Thornton vs. Rupp

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Neecic. Show Neecic's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    just because campbell fights doesnt make him tough!  he always loses!  the point about team toughness is valid however the players named we want on the ice, thornton and the resident goon other the other team are a good trade off.  Chara or lucic vs anyone is a bad trade off for us.

    I think thornton has earned his spot in the lineup come playoff time, his job is not an easy one, and lets remember he may get 10 goals this year.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from goodnewsbears. Show goodnewsbears's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    he has 2 goals in his last 42 games.  the only reason he has 9 goals for the year is because marchand was playing with him for the 1st couple of months.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from MeanE. Show MeanE's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]Rupp isnt a great fighter no denying that.  But he shows up and is a better player.  Skating in Pitts lineup is no easy task when they have everyone up and running.  His role is to protect his players and hit and turn the tide of the game.  He likely cracks 200 hits this year.  To me that is more than just a 2-5 minute goon.  Fact is Thorton shouldnt get near the ice he does.  He is terrible. Another point is we have enough team toughness.  Chara/Lucic/Campy/McQ. At least we agree in one area that he shouldnt be in the lineup come playoff time.  And for those who think he should...why?  What team in the East dresses the skating clown?  Philly- No- Shelley has a broken face and likely doesnt see ice time.  Carcillo is brutal and can be handled.  Washington- no skating clown, Montreal- no skating clown, Buffalo- no skating clown, Rangers- no skating clown. Pitt- No skating clown.  Godard wont play, Engelland is a 6th dman who plays, Rupp isnt worth dressing Thorton.  Point of the entire post was Thorton should sit.  I agree 100%.  If Paille is used to kill some penalties, add some team speed I will take that.  Thorton adds nothing. I wasnt trying to turn this into a who's better. But ask me who I would wanna start between the two in the playoffs and I will take the guy who has better skating and more hits and is a large large man(hense my intimidating factor).  No one cares about Thorton b/c he cant skate and doesnt hit as much. 
    Posted by shuperman[/QUOTE]

    Avery? McCormick? Kaleta? Hendricks?

    Avery 3 21 24 -1 169  11 Fights  107 Hits
    Rupp 6 7 13 -7 120 12 Fights  173 Hits
    McCormick 8 11 19 +3 142 16 Fights  99 Hits
    Kaleta 4 5 9 -3 78 2 Fights  125 Hits
    Eager 5 10 15 +5 110 6 Fights  82 Hits
    Hendricks 8 15 23 -2 104  14 Fights  154 Hits
    Thornton 9 9 18 +7 122 14 Fights  135 Hits

    All in all it looks like our "Skating Clown" is better then everyone else's "Skating Clown"!

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from adkbeesfan. Show adkbeesfan's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    shupe you must have had a traumatic childhood experience at the ringling bros. ice capades. you should definitely talk to somebody about this. your issue with "skating clowns", is comical. 
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from jmwalters. Show jmwalters's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]he has 2 goals in his last 42 games.  the only reason he has 9 goals for the year is because marchand was playing with him for the 1st couple of months.
    Posted by goodnewsbears[/QUOTE]

    Well said. I agree....
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]shupe you must have had a traumatic childhood experience at the ringling bros. ice capades. you should definitely talk to somebody about this. your issue with "skating clowns", is comical. 
    Posted by adkbeesfan[/QUOTE]

    Actually its NAS terminology, not mine.  But he is 100% correct.

    To the poster above who mentioned other teams skating clowns most don't fit the bill.  Hendricks/Avery all have more skill in their pinky toes than Thorton does.  Eager played very well for Chicago last year...maybe you missed their run.  McCormick is far from a heavy weight skating clown. 
    Hendricks is actually a solid player for the Caps and fights when needed. 
    Thorton has one role.  To fight.  He adds nothing else.  Period.  There is no fighting in the playoffs and he shouldnt be in the lineup.  He is terrible
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    MeanE

    Avery? McCormick? Kaleta? Hendricks?

    Avery 3 21 24 -1 169  11 Fights  107 Hits
    Rupp 6 7 13 -7 120 12 Fights  173 Hits
    McCormick 8 11 19 +3 142 16 Fights  99 Hits
    Kaleta 4 5 9 -3 78 2 Fights  125 Hits
    Eager 5 10 15 +5 110 6 Fights  82 Hits
    Hendricks 8 15 23 -2 104  14 Fights  154 Hits
    Thornton 9 9 18 +7 122 14 Fights  135 Hits

    Every single guy on the above noted list is twice the player(hockey wise) than Thorton.  Thorton is here for one reason only.  Can we agree on that?  The above mentioned I would put maybe Rupp in that same mold.  The others can all play the game.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from bogie6. Show bogie6's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    I like the list of teams that do not carry a resident "goon", including DETROIT. We probably should not refer to Thornton as a "goon". He is all heart, but very little hockey skill or hockey sense. This Bruins team would move up in class with a 4th line that is smart, and where available, fast. That eliminates both Thornton and Ryder, and suggests that the Bruins add Caron and probably Arneil, who just scored his 20th. It would be a good time to put REX on the 4th line, but, he does have chemistry with Marchand and Bergeron when he can get there.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from adkbeesfan. Show adkbeesfan's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    if all those on the the list "are twice the player"- they must be having horrendous seasons- as each of them has less goals than thorty. but if we look at the real reason each of them is on their respective roster- we would see they are performing the same role- protection for the skilled players. as we all know thorty's goals were all luck, and all the others listed were skillful. there is a difference in goons- some play 2 minutes a night specifically to fight(perrone), others are guys who skate 7-10 minutes to keep the other team from taking runs at your top players(thorty). i'm sorry if thorty stole your girlfriend, get over it.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from yep123. Show yep123's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    CJ paves the way for this decision......tied or even down in games, he totes his 4th line out there consistently even with 5 minutes left in the third; since he is not going to change/adjust his style, you almost have to dress someone other than Thornton to produce some offense.  Whether thats Ryder, Paille, or whoever, not sure, pick one.  Thornton does bring leadership, energy, and opponents respect to the lineup, tough decision for CJ to make on this one.

    By the way Hendricks undressed someone last week on a penalty shot; he has ability, just plays on a team w/ numerous skilled forwards.  Coudl you imagine seeing Thornton hop the boards to take a penalty shot hahhaa!!

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Fletcher1. Show Fletcher1's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]MeanE Avery? McCormick? Kaleta? Hendricks? Avery 3 21 24 -1 169  11 Fights  107 Hits Rupp 6 7 13 -7 120 12 Fights  173 Hits McCormick 8 11 19 +3 142 16 Fights  99 Hits Kaleta 4 5 9 -3 78 2 Fights  125 Hits Eager 5 10 15 +5 110 6 Fights  82 Hits Hendricks 8 15 23 -2 104  14 Fights  154 Hits Thornton 9 9 18 +7 122 14 Fights  135 Hits Every single guy on the above noted list is twice the player(hockey wise) than Thorton.  Thorton is here for one reason only.  Can we agree on that?  The above mentioned I would put maybe Rupp in that same mold.  The others can all play the game.
    Posted by shuperman[/QUOTE]

    Shupe, we're going to have to agree to disagree on Eager.  I think he's awful and is exhibit A for the 'skating clown'.  He's never done much except fight and he was only in Chicago to protect Kane and Toews.


    Thornton has more goals, more points, and more fights than Eager.  I think he is a better player.


    That said, you make some valid points about Thornton and I would rather see Paille in the playoffs (unless Lucic/Chara are being forced to fight another team's goons).  Hopefully McQuaid can take any garbage fights and play a regular D shift.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from goodnewsbears. Show goodnewsbears's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    thornton doesn't fight a guy who just took a run at one of our best players because he's not on the ice when that happens.  if someone took a run at krejci, lucic or horton would be the ones to jump in.  thornton's fights usually starts by him asking the other team's goon "you wanna go" and the other guy saying "sure".
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]if all those on the the list "are twice the player"- they must be having horrendous seasons- as each of them has less goals than thorty. but if we look at the real reason each of them is on their respective roster- we would see they are performing the same role- protection for the skilled players. as we all know thorty's goals were all luck, and all the others listed were skillful. there is a difference in goons- some play 2 minutes a night specifically to fight(perrone), others are guys who skate 7-10 minutes to keep the other team from taking runs at your top players(thorty). i'm sorry if thorty stole your girlfriend, get over it.
    Posted by adkbeesfan[/QUOTE]

    If Thortons role is to do that he did a great job protecting Savy and Bergie.
    7-10 minutes of ice time he doesnt deserve.  Bottom line.  he shouldnt he playing in the playoffs.  If other teams arent dressing these guys come playoff time.  Why are we?  guess you like watching this team lose every year
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chowdahkid-. Show Chowdahkid-'s posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp : Shupe, we're going to have to agree to disagree on Eager.  I think he's awful and is exhibit A for the 'skating clown'.  He's never done much except fight and he was only in Chicago to protect Kane and Toews. Thornton has more goals, more points, and more fights than Eager.  I think he is a better player. That said, you make some valid points about Thornton and I would rather see Paille in the playoffs (unless Lucic/Chara are being forced to fight another team's goons).  Hopefully McQuaid can take any garbage fights and play a regular D shift.
    Posted by Fletcher1[/QUOTE]

    I have to agree with this also. Ben Eager was the first name that popped up on the list when I read Shupe's comments. His hockey skills are very limited.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from MeanE. Show MeanE's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]MeanE Avery? McCormick? Kaleta? Hendricks? Avery 3 21 24 -1 169  11 Fights  107 Hits Rupp 6 7 13 -7 120 12 Fights  173 Hits McCormick 8 11 19 +3 142 16 Fights  99 Hits Kaleta 4 5 9 -3 78 2 Fights  125 Hits Eager 5 10 15 +5 110 6 Fights  82 Hits Hendricks 8 15 23 -2 104  14 Fights  154 Hits Thornton 9 9 18 +7 122 14 Fights  135 Hits Every single guy on the above noted list is twice the player(hockey wise) than Thorton.  Thorton is here for one reason only.  Can we agree on that?  The above mentioned I would put maybe Rupp in that same mold.  The others can all play the game.
    Posted by shuperman[/QUOTE]

    If every player above was twice the player than Thornton, the numbers should reflect that and they don't.  Thornton has the most goals, best +/-, 3rd in hits, and 2nd in Fights.  Is Shawn the best skater, no, but I believe it has improved this year and for the amount of minutes and line these guys play on, not necessary to have 3 burners.  I think that Shawn is primarily on the team to enforce.  However, he is not a liability, as his numbers bear that out, and he appears to be one of the leaders of this team, especially on the bench.  Am I against having him sit during the playoffs, not necessarily, but not for someone who hasn't earned his spot.  To me, Ryder, Paille, Caron, etc... have not earned the right to play.  Is he "on the bubble" for playing time, yes!

    Bubble players for the playoffs:
    Paille
    Ryder
    Thornton
    Kampfer
    Hnidy
    Boychuk

    Black Aces:
    Caron
    Arniel
    Bartkowski
    Hamill
    Sauve
    Whitfield

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from adkbeesfan. Show adkbeesfan's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    i never said i would dress him for the playoffs, i probally would not if i were the coach. i just won't lump thorty into the he's ONLY a goon argument. the b's don't have a true goon- 
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]i never said i would dress him for the playoffs, i probally would not if i were the coach. i just won't lump thorty into the he's ONLY a goon argument. the b's don't have a true goon- 
    Posted by adkbeesfan[/QUOTE]

    ADK, take fighting outta the league and he has no job.  He is a terrible hockey player that is here to fight.  Thats my point.  He played with Campy(who has 3rd line skill) and Marchand(now on the second line) when he was getting those points.  Imagine what someone with skill could do on that line.  The B's have enough guys to drop the gloves and protect. 

    For those who lump Eager in this mix must have missed the playoffs the last few yrs.  Eager had a pretty big goal for the Hawks last year.  He also drove Van/Calgary crazy.  I hate him but he can deliver hard hits.  He is a fighter only.  He wouldnt be in the league either w/o fighting but he has more to offer than Thorton.

    My pt in this entire debate is that I would much rather have Paille skate, kill some penalties and add some speed to our lineup over Thorton who we don't need.  Especially when other teams dont dress these types of players come playoff time.  How many fights has Thorton been in for the B's in the playoffs and of those how  many turned the series or game around in our favor?

    Eager will dress for SJ.  Hendricks will definielty play on Washintons 4th line with Bradley/Gordon(great 4th line).  Kaleta is an annoying fly but hits like a truck.  Avery has been scratched a lot but likely gets the playoff bump b/c he seems to drive teams nuts in the playoffs.  Rupp will play b/c Pitt has lots of injuries. 

    I dont hate Thorton.  But there is a time and place.  He has no time or place come playoffs.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from adkbeesfan. Show adkbeesfan's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    like i said, playoffs is different argument. but he DOES have 9 goals playing the fewest minutes on the team. paille is not going to score goals either, he can kill penalties though. as one dimensional as thorty in my opinion. regular season i play thorty for his grit, in the playoffs maybe not. there are not many penalties called in the playoffs(not as many as in the reg.), so how often is paille needed?i think a younger player with potential(caron/sauve/hamill) should be in the mix instead, and should have been all along.   
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]like i said, playoffs is different argument. but he DOES have 9 goals playing the fewest minutes on the team. paille is not going to score goals either, he can kill penalties though. as one dimensional as thorty in my opinion. regular season i play thorty for his grit, in the playoffs maybe not. there are not many penalties called in the playoffs(not as many as in the reg.), so how often is paille needed?i think a younger player with potential(caron/sauve/hamill) should be in the mix instead, and should have been all along.   
    Posted by adkbeesfan[/QUOTE]

    Yes I would dress Paille over them b/c he would have a role.  He isnt here to score.  He is here to block a shot so Bergie doesnt have to.  I would consider one of the guys you mentioned but would likely stick with Paille/Campy/Ryder-even though he may be scratched on my lineup card.  I don't see CJ doing this unless someone is injured.

    During the regular season I dont mind having Thorton eat some minutes.  But I likely wouldnt dress him as much.  I mean this is his career year in terms of pts.  I dont think he has these numbers again.  So those who based the argument on his stats should look at the career and not the one year.

    Anyway...I am done with this debate.  I see everyones pt but no way IMO he should line up in the playoffs.  Especially if we land Montreal in round one.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from MeanE. Show MeanE's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp : ADK, take fighting outta the league and he has no job.  He is a terrible hockey player that is here to fight.  Thats my point.  He played with Campy(who has 3rd line skill) and Marchand(now on the second line) when he was getting those points.  Imagine what someone with skill could do on that line.  The B's have enough guys to drop the gloves and protect.  For those who lump Eager in this mix must have missed the playoffs the last few yrs.  Eager had a pretty big goal for the Hawks last year.  He also drove Van/Calgary crazy.  I hate him but he can deliver hard hits.  He is a fighter only.  He wouldnt be in the league either w/o fighting but he has more to offer than Thorton. My pt in this entire debate is that I would much rather have Paille skate, kill some penalties and add some speed to our lineup over Thorton who we don't need.  Especially when other teams dont dress these types of players come playoff time.  How many fights has Thorton been in for the B's in the playoffs and of those how  many turned the series or game around in our favor? Eager will dress for SJ.  Hendricks will definielty play on Washintons 4th line with Bradley/Gordon(great 4th line).  Kaleta is an annoying fly but hits like a truck.  Avery has been scratched a lot but likely gets the playoff bump b/c he seems to drive teams nuts in the playoffs.  Rupp will play b/c Pitt has lots of injuries.  I dont hate Thorton.  But there is a time and place.  He has no time or place come playoffs.
    Posted by shuperman[/QUOTE]

    What has Paille done? Because he skates fast he is deserving of Thornton's spot in the line up?  3 goals 5 assists 8 points -1 24 hits 33 SOG in 36 games. Just because he spends time on the PK unit, he should get the nod?  The Bruins have Kelly, Peverly, Marchand, Krejci, Campbell, Bergeron, and Recchi to handle that job.  For the 10 minutes or less a game that the 4th line wingers will get in the playoffs, I'd rather have Thornton with his leadership and effort!  Shawn played in 15 playoff games with the Stanley Cup Champion Ducks, if he was good enough to suit up then, he is good enough to suit up now!  Paille may look nice on the ice, but not so much on the stat sheet!  If Thornton is gonna sit, I would rather see Caron or Sauve with his speed get a shot over Paille.  Daniel is lucky that he is even in the NHL anymore.  Rest assured he won't be next year. 

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from I-Like-Hockey. Show I-Like-Hockey's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    Look thornton has done nothing in about 40 games now. Hasnt fought since when?

    IMO in the playoffs a fourth line of Paille-Soups-Ryder has the most potential to throw some good hits (thornton cant hit), grind out an opposing teams D and cause an Icing, and even put a few pucks in the net.

    I imagine Ryder could snap in a few pucks that Soups-Paille would knock loose on the forecheck. One thing daniel can do is forecheck and backcheck thornton really cant even do either.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp : What has Paille done? Because he skates fast he is deserving of Thornton's spot in the line up?  3 goals 5 assists 8 points -1 24 hits 33 SOG in 36 games. Just because he spends time on the PK unit, he should get the nod?  The Bruins have Kelly, Peverly, Marchand, Krejci, Campbell, Bergeron, and Recchi to handle that job.  For the 10 minutes or less a game that the 4th line wingers will get in the playoffs, I'd rather have Thornton with his leadership and effort!  Shawn played in 15 playoff games with the Stanley Cup Champion Ducks, if he was good enough to suit up then, he is good enough to suit up now!  Paille may look nice on the ice, but not so much on the stat sheet!  If Thornton is gonna sit, I would rather see Caron or Sauve with his speed get a shot over Paille.  Daniel is lucky that he is even in the NHL anymore.  Rest assured he won't be next year. 
    Posted by MeanE[/QUOTE]

    He will be a cheer leader come playoff time.  Paille with his speed and penalty ability is more than what a fighter offers.  There are no fights in the playoffs.  So tell me what his role is? 
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from MeanE. Show MeanE's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp : He will be a cheer leader come playoff time.  Paille with his speed and penalty ability is more than what a fighter offers.  There are no fights in the playoffs.  So tell me what his role is? 
    Posted by shuperman[/QUOTE]

    I just told you who will kill penalties, and you still haven't told me what his speed has done?  Thornton's role will be what it has been all year, ENERGY and responsibility!  4th on the team in hits with 135 even though he is last on the team in avg. TOI!  Out of Ryder, Thornton, and Paille; Shawn has the best giveaway/takeaway difference.  He is +16, Paille is +5, and Ryder is +2.  Let's look at Plus/Minus, Thornton is +7, Paille is -1, and Ryder is -5!  Blocked shots Ryder 19, Thornton 17, and Paille 12.  Last time I checked how fast someone skated around the rink only mattered at the All-Star Game.  None of them take faceoffs.  How many other ways do you want me to slice it.  Thornton has outperformed Paille and Ryder!  Ryder has the goals, but has already proven that he can't play on the 4th line and is a minus player to boot!  Paille hasn't done anything except get suspended for a cheep shot to the head!
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from MeanE. Show MeanE's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]Look thornton has done nothing in about 40 games now. Hasnt fought since when? IMO in the playoffs a fourth line of Paille-Soups-Ryder has the most potential to throw some good hits (thornton cant hit), grind out an opposing teams D and cause an Icing, and even put a few pucks in the net. I imagine Ryder could snap in a few pucks that Soups-Paille would knock loose on the forecheck. One thing daniel can do is forecheck and backcheck thornton really cant even do either.
    Posted by I-Like-Hockey[/QUOTE]

    Where is the proof?  Is he better in the takeaway category?  Does he have more hits than Thornton?  Just because he can skate fast, does not make him effective?  Maybe the Bruins should get Shani Davis to play 4th line, because he is a lot faster then Paille!

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from MeanE. Show MeanE's posts

    Re: Thornton vs. Rupp

    In Response to Re: Thornton vs. Rupp:
    [QUOTE]Look thornton has done nothing in about 40 games now. Hasnt fought since when? IMO in the playoffs a fourth line of Paille-Soups-Ryder has the most potential to throw some good hits (thornton cant hit), grind out an opposing teams D and cause an Icing, and even put a few pucks in the net. I imagine Ryder could snap in a few pucks that Soups-Paille would knock loose on the forecheck. One thing daniel can do is forecheck and backcheck thornton really cant even do either.
    Posted by I-Like-Hockey[/QUOTE]

    That's why Thornton has 135 hits and Ryder and Paille combined only have 90!  In fact Shawn has more hits then Soupy(112) does as well.  I can already hear the keyboard typing, those are just numbers,they don't mean anything.  LOL Thornton has earned his ice time and has been productive in all phases when on the ice.

     
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