Trading Ryder

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    Crazy!

    :=)

    3-4th liners who are overpaid don't get a lot in return.  Ryder is also an expiring contract. So for the same reason you don't think Kaberle is worth it you are saying Ryder is???

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Eric66. Show Eric66's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    In Response to Re: Trading Ryder:
    [QUOTE] I agree B's Legion - can Sturm be sent to Providence and not clear through waivers, instead of the potential roster player you are rightly concerned about?  Can Sturm be handled this way?  I, for one, am not sure he's a great addition to the lineup, recovering from back-to-back serious knee injuries, and then perhaps interrupting the chemistry that is clearly building. 
    Posted by huscroft28[/QUOTE]

    No, he is not on a two-way contract.  Even if he cleared waivers, and he accepted his time in Providence, he would have to re-clear waivers if we tried to bring him back up.  Only this time, any team could pick him up for half his salary, with the other half counting against our cap.

    With Chiarelli holding all the cards in regards to Sturm's return from LTIR, it's doubtful that he would bring Sturm back without being sure that he was able to play effectively.  In other words, Sturm isn't going to play until he can contribute.

    However, I believe your concern is that, If we make room for Sturm, and then he goes down with an injury,  we will still be missing Sturm plus any players we traded to make room for him.

    To this I say, the easiest move to bring Savard back is Ryder (for a pick).  Once Ryder is gone, all that would have to be done (to make enough room for Sturm) is to send to providence 1 or 2 of:  Caron/McQuaid/Marchand.  all 3 are on 2-way contracts and could be re-called in the event of another Sturm injury. 
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from islamorada. Show islamorada's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    In Response to Re: Trading Ryder:
    [QUOTE]Can't trade money. There's probably a standing offer on the table for MR now.  He's not going to light anyone's world on fire, and he won't get traded to a team in the bottom 6 because they'd probably take their chances and grab him off of waivers.  Most sensible suggestion I've seen was that a team like the 'Jackets might scoop him for the right price - that is, a team that isn't secure as a playoff team and really needs to be a playoff team.  Cross-reference that with the list of teams with room to take on 2/3 of $4M - about $2.7 - and you get this list: Anaheim, Buffalo, Columbus, Dallas, Nashville, Carolina and Atlanta.  On the other end of the spectrum, the Kings, Tbay, StLoo, and the Avs all have the room to add him as insurance scoring.  That's too many teams for him to go to Providence.  If half that list are kicking the tires, you might even say there's enough of a market for Pete to acquire something more valuable than a crappy old Extreme cassette he can give Cam as his secret santa. But Chiarelli's also playing chicken here.  He doesn't have to trade Ryder yet, and MR has been one of the team's better secondary scorers.  The longer he remains useful, the more likely a team is to move to acquire him.  The on-rushing truck is the return of Sturm and Savard and the relative loss of bargaining power that comes with them. So - I think he's gone for a 3rd rounder by Christmas.
    Posted by Bookboy007[/QUOTE]

    I wonder if Neely liked "X".  Then the old cassette would doable for the LA Kings.  I would take a 3rd rounder for Ryder.  I was thinking a mobile defenseman if package with Wheeler and/or Hunwick.  Tonight's game is a good reason to think mobile defensemen in the Bs lineup.  

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Homebrew76. Show Homebrew76's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    Ryder has 12 points in under 14 min of ice time a game.    That puts him behind Horton and Lucic and ahead of Bergeron in points per minute played.   He is putting in the effort this year and moving his feet.  He has a great shot, is good on the forecheck and along the boards, but isn't a fast skater and is not a great defensive player. 

    Because Ryder is only a good fit on a 2nd/3rd line and on the PP, and because his contract is expiring, he should be worth about a 3rd rounder in my estimation.

    His contract will not be an issue as we get later into the season.   4 million will turn into 2 million pretty quick.   Who ever picks him up will do so with scoring depth for the playoffs in mind, which is where Ryder's real value lies.    If I were the Blues, with a contending team and lots of cap space, I'd certianly consider Ryder.   if Atlanta believes they will make the playoffs, he could fit there too.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bookboy007. Show Bookboy007's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    Eric66 - This is like "Remember the Alamo!" but it's "Remember McGrattan-o!"  A two-way contract only matters when bringing a guy back up from the minors.  If I read PC's comment right, if you're paying him a certain amount in the A on a two-way deal, he is exempt from recall waivers only.  The Bruins still had to send him through waivers to send him to Providence.  Two-way deal alone has nothing to do with waivers - it's the AHL salary that brings it into play in McGrattan's case.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from scottm50. Show scottm50's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    I'm going to go right off the tracks here and say something really provocative..."lets get rid of the human pylon, the cough up king, the over-rated defenceman " we all know as the Big Z!! What does Z stand for...Zero, as in zero effort most nights.  He is getting worse every game!!!  It pains me to watch him play these days!!  I know a lot of posters on here have a man crush on him but seriously...Trade the huge salary and all the cap issues are solved. 

    I know this is not going to happen but I look forward to everybodys comments.  Go easy, I am a true Bruins fan, I have just lost faith in Chara and it started last spring in Philly!!!
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    In Response to Re: Trading Ryder:
    [QUOTE]Crazy! :=) 3-4th liners who are overpaid don't get a lot in return.  Ryder is also an expiring contract. So for the same reason you don't think Kaberle is worth it you are saying Ryder is???
    Posted by shuperman[/QUOTE]
    No,I said Wheeler.He's a player the Leafs could use that they would still have some control over contractually.The Leafs would get younger,save money and maybe get some secondary scoring(provided Wheeler stepped it up)
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaPrince77. Show DaPrince77's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    Why would any GM in hockey want to trade for Dan Paille?? Really, this guy brings "NOTHING" to a hockey team.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from LoveRealHockey. Show LoveRealHockey's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    In Response to Re: Trading Ryder:
    [QUOTE]In a league where you may only get one crack at the cup I would do that deal and twice on sundays.  Before I get your reply I will do a break down of the moveable parts. a. 1st round pick.  Likely gonna be in the late round lets just say 25th overall. Why we can do it: We have the leafs 1st overall pick and we cripple them by taking their best player(meaning more L's and a greater chance at #1 overall). This yrs draft isnt great past the 1st 10.  b. Wheeler- 4th liner with some potential. Gladly part with him for a rental and a legit shot at Stanley. c. Sturm- Salary dump who isnt in our lineup anyway. Parts obtained: Kaberle- Top 4 Dman-20+ minute guy who would fit like PB&J.  He moves the puck and would anchor the PP(Vital in the playoffs).  Ryder for a 5th rounder.  = Salary dump in order to land a player at the deadline.  The snag in this could be giving our 1st rounder to the Leafs and not having the parts to land another player via trade. I believe adding Kaberle sends us to the top of the East.  I believe adding another player2-3rd line depth guy at the deadline also makes us the favorites.   We saw what Philly did with a top 4 pairing.  And the Bruins could be this yrs Philly.  Its possible.  Why not take a run at the cup this year.  We have a surplus 1st rounder and want rid of Sturm/Ryder anyway  
    Posted by shuperman[/QUOTE]

    I agree with most of what you're saying here Shuperman.  I'm not sure losing Kaberle actually impacts the Leafs as much as you think it does.  On this Leaf team, Kaberle is less then effective in my opinion. There aren't enough quality players up front to take advantage of his offensive creativity.  Similiarly, outside of Schenn, there isn't a good defensive partner to make up for Kaberle's shortcomings on defence.   On a team, like the Bruins, he becomes a key offensive catalyst with enough defensive support (both the Bruins system overall and their defensive minded backend) to offset his weaknesses.

    Chara and Kaberle on the powerplay would be formidable, IMHO.

    What would it cost?  I think Wheeler and a 2nd rounder would be more then enough OR/  Take a bad contract like Ryder's and the Bruins 1st pick (late 1st rounder).

    I'm not sure I'd give up on Wheeler, if I was the Bruins, but seems like a lot of folks on this forum are down on him.  I think the Ryder move would be more palatable for the Bruins, especially with Sturm and Savard coming back.

    I think Burke would make both deals.

    I've always contended that Kaberle to Boston would be a great fit for the Bruins and could make the difference in the playoffs, especially given how important PP's are.  Kaberle is also very good at making that 1st pass up ice, something the Bruins are really lacking.

    It's a good deal for the Leafs too, they get younger and can hopefully get a better up front and it wouldn't make them that much better this year to impact the 1st round pick 1 way or the other.

    Ofcourse, the little detail around giving up the no-trade clause may be the deal breaker.  I don't think Kaberle moves without a contract extension guaranteed and I'm not sure what kind of money he'd be looking at and if that fits Boston's cap situation.  Details.......

    If I was Kaberle, Boston would be an ideal situation if he's at all interested in playing for a Cup contender before he's done.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from islamorada. Show islamorada's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    In Response to Re: Trading Ryder:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Trading Ryder : I agree with most of what you're saying here Shuperman.  I'm not sure losing Kaberle actually impacts the Leafs as much as you think it does.  On this Leaf team, Kaberle is less then effective in my opinion. There aren't enough quality players up front to take advantage of his offensive creativity.  Similiarly, outside of Schenn, there isn't a good defensive partner to make up for Kaberle's shortcomings on defence.   On a team, like the Bruins, he becomes a key offensive catalyst with enough defensive support (both the Bruins system overall and their defensive minded backend) to offset his weaknesses. Chara and Kaberle on the powerplay would be formidable, IMHO. What would it cost?  I think Wheeler and a 2nd rounder would be more then enough OR/  Take a bad contract like Ryder's and the Bruins 1st pick (late 1st rounder). I'm not sure I'd give up on Wheeler, if I was the Bruins, but seems like a lot of folks on this forum are down on him.  I think the Ryder move would be more palatable for the Bruins, especially with Sturm and Savard coming back. I think Burke would make both deals. I've always contended that Kaberle to Boston would be a great fit for the Bruins and could make the difference in the playoffs, especially given how important PP's are.  Kaberle is also very good at making that 1st pass up ice, something the Bruins are really lacking. It's a good deal for the Leafs too, they get younger and can hopefully get a better up front and it wouldn't make them that much better this year to impact the 1st round pick 1 way or the other. Ofcourse, the little detail around giving up the no-trade clause may be the deal breaker.  I don't think Kaberle moves without a contract extension guaranteed and I'm not sure what kind of money he'd be looking at and if that fits Boston's cap situation.  Details....... If I was Kaberle, Boston would be an ideal situation if he's at all interested in playing for a Cup contender before he's done.
    Posted by LoveRealHockey[/QUOTE]

    LRH -  Obvious no Bs fan wants Toronto to do well.  So, do you think Ryder and the Bs 1st rounder would make Toronto a better team or a worse team?  I find you to objective enough to make an intelligent guess at the answer.  
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from LoveRealHockey. Show LoveRealHockey's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    In Response to Re: Trading Ryder:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Trading Ryder : LRH -  Obvious no Bs fan wants Toronto to do well.  So, do you think Ryder and the Bs 1st rounder would make Toronto a better team or a worse team?  I find you to objective enough to make an intelligent guess at the answer.  
    Posted by islamorada[/QUOTE]
    Honestly, taking Kaberle out of the equation if he went to Boston and getting Ryder back this year (along with 1st for next year); I would say that the Leafs would certainly NOT do materially better, and would probably lose a notch.  The deal would have to be getting a 1st rounder back as the benefit in the long-term.  I think getting Wheeler and a 2nd rounder would also be about the same effect, although I think Wheeler could make a bit more of a positive difference for the Leafs.  He's talented enough and looks like he needs a change of scenery.  Not sure TO would be the best fit for him, with all the media attention.  I would think Wheeler would play center on a team like the Leafs; and they need some size at the center position.

    It would help next year and beyond in both cases more then really help much this year.

    So I think the B's 1st rounder that they get in the Kessel deal would still be the same; potentially better given the Leafs are thin on offensive defencemen and losing Kaberle would hurt an already weak offensive team.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Eric66. Show Eric66's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    Bookboy - Now that you mention it I do remember McGrattan's situation.  Is it entry level players that do not have to clear waivers to be sent down?  In this case being Caron and Marchand
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from I-Like-Hockey. Show I-Like-Hockey's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    In Response to Re: Trading Ryder:
    [QUOTE]Bookboy - Now that you mention it I do remember McGrattan's situation.  Is it entry level players that do not have to clear waivers to be sent down?  In this case being Caron and Marchand
    Posted by Eric66[/QUOTE]

    2way contracts.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from KJBruinswin. Show KJBruinswin's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    i believe we could get kaberle for wheeler and a 2nd round pick.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Eric66. Show Eric66's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    In Response to Re: Trading Ryder:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Trading Ryder : 2way contracts.
    Posted by I-Like-Hockey[/QUOTE]


    Thats what I originally thought, but Mcgrattan has a 2-way contract, and Bookboy stated that McGrattan had to clear waivers to be sent to Providence.  I'm just going to have to look it up I guess.

    EDIT: here it is: http://www.stanleycupofchowder.com/2010/11/8/1802182/mcgrattan-placed-on-waivers-to-be-sent-to-providence

    he has a 2-way contract and had to clear waivers, so, again, is it only players on EL contracts that do not have to clear waivers?  I think we need DrCC on this one.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bruins6. Show Bruins6's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    I agree with Eric66,
    Ryder for a pick or to Providence for Savard
    Caron goes down when Sturm comes back and they yo-yo McQuaid back and forth to save cap space
    Paille will remain the 13th forward

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from yaz16. Show yaz16's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    Ryder plus Paille are gone real soon once Sturm is ready to play. Savard getting ready to play as early as tomorrow will have either Caron or Marchand dropped

    Ryder will fetch us at best a 3rd round pick and avg prospect. Don't even dream about anything better
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    In Response to Re: Trading Ryder:
    [QUOTE]i believe we could get kaberle for wheeler and a 2nd round pick.
    Posted by KJBruinswin[/QUOTE]
    agreed
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from bogie6. Show bogie6's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    Has anyone watched Kaberle play this year??In the Bruins/Leaf game he was slow and ineffective. Why do we want him?? Ryder can score, but his game is like a yo-yo. He had two great openings on Vacoun and put them both in his belly.  As soon as Savvy is ready Ryder goes for whatever Peter can get. When Sturm is ready, Paille goes, maybe to Providence. The real problem to solve is Claude. He doesn't have a clue as to why the slow starts, and he's had more than a year to evaluate his alternatives.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from dezaruchi. Show dezaruchi's posts

    Re: Trading Ryder

    In Response to Re: Trading Ryder:
    [QUOTE]Has anyone watched Kaberle play this year??In the Bruins/Leaf game he was slow and ineffective. Why do we want him?? Ryder can score, but his game is like a yo-yo. He had two great openings on Vacoun and put them both in his belly.  As soon as Savvy is ready Ryder goes for whatever Peter can get. When Sturm is ready, Paille goes, maybe to Providence. The real problem to solve is Claude. He doesn't have a clue as to why the slow starts, and he's had more than a year to evaluate his alternatives.
    Posted by Bogie6[/QUOTE]
    I'd be more concerned about CJ if Boston wasn't winning 2 out of every 3 games.I know you're going to mention play-off performance and it has merit but I think CJ should at least get the chance to coach a healthy lineup since it was never fully healthy last year.
     
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