Subban Arbitration Day

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from jmwalters. Show jmwalters's posts

    Subban Arbitration Day

    Today is the day. All the speculation will soon be over.


    Anyone care for one last guesstimate?


    I say either 1 year at $7.25mill or 2 years totalling $14.5 mill ($7 first year, $7.5 second year)


     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from jmwalters. Show jmwalters's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    As per TSN, both parties have now officially entered the building.

     

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from bobruins. Show bobruins's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    In response to jmwalters' comment:


    Today is the day. All the speculation will soon be over.


     


    Anyone care for one last guesstimate?


     


    I say either 1 year at $7.25mill or 2 years totalling $14.5 mill ($7 first year, $7.5 second year)


     


     





    I think that it’s the team that decides if it’s one or two years and they have to decide this when filing the arbitration case. What I heard is that Montréal decided one year so that they have another chance next year when he still remains an RFA to sign him long term. If its two years, at the end of the contract he is a UFA. Has anyone else heard this?


     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from jmwalters. Show jmwalters's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    You may well be right:

    According to reports, the Canadiens submitted their arbitration brief this week with a salary of $5.25 million on a one-year contract, while Subban - represented by agent Don Meehan of Newport Sports - is asking for $8.5 million. The arbitrator can choose either of the bids or set a salary somewhere in between.

     This is from TSN.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    Oh my gosh are there any free online links ?

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from jmwalters. Show jmwalters's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    haha....no idea. Would be great to have a live video feed of the process :)

     

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    PK smiles at the cameras

    Mother n father, with hanky in hand, wave as their son enters the meeting.

    Lawyers from both sides glare at each other.

    Geoff Molson, walks the halls on his cell phone, mortified he's not in the Hampton's. 

    "The suspense is killing me Jerry!"

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from jmwalters. Show jmwalters's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    Just imagine what the two sides are going to say about one another in the hearing. I hope PK has thick skin. It would be funny to watch, like a congressional hearing.

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from BadHabitude. Show BadHabitude's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    I hope this gets really really ugly at least in some way.  "trade me right F$$%ing now!"  and hang up the phone

     

     
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from jmwalters. Show jmwalters's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    That would be great but not likely....

     

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from BadHabitude. Show BadHabitude's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    In response to jmwalters' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    That would be great but not likely....

     

    [/QUOTE]

    My mind wanders with no Bruins news and it seems the NHL network is stuck on Rangers Flyers games 24x7.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from jmwalters. Show jmwalters's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    Yep, me too. Hence this thread.

     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from jmwalters. Show jmwalters's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    Hearing complete. Arbitrator now has 48 hours to come to a decision

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    They are trying to play hardball again.  Pk holds every ace.  Montreal is gonna pay.  They could have had him at 5m.  Time to pay!  Im guessing max deal. 8 yrs x 8.25

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from WalkTheLine. Show WalkTheLine's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    In response to shuperman's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    They are trying to play hardball again.  Pk holds every ace.  Montreal is gonna pay.  They could have had him at 5m.  Time to pay!  Im guessing max deal. 8 yrs x 8.25

    [/QUOTE]

    I think the arbitrator can only award a 1 or 2 year deal. Not 100% sure but I think so. If it's a 1 year award then he's a RFA again next year and the team has another opportunity to lock him up long term.  A 2 year award and Subban is UFA after the deal is up. Then MTL has to compete with other teams and he'll end up in Toronto for $15m/yr for 20 years.

    But you are right....I think MTL played hardball and they're going to pay for it.

     

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BadHabitude. Show BadHabitude's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    Given what Phaneuf got, and given how useless Phaneuf is, PK deserves the max.

     

     
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    They're going to have to pay because of what Subban did in the two years where they paid him less than Johnny Boychuk.  If they'd signed him at $5 then, he'd be going to UFA in three years.  It's entirely possible this course of action has saved the team money in the long term.  But yes, let's keep saying ooooooo, Subban's going to make them paaaay!

    The math is the math.  The media story is a pile of garbage.

     

     

    Are you not entertained?!?!

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from WalkTheLine. Show WalkTheLine's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    In response to Bookboy007's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    They're going to have to pay because of what Subban did in the two years where they paid him less than Johnny Boychuk.  If they'd signed him at $5 then, he'd be going to UFA in three years.  It's entirely possible this course of action has saved the team money in the long term.  But yes, let's keep saying ooooooo, Subban's going to make them paaaay!

    The math is the math.  The media story is a pile of garbage.

     

     

    Are you not entertained?!?!

    [/QUOTE]

    Are you saying they may save in the long run because they got to pay him less while he was under their control pre-RFA? Isn't that the case with most players? Other than when a team heads things off and gives the guy market value on a long-term deal before they have to, that is. MTL opted not to do this and now they are possibly going to get hit with a big number or worse, an award that takes Subban to UFA and they risk losing him to another team. If they manage to keep him long term perhaps they did save a few bucks overall. I think it would have been smarter to tie him up on a long term deal now. They have the cap room. It was a mistake to let it come to this. Unless Liz Neumier comes back with a 1 year award at $6m then MTL has one more chance to get a longer deal done. I get the feeling Subban might like the idea of being a UFA. All that attention and stuff.

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    Bergevin got 2 years one of them being a Norris trophy season at 2.85 million per. Subban will get closer to what he is asking for in this ruling and then a long term deal but I think Bergevin comes out of this looking pretty good for what he saves in the beginning.




     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanDogBrewin. Show SanDogBrewin's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    The arbitration hearing between defenseman P.K. Subban and the Montreal Canadiens has concluded in Toronto, according to multiple media outlets.

    "It's been an educational process for me," Subban told reporters after the hearing, which went through after he and the Canadiens could not agree on a new contract. "Obviously there's dialogue and discussion and decisions were made today in relations to both of our positions. Ultimately we have to live with those decisions and move on from here. That's what I'm ready to do, just move on and get ready for the season."

    Subban is now likely to receive the salary determined by the arbitrator, though he and the Canadiens can continue to negotiate until the decision comes down. The arbitrator has 48 hours to decide.

    Subban's agent, Don Meehan, told Sportsnet's Chris Johnston there are no plans to continue negotiating a long-term contract before the arbitration award. Subban said talk of signing a long-term contract was "a discussion for a later date, not a discussion for today, obviously."

    The 25-year-old restricted free agent tied for fifth among NHL defensemen last season with 53 points in 82 games and led the Canadiens with 14 points in the Stanley Cup Playoffs, averaging 27:26 of ice time per game. He earned $3.75 million last season, with a $2.875 million NHL salary-cap charge, in the final season of a two-year contract.

    Canadiens general manager Marc Bergevin declined to speak with reporters."

     

    48 hours dat dad duh

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from BsLegion. Show BsLegion's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    Habs like the Red Sox not paying their star.  They could have signed him for about 6.5-7m a year last contract negotiation.  IMO they dropped the ball on this one.

    Like McKenzie said the Habs have been using every tool in the CBA tool belt (bridge contract/salary arb) on Subban.

    PAY THE GUY ! 8.5 in 4 years from now will be a bargain for a dman like Subban. As a Bruins fan I'm smiling.

     

     
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    In response to WalkTheLine's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Bookboy007's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The math is the math.  The media story is a pile of garbage.

     Are you not entertained?!?!

    [/QUOTE]

    Are you saying they may save in the long run because they got to pay him less while he was under their control pre-RFA? Isn't that the case with most players? Other than when a team heads things off and gives the guy market value on a long-term deal before they have to, that is. MTL opted not to do this and now they are possibly going to get hit with a big number or worse, an award that takes Subban to UFA and they risk losing him to another team. If they manage to keep him long term perhaps they did save a few bucks overall. I think it would have been smarter to tie him up on a long term deal now. They have the cap room. It was a mistake to let it come to this. Unless Liz Neumier comes back with a 1 year award at $6m then MTL has one more chance to get a longer deal done. I get the feeling Subban might like the idea of being a UFA. All that attention and stuff.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    The team decides how long the contract will be, not the arbitrator - it will be a one year award.  He will still be RFA.  He was RFA when they gave him $5.75 over two years.  He was not a Norris quality defenseman at that point, so you'd have been paying him a big money long term deal for the potential that he could be a Norris winner.  And he has been Norris calibre once, in a half year season.  He was 14th in the voting for the award last year.  Should every defenseman who finished ahead of him get more than he does?  Even if he gets his $8.5, (which is ridiculous from an arbitrator's point of view because it would make him the highest cap hit defenseman by half a mil when he doesn't lead the league in any category for D-men), the Canadiens are still ahead on total dollars paid by about $2M vs. signing a 5 year deal two years ago.  Again, the deal from a year and a half ago was $25M/5ys, which would put Subban at UFA three years from now.  How is that a smart move?  If you think UFA status is the real kicker here, the team can force arbitration again next year and go for a two year deal.  That takes him to the same end date.  And if you think Pernell is inclined to like UFA's attention, how can you think it matters whether he gets there this way or at the end of a 5 year deal that would still feel like less than he deserved?

    What if he Phaneufs?   I mean, his game is predicated on wild free-lancing and bombs from the point.  He gambles constantly.  Eventually, you have to accept the fact that the way he plays could collapse to the ground like the calliope in Blinded by the Light, but why not mitigate the risk of him being an albatross like Phaneuf's contract as long as you can?  If, by January, he's got a burr going and is a Norris front-runner at the mid-way point, bit the bullet, open the long term conversation, and be prepared to pay for multiple years of UFA.

    Lest you think the Phaneuf thing is goofy - Subban has never come close to the high end numbers Phaneuf put up in Calgary - 20, 17 and 17 in goals, 49, 50, 60, and 47 points, plus major PiM for throwing his weight and his fists.  Last year was the closest Subban has come to those numbers.  Phaneuf looked like he could win a Norris through his first five years.  Subban just finished his fifth year.

    Maybe it's just philosophical, but I think the Shabs are doing this perfectly.  They will always have the option to do what everyone thinks they should have done years ago - overpay the guy - but the longer they wait to do it, the more they're comparing apples to apples, UFA to UFA years, rather than give up four years where you have some leverage just to make the guy feel good.  GM firings are littered with guys who tried to suck up to the players with friendly contracts only to see them walk anyway.
    [object HTMLDivElement]

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from kelvana33. Show kelvana33's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    In response to Bookboy007's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     

    [/QUOTE]

    The team decides how long the contract will be, not the arbitrator - it will be a one year award.  He will still be RFA.  He was RFA when they gave him $5.75 over two years.  He was not a Norris quality defenseman at that point, so you'd have been paying him a big money long term deal for the potential that he could be a Norris winner.  And he has been Norris calibre once, in a half year season.  He was 14th in the voting for the award last year.  Should every defenseman who finished ahead of him get more than he does?  Even if he gets his $8.5, (which is ridiculous from an arbitrator's point of view because it would make him the highest cap hit defenseman by half a mil when he doesn't lead the league in any category for D-men), the Canadiens are still ahead on total dollars paid by about $2M vs. signing a 5 year deal two years ago.  Again, the deal from a year and a half ago was $25M/5ys, which would put Subban at UFA three years from now.  How is that a smart move?  If you think UFA status is the real kicker here, the team can force arbitration again next year and go for a two year deal.  That takes him to the same end date.  And if you think Pernell is inclined to like UFA's attention, how can you think it matters whether he gets there this way or at the end of a 5 year deal that would still feel like less than he deserved?

    What if he Phaneufs?   I mean, his game is predicated on wild free-lancing and bombs from the point.  He gambles constantly.  Eventually, you have to accept the fact that the way he plays could collapse to the ground like the calliope in Blinded by the Light, but why not mitigate the risk of him being an albatross like Phaneuf's contract as long as you can?  If, by January, he's got a burr going and is a Norris front-runner at the mid-way point, bit the bullet, open the long term conversation, and be prepared to pay for multiple years of UFA.

    Lest you think the Phaneuf thing is goofy - Subban has never come close to the high end numbers Phaneuf put up in Calgary - 20, 17 and 17 in goals, 49, 50, 60, and 47 points, plus major PiM for throwing his weight and his fists.  Last year was the closest Subban has come to those numbers.  Phaneuf looked like he could win a Norris through his first five years.  Subban just finished his fifth year.

    Maybe it's just philosophical, but I think the Shabs are doing this perfectly.  They will always have the option to do what everyone thinks they should have done years ago - overpay the guy - but the longer they wait to do it, the more they're comparing apples to apples, UFA to UFA years, rather than give up four years where you have some leverage just to make the guy feel good.  GM firings are littered with guys who tried to suck up to the players with friendly contracts only to see them walk anyway.
    [object HTMLDivElement]

    [/QUOTE]

    Well said, in the meantime Bergevin got elite defenseman play on the cheap and by the time he has to play him what he's worth, the cap goes up.




     

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from madalton. Show madalton's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    He just signed for 8 years. Don't know yet how much he got.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from 50belowzero. Show 50belowzero's posts

    Re: Subban Arbitration Day

    PK agrees to an 8 yr deal with the Scabs,drama over.


     


     


     


     


     


    You will never find a more wretched hive of SCUM and VILLAINY.


    -Obi-Wan Kenobi

     

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