Re: torres on hossa
posted at 4/18/2012 1:57 PM EDT
In Response to Re: torres on hossa
In Response to Re: torres on hossa : I don't know steve, I don't think it is as murky as you, but I get what you are saying. Instead of looking at lifting the feet (which happens a lot) or just head contact (which can be inadvertant), I think it is really an issue of where the hitter targets the energy of the collision. I know that sounds nebulous, but the guys who are delivering hits must learn to take 'center mass' -- body, torso, hips, etc. If your feet come up, or some part of the head is hit on follow-through, I still think it is usually okay if the brunt of the hit is taken body to body. Dustin Brown's hit on Sedin was a good example -- a brutal hit where the torso was pounded, body on body. Ovechkin and Seidenberg have been putting on a clinic of body thumping hits without taking the head. I thought Chris Neil's huge hit on Boychuk was legal just for that reason -- the torso seemed to be targeted even if some follow through came up high. Torres appears to do just the opposite. He has the opportunity to take the body and instead he launches higher to get the head. If he didn't jump up at the last second into Hossa you have a pretty clean (still a bit late) hit. Same thing with Rome on Horton -- he sends all of the power and energy of the hit right at Horton's head instead of his body. Instead of bracing for hits, guys are launching themselves upwards. It may be a subtle difference, but the difference in injury level is certainly not subtle. I think Sedin and Hossa were hit very similarly, both were brutal, but since Sedin was hit in the body he was able to keep playing. Hossa left on a stretcher. It's a tough distinction but I think it is one they need to make. Any big hit must target the area between the hips and the shoulders. That should be the rule.
Posted by Fletcher1
ok, we agree that feet and head shouldn't be the yard stick. Certainly not defending Torres here, but I think this type of hit is a great example to discuss. I have a hard time with "target' period. Anyone who's played hockey at a high level knows target doesn't come into play often, and really is of no consequence anyway. I can target someones head, and if they move at the last second(which only happens about 98% of the time) the point of impact will be someplace else.
Targetting the "hips through to the shoulders" is great in theory, but a player can honestly do that, and still take your head off. Therefore, target is and should be, a moot point. It's a really fast game. Officials are really limited by "targets" too.
Torres deal was considered excellent not long ago. His stick wasn't up, and his elbows were down. For everyone that considered it late, another said it was just "finishing the check".
The new reality however, is this. For whatever reason(and we know most of them), players can't physically withstand this type of thing anymore. It's not lack of respect(there never was much), or anything like that, it's just that it's fundamental for athletes to push the boundaries of what's allowed and what isn't. Todays players are faster, stronger, and more willing to put themselves in dangerous positions than they used to. Equipment is harder. The result is that hits are much more forceful than they once were. Therefore the rules need to be amended in such a way, that anything violent enough to send somebody off the ice on a stretcher, can't be considered "part of the game". Accidents, and injuries will happen, but that's different. Any physical element that knocks someone into next week, cannot be considered, within the rules of fair play. The fact that people debate whether Rome, or Torres deserve suspension is proof of a much bigger problem. Of course they do, anyone watching the replay, with half a brain must admit the rules of hockey cannot permit this type of thing. The current rules though, we see, leave much room for argument.
How many times have we saw someone get pasted late? Wouldn't that be a good place to start? How about no checking after the puck leaves someones stick? It would be better if there was a moments lag time, but it's almost impossible to enforce, so we can't logically go there....so ..the rule becomes "the time the puck leaves the stick".(merely an example) Players can easily catch onto this. Many instinctively do it now. It's not difficult. The idea of physicality in the first place, is merely to seperate the man from the puck so you can take it. This is never, ever the case with late hits. Obviously, the puck is the last thing on the perpetraters mind.
Target, and intent, and feet, and anything over half a second.......geez !! How are people supposed to officiate that? It's ludicrous.
The rules need to evolve, and be straight forward enough to be enforceable by human beings.
Backstroms foul was "targeting the head". Is that somehow worse than targeting the pills? If Hossa's liver is pulverized, does it really matter if Torres left his feet?
That stuff is all blither from bored lawyers, and for some strange reason, we're just following along.
Again, the rules must evolve and grow with the game. They're not.
The referee's are the most capable people, in the league's employ. They're being minimized, and the game is suffering.
Another thing is the sickening increase in the number of faked injuries, and the league is doing nothing about it. There are quick fixes. It amazes me that the league is so authoritative about something as insignificant as the puck going over the glass in the defensive end, and all of this diving, and faking death, becomes more prevalent, and the "delay" caused, still has not been dealt with by the league. If a player can't get up and promptly make it to the bench, come up with a rule to deal with it. How about if you're too injured to get back to the bench, you must be evaluated in the dressing room, and not be allowed to return to action for 30 minutes?. Maybe not the best thought, but an easy, enforceable way to clean that crap up in a hurry. It's got to be put in the rules, then let the officials do their job.
We can't focus on subleties, when officiating a bunch of gladiators. I wish the league would sensibly deal with some of this stuff, put Shanahan in charge of foreign relations, and make at least a feeble attempt to get this game back on the rails.