't really stand up.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to DaveyN's comment:

    well that should end that one.




    I was waiting for that one. He did not let me down!

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from DaveyN. Show DaveyN's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    dont even know if its worth mentioning, but all of those players except for one (Krejci) wear the A or the C on thir jerseys. Just an observation.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to DaveyN's comment:

     

    dont even know if its worth mentioning, but all of those players except for one (Krejci) wear the A or the C on thir jerseys. Just an observation.

     



    And even that could change in a week.

    Also I like St. Louis as an argument - he won the Art Ross with and without it. 

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from Not-A-Shot. Show Not-A-Shot's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    I wish they'd just eliminate all of the total BS that drags the sport down.  Example:  Post whistle scrums are so annoying.  Bunch of guys get together, face wash here, face wash there, angry looks and words are exchanged, no penalties, back to the dot.

    Imagine if they just started calling everyone for 2 minutes for delay of game or roughing every time that happened.  It would end quickly...and the game would remain the same. 

    Review the heck out of the divers, starting with these pathetic goalies.  Guy gets bumped and he thinks he's JFK.  What's worse, he stays down.  Dude, you wear the most protective gear on the ice.  You could get pushed out of a sixth storey window and you'd be unscratched.

    They are already addressing the goalie gear.  I heard on the radio that Kay Whitmore is going to be stopping into random arenas with less than 10 minutes left in the third period and meeting the random goalies as they come off the ice.  He's going to take their gear and measure it, not allowing the trainer time to make the switch and burn the bad pads.  Big step in the right direction here, but more is needed.

    Get rid of all goons.  Your fight total has to at least equal your point total or you get suspended for 10 games for conduct unrelated to hockey.  Problem solved.

    Stop making fans crazy with pointless stats.  How many people here go bananas about the powerplay, despite it's basic irrelevance to the success of the team?  Most!

    Six outdoor games is so gross.  One a year was getting to be too much.  Talk about too much of a good thing.  When they announced that, I felt like the kid in the candy store that just wolfed an entire jar of gummy worms which was following an entire jar of Whoppers which was following an entire jar of lik-m-aid.  Sick.

    (lik-m-aid rules)

    Release the old games!  You know there is a vault somewhere that has all of the NHL games ever recorded.  Put them online.  I don't care what the cost would be.  I'm sick of pretending like I know what I'm talking about because Dit Clapper rules on What If Sports.  I'm also sick of Red referencing Frank Brimsek as if she used to watch him play nightly.  Let us see the tapes!

     

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    Agree with you. I would make the diving the priority. Goalies and players. Even if it's not called during a game. I would like to see first offense a fine and everything after resulting in a suspension.

    You just gave me an idea for a new thread.




     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from DrCC. Show DrCC's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    If you pick up Gamecenter Live, it comes with access to the NHL Vault, which includes 800+ games dating back to the '60s.  You can get just the Vault for $5 a month.  Binge time?  

    -- Proud user of Chambraigne; Now with Wiener Scent! --

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to DaveyN's comment:

     

    well that should end that one.

     




    Why? Those guys choose to wear one because they're comfortable doing so. Do I need to post pics of Gretzky, Messier, Lemieux, etc. to get back in the argument? It's a personal preference. Pictures of guys in shields doesn't change that any more than posting pics of guys without them would. If pics win debates then this one trumps all of the ones Nas provided. Maybe everyone should be forced to wear full face motorcycle style helmets so they'd never hurt their faces again.


     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to dezaruchi's comment:

    In response to DaveyN's comment:

     

    well that should end that one.

     




    Why? Those guys choose to wear one because they're comfortable doing so. Do I need to post pics of Gretzky, Messier, Lemieux, etc. to get back in the argument? It's a personal preference. Pictures of guys in shields doesn't change that any more than posting pics of guys without them would. If pics win debates then this one trumps all of the ones Nas provided.





    Dez, I think NAS posted that because someone posted how visors compromise your vision thus effecting performance level. Thats why he did the pics of star players in a visor.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level


    Dez, shields weren't used in those days - look at the list I posted. Since shields came into more common use it does not appear that shields restrict high end players from still being high end players. The fact a player could win the Art Ross both with and without a shield (St. Louis) seems to put a bit of a lie to how much some people claim it inhibits vision and ability. It's not about pictures. It's about the reality of how it impacts ability. At least on the high end, it seems to be a non-factor.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from UtahBruin. Show UtahBruin's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    I am not pretending to be a high end player.

    I wear a shield and do not even realize that it is there while I am on the ice. I do, however, notice when it fogs up sometimes while I am on the bench. 

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from red75. Show red75's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level


    I've worn a cage my entire hockey playing life (other than shinny), so I can't really make a with and without point from first hand experience - just looking at the differences of the players I've watched who have used both or one or the other.

     
  • You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Skating Clowns At A New Level

    In response to red75's comment:


    Dez, shields weren't used in those days - look at the list I posted. Since shields came into more common use it does not appear that shields restrict high end players from still being high end players. The fact a player could win the Art Ross both with and without a shield (St. Louis) seems to put a bit of a lie to how much some people claim it inhibits vision and ability. It's not about pictures. It's about the reality of how it impacts ability. At least on the high end, it seems to be a non-factor.



    Of course they were. Bourque and Gretzky came into the league in 1979. One chose to wear a visor. The other didn't. Was there ever a player with better vision than Gretzky? How about Lemieux? If visors didn't affect vision then players wouldn't spend half of the games wiping them off and pushing them up above their eyes. Watch any junior game and you see players with visors that look like they're on the tops of their heads. Wearing visors should remain a preference, not a rule. The fact that players have had success wearing them shouldn't change that. I've played under both circumstances so no amount of pics or opinions will trump my own.

     
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