TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from perrysound. Show perrysound's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    In Response to Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS:
    [QUOTE]Under no circumstances should the Bruins trade a first round pick (either one) for a UFA.   That is the type of boneheaded move that time and time again bites a team in the butt. How many teams each season trade away valueable building blocks for a UFA to help them get to the cup only to be defeated from the playoffs and left with nothing?   Trade for a UFA if the opportunity is right, but don't use first rounders to do it.
    Posted by Homebrew76[/QUOTE]


    Homey....
    Let's look at the last 10 years of of First Round picks.
    Yr    Position   Player      Rating 
    2010 19         Traded      TBD
    2009 25         Caron       Maybe 
    2008 16         Colbourne  Maybe 
    2007 8           Hamill       Dud 
    2006 5           Kessell     Great 
    2005 22         Lashof      Dud 
    2004             Traded 
    2003 21         M.Stuart    Good 
    2002 29         H.Torvoinen    Dud 
    2001 19         S. Morrison    Good 
    2000 7           Lars Jonsson    Dud  

    So, we can see that anything after #5 pick is questionable at best. If you can get an impact player by giving up a # 10+ pick, you do it, especially when you have a very good chance to win now. Look at what Calgary gave up to get the parts they needed back when. They gave up Brett Hull, and won the cup.  A gamble yes, but sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do.





     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Homebrew76. Show Homebrew76's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    2008 16         Colbourne  Maybe 
    -->  #22 Jordan Eberle, #26 Tyler Ennis
    2007 8           Hamill       Dud 
    -->  #9 Logan Couture,
    2005 22         Lashof      Dud
    -- /> #23 Nicklas Bergfors, 24 TJ Oshie, 29 Steve Downie

    Sure, there will be picks that work out, and picks that don't, but that is the job of the scouting department, and coaching staff in our farm system.    I don't like giving away a potential Jordan Eberle for a 2 month rental player that may provide marginal improvement over the players we have.

    What I would do is trade a mid level UFA with value like Ryder for a 2nd or couple of 3rd round picks, and then package those assets with our own 2nd or 3rd for a top tier UFA.   

    Remember this trade in 2008.  Hossa being a UFA at the time and Atlanta being sellers:

    "Atlanta Thrashers traded Marian Hossa and Pascal Dupuis to the Pittsburgh Penguins for Colby Armstrong, Erik Christensen, Angelo Esposito and a 1st-round selection in 2008." 

    That would be roughly equivalent to us trading something along the lines of Wheeler, Kampher, Paille and the Bruins first for Brad Richards and ____ (not sure who).     The Pens didn't win the cup, and Hossa went off to another team after that season.   

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from I-Like-Hockey. Show I-Like-Hockey's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    2008 16         Colbourne  Maybe 
    -->  #22 Jordan Eberle, #26 Tyler Ennis
    2007 8           Hamill       Dud 
    -->  #9 Logan Couture,
    2005 22         Lashof      Dud
    -- /> #23 Nicklas Bergfors, 24 TJ Oshie, 29 Steve Downie


    Man thats painful to Look at.... Omfg Hamil and Lashoff ugh.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from perrysound. Show perrysound's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    In Response to Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS:
    [QUOTE]2008 16         Colbourne  Maybe  -- />  #22 Jordan Eberle, #26 Tyler Ennis 2007 8           Hamill       Dud  -->  #9 Logan Couture, 2005 22         Lashof      Dud -- /> #23 Nicklas Bergfors, 24 TJ Oshie, 29 Steve Downie Sure, there will be picks that work out, and picks that don't, but that is the job of the scouting department, and coaching staff in our farm system.    I don't like giving away a potential Jordan Eberle for a 2 month rental player that may provide marginal improvement over the players we have. What I would do is trade a mid level UFA with value like Ryder for a 2nd or couple of 3rd round picks, and then package those assets with our own 2nd or 3rd for a top tier UFA.    Remember this trade in 2008.  Hossa being a UFA at the time and Atlanta being sellers: "Atlanta Thrashers traded Marian Hossa and Pascal Dupuis to the Pittsburgh Penguins for Colby Armstrong, Erik Christensen, Angelo Esposito and a 1st-round selection in 2008."  That would be roughly equivalent to us trading something along the lines of Wheeler, Kampher, Paille and the Bruins first for Brad Richards and ____ (not sure who).     The Pens didn't win the cup, and Hossa went off to another team after that season.   
    Posted by Homebrew76[/QUOTE]

    Nobody is talking about bringing in a 'marginal' player. We want an 'impact' player. And Hossa went to the finals with Pitts. I'd take that right now.

    I can only base the picks on what they did, not what they could have done. If they could have seen what these players would be, then we aren't having this conversation.

    And your argument is self-defeating. You said don't trade the first pick away, yet you site an example of where they do. "Colby Armstrong, Erik Christensen, Angelo Esposito and a 1st-round ". Which I said I'd trade, made my point about and said to not trade the Leaf's pick. Not sure where you are going with this. 
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from rolerhoky19. Show rolerhoky19's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    Hombrew,
    pens made a run that year, you really think giving up armstrong, esposito and christiansen and the right to draft Daultan Leveille really hurt the penguins long term? Cause the trade certainly helped them.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    The Calgary example doesn't really apply here, perry.  They dealt Hull for former #1 overall stay-at-home defenseman with almost no offensive upside.  Ramage was a complimentary piece on a blueline with McInnis and Suter, Macoun and McCrimmon as their top four.  In other words, they didn't make a huge investment in a top of the roster player.  They dealt from their depth in scoring forwards (Mullen and Nieuwendyk both hit 51 goals, Loob and Gilmour both had 85 pts, Roberts and Fleury were up and coming wingers...) and solidified the bottom half of their defense corps.

    If you're looking to acquire a top 3 forward or top 2 defenseman via trade to make yourself a contender, you are well advised to lose your cell phone until after the deadline.  I can't think of many deals where a team acquired the best player (or second best) on its roster via mid-season trade and then won the cup.  Even Ray Bourque had to come back for one more year before the Avs won.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from perrysound. Show perrysound's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    In Response to Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS:
    [QUOTE]The Calgary example doesn't really apply here, perry.  They dealt Hull for former #1 overall stay-at-home defenseman with almost no offensive upside.  Ramage was a complimentary piece on a blueline with McInnis and Suter, Macoun and McCrimmon as their top four.  In other words, they didn't make a huge investment in a top of the roster player.  They dealt from their depth in scoring forwards (Mullen and Nieuwendyk both hit 51 goals, Loob and Gilmour both had 85 pts, Roberts and Fleury were up and coming wingers...) and solidified the bottom half of their defense corps. If you're looking to acquire a top 3 forward or top 2 defenseman via trade to make yourself a contender, you are well advised to lose your cell phone until after the deadline.  I can't think of many deals where a team acquired the best player (or second best) on its roster via mid-season trade and then won the cup.  Even Ray Bourque had to come back for one more year before the Avs won.
    Posted by Bookboy007[/QUOTE]

    I remember listening to Cliff (Trader) Fletcher about that trade, and they had to ask themselves if they could live with giving up the potential that Hull had, and they thought it was worth the trade. But you are right, we are not looking at the same type of trade. They needed D depth, where we need scoring, either from the Point, as Chara isn't giving us that, or a scoring forward, as Horton isn't giving us that. 
    In an ideal world, you'd want to get a player that is long term. If Webber is traded because he won't sign with Nashville, and they want to get the best they can, then YES do the deal if he will sign in Boston. And let's face it, the B's can offer a pretty good competitive team for a guy who might want to WIN.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    Hossa helped the Pens get to the finals but then pffffft vanished.  And Atlanta should have gotten much more for him, but they seemed to think they needed more sandpaper around their stars.  Esposito was once considered a can't miss kid, but the lipstick was off that pig by the time of the trade.

    I'm not sure the league has realized the true value of high first rounders yet, but we're getting there.  These are kids who can play very very soon, and will play for very very reasonable contracts compared to their production.  In a Capped league, that's huge.  Essential, even, if you want to win a Cup.

    I was certain the Bruins were getting Couture - Ottawa connections - and I had my own doubts about whether his skating would let him be a scorer in the NHL. He skates better now.  I thought, on the subject of 67s, Toffoli was a much better bet this year than Couture was in his year, and I'm frankly stunned that the Bruins didn't take him over Knight or Spooner.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from perrysound. Show perrysound's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    And if you go with the maxim, that the team that gets the best player wins the trade, then anything involving the B's getting Webber is a win. I really like this guy. He's not Duncan Keith, but right up there.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Homebrew76. Show Homebrew76's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    In Response to Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS :  And your argument is self-defeating. You said don't trade the first pick away, yet you site an example of where they do. "Colby Armstrong, Erik Christensen, Angelo Esposito and a 1st-round ". Which I said I'd trade, made my point about and said to not trade the Leaf's pick. Not sure where you are going with this. 
    Posted by perrysound[/QUOTE]

    Actually where I was going, but mistakenly never said it, was that Pittsburg never got value back for what they traded given they didn't win the cup.   With all they traded to Atlanta in that trade, they might have been able to up that first round puck to a higher postion, kept the pick and made a better selection than Atlanta did, or who knows what else. 

    It's all moot this year anyway.  Is there a 'Hossa' level player available as a UFA this year? Brad Richards perhaps, but that might be able it.   I doubt Washington will be trading Semin.    Even if Richards is available, is he a player that would make the Bruins that much better and if so, who would he replace in the lineup?


     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from thedauber1. Show thedauber1's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    DO NOT trade that pick, draft adam larsson and be done with it.


     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from perrysound. Show perrysound's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    In Response to Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS : Actually where I was going, but mistakenly never said it, was that Pittsburg never got value back for what they traded given they didn't win the cup.   With all they traded to Atlanta in that trade, they might have been able to up that first round puck to a higher postion, kept the pick and made a better selection than Atlanta did, or who knows what else.  It's all moot this year anyway.  Is there a 'Hossa' level player available as a UFA this year? Brad Richards perhaps, but that might be able it.   I doubt Washington will be trading Semin.    Even if Richards is available, is he a player that would make the Bruins that much better and if so, who would he replace in the lineup?
    Posted by Homebrew76[/QUOTE]

    Yes he is that good. He is top 6 scoring this year. He was top 6 last year. Playoff MVP (Conn Smythe) and would give them a proven playoff performer. I'd give Bergeron or Krejci up for him, but that is me. I know PB is great at faceoffs, but what have they won with either of them.

    My first choice is a Dman (Webber) that controls the play and gets the puck to the forwards to let them do their job. I think that is the reason the scoring is down, the D doesn't move or shoot the puck very well. Richards would be next.

    Just my opinion.  

    All pipe dreams.
     
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  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from No4BobbyOrr-GOAT. Show No4BobbyOrr-GOAT's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    We gave Seid 3.2M, Yandle will be closer to 4M, he will be moved or Jov will be moved.

    Yan 24 is RFA 1.2M and Jov is 34 UFA 6.5M.

    Jov may be a late season run for cup pickup for someone, I would not move Yandle if I was PHO.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    In Response to Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS:
    [QUOTE]If Chiarelli keeps the pick and it ends up being a lottery pick that stays in the 4 or 5 spot, he should deal it.  The players in those spots probably won't play in the NHL for several years much like Jared Knight.  I'm just sayin.. Iggy would be a rent and release much like Miro was and would be worth it.
    Posted by bim09[/QUOTE]
    Except Iginla costs 20x as much as Satan did.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS

    In Response to Re: TRADING OUR 1st ROUND PICKS:
    [QUOTE]Dez- kessel isnt playing well, and has nearly twice as many point as seguin.. I think it would take a stamkos like second half for them to be at nearly the same level.. Kessel should still chip in for 30g (maybe not) but seguins not going to get there this year.. no big deal..  I think "one of the most lop sided deals in history is an over statment and a half.. We didnt get a single roster player for kessel, there was a risk involved with taking draft picks, it panned out well, but seguins not crosby ovechkin, and kessel is still a good player. BIM, others.. Iggy's not a rental, i thought he had 1 year left, hes got 2 years left at 7per.. The bruins can't touch him...
    Posted by rolerhoky19[/QUOTE]
    Too early in Seguins career to say what he won't be but I'm confident enough ,after this small sample,to expect Seguin to outscore Phil next year.He'll have more play-off points than him this year too.Throw in Knight and another lotto pick and that's pretty lopsided.
     

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