3 Ways to Do it

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it:
    [QUOTE]I'd try to get Roy Hibbert or Andrew Bynum. Or make a trade. We have two max contracts and two first round draft picks and Rondo. That's a lot to work with.
    Posted by Kirk6[/QUOTE]

    I agree with you about next season.  The Celtics will have a lot of money to sign players for the future.   Although, I am not opposed to trades this season, I am not convinced that any trades that are made now will help the team improve this season.  What would the Celtics get in return for trading Ray or KG who aren't anywhere the players that they once were?  I am not sure that trading Rondo is a good idea unless you can get a player that will really help this team and also be part of the rebuilding process. 
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from concord27. Show concord27's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it:
    [QUOTE]If we don't get Deron then I say we trade KG to Detroit for their UNPROTECTED 1st round pick, Ben Gordon, and Charlie V.  Then we trade Ray to Indy for another 1st round pick. That way we would end up with 4 1st round picks and the 2 would be lottery picks. 
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]
    Fierce I am not sure the value of the big three is not seriously damaged at this point.  The Celtics have collapsed. We may not be getting a what we think in return.  I hope I am wrong.

    The Big three look very unable to impact games and win.
     
  3. This post has been removed.

     
  4. This post has been removed.

     
  5. This post has been removed.

     
  6. This post has been removed.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bird-to-DJ. Show Bird-to-DJ's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    A few thoughts/opinions

    1.  I don't want the contracts/attitudes of BG and CV just so I can get another #1 pick.  While you might argue it would be a lottery pick - then that is the #1 reason that Joe Dumars would never do it... KG for a lottery pick - he'd be fired for making that trade unless CV and BG are that much of a problem on the team... which brings me back to the first point - I wouldn't want them under that scenario wiht multiple years lef ton their contracts.

    2.  Unless, Bird thinks RA gets him into the Eastern Conference Finals, would you as the Pacers' owner spend $10M (prorated) to be marginally better.  I believe you that it works under the cap rules, but would you spend your organization's money to not be able to beat the top-2 teams?  I wouldn't and I doubt Bird would either.

    3. Why in the world would Golden State trade Ellis for RA in the final year of his contract... If they wanted to, they could get a lot more long-term value than RA unless we are including multiple draft picks... Unless he is a cancer in the locker room... if so, why would we want him.

    4. RR for Dwill.... That one is interesting.  It would take a gunslinger (DA, maybe) to trade for DWill wihthout an extension on the presumption that with the expiring KG/RA contracts we will get D12.  If it doens't happen and both end up elsewhere, remember how bad the Bulls were when they "blew it up...".

    Too many people forget how bad it can be when you simply "blow it up".

    Fierce - you started the thread with 3 options.  I would argue that the team was actually built through the draft (Jefferson, #5 pick, etc.) that provided the opportunity to build the champiosnhip team through two major trades.  Maybe that's only a semantic game but other than a DWill/D12 scenario, play out the season do not gut the rest of the roster (i.e., RR) and begin a 2-3 year (hopefully) rebuild process...

    Personally, I think DA makes a decision in two weeks and if he thinks he can get to the #6 seed - he actually goes shopping for help (who will be this year's PJ Brown (good) or Troy Murphy (not so good...) rather than the seller everyone here is clamoring for - even if they can't really come up with good options.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bird-to-DJ. Show Bird-to-DJ's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it:
    [QUOTE]Remember guys, Ainge built a championship team through trades. The best player Ainge drafted is Al Jefferson. Free-agent signings also didn't work out too well for Ainge. Other than Posey, the other signings didn't pan out. So the fastest way to get back to the Finals is to trade our current assets for players like Pau Gasol. Gasol is 31 years old, so he has 4-5 good years left in him. Even this year's deep draft doesn't have a big man like Pau Gasol. Building through the draft will take time. If we start from scratch this year, it will take at least 5 years to get back to the playoffs.  
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    Fierce - Per my last post, may eb a semantic game... but I think it was more through draft...

    RA trade was really #5 pick (draft) / DWest (draft and an solid NBA player) and WSz (salary dump) & KJ was Jefferson (draft) Ryan Gomes (draft and a solid NBA player) GGreen (draft but a stiff) Ratliff (salary dump) and assorted other parts... I hope I remember the trade correctly as I am not spending the time to check the details...

    With a couple of draft picks... RR/PP/JGreen (hopefully) and hopeful developemnt from a couple of our younger guys & cap flexibilty for the next coiuple of seasons - maybe next year's FA crop snce you are correct that this year's isn't the greatest... I think a 2-3 years to get to the playoffs is very doable (vice your 5) but a finals team is anyone's guess as it will be dependent on things that can't be predicted at the moment.  I think 5 years is too pessimistic primarily because we won't be blowing itup and "starting from scratch"... unless we do what many on  this board want us to do an dbecome the Bulls post Jordan.  Just my opinion.
     
  9. This post has been removed.

     
  10. This post has been removed.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bird-to-DJ. Show Bird-to-DJ's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    Fierce,

    I happen to be a RR fan - although he has his well documented faults...  But he would obviously be the main piece that went to the Lakers for Pau.  I think we simply filled one hole while creating another.  I know that while RR was hurt, PP acted as the point forward with good results; however, I don't think, even with the addition of Gasol, that running the offense with PP as the point forward every night and into the playoffs gets us past Miami/Bulls unless we come up with a PG out of thin air - maybe E'Twan becomes the next Jeremy Lin.  And then we got older not younger as a team moving into the next few years.  If we discuss trading RR (unless we are just getting assets for the future) as a component piece for this year/next, I don't do it unless there is the second piece outlining where our playoff caliber PG comes from...
     
  12. This post has been removed.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from myaim45. Show myaim45's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    I would attempt to move players for draft picks, then attempt to sign a top free agent, then build a supporting cast through the draft. To run a solid team you need to have a little of everything.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from SFBostonFan. Show SFBostonFan's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it : We have 2 options. 1. Rondo and JO for Gasol then Ray for Mo Williams 2. Rondo, JO, and Bass for Gasol and Blake
    Posted by Fiercest34[/QUOTE]

    There are so many different threads dealing with the same topic...trades...so I've copied and pasted this which I posted separately under “LA’s BIG 3 better than Our BIG 3”.


    Fiercest, I do not profess to be Sherlock Holmes here as this has been discussed ad infinitum the past few weeks as our Celtics have collapsed.  Watched the Lakers-Dallas game last night won by LA and , despite Norwitzki’s 25 pts, it was LA’s big men, Gasol 24 pts/9Rebs and Bynum 19pts/14 rebs that ensured the victory. First let me say since I go back as a fan to Cousy days, I hate the Lakers, still pissed about the loss 2 years ago in 7th game blowing a 13 point lead and despite the egregious difference in foul shots 41-18, we still could have won but the difference was, and they shot 32% to our 40% and Kobe only 25%, we lost the REBOUND battle. Yup, I know Perkins was out.

    Our biggest need is a big guy..6’11”…7 footer. It is not to exchange PGs  . However, I would do an even up on Rondo for Monta Ellis(I live in SF & go to GS games---fans hate LA same as we do and in sports bars root for us vs LA).  Would love too to get Mo Williams from Clippers for Ray Allen but don’t think they’d bite. Hate to say it but the Lakers BIG 3, Kobe, Gasol & Bynum are more valuable than our BIG 3.  Although our supporting cast is better, theirs does not have to shoot as well as we do but since they out rebound teams, the biggies put in the rebound or pass it out for another shot. As they say with shot after shot, even a blind chipmunk finds an acorn after time.

    So, we need get Gasol, Kaman or Gortat so using Rondo for Monta Ellis ain’t gonna do it.  If Genius Danny can get D. Howard and Deron Williams, let KG go along with Rondo & Allen. I'd let PP go too but feel that passing Bird in scoring and the contribution he’s made over the years, he should retire a Celtic. Although being from LA area, maybe he wouldn’t mind finishing his days with Lakers or Clippers.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from davidap. Show davidap's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    Over on Grantland, Sports Guy suggested three trades for the Celtics:

    1. Garnett to the Mavericks for Odom and Marion.
    2. Rondo and O'Neal to the Lakers for Gasol.
    3. Allen to the Clippers for Williams.

    Of the three deals, only the first one seems realistic to me because the Mavericks want to clear enough cap space to sign both Howard and Williams, plus Garnett is outplaying Odom this year anyway. Both Odom and Marion could flourish in Boston, so this is a win-win swap for each team. The Celtics could possibly even finagle a first round draft pick out of it too because of Dallas' desperation to sign two max players.

    The deal for Gasol is too lopsided in the Celtics' favor. Sports Guy claims that Gasol "checked out." I've been watching some recent Lakers games and Gasol looks phenomenal. It would make no sense to trade one of the best bigs in the league. The Lakers have been winning of late because of Gasol and Bynum, not Kobe Bryant. In a wide open playoff race, I think the Lakers could advance as far as anyone else in the West, even if they do nothing. Trading Gasol for Rondo would make them worse. Maybe they could have done that had they held onto Odom, but Bynum alone won't be able to provide the necessary rebounding and scoring punch. If the Lakers trade Gasol, it will be for both a point guard and a decent inside player. I'm not counting Jermaine O'Neal here. To further entice the Lakers, the Celtics would have to throw in a draft pick and add Bass while taking back Blake, or would have to swap Allen for World Peace.

    The proposed Allen for Williams trade doesn't really help the Clippers. If they still had a healthy Chauncey Billups, then it would work because of the glut of quality point guards. But Billups is out for the season and Williams a younger, more athletic combo guard who can come off the bench with energy and volume scoring. He's better than Ray Allen at this juncture. I suppose the Clippers might want to shed Williams' contract because of the team option he holds for next season. However, that would make the Clippers worse for this year, at a time when they might be able to win it all. Also, there's no way they'd throw in a first round draft pick on top of the superior player to make the exchange.

    I'm on board with Sports Guy on Garnett for Odom and Marion. I think the Lakers deal would need a lot of tweaking to make it appetizing on their side. Rondo, Allen, O'Neal, Bass for Gasol, World Peace, Blake and Goudelock would probably do it. I hate the idea of giving up Bass (the lone rebounder on the current Celtics team) and I'm also not too keen on adding World Peace. But with the way Gasol is playing of late, it will take a lot to get him, and overall, the Celtics would still be a much better team. The 9-man rotation:

    C Gasol
    PF Odom
    SF Marion
    PG Bradley
    SG Pierce

    C Wilcox
    PF Johnson
    SF/SG World Peace
    PG Blake
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from SFBostonFan. Show SFBostonFan's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    Davidap....pretty good analysis. I agree that Gasol straight up for Rondo would be a steal for us and they would suffer not having their 2 twin towers and JO as a replacement ain't gonna do it. And you are right about Kobe not the reason they've done well but when you outrebound teams, your shooting % doesn't need be more than 40% when you get shot after shot.

    Personally, I think Odom is as washed up as our big 3...I say that as being older, not just lousy but who know's on a team where he can be more of a star with more playing time than Dallas, he might be a good gamble. I hate Ron Artest...please no!

    Ray Allen is in great shape for his age and can still shoot when not double teamed and can get open. On another team with threats like Paul & Griffin on Clippers, he could be a major contributor. I would try to sell him, someone else with him and a draft pick too for Mo Williams. Anyway, thanks for your great comments.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Red-16Russ-11. Show Red-16Russ-11's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it:
    [QUOTE]Davidap....pretty good analysis. I agree that Gasol straight up for Rondo would be a steal for us and they would suffer not having their 2 twin towers and JO as a replacement ain't gonna do it. And you are right about Kobe not the reason they've done well but when you outrebound teams, your shooting % doesn't need be more than 40% when you get shot after shot. Personally, I think Odom is as washed up as our big 3...I say that as being older, not just lousy but who know's on a team where he can be more of a star with more playing time than Dallas, he might be a good gamble. I hate Ron Artest...please no! Ray Allen is in great shape for his age and can still shoot when not double teamed and can get open. On another team with threats like Paul & Griffin on Clippers, he could be a major contributor. I would try to sell him, someone else with him and a draft pick too for Mo Williams. Anyway, thanks for your great comments.
    Posted by mandobello[/QUOTE]

    We can't do Rondo straight up for Gasol, the salaries don't match.  I would never trade with LAL anyway, as I don't trust Kupcake!!
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from SFBostonFan. Show SFBostonFan's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it : We can't do Rondo straight up for Gasol, the salaries don't match.  I would never trade with LAL anyway, as I don't trust Kupcake!!
    Posted by Red-16Russ-11[/QUOTE]

    Magic Johnson believes there's one sure cure for the Lakers’ woes.

    "If they can make a trade, they'll be right there competing for the Western Conference championship. We're lacking at the point guard, like we've been saying for the last year-and-a-half or so. But if they don't (make a deal), with Oklahoma City and San Antonio playing so much better than the Lakers, I don't think they will compete."

    Magic has put the ball in management's court. Will it be another brilliant assist, or will Jim Buss watch the ball go right through his hands?

    Problem for LA is how can they get a PG, Rondo for example, without giving up Gasol and that breaks up their twin towers rebounding dominance !!!
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Accension13. Show Accension13's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it:
    [QUOTE] 3. Why in the world would Golden State trade Ellis for RA in the final year of his contract... If they wanted to, they could get a lot more long-term value than RA unless we are including multiple draft picks... Unless he is a cancer in the locker room... if so, why would we want him.
    [/QUOTE]

    I think this deal is a possibility for GS. This is a losing team, and they have been a losing team with the same main players for years. They are over the cap, and they have a young SG in waiting to take the place of Ellis. By trading for Ray Allen and maybe a #1, they would get some value in the pick and the ability to dump salary. If Boston really wants Ellis, they could offer to take on some salary like Biendries, but thats an iffy proposition
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from beavis. Show beavis's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it:
    [QUOTE]1. Trade the Ageing 3! 2. Trade the Ageing 3! 3. Trade the Ageing 3!
    Posted by Elven 32[/QUOTE]

    Yes to Kevin and Ray, but no to Paul. If each could bring a first rounder, I would do it.

    Cant see Paul wearing anything but Green...

    The draft the next two years are deep...
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from JayShizzle45. Show JayShizzle45's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    Trade Rondo for Millsap and Devin Harris. If we need a throw in, give them Dooling and Wilcox


    Once Bass and gets healthy, you have him, Mills, and J.J. to play alongside K.G. and J.O.

    Mills can rebound and do the dirty work inside.

    Harris can score outside and penetrate and is a decent enough pass to be the pg for us. Let A.B. keep coming off the bench., and next year let them battle it out.

    Keep the Big 3 for last for one last run(they have played better with A.B.)

    and after the reason let K.G. go, keep Pierce on and ask Ray is he wants to come be a 6th man for veteran exception.

    Use money to resign J.Green


    D.Harris
    Pierce
    Green
    Millsap
    (acquired free agent Big)

    A.B. - Moore
    R.Allen
    J.J.
    Bass
    Steamboat
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from sporter81. Show sporter81's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    Keep the Big 3 for last for one last run(they have played better with A.B.)

    A run at the 8th seed? These guys are so old and declining fast, they wont improve only slow down even more. Get something for them now before its too late. Sports is a business, they made plenty of money and will get over it. The Celtics should have traded these guys before last season.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from prakash. Show prakash's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it : We can't do Rondo straight up for Gasol, the salaries don't match.  I would never trade with LAL anyway, as I don't trust Kupcake!!
    Posted by Red-16Russ-11[/QUOTE]

    As long as we are discussing trade options how about this one.  Rondo, Jon and a 1st round draft pick for Kaman and Gordon.  Improves the team this year and improves the salary cap flexibility next year.  Sign Gordon to a qualifying offer (unless he gets a big offer) for 1 year and retain his Bird rights.  The roster may be attractive enough to lure DWill & DH.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: 3 Ways to Do it : Yes to Kevin and Ray, but no to Paul. If each could bring a first rounder, I would do it. Cant see Paul wearing anything but Green... The draft the next two years are deep...
    Posted by beavis[/QUOTE]

    Agree that I would never want to see Pierce traded.  
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from CablesWyndBairn. Show CablesWyndBairn's posts

    Re: 3 Ways to Do it

    FA, draft and  trades will be how this team rebuilds.  FA first because what the C's do this offseason with those max contracts will set the table for the next 5-7 years.  Assuming they can find players(s) worth using the max on, and assuming they have two top 20 picks in their own and the Clips' pick, this team could increase its talent level pretty quickly. 

    Ainge needs to be careful that he doesn't spend the money just because he has it.  Villanueva and Gordon haven't done too much for Detroit, and they got a lot of money because they happened to hit FA at the right time and Detroit had the money.  I'm hoping if the C's miss out on, say, Williams and Howard that they just don't grab any FA.   
     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share