Twice in the last 5 minutes

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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    B'slegion,
    if the only goal against is from the icing play in the canadians game, you cant fault him or his line for that play either, that was a bad play by chara..
    The fact is when your protecting  a lead i care less about generating chances and more about mistake free hockey.. Thorntons been good at that.. Say what you will, its the "skill guys" I see making most of the turn overs late in the game..
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]B'slegion, if the only goal against is from the icing play in the canadians game, you cant fault him or his line for that play either, that was a bad play by chara.. The fact is when your protecting  a lead i care less about generating chances and more about mistake free hockey.. Thorntons been good at that.. Say what you will, its the "skill guys" I see making most of the turn overs late in the game..
    Posted by rolerhoky19[/QUOTE]

    No, I'm not talking about the Montreal game specifically .I only brought this up because Chowdah stated that he's been on the ice for 55 shifts with the Bruins leading and only once (that Mtl game) did he get scored upon. 
    I could agree with for not having Savard on the ice but there are many more options that could be more effective than Thorton.
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    Bs'
    There are, but your talking 5 minutes, so your talking about running 4-6 shifts right?

    There are players you dont want out there, which is going to shorten your options.. Thornton clearly is not a liability, the bruins have been good in the 3rd, but have their share of collapses this year, I would wager he is not on the ice for many of them, you dont have those kid of collapses when your giving a full effort..
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    Roler,
    Time will tell and see how many more situations Thorts will be in .  Right now as I was saying,  even though he's had 55 shifts and only got scored on once how many of those shifts were the Bruins leading by more than one goal and having him on the ice was not such a hazard.
    Thorton has never been paid to score goals or being a defensive player in all of his career but if Julien has molded this guy differently I'll be happy with what he's bringing .


     

     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    B's
    55 shifts in the last 5 minutes, how many blow outs have the bruins really produced that he would have increased shifts in the past few minutes..
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes : No, I'm not talking about the Montreal game specifically .I only brought this up because Chowdah stated that he's been on the ice for 55 shifts with the Bruins leading and only once (that Mtl game) did he get scored upon.  I could agree with for not having Savard on the ice but there are many more options that could be more effective than Thorton.
    Posted by BsLegion[/QUOTE]

    Obviously it hasn't been 55 shifts when they were ahead . Where did you read that ? Not from me .He has 55 shifts total. If you look at one of my posts it says 'every type of situation'. And for the record I also stated that I would prefer someone other then Thornton.

    People are turning this into a thread of ' I'd rather have someone else out there' or 'how many times has he scored when he's been out there. That is not the point of the thread. The point is Thornton has been out there 55 times and only one goal has been scored against the B's. Isn't this a positive stat  ?

    This board has become a 'show me the facts' type of board rather then an opinion board so I thought I'd say show me the facts why he shouldn't be out there ( ever ) if your opinion is that strong. So far nothing !

    And for the record he has a plus minus of zero during that time frame. He has also scored a goal.
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    Chowd,
    we werent saying that, B's legion is questioning how many shifts when we were in a blow out..

    But realistically, that amounts to about 1.3 shifts per game in the final minutes.. And through thornton may have gotten more in a big lead, we know he is getting less shifts when lines can be managed properly when we are trailing..
    There have been games where the 4th line has played while trailing etc..

    The 4th gets a regular shift, unless they start to become a liability its just biased saying the dont belong on the ice with a 1 goal lead though.. nothing supports that whether NAS likes it or not..

    You can't play bergeron's line the entire 5 minutes, I dont want savy or seguin out there protecting a lead, and krejci had as many off nights as anyone else..

    1 goal againts in that role (which is on chara) nothing supports that they dont belong out there.
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    As I posted early in this thread, Thornton gives 100% of his capability whenever he is on the ice. That said, his capabilities are limited to skating in one direction without changing; throwing down with the "goons" from other teams; once in a while, scoring a goal from trying hard and having some Irish luck. He is not the smartest hockey player; he does not anticipate, he reacts; he does not pass well or control the puck very well; he over-reacts, and is out of position more than he is where he can help. The bruins pay him for what he can do, and Claude is not exactly astute in his management of player's ice time. Claude has been better lately, but, he often regresses to calling on the center and not modifying the wings in the final minutes. Even Claude's use of REX, like on PK is not really astute. REX is smart, but often left behind with faster skaters, and lately has made some real passing blunders in the defensive zone. Both Rex and Thornton need to have the coaching staff use them wisely not reactive.
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]Chowd, we werent saying that, B's legion is questioning how many shifts when we were in a blow out.. But realistically, that amounts to about 1.3 shifts per game in the final minutes.. And through thornton may have gotten more in a big lead, we know he is getting less shifts when lines can be managed properly when we are trailing.. There have been games where the 4th line has played while trailing etc.. The 4th gets a regular shift, unless they start to become a liability its just biased saying the dont belong on the ice with a 1 goal lead though.. nothing supports that whether NAS likes it or not.. You can't play bergeron's line the entire 5 minutes, I dont want savy or seguin out there protecting a lead, and krejci had as many off nights as anyone else.. 1 goal againts in that role (which is on chara) nothing supports that they dont belong out there.
    Posted by rolerhoky19[/QUOTE]

    Roler, a really good post !
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from BsLegion. Show BsLegion's posts

    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    Nah Chowdah,  just chatting with you.
    I did mis-read about the 55 shifts , I thought you meant when the Bruins were leading with less than 5mins . 
    Facts,  when it happens I can point it out but I'de much rather give the team merit on holding on to 3rd period leads rather than one player or blame the whole team if they get scored upon. Unless Thorton (or another player)  gets a penalty or a give-a-way late in the 3rd you won't see me blaming him. So far so good.
    Your opinion is valued.



     
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]Nah Chowdah,  just chatting with you. I did mis-read about the 55 shifts , I thought you meant when the Bruins were leading with less than 5mins .  Facts,  when it happens I can point it out but I'de much rather give the team merit on holding on to 3rd period leads rather than one player or blame the whole team if they get scored upon. Unless Thorton (or another player)  gets a penalty or a give-a-way late in the 3rd you won't see me blaming him. So far so good. Your opinion is valued.  
    Posted by BsLegion[/QUOTE]

    B's Legion , no big deal . I just read Chowda said ......... and my first reaction was ' hey, wait a minute '. Your opinion is also valued.
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]No , your sig line and posted opinions hasn't stayed the same on this topic . It started out as 4th line ..........just Thornton........any situation.......went to 1 goal .....then 2 goals . It's obvious that after 3700+ posts you don't remember everything you've posted . As a matter of fact you altered your sig line yesterday. Lying to your faithful . Shame on you ! And considering it's my thread you should go back and read the first post. It has nothing to do with the B's being behind in a game and scoring goals. He is obviously not the player to be out there with 5 minutes left and down on the scoreboard. It is a matter of him being out in a defensive role with 5 minutes left to play . You keep changing the topic to suit your argument ( you are famous for this ). I asked for cold hard statistical facts. I gave you 54 out of 55 times that Thornton was on the ice ( in every type of situation ) and the other team didn't score. And you gave me .....well......nothing ( but your opinion ). Am I supposed to take your opinion over cold hard statistical facts ?  Let it go ?  There are quite a few who are fine with Thornton being out there . Try reading again . This time don't skip over everyone elses posts just so that you can go back and fall in love with your own..
    Posted by Chowdahkid-[/QUOTE]

    Haven't changed my sig line since I made this one. You're just wrong about that.

    I certainly appreciate your 55 stat.  Of those 55 times, how many times were related to my sig line, which is up or down by two goals? 

    How many times has he been on the ice when the team needed a goal (again, relating to my sig line) and has gotten one?  Zero.




     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    For those howling about the fourth line:

    This isn't about the fourth line.


     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chowdahkid-. Show Chowdahkid-'s posts

    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes : Haven't changed my sig line since I made this one. You're just wrong about that. I certainly appreciate your 55 stat.  Of those 55 times, how many times were related to my sig line, which is up or down by two goals?  How many times has he been on the ice when the team needed a goal (again, relating to my sig line) and has gotten one?  Zero.
    Posted by Not-A-Shot[/QUOTE]

    Once again I will tell you to read the original post. Does it say anything about getting goals ? It does say something about protecting the lead. Hopefully after posting this for the third time you'll understand this. You really need to read the whole thread and all the points that were made.

    Your hatred for Thornton as a player doesn't actually make you objective on this. btw thanks for your opinion but still nothing but that.
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes : Once again I will tell you to read the original post. Does it say anything about getting goals ? It does say something about protecting the lead. Hopefully after posting this for the third time you'll understand this. You really need to read the whole thread and all the points that were made. Your hatred for Thornton as a player doesn't actually make you objective on this. btw thanks for your opinion but still nothing but that.
    Posted by Chowdahkid-[/QUOTE]
    Chowdah...it appears some people are having a difficult time understanding your post. So far nobody has come up with any cold hard facts to dispute your claim........you win my friend....I'm waiting for someone to cry Uncle! haha
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]Anyone see a relationship between CJ rolling 4 lines and Boston being the best 3rd period team in hockey?  they're fresher than the other team.  Thorton deserves nothing but credit for his play this year.
    Posted by Seabasshole[/QUOTE]

    Boston's improvement had nothing to do with rolling 4.  It had to do with Cj actually beginning to coach, he started shifting lines during the game, he changed the lines and players came back, giving him a pretty awesome lineup. Until the other night he also had smartened up since having the Thorn line out against the Habs.

    I have commended Cj on some of his coaching in past days, since shellacking him in past. The team is playing better, be it because of Cj or in spite of him I still don't know and the jury is still out.
    --------------------------------------------------------------
    The team is winning but Thorn is not his top defensive specialist and should never be on the ice shorthanded nor in last 10 mins if down a goal or up 2 goals unless the game has become a bloodbath and the game outcome has been sacrificed. This should have happened against Pit when Sav was injured.

    Thorn has played 35 secs SH this year, 13S in 7-0 win against Car(14:40 in 7-0 score after McQ fight and instigator call, a just in case shiite happens), 5S in 5-2 win over Buf(out of box straight to bench), 17S in 3-2 loss to Buf (unknown why- Berg was in Box in 1-1 score at 17 mins in second period).

    Pretty sure Cj does not want him on the ice in a SH situation, so why would he put him on the ice during a key time when you need a goal or are down a goal, why-pure stupidity sending a message that his players aren't playing well enough that his worst player is out there.

    If Cj has to send a message to the rest of the team by throwing Thorn out when the game is on the line, he is either 1-classically stupid and does not care whether he wins or loses or 2)He has no control over his team to get his best players to be his best players or 3)Thorn has something on him.

    I don't believe he is totally stupid, his players want to play for him, so it must be that Thorn has something on him like maybe the keys to the fridge and the KFC bucket.

    Chowda and boys for Thorn playing in tight situations when the game is on the line--  It is great to have an opinion and back it up, but when that opinion is just becoming bullheadedness, time to take a step back. 
               To suggest that playing your absolute worst playing player and probably worse(meaning less talented, not about being able to fight) than those sitting in the pressbox and playing in junior or the minors over your top players because you want to rest them that extra min because the playoffs are only 40 games away-is just 2fnfunny. 
        Or because he has had a couple of good shifts, these shifts are usually against the worst line of the other team not when the other teams top line is out putting it all on the line trying to score.


    The point is this is just totally absurd that a coach would put out his weakest line in this time of the game and even more equally absurd that a pile of doughheads that think roses grow out of his shiite would try to justify it is just priceless.

    I guess I will never get it, never seen coaches in any sytem apply this theory, definitely not coaches that were on winning teams maybe in Tykes where the fair play rule applies but nowhere else.

    I threw out the baseball analogy because you obviously are lacking in the hockey smarts and thought it might appease your baseball minds.
    NAS- it was a DH to pitch not pinchhit in bottom of ninth that likens throwing Thorn on ice to score or stop a goal in last of game, next he will pull TT and throw Thorn in nets, I bet a lot of the same people would jump for this also.

    Hopefully Cj gets smart and doesn't do it any more this year, but I doubt it, I will try to refrain from my long windedness in the future.

    Chowda et al, I know you are not stupid I disagree and agree with some of your posts, i JUST DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHY YOU WOULD AGREE WITH THIS.  I will agree to disagree.
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes : Boston's improvement had nothing to do with rolling 4.  It had to do with Cj actually beginning to coach, he started shifting lines during the game, he changed the lines and players came back, giving him a pretty awesome lineup. Until the other night he also had smartened up since having the Thorn line out against the Habs. I have commended Cj on some of his coaching in past days, since shellacking him in past. The team is playing better, be it because of Cj or in spite of him I still don't know and the jury is still out. -------------------------------------------------------------- The team is winning but Thorn is not his top defensive specialist and should never be on the ice shorthanded nor in last 10 mins if down a goal or up 2 goals unless the game has become a bloodbath and the game outcome has been sacrificed. This should have happened against Pit when Sav was injured. Thorn has played 35 secs SH this year, 13S in 7-0 win against Car(14:40 in 7-0 score after McQ fight and instigator call, a just in case shiite happens), 5S in 5-2 win over Buf(out of box straight to bench), 17S in 3-2 loss to Buf (unknown why- Berg was in Box in 1-1 score at 17 mins in second period). Pretty sure Cj does not want him on the ice in a SH situation, so why would he put him on the ice during a key time when you need a goal or are down a goal, why-pure stupidity sending a message that his players aren't playing well enough that his worst player is out there. If Cj has to send a message to the rest of the team by throwing Thorn out when the game is on the line, he is either 1-classically stupid and does not care whether he wins or loses or 2)He has no control over his team to get his best players to be his best players or 3)Thorn has something on him. I don't believe he is totally stupid, his players want to play for him, so it must be that Thorn has something on him like maybe the keys to the fridge and the KFC bucket. Chowda and boys for Thorn playing in tight situations when the game is on the line--  It is great to have an opinion and back it up, but when that opinion is just becoming bullheadedness, time to take a step back.             To suggest that playing your absolute worst playing player and probably worse(meaning less talented, not about being able to fight) than those sitting in the pressbox and playing in junior or the minors over your top players because you want to rest them that extra min because the playoffs are only 40 games away-is just 2fnfunny.      Or because he has had a couple of good shifts, these shifts are usually against the worst line of the other team not when the other teams top line is out putting it all on the line trying to score. The point is this is just totally absurd that a coach would put out his weakest line in this time of the game and even more equally absurd that a pile of doughheads that think roses grow out of his shiite would try to justify it is just priceless. I guess I will never get it, never seen coaches in any sytem apply this theory, definitely not coaches that were on winning teams maybe in Tykes where the fair play rule applies but nowhere else. I threw out the baseball analogy because you obviously are lacking in the hockey smarts and thought it might appease your baseball minds. NAS- it was a DH to pitch not pinchhit in bottom of ninth that likens throwing Thorn on ice to score or stop a goal in last of game, next he will pull TT and throw Thorn in nets, I bet a lot of the same people would jump for this also. Hopefully Cj gets smart and doesn't do it any more this year, but I doubt it, I will try to refrain from my long windedness in the future. Chowda et al, I know you are not stupid I disagree and agree with some of your posts, i JUST DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHY YOU WOULD AGREE WITH THIS.  I will agree to disagree.
    Posted by No4BobbyOrr-GOAT[/QUOTE]

    Wow !
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    If you can't win them wisdom, then baffle them with...
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes : Haven't changed my sig line since I made this one. You're just wrong about that. I certainly appreciate your 55 stat.  Of those 55 times, how many times were related to my sig line, which is up or down by two goals?  How many times has he been on the ice when the team needed a goal (again, relating to my sig line) and has gotten one?  Zero.
    Posted by Not-A-Shot[/QUOTE]

    NAS completely agree and you sig line is right on.  Just because it has only blown up in CJ's face once this season, doesn't mean that he isn't playing with fire.

    Thornton has limited ability, anyone who says otherwise is simply missing the point.  If Thornton is so strong defensively, why doesn't he see PK time?  Since he is so strong defensively, why doesn't he see more overall ice time?  It is a risk to have him out there over any other forward on the team, CJ should shorten his bench and use his best players, play some situational hockey.

    Using the Chowda theory, maybe we will see more McQuaid and Kampfer in the final five, sit Chara....since it doesn't matter...roll 6 D, right?
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes : NAS completely agree and you sig line is right on.  Just because it has only blown up in CJ's face once this season, doesn't mean that he isn't playing with fire. Thornton has limited ability, anyone who says otherwise is simply missing the point.  If Thornton is so strong defensively, why doesn't he see PK time?  Since he is so strong defensively, why doesn't he see more overall ice time?  It is a risk to have him out there over any other forward on the team, CJ should shorten his bench and use his best players, play some situational hockey. Using the Chowda theory, maybe we will see more McQuaid and Kampfer in the final five, sit Chara....since it doesn't matter...roll 6 D, right?
    Posted by Crowls2424[/QUOTE]

    This is what I'm saying also BUT Chowdah put out a number and there's no other stat out there showing that having Thorton on the ice with less than five minutes in the game a goal against the Bruins has been scored with the exception of that game in Montreal.
    Chowdah also agrees that Thorton should not be on the ice to defend but there are no facts to prove our point.
    You say playing with fire, I say for now it's working.  
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes : Boston's improvement had nothing to do with rolling 4.  It had to do with Cj actually beginning to coach, he started shifting lines during the game, he changed the lines and players came back, giving him a pretty awesome lineup. Until the other night he also had smartened up since having the Thorn line out against the Habs. I have commended Cj on some of his coaching in past days, since shellacking him in past. The team is playing better, be it because of Cj or in spite of him I still don't know and the jury is still out. -------------------------------------------------------------- The team is winning but Thorn is not his top defensive specialist and should never be on the ice shorthanded nor in last 10 mins if down a goal or up 2 goals unless the game has become a bloodbath and the game outcome has been sacrificed. This should have happened against Pit when Sav was injured. Thorn has played 35 secs SH this year, 13S in 7-0 win against Car(14:40 in 7-0 score after McQ fight and instigator call, a just in case shiite happens), 5S in 5-2 win over Buf(out of box straight to bench), 17S in 3-2 loss to Buf (unknown why- Berg was in Box in 1-1 score at 17 mins in second period). Pretty sure Cj does not want him on the ice in a SH situation, so why would he put him on the ice during a key time when you need a goal or are down a goal, why-pure stupidity sending a message that his players aren't playing well enough that his worst player is out there. If Cj has to send a message to the rest of the team by throwing Thorn out when the game is on the line, he is either 1-classically stupid and does not care whether he wins or loses or 2)He has no control over his team to get his best players to be his best players or 3)Thorn has something on him. I don't believe he is totally stupid, his players want to play for him, so it must be that Thorn has something on him like maybe the keys to the fridge and the KFC bucket. Chowda and boys for Thorn playing in tight situations when the game is on the line--  It is great to have an opinion and back it up, but when that opinion is just becoming bullheadedness, time to take a step back.             To suggest that playing your absolute worst playing player and probably worse(meaning less talented, not about being able to fight) than those sitting in the pressbox and playing in junior or the minors over your top players because you want to rest them that extra min because the playoffs are only 40 games away-is just 2fnfunny.      Or because he has had a couple of good shifts, these shifts are usually against the worst line of the other team not when the other teams top line is out putting it all on the line trying to score. The point is this is just totally absurd that a coach would put out his weakest line in this time of the game and even more equally absurd that a pile of doughheads that think roses grow out of his shiite would try to justify it is just priceless. I guess I will never get it, never seen coaches in any sytem apply this theory, definitely not coaches that were on winning teams maybe in Tykes where the fair play rule applies but nowhere else. I threw out the baseball analogy because you obviously are lacking in the hockey smarts and thought it might appease your baseball minds. NAS- it was a DH to pitch not pinchhit in bottom of ninth that likens throwing Thorn on ice to score or stop a goal in last of game, next he will pull TT and throw Thorn in nets, I bet a lot of the same people would jump for this also. Hopefully Cj gets smart and doesn't do it any more this year, but I doubt it, I will try to refrain from my long windedness in the future. Chowda et al, I know you are not stupid I disagree and agree with some of your posts, i JUST DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHY YOU WOULD AGREE WITH THIS.  I will agree to disagree.
    Posted by No4BobbyOrr-GOAT[/QUOTE]


    BOOM! Finally someone else who understands the role of a forth liner! PERFECTLY SAID GOAT!!
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes : Once again I will tell you to read the original post. Does it say anything about getting goals ? It does say something about protecting the lead. Hopefully after posting this for the third time you'll understand this. You really need to read the whole thread and all the points that were made. Your hatred for Thornton as a player doesn't actually make you objective on this. btw thanks for your opinion but still nothing but that.
    Posted by Chowdahkid-[/QUOTE]

    I understand now. 

    Of the 55, how many of those were with the team down one or two goals?
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes : I understand now.  Of the 55, how many of those were with the team down one or two goals?
    Posted by Not-A-Shot[/QUOTE]


    Hey Chowda,

    Since this thread was clearly directed at my sig line, and because you're done your homework on the stats, it would be great if you could answer this question.


    Thanks.
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    Let's go, Chowda. Of the 55 times, how many were when the B's were up by one or two goals?
     
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    Re: Twice in the last 5 minutes

    Shot,
    He already answered me your question:
    I wrote:
    You're saying out of 55 shifts when Bruins were leading  (and I applaud you on getting this stat ) only 1 goal has been scored with Thorton on the ice ?
    Impressive , but how many of them the Bruins were leading by more than 1 goal ?  I know I saw him on the ice a lot when they were beating Atlanta 8-1 or Ottawa 6-0 or Canes 7-0. 



    Chowdah wrote:
    Obviously it hasn't been 55 shifts when they were ahead . Where did you read that ? Not from me .He has 55 shifts total. If you look at one of my posts it says 'every type of situation'. And for the record I also stated that I would prefer someone other then Thornton.

    People are turning this into a thread of ' I'd rather have someone else out there' or 'how many times has he scored when he's been out there. That is not the point of the thread. The point is Thornton has been out there 55 times and only one goal has been scored against the B's. Isn't this a positive stat  ?

    This board has become a 'show me the facts' type of board rather then an opinion board so I thought I'd say show me the facts why he shouldn't be out there ( ever ) if your opinion is that strong. So far nothing !

    And for the record he has a plus minus of zero during that time frame. He has also scored a goal.
     

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