Ainge and ownership repeats history...

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from CubanPete. Show CubanPete's posts

    Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    After the 1988 loss to the Pistons in the ECF, it was painfully obvious the Cs were done and the Bird Era was effectively over. Yet Cs management put off rebuilding and allowed the Big Three to linger into the early 1990s. This started a period of irellevancy that lasted 20 years.

    When Chris Bosh resumed logging starter's minutes for games 6 and 7 in the 2012 ECF, the Heat made the point clear that the Cs could no longer compete for the NBA championship. Yet the Cs didn't trade Paul Pierce and re-upped KG. Plus they overpayed to get Green and Lee. The results: they are irrelevant this season.

    Does anyone expect them to improve next year?

    "Those who don't know history are destined to repeat it."

    - Edmund Burke

     

     

     

     
  2. This post has been removed.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from jdm894g. Show jdm894g's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    Im not a huge fan of KG nad Pierce's contracts....If KG cant go more than 5-6 minutes straight and he looks gassed at times, what is going to happen in the playoffs? It is time to bring KG and pierce off the bench!!!!

     
  4. This post has been removed.

     
  5. This post has been removed.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from kyceltic. Show kyceltic's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    In response to Fierce34's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to CubanPete's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    After the 1988 loss to the Pistons in the ECF, it was painfully obvious the Cs were done and the Bird Era was effectively over. Yet Cs management put off rebuilding and allowed the Big Three to linger into the early 1990s. This started a period of irellevancy that lasted 20 years.

    When Chris Bosh resumed logging starter's minutes for games 6 and 7 in the 2012 ECF, the Heat made the point clear that the Cs could no longer compete for the NBA championship. Yet the Cs didn't trade Paul Pierce and re-upped KG. Plus they overpayed to get Green and Lee. The results: they are irrelevant this season.

    Does anyone expect them to improve next year?

    "Those who don't know history are destined to repeat it."

    - Edmund Burke

     [/QUOTE]

    Don't forget that it was the Celtic fans who wanted the team back. Ainge and ownership just gave the fans what they wanted.

    People still pay to watch KG and Pierce. It's not all about basketball, it's also about money.

    [/QUOTE] Not all of us wanted the team back, yourself included. You don't need me to tell you, that you were right!!


     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from concord27. Show concord27's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    If we can bring in Gortat for Lee and Bass(of which I am not sure can be pulled off) we will be back in the hunt.  If not we are a sub .500 team.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    the main thing that people forget about a player like KG is that while he's 36, he's FORTY in basketball years- been playing ball since he was 18, NOT 22!!!  pierce is also TWO basketball years older than his actual age suggests. 

    these guys have not had 'breaks' in their careers like jameel o'neal or other lesser used players who are still relevant from age 35-38.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    say what you want about the celts of the late 80s- bird still tried his asse off when he was healthy and in there and was effective.  parish was still an elite center until 1991 or so.  you cannot say the same about either pierce or kg right now and they are years younger.  part of that is the added years in the league starting at a younger age.

     
  10. This post has been removed.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from bt33. Show bt33's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    In 2007 when the Celts added KG and Ray Allen, the idea that this whole thing would have a shelf-life of 5 years, and then (minus Ray) would be extended into a sixth would have been almost laughable. Throughout that time the team has been competitive and until recently mostly fun to watch. The cracks started showing last year and this year is turning into a bit of a bomb, but it's been a good run. There are some regrets to be sure - Perk missing game 7 in 2010 and that awful loss and then a still nearly inexplicable trade that basically threw the team's chances for a title out the window the following year. It made no sense then; it makes even less sense in hindsight. The Celtics had a small window and everything should have been about trying to win as many titles as possible in that very short window and unfortunately that was not always the case. The fact that it went on for an extra couple of years only makes it more frustrating. There is no way that team should have won only one title.

    Back in the late 80s the team did face a similar set of decisions regarding aging talent and chose to ride the vets. Perhaps the better move would have been to deal pierce and garnett, but I'm not so sure it would have yielded much better results. Perhaps though the long term would look better than it does now. Bias killed the Celtics in the 80s because he was the bridge to a new era and would have theoretically taken the heat off an overworked front line. While it's not close to having the same impact, Jeff Green has proven to be a monumental mistake. Because they ripped the guts out of a close-knit team, got a guy in return who by luck of the drawer had a major health issue and is the antithesis of Perk from a toughness standpoint, had no replacement for Perk waiting in the wings, lost their back-up center to free agency, and the spending a big chunk of money to re-up Green, find him to be an incredibly soft and inconsistent player who obviously has major between the ears issues. 

     

    In any event, it is officially over. Their only shot this year is to try to pull off something to acquire a quality big. With the exception of pierce, garnett (who you can't get value for) and rondo (the face of the franchise), I'd put any one on the roster on the table to try to bring in big bodies.    

     
  12. This post has been removed.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from 003323344. Show 003323344's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    Ainge said he would consider trades if they would net younger talent. He has maintained he does not want the franchise to go through a 10-year span of insignificance as it did following the departures of the previous Big Three of Larry Bird, Kevin McHale, and Robert Parish, who remained with the team past their primes.

    http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball/celtics/extras/celtics_blog/2012/01/ainge_not_afrai.html

    yet that is exactly what he's doing.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    In response to aciemvp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    the main thing that people forget about a player like KG is that while he's 36, he's FORTY in basketball years- been playing ball since he was 18, NOT 22!!!  pierce is also TWO basketball years older than his actual age suggests. 

    these guys have not had 'breaks' in their careers like jameel o'neal or other lesser used players who are still relevant from age 35-38.

    [/QUOTE]


    Incorrect on Pierce.

    He played 3 years at Kansas and his rookie season was a lockout where he played 48 games, which was all of 11-12 more than he would have played as a senior at Kansas.

    His situation is not comparable to KG whatsoever and he is not '2 years' older than a typical guy who spent 4 years in college like Bird or McHale (that is who we are comparing them to right?).

    Pierce has played 43,600 minutes. Kobe, who is all of 10 months younger, has played 52,000 minutes. Its guys like that you talk about extra mileage from the extra years, NOT Pierce. Pierce is in the same mins and age range Jordan was during the '98 season.

    Paul is obv not Jordan, but he is well rested compared to KG, Duncan and Kobe and should be more than up to the task of being a contenders 2nd or 3rd best player and producing highly efficient 25 point games when needed if managed and used correctly.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from teejaytee70. Show teejaytee70's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    I think its time to blow this team up.  I'm not buying the "old" argument.  This team is completely lifeless and generally disinterested.  Its like they are just drifting through the regular season with the thought that they will just turn it on in the playoffs.  Sorry that ain't gonna happen.  I'd blow it up.  This is the worst type of team.  I look at this team and see another 2 years of .500 hovering and then maybe we can start to rebuild.  Ugh, it's gonna be a long, long time.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from aciemvp. Show aciemvp's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    In response to rameakap's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to aciemvp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    the main thing that people forget about a player like KG is that while he's 36, he's FORTY in basketball years- been playing ball since he was 18, NOT 22!!!  pierce is also TWO basketball years older than his actual age suggests. 

    these guys have not had 'breaks' in their careers like jameel o'neal or other lesser used players who are still relevant from age 35-38.

    [/QUOTE]

    His situation is not comparable to KG whatsoever and he is not '2 years' older than a typical guy who spent 4 years in college like Bird or McHale (that is who we are comparing them to right?).

    Pierce has played 43,600 minutes. Kobe, who is all of 10 months younger, has played 52,000 minutes. Its guys like that you talk about extra mileage from the extra years, NOT Pierce. Pierce is in the same mins and age range Jordan was during the '98 season.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    ok, so pierce played 3 college years instead of two.  he came out EARLY by ONE year so my statement was off by ONE YEAR so you can go ahead and add ONE basketball year to pierce's nba life. 

    THIS YEAR, pierce is generally noticably declined on defense.  he gets abused a lot.  his age plus a year or two are showing in reality.  he can still score as any veteran elite wily scorer can into the twilight of his career but this year more than ever before, medicore players he is "guarding" are getting their pound of flesh and then some at the other end.

    and just go ahead and forget about him guarding kobe or lebron.  it worked out extremely poorly last year with lebron

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    In response to Fierce34's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to CubanPete's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    After the 1988 loss to the Pistons in the ECF, it was painfully obvious the Cs were done and the Bird Era was effectively over. Yet Cs management put off rebuilding and allowed the Big Three to linger into the early 1990s. This started a period of irellevancy that lasted 20 years.

    When Chris Bosh resumed logging starter's minutes for games 6 and 7 in the 2012 ECF, the Heat made the point clear that the Cs could no longer compete for the NBA championship. Yet the Cs didn't trade Paul Pierce and re-upped KG. Plus they overpayed to get Green and Lee. The results: they are irrelevant this season.

    Does anyone expect them to improve next year?

    "Those who don't know history are destined to repeat it."

    - Edmund Burke

     [/QUOTE]

    Don't forget that it was the Celtic fans who wanted the team back. Ainge and ownership just gave the fans what they wanted.

    People still pay to watch KG and Pierce. It's not all about basketball, it's also about money.

    [/QUOTE]
    First off, do you work for Gallup or one of the other polling companies? Im impressed you're able to speak on behalf of what Celtic fans wanted.

    Im also amazed you would believe the team makes decisions based upon what they feel their fans desire. Maybe the Celtic brass should poll the fans before each trade or signing so they dont make a wrong decision in the future. 

    Cmon, you know better than this

     

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    In response to aciemvp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to rameakap's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to aciemvp's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    the main thing that people forget about a player like KG is that while he's 36, he's FORTY in basketball years- been playing ball since he was 18, NOT 22!!!  pierce is also TWO basketball years older than his actual age suggests. 

    these guys have not had 'breaks' in their careers like jameel o'neal or other lesser used players who are still relevant from age 35-38.

    [/QUOTE]

    His situation is not comparable to KG whatsoever and he is not '2 years' older than a typical guy who spent 4 years in college like Bird or McHale (that is who we are comparing them to right?).

    Pierce has played 43,600 minutes. Kobe, who is all of 10 months younger, has played 52,000 minutes. Its guys like that you talk about extra mileage from the extra years, NOT Pierce. Pierce is in the same mins and age range Jordan was during the '98 season.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    ok, so pierce played 3 college years instead of two.  he came out EARLY by ONE year so my statement was off by ONE YEAR so you can go ahead and add ONE basketball year to pierce's nba life. 

    THIS YEAR, pierce is generally noticably declined on defense.  he gets abused a lot.  his age plus a year or two are showing in reality.  he can still score as any veteran elite wily scorer can into the twilight of his career but this year more than ever before, medicore players he is "guarding" are getting their pound of flesh and then some at the other end.

    and just go ahead and forget about him guarding kobe or lebron.  it worked out extremely poorly last year with lebron

    [/QUOTE]


    Acie, as bad as it is to not know how many years of college ball Pierce played, you are still missing the point that his rookie year was the 48 game lockout season... he played 10 more games than he would have as a senior at Kansas.... his NBA life is not really any longer than a guy who played 4 years of college ball. Its all of 10 games longer, that is NO excuse when it comes to his play and wear/tear like it would be with Kobe or KG.

     
  19. This post has been removed.

     
  20. This post has been removed.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    The worst thing might have been last years playoff push.

    Everyone was ready to blow the team up and then all of a sudden it seemed like with a few tweaks they actually had a shot at winning it all.

    If they went out in the first or second round this probably would have been a whole different team.

    Still with that said if you ad Bradley and a decent big to this team it would be a lot better.

    Still not championship better though.

     
  22. This post has been removed.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    If the bench was producing at a high level, the Celtics would be winning.  When they have played well, the Celtics won most of these games.  You can't win games when your bench is being outscored by a large margin.  

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from concord27. Show concord27's posts

    Re: Ainge and ownership repeats history...

    In response to Fierce34's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to snakeoil123's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The worst thing might have been last years playoff push.

    Everyone was ready to blow the team up and then all of a sudden it seemed like with a few tweaks they actually had a shot at winning it all.

    If they went out in the first or second round this probably would have been a whole different team.

    Still with that said if you ad Bradley and a decent big to this team it would be a lot better.

    Still not championship better though.

    [/QUOTE]

    I agree that maybe it will still not be a championship team even with a decent big. But it would surely be an elite team. It would be a team that will not exit in the 1st round.

    A lot of people here don't like Amare. But if the Celts had Amare, in place of Bass, and the Celts are facing the Nets or Sixers in the 2nd round, most probably it's going to be another Eastern Conference Finals appearance for the Celts.

    [/QUOTE]

    If Gortat is all we think he could be and Bradley comes back as he was last year, we could make a run like last year.  It is possible.  So it is worth doing. Lee, Bass, Sullinger and perhaps Green are not impact players for the future,  they are players with potential and that is no guarantee of anything. Sullinger is never going to be 6-11, so all his fans must keep that in mind.

     
  25. This post has been removed.

     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share