An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from RallyC. Show RallyC's posts

    An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    Ian Thomsen is a neutral party from SI. He has no dog in the fight. He has no agenda and speaks from a position of expertise. Many of us here, from both sides of the argument, have said all the things that he says and I repeat, from both sides. In the end, I think his take is correct. WHAT SAY YOU?:

    http://greenstreet.weei.com/sports/boston/basketball/celtics/2013/07/04/ian-thomsen-on-dc-celtics-need-to-trade-rajon-rondo-following-fascinating-hiring-of-brad-stevens/

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    THought the article went easy on Rondo but it did make the major points.... Rondo being difficult to deal with, the Celtics played better without him and teams need to change their game around him...translation, ROndo has to be the star and play the game his way...

    I agree with him that Rondo would likely be poison to our new coach, who's going to have his hands full becoming an NBA coach to begin with..

    Best thing that could happen is ROndo heals fast and works out for all to see... then DA can dump him for whatever chump change teams are willing to give.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from RallyC. Show RallyC's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to Karllost's comment:

    THought the article went easy on Rondo but it did make the major points.... Rondo being difficult to deal with, the Celtics played better without him and teams need to change their game around him...translation, ROndo has to be the star and play the game his way...

    I agree with him that Rondo would likely be poison to our new coach, who's going to have his hands full becoming an NBA coach to begin with..

    Best thing that could happen is ROndo heals fast and works out for all to see... then DA can dump him for whatever chump change teams are willing to give.


    Ditto, on all of your points.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from BaileyPowe. Show BaileyPowe's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    i'll eat my hat if rondo's moved this summer.

    bp

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from RallyC. Show RallyC's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to BaileyPowe's comment:

    i'll eat my hat if rondo's moved this summer.

    bp



    I'll send you some hot sauce! ;-)

     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from puddinpuddin. Show puddinpuddin's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    DA needs to be able to get just enough in return for Rondo so that he doesn't look like the TOTAL idiot for having drafted him  in 2006.

    My guess is a few high draft picks and gar-barge will do the trick.

    Otherwise, I have to wonder what BSteve does the first time the smartest ASPG in the known universe walks the ball up the court while coach is   screaming to  "push it... push it.... PUSH IT!!!!" and R9R ignores him like he has done to  previous coaches.

    Pud

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from RallyC. Show RallyC's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to puddinpuddin's comment:

     

    DA needs to be able to get just enough in return for Rondo so that he doesn't look like the TOTAL idiot for having drafted him  in 2006.

    My guess is a few high draft picks and gar-barge will do the trick.

    Otherwise, I have to wonder what BSteve does the first time the smartest ASPG in the known universe walks the ball up the court while coach is   screaming to  "push it... push it.... PUSH IT!!!!" and R9R ignores him like he has done to  previous coaches.

    Pud

     


    Damn, Pud! I just had dejavu reading your post. There was rajon, the fast paced, "running" PG with DOC standing on the side line screaming incessantly to do exactly what you claim, and there is Rajon pounding the ball into the wood as he strolls up the floor to the high wing directing traffic while totally ignoring the great Doc Rivers on national TV. Nawwww, Rondo had NOTHING to do with DOC leaving!!!!!

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    DA knows Rondo has to go.... Id love to get Ty Lawson but they would never part with him for just RONdo

     
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  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from prakash. Show prakash's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to RallyC's comment:

    Ian Thomsen is a neutral party from SI. He has no dog in the fight. He has no agenda and speaks from a position of expertise. Many of us here, from both sides of the argument, have said all the things that he says and I repeat, from both sides. In the end, I think his take is correct. WHAT SAY YOU?:

    http://greenstreet.weei.com/sports/boston/basketball/celtics/2013/07/04/ian-thomsen-on-dc-celtics-need-to-trade-rajon-rondo-following-fascinating-hiring-of-brad-stevens/



    Unbiased and uninformed.  Sacramento top brass met with Cousins and proclaimed that they are looking to build the team around him.  Cousins makes Rondo look like an angel.

    Pud thinks that Rondo should be traded before he makes Danny look like an idiot for drafting him.  And then he thinks that the trade can net draft picks.  Wow!  Talk of senseless opinion.

    Lets hear it you "Rondo realists".  1 first rounder?  A couple of 2nd. rounders?  No players, just draft picks.  At what point will you guys pull the trigger?  You guy want to trade Rondo.  Lets separate hate from value.  Lets hear your sense of his value.

     

     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from prakash. Show prakash's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to darrylfries' comment:

    In response to puddinpuddin's comment:

     

    DA needs to be able to get just enough in return for Rondo so that he doesn't look like the TOTAL idiot for having drafted him  in 2006.

    My guess is a few high draft picks and gar-barge will do the trick.

    Otherwise, I have to wonder what BSteve does the first time the smartest ASPG in the known universe walks the ball up the court while coach is   screaming to  "push it... push it.... PUSH IT!!!!" and R9R ignores him like he has done to  previous coaches.

    Pud

     

      That's a good one Pud. Pierce and Garnett and the rest of our great running team was waiting on Rondo? . Show me some clips one of us must be watching some other team

     



    You took the words from my mouth.  Add Bass' ability to finish in traffic as well.  All these great runners and finishers were being held back by Rondo.

     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from prakash. Show prakash's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to darrylfries' comment:

    In response to Karllost's comment:

     

    DA knows Rondo has to go.... Id love to get Ty Lawson but they would never part with him for just RONdo

     




    Yea he said it over and over.

     



    LOL.  Actually what you will hear is that Danny says just the opposite of what he intends to do.  For example, when he said that the Celts were no longer a contender, he meant that they were.  When he said that he wanted Doc back, he actually wanted Doc to go.  When he said that he thinks that Doc is coming back, he knew that Doc will be leaving.  Now that he is saying that Brad Stevens was his first choice, it wasn't.  So when he says that he does not intend to trade Rondo, he actually means to trade him.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from RallyC. Show RallyC's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to prakash's comment:

     

    In response to darrylfries' comment:

     

     

     

    In response to puddinpuddin's comment:

     

     

     

     

     

    DA needs to be able to get just enough in return for Rondo so that he doesn't look like the TOTAL idiot for having drafted him  in 2006.

    My guess is a few high draft picks and gar-barge will do the trick.

    Otherwise, I have to wonder what BSteve does the first time the smartest ASPG in the known universe walks the ball up the court while coach is   screaming to  "push it... push it.... PUSH IT!!!!" and R9R ignores him like he has done to  previous coaches.

    Pud

     

     

     

      That's a good one Pud. Pierce and Garnett and the rest of our great running team was waiting on Rondo? . Show me some clips one of us must be watching some other team

     

     

     

     

     



    You took the words from my mouth.  Add Bass' ability to finish in traffic as well.  All these great runners and finishers were being held back by Rondo.

     

     

     


    Hey Prak and Darryl, We all watched the games and we all saw the same things. You both saw exactly what Pud, agree with him or not, described with DOC yelling at Rajon to push with Rondo constantly ignoring Doc's pleas. If you say you never saw that, then you didn't watch the games closely enough. It happened EVERY SINGLE GAME, UNTIL!!!!!!! He got hurt......THEN, the other guys obeyed DOC and we say a big difference. Black and white, plain and simple. Now as far as what DA thinks, yeah its a little hard to predict that, but WE CAN AT LEAST HOPE! Anyway, I do want value for Rondo, but what is the value of an injured malcontent? I don't know........

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to RallyC's comment:

    In response to prakash's comment:

     

    In response to darrylfries' comment:

     

     

     

    In response to puddinpuddin's comment:

     

     

     

     

     

    DA needs to be able to get just enough in return for Rondo so that he doesn't look like the TOTAL idiot for having drafted him  in 2006.

    My guess is a few high draft picks and gar-barge will do the trick.

    Otherwise, I have to wonder what BSteve does the first time the smartest ASPG in the known universe walks the ball up the court while coach is   screaming to  "push it... push it.... PUSH IT!!!!" and R9R ignores him like he has done to  previous coaches.

    Pud

     

     

     

      That's a good one Pud. Pierce and Garnett and the rest of our great running team was waiting on Rondo? . Show me some clips one of us must be watching some other team

     

     

     

     

     



    You took the words from my mouth.  Add Bass' ability to finish in traffic as well.  All these great runners and finishers were being held back by Rondo.

     

     

     


    Hey Prak and Darryl, We all watched the games and we all saw the same things. You both saw exactly what Pud, agree with him or not, explained with DOC yelling at Rajon to push with Rondo constantly ignoring Doc's pleas. If you say you never saw that, then you didn't watch the games closely enough. It happened EVERY SINGLE GAME, UNTIL!!!!!!! He got hurt......THEN, theother guys obeyed DOC and we say a big difference. Balck and white, plain and simple. Now as far as waht DA thinks, yeah its a littel hard to predict that, but WE CAN AT LEAT HOPE! Anyway, I do want value for Rondo, but what is the value of an injured malcontent? I don't know........



    His value wasnt so high when he was healthy.... has to have plummeted with the acl....

    When coach K kicks u off a team, you know theres a problem.... his coach at Kentucky couldnt deal with him and neither could Doc...instead Doc tried the more love approach and it backfired.... not surprising from a lower tier coach..

    Best thing is getting rid of him before he becomes near worthless with his knee, attitude, selfishness and inability to take instruction from his coaches.... a nightmare

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from prakash. Show prakash's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to MelWitt's comment:


    Whatever is going to happen with Rondo will happen...I just want to end all this nonsense talk about him being a "top 3" ponit guard...far from it.....his baggage and temperment makes it difficult to count him in the top 10 at times...we'll find out when he is healthy what his true value is...I will add that I'd be the happiest C's fan going if he returns to full health, gets his head right with the team and the new coach and grows with the young team....but I feAR THAT'S JUST TOO MUCH TO ASK OF A GUY WHO HAS ONLY SHOWN THOSE THINGS ONE-AT-A-TIME OVER THE TIME HE'S BEEN A CELTIC...(opps, caps, sorry)



    OK, I will bite.  A brilliant Rondo is not just a top 3 point guard.  He is a top point guard.  He has had some unreal playoff performances.  Game 4 against Cleveland in 2010 playoffs his line read 29 points, 18 rebounds and 13 assists.  Down 2-1 that was a crucial game for the Celts to win.  In fact, until the finals, he was hands down the best Celtics performer until Dwight Howard put him down on his hip. His game 2 performance against Miami in 2012 netted 44  points, 10 assists and 8 rebounds.  He is capable of dominating games.  Have Chris Paul, Deron Williams or Tony Parker put up that kind of playoff stats when the series was on the line?


    His issue is consistency and I grant that.  Yes, he is mercurial.  But you don't short change brilliance.  There is a big difference between playing with the odds and playing against the odds.  Lately, the Celts were playing against the odds.  LeBron had to get the odds in his favor to be able to get to the top.

    If the Celts get involved in a protracted rebuilding process, it makes all the sense to trade Rondo to collect more chips.  But the trade must value him.  If the Celts think that they can have a shorter rebuilding horizon, then it does not make sense to trade him.  After all, Houston was able to sign Dwight Howard only because they had young and promising players.  If Danny can shed some contracts, Boston can be a player in free agency and rebuild faster.  For that, Rondo needs to stick around.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from prakash. Show prakash's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to RallyC's comment:


    Hey Prak and Darryl, We all watched the games and we all saw the same things. You both saw exactly what Pud, agree with him or not, described with DOC yelling at Rajon to push with Rondo constantly ignoring Doc's pleas. If you say you never saw that, then you didn't watch the games closely enough. It happened EVERY SINGLE GAME, UNTIL!!!!!!! He got hurt......THEN, the other guys obeyed DOC and we say a big difference. Black and white, plain and simple. Now as far as what DA thinks, yeah its a little hard to predict that, but WE CAN AT LEAST HOPE! Anyway, I do want value for Rondo, but what is the value of an injured malcontent? I don't know........

     



    That is precisely what I wanted to establish regarding your opinion.

    You make it sound like Rondo entered the league last year, established himself as a malcontent and then got injured.  Pretty short sighted I say!

    I see it differently.  With all the roster changes, the need to play a different style of basketball and the anointment of Rondo as the team leader, he floundered in the process of finding the winning formula.  Then he got injured.  And it is not like the Celts discovered any formula last year which directly contributed to Danny's decision to break it up.

    For me, Rondo did not join the Celts in 2012.  His lack of success in 2012-13 must be balanced against his many brilliant performances when the Celts had a competitive team.  Thus, he has great value.  I am OK if Danny trades him but Danny will trade him for value.  He will not make a 4 qtrs. for a dollar bill trade.

     
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  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from RallyC. Show RallyC's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to prakash's comment:

     

    In response to RallyC's comment:

     

     

     


    Hey Prak and Darryl, We all watched the games and we all saw the same things. You both saw exactly what Pud, agree with him or not, described with DOC yelling at Rajon to push with Rondo constantly ignoring Doc's pleas. If you say you never saw that, then you didn't watch the games closely enough. It happened EVERY SINGLE GAME, UNTIL!!!!!!! He got hurt......THEN, the other guys obeyed DOC and we say a big difference. Black and white, plain and simple. Now as far as what DA thinks, yeah its a little hard to predict that, but WE CAN AT LEAST HOPE! Anyway, I do want value for Rondo, but what is the value of an injured malcontent? I don't know........

     

     

     



    That is precisely what I wanted to establish regarding your opinion.

     

     

    You make it sound like Rondo entered the league last year, established himself as a malcontent and then got injured.  Pretty short sighted I say!

    I see it differently.  With all the roster changes, the need to play a different style of basketball and the anointment of Rondo as the team leader, he floundered in the process of finding the winning formula.  Then he got injured.  And it is not like the Celts discovered any formula last year which directly contributed to Danny's decision to break it up.

    For me, Rondo did not join the Celts in 2012.  His lack of success in 2012-13 must be balanced against his many brilliant performances when the Celts had a competitive team.  Thus, he has great value.  I am OK if Danny trades him but Danny will trade him for value.  He will not make a 4 qtrs. for a dollar bill trade.

     


    What you say makes perfect sense. Let me say, there was a time when I, just as many other present day Rondo detractors, were all HUGE RAJON RONDO fanatics. How could you not be? He was young, athletic, lots of fun to watch, and was incredibley effective. My fandom stopped after hearing the scattered but consistant reports about his disagreements with his elder statesman HOF teammates, watching his blatant negative body language on the bench and in games, reading his lips on TV, and then having to watch his immaturity in the way he handles himself with officials, DOC, and the opposition in tense moments of those TV games. He became an embarrassement for may of us, yes just like Paul Pierce was in his earlier years, who watched closely and consider the Celtics the class of the NBA. Especialy for guys like me, a guy who loves the Patriots way of doing business, and who are the model for player discipline and acting right. Don't give me the Hernandez stuff, he's gone as a result of his idiocy! So, with all of this in mind, I think that DA has his hands full in getting ANY real VALUE in exchange. I am sorry to say that at this point, I feel that Rajon is more of a risk in keeping him than it is with trying to trade him for value. Like many, I say YOU GAIN SO MUCH BY MOVING HIM in overall team health and building unity and a solid tradition. Keeping him opens the door to a cancerous attitude that could damage it all, both in the short and long terms. DA will get what DA can. If we don't think its enough, its only because he couldn't get anymore than he got and knew it. There is my honest and sincere assesment. 

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    We all read the leaked comments from some players about Rondo... right after he went down and the team went on a big winning streak playing inspiring ball..as if that wasnt enough..

    Most of us who have played organized sports know there are just some coaches and players that make it hard to put out for...  nothing undercuts a players will more than watching another player be credited and spoiled like a brat and playing hero/stat ball....

    When others give up their ego and committ for the sake of the team and one Star doesnt...and your coach refuses to remedy it.... well you get a 20-23 boring Celtics team that couldnt score or play defense very well... Once that kid went down, we had a rebirth or didnt you notice???

    That wasnt coincidence or the team circling the wagons...it was relief!!! Free at last, Free at last... thank ...............

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from RallyC. Show RallyC's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to Karllost's comment:

     

    We all read the leaked comments from some players about Rondo... right after he went down and the team went on a big winning streak playing inspiring ball..as if that wasnt enough..

    Most of us who have played organized sports know there are just some coaches and players that make it hard to put out for...  nothing undercuts a players will more than watching another player be credited and spoiled like a brat and playing hero/stat ball....

    When others give up their ego and committ for the sake of the team and one Star doesnt...and your coach refuses to remedy it.... well you get a 20-23 boring Celtics team that couldnt score or play defense very well... Once that kid went down, we had a rebirth or didnt you notice???

    That wasnt coincidence or the team circling the wagons...it was relief!!! Free at last, Free at last... thank ...............

     


    Ya know, what Karl says in his above post is EXACTLY TRUE and puts it all in a nutshell. I know first hand from havin been on many teams throughout my life where it was mandatory to "scarifice oneself for TEAM" in order to gain success. As such, the most frustrating thing for me personally over the last few seasons, was watching both DA and DOC not only allow the dysfunction, but reward it by making such a big deal about who the LEADER of the team was. This whole fascade was to pacify Rajon rondo's fragile ego and emotional state. See, on a real pro sports team, Leaders make themselves and don't have to be annointed as such. I think that Doc is implicit in creating the problem with Rondo. i don't see Rajon as being able to shake it now. Sad, but that is really what I feel. He's gonna go by NLT the trade deadline. The longer we wait, the more risk we are assuming. 

     

     
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  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Karllost. Show Karllost's posts

    Re: An Unbiased Perspective on RONDO and the CELTICS Moving Forward

    In response to darrylfries' comment:

    In response to Karllost's comment:

     

    We all read the leaked comments from some players about Rondo... right after he went down and the team went on a big winning streak playing inspiring ball..as if that wasnt enough..

    Most of us who have played organized sports know there are just some coaches and players that make it hard to put out for...  nothing undercuts a players will more than watching another player be credited and spoiled like a brat and playing hero/stat ball....

    When others give up their ego and committ for the sake of the team and one Star doesnt...and your coach refuses to remedy it.... well you get a 20-23 boring Celtics team that couldnt score or play defense very well... Once that kid went down, we had a rebirth or didnt you notice???

    That wasnt coincidence or the team circling the wagons...it was relief!!! Free at last, Free at last... thank ...............

     




    I didn't read any negative comments by the players about Rondo.

     

    Why don't you post some??

    “Don’t get me wrong,” he prefaced, “Rajon (Rondo) makes us the best we can possibly be.”

    (You can just hear that BUT coming, can’t you?)

    “But,” he continued, “now, having multiple ball-handlers out there, it’s just going to make us unpredictable. You don’t know who’s going to handle it. I think the wings are going to get out there and run a little harder. We should be able to play in transition a little more.”

    Terry essentially admitted when many have felt about the Celtics for a while this season – that what wasn’t working on the offensive end had at least a little something to do with the way Rondo dominated the ball. How he looked to get it to Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett as options A-V, with Avery Bradley becoming X, Y and Z since his return. And how that often left complementary players such as Jeff Green, Courtney Lee and Terry standing around aimlessly on the perimeter waiting for a 3-pointer.


    Read more: http://www.metrowestdailynews.com/blogs/mobileghmne/x472365769/Celtics-practice-report-Jason-Terry-talks-candidly-about-life-after-Rajon-Rondo#ixzz2YOnmpHto
    Under Creative Commons License: Attribution Non-Commercial
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    http://www.metrowestdailynews.com/blogs/courtsideview/x472365769/Celtics-practice-report-Jason-Terry-talks-candidly-about-life-after-Rajon-Rondo#axzz2YOn74TY1

     
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